Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?

  • Sack Ole & appoint new coach ASAP

  • Keep Ole & back him to finish rebuild


Results are only viewable after voting.

vfc_redarmy

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We look like a very good counter attacking team now, but nothing more. When we’re playing against teams like wba there is no plan how to play. Then we trust individual qualities and other players are waiting to see what the man with the ball will do with it. There are no movements, just watch the game and especially first half versus wba. And if our play is based upon individual qualities then I would say we are in deep trouble. Some of our chances yesterday came after counter attack. It’s good to have a great counter attacking side, you need to be good at that to, but we can’t just be good at counter attack if we want to challenge for titles in the future.
After two years in charge you would expect that there is a plan on the pitch how to play attacking football. That’s why I doubt that Ole is the right man for us.

how many seasons do he need to implement a system on the pitch?
how many seasons do he need before we can demand to be a title challenge team?
Are we happy with being a good counter attacking side and nothing more?

Ole said that after the match yesterday that three points is sometimes more important than the performance, that’s true when you are talking about one match, but performance is important if you want to do something over a whole season. And our performance has been crap in more than just one match so far.
 

FatherWolff

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Out of interest. Did anyone see some other team play good football yesterday? I didn’t in the five games I watched. Teams who had a lot of players out on int duty looked tired and slow.

people complaining about our starting line up? Starting Mata? First, he deserved starting. Second. Have anyone seen our fixturelist the next two months? It’s every man on deck. But I see a few internet fans don’t want to see where we are I January. They want to rip it up and start again. At the worst possible time. And they think it’s for the best of the club. Go figure.
 

R'hllor

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Love how people mention if our player did this or that but completely ignore that WBA fans could say the same, nevermind the luck we got by overturning their penalty shout. If they scored from pen. that they didnt get, oh boi, we would be in hot water for remaining of the game.
 

Judas

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Hard game after the international break :lol: West Brom at home.


And the mad thing is West Brom probably deserved something out of the game, and in the end we did make it look like a hard game, but it shouldn't have been, it never should be.
 

Idxomer

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Love how people mention if our player did this or that but completely ignore that WBA fans could say the same, nevermind the luck we got by overturning their penalty shout. If they scored from pen. that they didnt get, oh boi, we would be in hot water for remaining of the game.
You know it's a problem when there's talk about the ifs against WBA.
 

FatherWolff

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Hard game after the international break :lol: West Brom at home.


And the mad thing is West Brom probably deserved something out of the game, and in the end we did make it look like a hard game, but it shouldn't have been, it never should be.
I don’t know if you watch much football. But brom is a hard team to beat. You have to work for it. It was a shit game, no one denying that.
But we won. Should have won by more. And if they scored we would score two. Having a crisis after a scrappy win, and absolutely being in the mix for the Christmas fixtures is a bit embarrassing.
 

90 + 5min

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then the bar is on the floor mate ...
It is not. It is about seeing reality.

Out of interest. Did anyone see some other team play good football yesterday? I didn’t in the five games I watched. Teams who had a lot of players out on int duty looked tired and slow.

people complaining about our starting line up? Starting Mata? First, he deserved starting. Second. Have anyone seen our fixturelist the next two months? It’s every man on deck. But I see a few internet fans don’t want to see where we are I January. They want to rip it up and start again. At the worst possible time. And they think it’s for the best of the club. Go figure.
No, no, no. You can't post this. It is against SolskjaerOut agenda. But. you are right. And it has been like this before. This season it is even more extreme because of compressed fixture list. Players are not robots.

Hard game after the international break :lol: West Brom at home.


And the mad thing is West Brom probably deserved something out of the game, and in the end we did make it look like a hard game, but it shouldn't have been, it never should be.
Of course it is. While teams like WBA could train for two weeks with pretty much same team intact, our players were all over world and coming back a day before kick of.

WBA deserved? In what way? We camped in their half for the most part of the game. We missed lot of goalscoring chances.
 

Bilbo

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Out of interest. Did anyone see some other team play good football yesterday? I didn’t in the five games I watched. Teams who had a lot of players out on int duty looked tired
Don't be silly. Redcafe posters don't watch other football matches. They post tweets from other people that do and then watch MotD so they can comment on that assist they saw and call that player 'class'.

I'm not convinced that many posters even watch our own games that closely, the amount of posting that goes on during games.
 

Hellboy

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It is not. It is about seeing reality.


No, no, no. You can't post this. It is against SolskjaerOut agenda. But. you are right. And it has been like this before. This season it is even more extreme because of compressed fixture list. Players are not robots.


Of course it is. While teams like WBA could train for two weeks with pretty much same team intact, our players were all over world and coming back a day before kick of.

WBA deserved? In what way? We camped in their half for the most part of the game. We missed lot of goalscoring chances.
Yeah the reality is trash that's what I'm trying to say. Ole has been in the job for 2 years with one of the best squads in the league, we look like relegation fodder. Trash !
 

Rado_N

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Rashford and Martial are “kick and rush footballers” now is the latest argument to somehow defend Ole.

I mean Jesus fecking christ.
 

Di Maria's angel

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I don’t know if you watch much football. But brom is a hard team to beat. You have to work for it. It was a shit game, no one denying that.
But we won. Should have won by more. And if they scored we would score two. Having a crisis after a scrappy win, and absolutely being in the mix for the Christmas fixtures is a bit embarrassing.
They have 3 points. They're the opposite of hard to beat.
 

tomaldinho1

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I don’t know if you watch much football. But brom is a hard team to beat. You have to work for it. It was a shit game, no one denying that.
But we won. Should have won by more. And if they scored we would score two. Having a crisis after a scrappy win, and absolutely being in the mix for the Christmas fixtures is a bit embarrassing.
The same WBA who have conceded the most goals in the PL? We were horrendous, they play a flat back 5 and Ole decided to play a defensive double pivot. No wonder the game was so turgid. Their penalty was incorrectly overruled and we were saved by another penalty, it's actually embarrassing how bad we are from open play.
 

90 + 5min

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I really wonder where he'd be without VAR being introduced shortly after he came. Add to that the COVID break which allowed us to squeak top 4.

He's one of the luckiest managers I've ever seen.
I wonder where Liverpool would have ended last year without VAR? Would Klopp ever got a title?

He’s a our version of Southgate. Lucky, over his head and still in a job when it’s clear neither will achieve anything of note.
Both have very good players yet set up as the team that needs to play on the back foot and counter: 2 sitting deep midfielders and then long balls to wide players. Both manager are trying to copy Jose and failing miserably with horrendous football.
Can’t wait until he’s gone.
Well, he came 3rd last year. Came to semi in all cups. Sure, we didn't win anything. But did beat or came before lots of managers people want here.

- Tactically naive
- Relies on individual brilliance
- insistence of things that doesn't work
- No passion at the touch line/ no passion in the game

He looks directly opposite of Klopp. Give me any manager who is passionate, hopefully it will breath some fire in the belly of players. Just look at Rushford, Martial, Martial, Maquire, AWB and etc. There is no fire in this team except a couple. We will be stuck from 4-8 in the table with this team. What culture? I dont see any fire. I wish there is a manager like Roy but does not alienate players. That would be a perfect Man Utd manager.
Why is Klopp always mentioned but people don't want to recognize that he didn't win anything for 4 years and even Liverpool fans wanted him out in some periods?

Tactically naive? Beating PSG, Leipzig and previous years ManCity, Tottenham, Chelsea and all those big teams. Who have managers people seem to adore in here.
Relies on individual brilliance? Tell me any big club or manager who doesn't rely on individual brilliance. Messi? Ronaldo? Mbape? Salah? Kane? DeBruyne? Lewandwski?
No passion at the touch line/ no passion in the game? Well, he can't be a clown shouting out every sec.

A quick wiki would give you it all, but if you can’t be arsed:

Molde 2010 - 2014
Cardiff 2014 - 2014
Molde 2015 - 2018
Man Utd 2018 -

Last trophy was effectively the Danish version of the league cup in 2013, won the league in 11 & 12.

Got Cardiff relegated & poor form in the Chanpionship meant he was sacked to stop the rot.

His second stint at Molde I don’t really care, but nothing of note appears worth mentioning.

You be the judge of his time at United, but I’ll give you a clue, average at best.
If you want to be believed, try to google what country he managed teams in. Not being bothered to even look up that it is Norway and not Denmark just points out you just want to have a go at him.

He is probably even more tactically clueless than Moyes. I really hope we bring someone more competent in sooner rather than later.
Clueless? In what way?

A top brave manager wouldn’t be such a coward and get Pogba and Fernandes playing in a 4-1-2-3, but not Ole, it must be 2 defensive midfielders no matter the opposition or whether or not we’re at home.
Well, you can discus lot of managers decisions. A brave manager should bench Pogba. And in best case sell him for the good of our team and Pogbas career.
 

Rado_N

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Tough team to beat with only kick and rush footballs like Rashford and Martial up top.
 

FatherWolff

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Spurs? Or does parking a bus automatically mean you didn't play well?
I thought the game was slow and sloppy. So was Real Madrid. Chelsea looked tired and sloppy. Bayern looked sloppy. Barca lost again. Rb Leipzig drew, didn’t watch it though. Even the Dortmund game was slow and sloppy the 40 mins I watched. But they have Haaland.. I didn’t see any good football on display yesterday. As expected I guess. But it was nice having football back. International breaks are tiresome even as a fan. We are in good position for the run coming up, where players will go down like flies injured. 8 games in I think it’s a bit knee jerking on here.
see where we are in January and go from there.
 

JG3001

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I wonder where Liverpool would have ended last year without VAR? Would Klopp ever got a title?


Well, he came 3rd last year. Came to semi in all cups. Sure, we didn't win anything. But did beat or came before lots of managers people want here.


Why is Klopp always mentioned but people don't want to recognize that he didn't win anything for 4 years and even Liverpool fans wanted him out in some periods?

Tactically naive? Beating PSG, Leipzig and previous years ManCity, Tottenham, Chelsea and all those big teams. Who have managers people seem to adore in here.
Relies on individual brilliance? Tell me any big club or manager who doesn't rely on individual brilliance. Messi? Ronaldo? Mbape? Salah? Kane? DeBruyne? Lewandwski?
No passion at the touch line/ no passion in the game? Well, he can't be a clown shouting out every sec.


If you want to be believed, try to google what country he managed teams in. Not being bothered to even look up that it is Norway and not Denmark just points out you just want to have a go at him.


Clueless? In what way?


Well, you can discus lot of managers decisions. A brave manager should bench Pogba. And in best case sell him for the good of our team and Pogbas career.
Corrected it in a reply to an earlier poster, typed in haste, not due to a lack of research. And I’ll say the same thing to you as I did to him. The original point about his credentials being crap still stands, whether it be Norway, Denmark, Mars or bleeding Timbuktu
 

Andycoleno9

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When you look other teams. Managers come and in less than a year they implement their style of play. And all that in worse teams than our and with much money less spent.
Failed Cardiff manager spent 300 mil and after two years he still needs time?
He has team which should be playing good football and instead we play even game with WBA.
 

Litch

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Going to be a long and slow death. Not poor enough to sack him but not good enough consistently to feel we have turned a corner. Painful.....
 

MattofManchester

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I thought the game was slow and sloppy.
Honestly, I see no difference between that Spurs performance and one's we've put in recently against City.
City being very good in the first, conceding on the break, and completely losing the plot after that.
Spurs were focused and looked very good on the break until that final pass most of the time.


The problem for me with the West Brom game was the lack of control we had over it. We had possession but that doesn't mean control. We just don't box teams in and batter them, in the same manner the top teams do.
If we win 1-0 and dominate the game comfortably, all good. But a better team than WBA yesterday and we'd have been punished a few times yesterday. Some will say we did dominate but I'm in disagreement.

All good and well we won, but the only consistency we have at the moment is consistency in lacklustre performances.
That is what is concerning.
 

Litch

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When you look other teams. Managers come and in less than a year they implement their style of play. And all that in worse teams than our and with much money less spent.
Failed Cardiff manager spent 300 mil and after two years he still needs time?
He has team which should be playing good football and instead we play even game with WBA.
Only the ex player status saves him. Anyone else will be gone by now.
 

Chairman Steve

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Worrying thing for me is even if he got his wish and the club spent £200m on Sancho and Grealish, the same result would have happened in my opinion.

I don’t think he knows how to implement a system that isn’t reliant on individual brilliance, and nor do his coaches. OGS has said he’s a man management guy. Phelan isnt the tactics guy. From stuff I’ve read, his strength is motivator/man management rather than tactician. There’s a reason why our style of play steadily dropped once he took over from Queiroz in the SAF times. Carrick got parachuted into a first team coaching role after retiring. McKenna has experience at youth level but youth and senior levels are completely different.

So we have two senior coaches who are man management, an inexperienced coach who was dropped into the first team coaching setup immediately after retirement and a coach who has credentials at youth level. Who would be the tactician out of that lot? Is it really a case of “go out there and enjoy yourselves lads but try to give the ball to Bruno at every chance”
 

Andycoleno9

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Some of his quotes when he was hired.

"It is easier here because I know what the DNA and identity of Manchester United is and what a Manchester United player is."
"It’s a winning identity,” he explains. “It’s a confident identity. We want to take risks. We want to go for the second, the third and the fourth goal because that’s just how we do things at Manchester United. If you can’t handle that then you are at the wrong club.”

About full backs:
"Man Utd full backs must provide goals and assists". And then he buys AWB.

He says what fans want to hear but does opposite.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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Worrying thing for me is even if he got his wish and the club spent £200m on Sancho and Grealish, the same result would have happened in my opinion.

I don’t think he knows how to implement a system that isn’t reliant on individual brilliance, and nor do his coaches. OGS has said he’s a man management guy. Phelan isnt the tactics guy. From stuff I’ve read, his strength is motivator/man management rather than tactician. There’s a reason why our style of play steadily dropped once he took over from Queiroz in the SAF times. Carrick got parachuted into a first team coaching role after retiring. McKenna has experience at youth level but youth and senior levels are completely different.

So we have two senior coaches who are man management, an inexperienced coach who was dropped into the first team coaching setup immediately after retirement and a coach who has credentials at youth level. Who would be the tactician out of that lot? Is it really a case of “go out there and enjoy yourselves lads but try to give the ball to Bruno at every chance”
And people think this is the best this squad can do?
 

AshRK

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Yet those defending him say they don’t understand the moaning, cause 1-0 is a good result.
They can’t see the woods from the trees.

@Skåre Willoch, this is why expectations should be sky high (and also why AC Milan’s shouldn’t), it’s also the reason Bayern don’t make the United mistake of keeping managers in too long to make a right feck up of thing. If you invest the first or second most in the league, expect good football and results pretty fecking quickly:


Full cost of each 25-man squad in the Premier League
  1. Manchester City - £810,870,000
  2. Manchester United - £628,130,000
  3. Chelsea - £577,100,000
  4. Arsenal - £454,800,000
  5. Liverpool - £454,250,000
  6. Everton - £388,050,000
  7. Tottenham Hotspur - £385,300,000
  8. Leicester City - £317,450,000
  9. Wolverhamton Wanderers - £241,980,000
  10. Aston Villa - £229,350,000
  11. West Ham United - £218,500,000
  12. Newcastle United - £198,100,000
  13. Southampton - £170,550,000
  14. Brighton & Hove Albion - £159,100,000
  15. Crystal Palace - £149,860,000
  16. Sheffield United - £120,700,000
  17. Leeds United - £120,300,000
  18. West Bromwich Albion - £97,700,000
  19. Fulham - £94,350,000
  20. Burnley - £82,600,000
Wow looking at this list, I am surprised how little pressure is put on Arsenal. I would seriously ask more questions to the likes of arteta also.

Anyways coming to Ole I don't think he should remain as the manager next season unless we end up finishing 2nd or 3rd or even 4th if that means we are challenging for the title. But we are just scrapping past 4th then I don't think he should be our manager next season. But then again do I trust this board to be ruthless and smart, I don't so no point of talking about when to replace the manager.
 
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Worrying thing for me is even if he got his wish and the club spent £200m on Sancho and Grealish, the same result would have happened in my opinion.
I disagree somewhat, give any manager a great squad and first eleven and they can achieve. Not always, but it’s possible, many average managers have won with great teams.

Great managers achieve even with imbalanced and imperfect squads.
 

Volumiza

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I’ve been one of the biggest flip floppers on this. I love Ole, the memories of him as a player and his contribution to this club are amazing.

I usually change my mind after a dreadful performance and a loss but this time I’m done. I’m bored of supporting Ole. I’m bored of waiting for some kind of development of the team, some kind of improvement, some kind of identity.

I think this is his limit. We may never know what is holding him back, holding the team back but we have a good team. We may not have the best team but it is a good one and should be performing much better than an this.

Sorry to say but sack him now. Get Poch in. Poch himself may not be the long term answer but it will be a massive upgrade on Ole who has clearly reached his ceiling.
 

Massive Spanner

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I'm not convinced that many posters even watch our own games that closely, the amount of posting that goes on during games.
I've seen you say this loads. It's clear you have a superiority complex over the posters who don't see Ole as a good manager for us. It really helps explain your posting style, pure condescension.

It was plain for all to see that we were terrible last night. You don't have to be glued to the screen for 90 minutes with a notepad and your tongue hanging out analysing every bit of the game to see that. Feck sake.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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Some of his quotes when he was hired.

"It is easier here because I know what the DNA and identity of Manchester United is and what a Manchester United player is."
"It’s a winning identity,” he explains. “It’s a confident identity. We want to take risks. We want to go for the second, the third and the fourth goal because that’s just how we do things at Manchester United. If you can’t handle that then you are at the wrong club.”

About full backs:
"Man Utd full backs must provide goals and assists". And then he buys AWB.

He says what fans want to hear but does opposite.
Why is there no longer a clamour for an exciting style of play under Ole. I remember this was one of the major criterias from a new manager after Mourinho. Are Ole supporters happy with our style of play?
 

Matt6677

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How do you need dodgy refeering to beat a team like WBA? Ole has to go

Do Ole supporters ever wonder why do fans of other team want Ole to stay in the job? They know that we are not going anywhere with him. We are a joke.
 

Paxi

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I've seen you say this loads. It's clear you have a superiority complex over the posters who don't see Ole as a good manager for us. It really helps explain your posting style, pure condescension.

It was plain for all to see that we were terrible last night. You don't have to be glued to the screen for 90 minutes with a notepad and your tongue hanging out analysing every bit of the game to see that. Feck sake.
:lol:

Good post.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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I've seen you say this loads. It's clear you have a superiority complex over the posters who don't see Ole as a good manager for us. It really helps explain your posting style, pure condescension.

It was plain for all to see that we were terrible last night. You don't have to be glued to the screen for 90 minutes with a notepad and your tongue hanging out analysing every bit of the game to see that. Feck sake.
He talks like a Christian that thinks he's among the few following the right path to paradise
 

Andycoleno9

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Why is there no longer a clamour for an exciting style of play under Ole. I remember this was one of the major criterias from a new manager after Mourinho. Are Ole supporters happy with our style of play?
Funny how that stopped. When he came here, without any proof, fans said that we have "progressive, attacking manager". Based on the fact that he is former striker and "knows the club".
Then it was "he needs time" to implement that.

And now 2 years later and 300 mil spent, we play with two destroyers in midfield against bloody WBA. And winning 1-0 from penalty spot.