Will Jose be sacked if he is going to do LVG 2015-16 and finish outside top 4?

[Sky1981]

I wonder what these posters who wants poch will say when he eventually gets the job we're still 4th with a better football.

While Jose probably fecks off to juve/psg/madrid and continue winning trophies.

At this rate maybe people will ask whether it's the cook? Or the ingredients?

 

[T A]

Obviously, this has been United's policy after SAF reign. VG, DM, no matter how big or how small the name is, there is and should be no exception, not having Champions League is unacceptable.

I am a big fan of Jose but if these things happen, i will be at peace with the fact that he and United are not meant to be, no hard feelings. However, no way Jose cant guarantee Champions League football, never will

 

[XH6]

Mourinho took over a side that finished 5th in 15/16.

In the Summer of 2016, he spent 150 million to bring in arguably the best player from the previous season in Serie A, Bundesliga, and Ligue 1 in addition to one of the best young defenders in the world in Bailly.

He also had an older Rashford and Martial at his disposal but still massively underachieved and took us down to 6th with arguably the best squad in the league heading into the season.

He then spends another 150 million this past Summer, but barely has the team playing better than when he took over despite 300 million+ spent and over 12 months to develop the youth players who were showing plenty of promise in LVG's final few months.

I think the fact that we underachived in finishing 6th last season is deluding many into thinking that Mourinho is taking United forwards. The squad United had at the start of last season was easily good enough to finish top 4 and probably should have been pushing for the title. Mourinho fecking up last season doesn't mean we should be able to write off a fourth or fifth place finish this season as "progress" and he should definitely get the sack if United do not end up finishing inside the top four

 

[GlastonSpur]

I think he would come in a flash, even now if the offer was made. Tottenham have a good team, and are building a new stadium, but they are nothing compared to us.
He'll struggle to keep Kane for next season, whereas he can build a lasting team with us. The conflict of interest woud be if Real or Barca came knocking for him.
As for being convinced, we can no longer being convinced about anyone. If people demand instant success, we can only try people out until it clicks.

I strongly doubt that - he gives every indication in word and deed in wanting to build a dynasty at Spurs. He has an excellent relationship with Levy by all accounts and has been sold on the long-term project - new stadium, new training ground and all - which essentially aims to establish Spurs as one of the elite teams in Europe, regardless of all the sugar-daddy clubs.

As for struggling to keep Kane for next season ... there is no surer bet in world football other than that Kane will walk out with the Spurs team into the new stadium in our first home game there in 8 or 9 months time.

 

[K2K]

Not if we did it because we did so poorly in the league every season to not even finish in the top 4. I remember when Milan and Liverpool did that. I'd take it the first time but expect to be more competitive in the league moving forward

I love the Champions league. It's the holy trail for me. We simply haven't done well enough in it as a club. Even Sir Alex lamented that.

 

[Ekeke]

I love the Champions league. It's the holy trail for me. We simply haven't done well enough in it as a club. Even Sir Alex lamented that.

I agree and thats why I'd be more than happy if we were 5th and won it this year. But not every year

 

[N91]

It depends on how the board thinks, if it's enough for any manager to qualify for the champions league while playing bad football and not showing any signs of improvement then he will stay and it's possible that he will sign a new contract.

Finishing in top 4 alone should not be considered as a measure of success or improvement, LVG finished in top 4 in his first season and failed to achieve the minimum in his second season, sometimes the results can be deceptive.

Regardless of what we might achieve by the end of the season, if he don't improve our football and change our approach especially against the top teams then he must leave.

 

[wolvored]

3 draws in a row and its a nightmare. 6 mths without a trophy and it's a nightmare...

I said slowly turning into a nightmare. We were supposed to be challenging for the league, now were in a battle for top 4. We will also be playing without no experienced strikers for a few weeks. What happened last year winning 2 minor trophies is history.

 

[buckooo1978]

I think Poch becomes available the day that Harry Kane etc all decide they want to double their wages and decide to move on.....

Poch and Kane to United in 2 years

 

[Siorac]

3 draws in a row and its a nightmare. 6 mths without a trophy and it's a nightmare...

Van Gaal won a trophy days before he was sacked.

 

[Litch]

Hope not as we'll end up like every other club with 'managers for hire' that last a couple of years. How's anyone gonna turn this thing around if they never have the opportunity to see things through. It will be the merry-go-round all over again when fundamentally for me it's the quality of players that's the issue. If you inherit a team of quality, you can attempt to add to it with signings that you know maybe only 50% will work. If you inherit a team of poor quality, which essentially this was, you have to hope 80% of your signings hit the ground running.

I think it's not easy because where do you start with this team when so many of the established players let you down and how do you replace them in 2 seasons? The biggest example for me are Jones and Smalling whi are proven prem and international players yet imo not the quality we need to bring us forward. These are SAF signings, trophy winning players that demonstrate child-like mistakes and no leadership. Rojo, an international that makes decisions like he's a youth team player. Herrera a player that talks a good fight but has now forgotten how to do it on the pitch.

When I think about Jose's teams, if nothing else they were mentally strong and sadly the pressure since SAF to succeed has had a lasting damage and once the pressure is applied, they implod. This is going to take time to resolve as you can't buy quality and quantity in the same season. Also you can't bring people in without get the problems out...

 

[Siddharth]

Yes and he should be sacked.

 

[Judas]

I think Poch becomes available the day that Harry Kane etc all decide they want to double their wages and decide to move on.....

Poch and Kane to United in 2 years

Kane will already be a Real player by then.

 

[vidic blood & sand]

I strongly doubt that - he gives every indication in word and deed in wanting to build a dynasty at Spurs. He has an excellent relationship with Levy by all accounts and has been sold on the long-term project - new stadium, new training ground and all - which essentially aims to establish Spurs as one of the elite teams in Europe, regardless of all the sugar-daddy clubs.

As for struggling to keep Kane for next season ... there is no surer bet in world football other than that Kane will walk out with the Spurs team into the new stadium in our first home game there in 8 or 9 months time.

If United come knocking, Pochetinno will not be able to resist. No manager would dare turn down the opportunity, with the size of the club, history etc
He's doing well at Spurs, but they are a stepping stone make no mistake.

 

[Hawks2008]

I strongly doubt that - he gives every indication in word and deed in wanting to build a dynasty at Spurs. He has an excellent relationship with Levy by all accounts and has been sold on the long-term project - new stadium, new training ground and all - which essentially aims to establish Spurs as one of the elite teams in Europe, regardless of all the sugar-daddy clubs.

As for struggling to keep Kane for next season ... there is no surer bet in world football other than that Kane will walk out with the Spurs team into the new stadium in our first home game there in 8 or 9 months time.

As far as I'm concerned he can stay at Spurs. I wouldn't want the person who follows Jose to have no title-winning pedigree.

 

[Womp]

Probably. The board only seem to care about top 4 as all managers have been let go of when failing to qualify for the CL. If Jose didn't get us CL football, he'd be fired too and rightly so imo.

 

[ZAGREB RED]

I think he will get another season after this at most, but by then he might have decided himself to go elsewhere anyway.

 

[Xaviesta]

The thing that complicates this for me is who do you get to replace him? Pochettino needs to add some silverware to Tottenham's cabinet before United go after him. The Guardiola ship has sailed. I'm far from Ancelotti's biggest fan. The manner of his demise at Bayern would be a worry plus i think he's a tad overrated - 4 league titles having managed the clubs he's managed isn't good enough. Fine Champions League record mind you but great managers have a healthy hall of league titles to their name as well as European titles. Sarri gets talked up and i don't know a huge amount about him so i won't comment much on him. Giggs has done stuff all to warrant the Manchester United job. Thomas Tuchel is an interesting coach but United's squad might require a hefty revamp if he was their boss and i doubt people could get behind Luis Enrique for a somewhat left field pick.

 

[Jazz]

The thing that complicates this for me is who do you get to replace him? Pochettino needs to some silverware to Tottenham's cabinet before United go after him. The Guardiola ship has sailed. I'm far from Ancelotti's biggest fan. The manner of his demise at Bayern would be a worry plus i think he's a tad overrated - 4 league titles having managed the clubs he's managed isn't good enough. Fine Champions League record mind you but great managers have a healthy hall of league titles to their name as well as European titles. Sarri gets talked up and i don't know a huge amount about him so i won't comment much on him. Giggs has done stuff all to warrant the Manchester United job. Thomas Tuchel is an interesting coach but United's squad might require a hefty revamp if he was their boss and i doubt people could get behind Luis Enrique for a somewhat left field pick.

This is the dilemma. There's no one out there you can readily pinpoint. It'll be a big issue for us.

Maybe no choice but to go for someone like Sarri. At least the players would be well coached and have a proper structure. The few talented players we have should strive in that environment, plus we'd be able to add talented replacements as we do have some money
Otherwise I really can't think of anything else.

 

[GlastonSpur]

If United come knocking, Pochetinno will not be able to resist. No manager would dare turn down the opportunity, with the size of the club, history etc
He's doing well at Spurs, but they are a stepping stone make no mistake.

This is the illusion that some United fans still cling to. But resting on your historical laurels only carries you so far, as Spurs have discovered in the past. Since Fergie retired your club has fallen out the elite club bracket and is not regarded in the same light as Real Madrid, Bayern Munich, Barca etc. These days you are scrapping it out for top 4 (just like Spurs) and failing to make it more often than not.

You have more money than Spurs, but not much else going forward. And you under-estimate what Pochettino has at Spurs: a pool of young, talented players with squad coherence and continuity, the opportunity to establish a dynasty, a training centre that's the equal of any in the world, a London base, a fantastic new stadium (soon) and the knowledge that with the new stadium will come an increased budget for player wages and net transfer spend.

 

[vidic blood & sand]

This is the illusion that some United fans still cling to. But resting on your historical laurels only carries you so far, as Spurs have discovered in the past. Since Fergie retired your club has fallen out the elite club bracket and is not regarded in the same light as Real Madrid, Bayern Munich, Barca etc. These days you are scrapping it out for top 4 (just like Spurs) and failing to make it more often than not.

So?

We're still the most supported and most valuable club in the world.

You have more money than Spurs, but not much else going forward. And you under-estimate what Pochettino has at Spurs: a pool of young, talented players with squad coherence and continuity, the opportunity to establish a dynasty, a training centre that's the equal of any in the world, a London base, a fantastic new stadium (soon) and the knowledge that with the new stadium will come an increased budget for player wages and net transfer spend.

Very true that Poch has good thing going at Spurs, but if united call he leaves, simple as that. Now, it's probable that United won't go after him anyway because he's not won anything. He's inexperienced at the highest level, and we've been burned before by appointing such a person. But I assure you that if we want him, he leaves Spurs.
Sorry but the difference in the size of the two clubs is too great.

 

[Kapardin]

So?

We're still the most supported and most valuable club in the world.



Very true that Poch has good thing going at Spurs, but if united call he leaves, simple as that. Now, it's probable that United won't go after him anyway because he's not won anything. He's inexperienced at the highest level, and we've been burned before by appointing such a person. But I assure you that if we want him, he leaves Spurs.
Sorry but the difference in the size of the two clubs is too great.

It is true that we are a bigger club, but Pochettino is at the stage of his career when his rep should not take a beating. He could well choose to not take the United job due to the mediocrity of our squad and stay at Spurs. So we cannot be too sure.

Besides, his dream is to manage PSG. Reckon it is only a matter of time before Emery gets the sack or leaves, so he might be holding out for that.

 

[Paxi]

This is the illusion that some United fans still cling to. But resting on your historical laurels only carries you so far, as Spurs have discovered in the past. Since Fergie retired your club has fallen out the elite club bracket and is not regarded in the same light as Real Madrid, Bayern Munich, Barca etc. These days you are scrapping it out for top 4 (just like Spurs) and failing to make it more often than not.

You have more money than Spurs, but not much else going forward. And you under-estimate what Pochettino has at Spurs: a pool of young, talented players with squad coherence and continuity, the opportunity to establish a dynasty, a training centre that's the equal of any in the world, a London base, a fantastic new stadium (soon) and the knowledge that with the new stadium will come an increased budget for player wages and net transfer spend.

You talk some bollocks I tell you. ALL of those clubs have experienced blips in their not too distant pasts.

The reality is, Spurs are a shadow of United and no amount of sugar coating will change that 'London base, a fantastic new stadium' etc.

feck Arsenal are FAR bigger club than you are. So where do you think Spurs are to United? GTFO! haha

 

[RedLenny]

I think Mourinho will be sacked if the quality of the team performances won't improve. If I had to choose between 5th place and attacking play or becoming 2nd with the defensive style of Mourinho, I would choose the first. The men behind United are starting to see that the ego of Mourinho isn't fitting between te style and legacy of a club like United...

 

[Ecstatic]

Is it that unlikely? Given our recent form and the form of Liverpool and Spurs behind us now?

The team needs a kick up the arse, which is Mourinho's job.

Two seasons of 6th and 5th is a sackable offense.

If Pogba is fit, I don't believe in this scenario

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[Womp]

If Pogba is fit, I don't believe in this scenario

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[The holy trinity 68]

So if Arsenal lose tomorrow then we will be 9 points ahead of them so it is most likely we won’t even finish outside of the top 4. Obviously for United an Arsenal win is probably a good scenario because we should be aiming for 2nd now. A draw would be great also.

 

[minoo-utd]

Not acceptable. I support Jose very much but finishing 6th then finishing out side the top four again if happened this season will be absolutely not acceptable under any manager under any name. I want Mourinho to stay even beyond his current contract but if failed to take us back where we belong then thank you very much. Some other big clubs sack managers if they don't win the league too.

 

[reddaz71]

We wont finish outside top 4 and the Mourinho haters need to give their deluded heads a severe wobble if they think a manager like Pochettino with zero trophies (remember Moyes) to his name could do any better and command the same amount of respect from world class players is absolute nonsense of the very highest order,Blimey!! Get behind Mourinho and count your lucky stars we have a manager of such standing!!

 

[Andersons Dietician]

We wont finish outside top 4 and the Mourinho haters need to give their deluded heads a severe wobble if they think a manager like Pochettino with zero trophies (remember Moyes) to his name could do any better and command the same amount of respect from world class players is absolute nonsense of the very highest order,Blimey!! Get behind Mourinho and count your lucky stars we have a manager of such standing!!

Forgive me for asking but how many trophies did Zidanne and Pep have as a manager before taking over Barca and Real Madrid. Was it like 8 league wins and 4 CL wins before being handed their first outings?

 

[reddaz71]

Forgive me for asking but how many trophies did Zidanne and Pep have as a manager before taking over Barca and Real Madrid. Was it like 8 league wins and 4 CL wins before being handed their first outings?

Well yeah,taking over at RM with Ronaldo,Kroos,Isco etc and Barca with Messi,Iniesta,Xavi etc must have been a thankless task for Zinedine and Pep.....

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Well yeah,taking over at RM with Ronaldo,Kroos,Isco etc and Barca with Messi,Iniesta,Xavi etc must have been a thankless task for Zinedine and Pep.....

Yeah, not like we don’t have talent in our team and it’s not as if he won’t be given money to do so, it’s also not as if he isn’t already over achieving with half the resources of the other 7. I just think it’s really narrow minded to wipe out his abilities based on trophies when he hasn’t had the quality of tools to really have a crack at them. It’s just fu£king stupid.

 

[mike bird]

Forgive me for asking but how many trophies did Zidanne and Pep have as a manager before taking over Barca and Real Madrid. Was it like 8 league wins and 4 CL wins before being handed their first outings?

Not the same, Pep inherited a Barcelona team with Messi. His instructions before the game were "tiki taka, then pass it to Messi, he knows what to do". That was his game plan for all the years at Barca. Thus, everyone that followed won everything.

As for Zidane, he inherited a world class team, that clearly needs no direction.

With Utd is a huge project and a very risky one. Kudos to Jose who had cajones to take it on. As he did with Inter and Real. He builds teams, that what he does best. And those who follow reap rewards (ancelotti, conte, zidane).

Pochettino could do well, but also not. He declined out offer anyway, so I dont know why people think he will change his mind.

 

[Sylar]

With regards to the title of the thread, you would think it would be an easy answer, "yes"

The big problem is what follows:
-Who succeeds him
-How much money will they want? And how many of the current players will be abandon.
-Would it mean a new start- (third new start and change in style?)

 

[The White Pele]

I've seen enough to believe Jose is the right man for this job and that he should be given the time to get it right.

Therefore I would want him to remain even if we failed to finish in the top 4. I also have faith that the club would take the same view, providing that Mourinho didn't make his position untenable with a public fall out (which I appreciate is always a possibility with Jose).

Thankfully, I don't think there is much chance of us finishing outside the top 4, although admittedly the competition is very tough this season. We sit here today over halfway through the season on course to finish on 80+ points in a season where the top 6 is arguably the strongest ever seen in the PL. This is on the back of a bad run of form and also with the context of missing our best player for significant chunks of the season so far and our top scorer from last season.

If we continue on the same trajectory this will comfortably be our best league campaign post-Fergie. I find it bewildering that some are drawing comparisons to LVG's second season when we only accumulated 66 points in a league won by Leicester City and finished in 5th place just 3 points ahead of Southampton.

 

[Listar]

With all this talk about Poch, lets look at some facts:
One of the best striker in England with Harry Kane
One of the best young attacking forward in Ali
One of the most creative player in Eriksen
One of the best defence
One of the strongest midfield - Wanyama, Dier etc.
One of the best goalkeeper in the league
One of the most underrated player that score you vital goals in Son

So the question is, if Poch is one of the best managers out there currently, yet with a world class team, one that can put Real Madrid to the sword, where are they in the table? If you lead a world class team to outside of top 4, is that not a sackable offence?

 

[giorno]

It's called accountability. If i hire a guy to do a job expecting him to reach certain standards and goals and paying him accordingly while giving him the resources to succeed and he fails on an epic scale, why should i stick with him?

No CL next season=no Mourinho. It's only normal

 

[IronCroos37]

With all this talk about Poch, lets look at some facts:
One of the best striker in England with Harry Kane
One of the best young attacking forward in Ali
One of the most creative player in Eriksen
One of the best defence
One of the strongest midfield - Wanyama, Dier etc.
One of the best goalkeeper in the league
One of the most underrated player that score you vital goals in Son

So the question is, if Poch is one of the best managers out there currently, yet with a world class team, one that can put Real Madrid to the sword, where are they in the table? If you lead a world class team to outside of top 4, is that not a sackable offence?

If spurs would finish outside top 4 this season, they would be idiots to fire poch. Everything you mentioned poch created. Ali, dier, kane, ericksen poch made them better.

 

[mike bird]

With all this talk about Poch, lets look at some facts:
One of the best striker in England with Harry Kane
One of the best young attacking forward in Ali
One of the most creative player in Eriksen
One of the best defence
One of the strongest midfield - Wanyama, Dier etc.
One of the best goalkeeper in the league
One of the most underrated player that score you vital goals in Son

So the question is, if Poch is one of the best managers out there currently, yet with a world class team, one that can put Real Madrid to the sword, where are they in the table? If you lead a world class team to outside of top 4, is that not a sackable offence?

I ll tell you what, I liked Poch, but lately, I get the feeling he is out of his depth. He is more like a passive coach, he is good with his players and can develop them, but when he goes into the games he does not react in time when things go wrong. His ability to affect a game from the sidelines is nowhere near Pep's or Jose's. He is smart, but not genius like Pep or Jose.

Will he win any title, at some point he maybe win something. I mean tinkerman won the PL title, who would have thought.

So to answer your question, give Poch another two seasons in charge and if he does not come up with some kind of serious trophy, he will definitely get to boot. As for putting R Madrid to sword, let me tell you there are worst teams in La Liga this season who have put R Madrid to the sword. They are not playing well this season.

 

[SAFicus]

Mourinho took over a side that finished 5th in 15/16.

In the Summer of 2016, he spent 150 million to bring in arguably the best player from the previous season in Serie A, Bundesliga, and Ligue 1 in addition to one of the best young defenders in the world in Bailly.

He also had an older Rashford and Martial at his disposal but still massively underachieved and took us down to 6th with arguably the best squad in the league heading into the season.

He then spends another 150 million this past Summer, but barely has the team playing better than when he took over despite 300 million+ spent and over 12 months to develop the youth players who were showing plenty of promise in LVG's final few months.

I think the fact that we underachived in finishing 6th last season is deluding many into thinking that Mourinho is taking United forwards. The squad United had at the start of last season was easily good enough to finish top 4 and probably should have been pushing for the title. Mourinho fecking up last season doesn't mean we should be able to write off a fourth or fifth place finish this season as "progress" and he should definitely get the sack if United do not end up finishing inside the top four

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