Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

[MisterLupus]

what is he exactly building? what proof there is he is working on some master plan? its all just based on faith, this is not a religion. To keep a manager with such poor results at least we should have SOLID proof that progress is being made, that the form is just a bad luck patch.

So far no one can prove or argue that Ole is improving the team in ANY aspect of the game. We used to be shit, we are shittier now under him, Im all in to give time and respect a manages process, but 9 freacking months is for sure a hell lot of time to at least show glympses of a style of football. He needs to go.

People - myself included - have elaborated on this time and time again across many threads so make an effort yourself if you're curious. Not once have I seen anyone present anything even resembling "it's Ole of course we have to back him he's a legend lulz" argument you guys are repeating to be the source of our continued support so just stop it it's nonsense. Read back if you may - the real reasons are all there to see and comment on so stop being a child arguing a point nobody's making.

As for today's game - it's apparent we don't rate the EL. Did you see the team put out there? That was our reserves - plus James played out of position. We didn't field a team to win but one that hopefully wouldn't lose. With a squad as thin as this I can see why they don't want to risk even further attrition - but that being said it was depressing. Our first eleven just needs two or three reinforcements to be a good side but beyond that we are obviously miles away from having the depth required to challenge.

 

[TMDaines]

What disappoints me is that a number of people seem to believe that just because Mourinho pulled the roof in and now Ole has struggled too that the players are all shit and that this is our level. If someone commits misconduct at work and gets sacked, then you gamble on their replacement and they are proved incompetent, then it doesn’t mean you should just stick with them and label the job impossible. The wrong decision was to appoint Ole, don’t compound that with a further one by keeping him on and allowing him to drag us down further. We’re moving in completely the wrong direction and getting worse.

You give a manager time when analysis suggests that the team is improving and perhaps you have misfortunate with results. You don’t give incompetence time. That’s not a virtue.

 

[Buster15]

Why would it be a joke? There is a difference between what I want and what should be.

What do you want?

 

[JPRouve]

What do you want?

I want the team to succeed, ideally with Ole. As I said earlier in the thread, if he gets sacked it will be deserved but it saddens me.

 

[Kemizee]

We've been here before, but as usual, it will end the same and he'll be gone. It's easy to see a manager who might not be getting results but is making a change. Ole so far has failed on the pitch tremendously, not an ounce of identity, needs to go and will go eventually.

This has been my biggest issue with Ole. Not necessarily the result but that we fail to establish any attacking blueprint in his coaching. He does not need to buy the whole world before we can begin to feel his impact on the pitch. I think I read somewhere he is 3rd from bottom in terms of chances created in the league and no shots on target against Alkmaar tonight is just underwhelming.

 

[Enigma_87]

Truly a terrible manager. Told my dad in the summer he’ll be worse then Moyes.

Think he already is. Come October and we can be near relegation zone.

 

[Majima]

What makes you think the players will respond to it?

Why wouldn't they respond to expert coaching?

Because they are really responding to Solksjaer's coaching right now aren't they? This is the worst football I've ever seen from us in my life and that's saying something considering what we've seen over the past 6 years.

He really hasn't got a clue and it's only going to get worse from here in. There's 80% of the season still to play so we should change it before it's too late.

 

[Volumiza]

Yes. Direction to the Championship is clearly there.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Why wouldn't they respond to expert coaching?

Because they are really responding to Solksjaer's coaching right now aren't they? This is the worst football I've ever seen from us in my life and that's saying something considering what we've seen over the past 6 years.

He really hasn't got a clue and it's only going to get worse from here in. There's 80% of the season still to play so we should change it before it's too late.

I don't think Allegri is the answer, he is a very meticulous coach yet also quite negative at the same time. I have a feeling he won't have much issue with todays football, he will however try to get that one goal and then secure the result like we did today.

 

[Code-CX]

I’d love to know what the 60% are smoking honestly. At this rate, we’ll be celebrating staying out of the relegation zone.

 

[Greck]

Funny thing is if we get sacked he won't get work anywhere. That will be 4 of our last 4 hires who can't or struggle to get a job. We sure do know how to pick em

 

[Jericholyte2]

The concern with those saying sacking won’t make things better, how can it get any worse?

I had previously said keep but but I’m incredibly tempted to switch.

 

[John Blund]

Ole: What have you been smoking? We played woeful tonight. Good thing, we're going to an easier away game Sunday. We can turn this around Ole! If we crash and burn on Sunday, I'm joining the other side. No pressure.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

I do get what you're saying but, this bad run with Ole started March last season so i would expect the club to have already held serious discussions about what to do if it continues, like it has. I feel this is a bit different, to Poch with you as did you see this coming from last season at all?

He was a massive risk to begin with, but the performances are so alarming, that it's clearly only going to get worse from here in. We're embarrassing to watch. We go to any team in any division and they look more coherently coached than us, we haven't got an amazing squad but it's not that bad.

We are in serious danger of being sucked into the battle at the bottom of the table, our form is that frightening. There's 80% of the season still to play, so we can still fix the season if we are serious.

Someone like Allegri could arguably do better than us if i'm being honest, so if he's willing to come, I don't see any downsides really.

Yes it is different but Poch was struggling half way through last season. My point is that no plan, no point in sacking Ole, especially if it’s a member of the back room staff to take over.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Considering that those 10-12 games got him the job it seems weird that we (the owners) don't prioritise how bad the past 20 have been.

5 wins. 8 losses. 7 draws.

25% win ratio. Shocking stuff.

 

[MisterLupus]

This has been my biggest issue with Ole. Not necessarily the result but that we fail to establish any attacking blueprint in his coaching. He does not need to buy the whole world before we can begin to feel his impact on the pitch. I think I read somewhere he is 3rd from bottom in terms of chances created in the league and no shots on target against Alkmaar tonight is just underwhelming.

https://understat.com/league/EPL

Fourth best on expected goals compared to chances created and best in the league on expected goals against. Second place in terms of points expected. So yeah we do create chances - we just don't take them. We needed that striker - we needed that creative force capable of also scoring goals - our defense is solid but they fecked us majorly by not putting in a proper effort finding candidates to strengthen us up front. Also - no I'm not a big fan of xG let's just get that out of the way. It's useless for predicting results - but it is a good indicator as to what a club is doing right and what is wrong.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

I'm looking at it in a positive way.....Ole could be THAT bad he could just maybe force Woodward out too when he does get the boot. Let's hope so anyway.

Fans need to direct their anger at the board and owners and leave Ole only when he gets the boot. He's a legend forever for me. This mess isn't his doing. He's just not the guy to save us.

Woodward needs taking out. Can't we kidnap him or something? Twat.

 

[Sandikan]

He has until Christmas at least.

The board will want to give him time of course, but if we're still messing about 8-12th at Christmas it becomes a hell of a lot harder to defend

 

[elnorte]

https://understat.com/league/EPL

Fourth best on expected goals compared to chances created and best in the league on expected goals against. Second place in terms of points expected. So yeah we do create chances - we just don't take them. We needed that striker - we needed that creative force - our defense is solid but they fecked us majorly by not putting in a proper effort finding candidates to strengthen us up front. Also - no I'm not a big fan of xG let's just get that out of the way. It's useless for predicting results - but it is a good indicator as to what a club is doing right and what is wrong.

Purely based your posts that I've read, am I correct in saying that you think he's a talented manager?

 

[Buster15]

I want the team to succeed, ideally with Ole. As I said earlier in the thread, if he gets sacked it will be deserved but it saddens me.

It saddens me as well in exactly the same way that Jose failing saddened me.
The way I see it we have 2 basic options.
Keep hiring and then sacking managers. Eventually that will work. Eventually.
Or the penny/cent will drop and Woodward will realise that the problem goes far deeper and accept that major structural changes are required and implement a transformation plan to bring the football club into the 21st century.
Even though I am an optimist I cannot see the latter happening.

 

[Majima]

I don't think Allegri is the answer, he is a very meticulous coach yet also quite negative at the same time. I have a feeling he won't have much issue with todays football, he will however try to get that one goal and then secure the result like we did today.

Allegri played really exciting football at Juve with Pogba, Tevez, Pirlo & Vidal. Then with Dybala etc. He's pragmatic, he makes the most out of what he has at his disposal. He's not set in one way or another.

Meticulous is a good thing. I think that is just what we need here. We have a lack of experts at this club. We can't even do the basics of football correct, so he would instill the framework in our play again.

What are you apprehensive about him?

 

[Irwin99]

Genuine question and it's not leaning either way towards 'Ole Out' or 'Ole Keep' but in the last decade or so have there been many examples of managers at top clubs who have been able to reverse a dreadful run of form and keep their jobs when at the time it seemed as if the writing was well and truly on the wall? It doesn't just relate to Ole but Poch too, once the bad results continue for months on end it generally only ends with the sack.


Edit - not that tonight was a bad result, but the performance was bad as ever

 

[Eric7C]

https://understat.com/league/EPL

Fourth best on expected goals compared to chances created and best in the league on expected goals against. Second place in terms of points expected. So yeah we do create chances - we just don't take them. We needed that striker - we needed that creative force capable of also scoring goals - our defense is solid but they fecked us majorly by not putting in a proper effort finding candidates to strengthen us up front. Also - no I'm not a big fan of xG let's just get that out of the way. It's useless for predicting results - but it is a good indicator as to what a club is doing right and what is wrong.

Yeah Ole sold that striker.. Open your eyes.

 

[hobbers]

The only factor on when (not if) Ole will be sacked is whenever Poch or Tuchel are able to take over.

Football-wise this spell looks even bleaker than last November under Mourinho. It's already Moyes in April territory.

 

[MisterLupus]

Purely based your posts that I've read, am I correct in saying that you think he's a talented manager?

Maybe just comment on what I actually write if you disagree rather than attempting to psychoanalyze me. I'm not interested in getting intimate with you RandomInternetGuy2496474901

Yeah Ole sold that striker.. Open your eyes.

Lukaku and Sanchez had to go almost everyone agreed on this before the summer so give it a break. Problem wasn't who we sold - it was not replacing them.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

Given how he earned the permanent job over a small sample of games, the sample of games after that has been truly awful.

Has failed to impose any kind of style, skill or capability on the players we have. The club is too big for him as a manager, and no sign of the forwards picking up any of his nous from a player perspective.

We needed a revolution, but Ole isn't the one to lead it.

He's done some good, McTominay has clearly become a better player. We've weeded out some legit trash. The defence is definitely better, but still not the level it needs to be.

It would take an absolute miracle for him to be in the job next summer.

 

[Jacckk1985]

Sack.

 

[Rafaeldagold]

Maybe just comment on what I actually write if you disagree rather than attempting to psychoanalyze me. I'm not interested in getting intimate with you RandomInternetGuy2496474901



Lukaku and Sanchez had to go almost everyone agreed on this before the summer so give it a break. Problem wasn't who we sold - it was not replacing them.

You don’t fcking sell them both with no replacements. Naive, suicidal & awful management

 

[Kopral Jono]

Tempted, very tempted, to press that 'sack' button but I think I'm sticking to my initial judgment on this i.e. wait until Christmas and assess from there. Sack if this relegation form goes on until then but keep if he somehow manages to turn things around, though the latter is looking increasingly unlikely.

 

[Eric7C]

Lukaku and Sanchez had to go almost everyone agreed on this before the summer so give it a break. Problem wasn't who we sold - it was not replacing them.

This is Manchester United. Its criminal to not replace them - and reportedly he told Woodward that he had the strike force he needed. He has no clue how a big club participating in four competitions is run. Utterly out of his depth. Lukaku needed to go but he is ten times the finisher Rashford is. Ole will pay for it (very soon).

Also you can't say you're not a fan of xg and then use it as a basis for your argument.

 

[buckooo1978]

On current form there’s no way he makes it to the end of the season.

when would you pull the trigger?

I'm just not sure who you could even get in....

I'd genuinely like someone who could coach us to attack - Wenger until the end of the season?

 

[Rafaeldagold]

https://understat.com/league/EPL

Fourth best on expected goals compared to chances created and best in the league on expected goals against. Second place in terms of points expected. So yeah we do create chances - we just don't take them. We needed that striker - we needed that creative force capable of also scoring goals - our defense is solid but they fecked us majorly by not putting in a proper effort finding candidates to strengthen us up front. Also - no I'm not a big fan of xG let's just get that out of the way. It's useless for predicting results - but it is a good indicator as to what a club is doing right and what is wrong.

This just proves that stats can be manipulated anyway you want . As we’ve been boring, definitely not attacking, no attacking plays being developed.

We look absolutely clueless. It’s like the Moyes day’s again. We’re a soulless club with no identity right now & a lot of that is our poor managers doing

 

[Florida Man]

Tempted, very tempted, to press that 'sack' button but I think I'm sticking to my initial judgment on this i.e. wait until Christmas and assess from there. Sack if this relegation form goes on until then but keep if he somehow manages to turn things around, though the latter is looking increasingly unlikely.

You'll change your mind when we have a stinker against a poor Newcastle.

 

[Kopral Jono]

You'll change your mind when we have a stinker against a poor Newcastle.

You sound like someone who feels the same way as I do about this!

 

[Castia]

Worrying times

Relegation form. We aren’t too good to go down, Sounds fecking ridiculous but we’re in genuine relegation form and getting worse.

Zero goals in this team. Zero creativity. Genuinely concerned. Lose to Newcastle at weekend we could be 1 point off the relegation zone.

 

[Uncle Pat]

He's got to go. I'd be patient if there was even a small sign of us improving but there isn't and that goes for on and off the pitch. Dire, tumescent football. The run since the PSG game has been utterly unacceptable and cannot be allowed to continue.

I love you Ole but show some guts and admit this task is beyond you.

 

[Svartzonker]

Last 15 games in the league = 17 points. That would be about 43 points for the whole season. We might avoid relegation after all.

Time has come. Get rid as soon as possible. Absurd situation this team is in with all the resources we have.

 

[Florida Man]

You sound like someone who feels the same way as I do about this!

Do we? I'm firmly in the Ole out camp. I've been a late adopter with our previous managers so now I'm an early adopter on this one.

 

[Kemizee]

https://understat.com/league/EPL

Fourth best on expected goals compared to chances created and best in the league on expected goals against. Second place in terms of points expected. So yeah we do create chances - we just don't take them. We needed that striker - we needed that creative force capable of also scoring goals - our defense is solid but they fecked us majorly by not putting in a proper effort finding candidates to strengthen us up front. Also - no I'm not a big fan of xG let's just get that out of the way. It's useless for predicting results - but it is a good indicator as to what a club is doing right and what is wrong.

Yea. I agree the defense is solid and provides a good platform to build on. I just wonder why he didn't insist to Ed not to ever deal with Inter for Lukaku unless we had a replacement lined up. I feel he was too quick to just say 'I am okay to go in with Martial and Rashford'. I want him to succeed as he is a good bloke at heart but we really need to pick up some steam play-style wise as we have been so terrible lately.

 

[Majima]

Yes it is different but Poch was struggling half way through last season. My point is that no plan, no point in sacking Ole, especially if it’s a member of the back room staff to take over.

Ah, I was aware it wasn't as energetic as past years but I must not have noticed it was a genuine slump. Oh i most definitely wouldn't sack Ole to appoint Carrick or Phelan or McKenna as i think they are all clueless & out of their depth. I agree 100% there's no point doing that.

My main point is, i don't think it would necessarily be a rush job to get Allegri provided they had already done their due diligence in the summer and he was already sounded out as they had one eye on the worst case scenario. That's what i would have expected them to have done. The alarm bells were ringing last season. It's only collective delusion and sheer hope that people had to begin with in the summer.