You are mostly very sensible but what high press exactly? We do it once or twice a game but also then we aren't pressing as a unit. Our defence line is way too deep for that. Probably because our CBs are absolute snails. Look at Leipzig, Liverpool, Salzburg et al. That's high press not that sorry attempt from us.
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
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Until recently Ole’s record as permanent boss was relegation level, he now has us on course for a record breaking 45 points. Like I said he lowered bar to such an extent that any win is seen as an improvement but after a year he will have us in a worse position than a manger who was sacked.
Poch is much coveted because he’s a better manager, that isn’t even a debate. Ole is a poor manger doing his best which isn’t good enough, no other way to describe it.
If fans want to do Glazers and Woodward a favour and accept that and dress it up good luck to them but I don’t see point in pretending there is improvement and making excuses when we have regressed.
Allegri is a far better manager than both, that's not a debate at all. Proven to be able to successfully handle big egos too. But there is a weird love-in for poch on these forums for some reason.
We have rarely had the chance to put our preferred team this season, as soon as martial came back after 7 weeks out our form has clearly changed. Don’t know how anyone can argue with that. If the overhyped pogba could muster a few games before he leaves that may help along with getting mctominay back as any manager even the trophy machine poch would look lost playing Fred and Peirara in central midfield. Possibly the worst pairing I have ever seem in top level football neither Ole’s fault but having to make do currently.
Amazing how opposition players are suddenly always better than ours. There’s not a single Sheff Utd player that would get in our team yet Ole doesn’t have his preferred team so can’t expect a win.
What about all the games where the opposition don’t have their best team, if we win should we not read anything into those?.
Excuses need to stop now, he’s a poor manager doing a poor job. He wouldn’t be employed by any other Premier League team. If people want to stick with that and hope it all gets better based on no logic then good luck to them.
False. Do you think Pereira could get into the Sheffield team?
It's not weirder than love-in for Ole (as a manager) on these forums.
I was thinking the same thing, what high press? We never move as a unit.
I honestly have no idea what type of football we play, if we can’t counter we are atrocious. Which is my main problem with Ole, we have no style except hit teams on the break.
If he doesn’t get any players in January we will stay a mid table team.
We should have won the game.
I'd bet you my mortgage that if some of you weren't so harsh on him even when there's no match in recent days, there probably wouldn't be people defending him as much. It goes both ways.
From our last 7 games we are 5-1-1. Not the most difficult fixtures, but thats decent all the same. Attack is markedly improved with Martial back and him, Rashford and James seems to have clicked pretty well and is starting to develop an understanding. In those 7 games we have also scored 16 goals, the 7 games before that (when Martial was out) we only managed 4 goals. The latter is clearly dreadful, but it goes to show just how ridiculously vulnerable we are to injuries in our current state
And i am not saying results dont matter. I just think they are not the only thing that matters. We are in a rebuild though so as i said, what happens in terms of squad building is more important than results imo. Ole bought young and is giving youth a chance so 1-2 years from now when they had proper time to gel and develop, with hopefully some more quality additions to the squad we hopefully look much stronger than we do today. Just look at the age of this potential XI. In my opinion, that XI is so young it wont hit its peak in another 2-3 years
--------------------------Henderson (22)--------------------------------
AWB(21)--Maguire(26)--Tuanzebe(22)---Williams(19)
---------McTomminay(22)----Pogba(26)--Fred(26)-------
---James(22)-----Martial (23)--------Rashford (22)-------
There are new stories every day about us getting Haaland(19) Link. Add a couple of young quality CM's and suddenly things will start to look a lot better. Big Pete also said he "saw something there" Link, and unlike Neville who spouts a lot of nonsense, Pig Pete has never been afraid to speak his mind.
I also think its worth mentioning we have not been as bad as our results are and individual errors like missed penalties and defensive howlers have cost us badly.
Going by Xg in games we have dropped points: Wolves: 0.31 - 1.14, Palace: 0.68 - 2.24, Soton: 0.77 - 1,9 West Ham: 0.51 - 1.28 Arsenal: 1.70 - 1.13, Liverpool: 1.03 - 0.79 Bournemouth: 1.87 - 0.64. Had we been more clincal in front of goal and a some fewer defensive feck ups and we would have a lot more points. Link.
What, like we were when we went to Paris. like when we played Liverpool at home recently, like when we went to Chelsea in the cup, like when we ....
And the poll is virtually 50/50
The Sheffield game had exposed our tactics and squad management so badly that everyone would have called for the manager's head if his name is not Ole. Sheffield United was on a different level for 70 minutes and the 3 goals was a miracle that doesn't happen everyday and Ole knows it. One step forward, two steps back and we are worst off compared to last season. There's a change of style but unfortunately no progress in our plays and results. Thanks for the winning runs and the PSG game Ole.
The games against City and Spurs aren't the ones to worry about, history under Ole has clearly shown that. It's not the big games we make a mess of most of the time.
I'd bet you my mortgage too that if we had a manager named "Lole Sunnar Bolskjaer" who wasn't our ex player, there wouldn't be people defending him as much as Ole.
Maybe, maybe not but I doubt Ole would swap Perreira for any of their midfielders or that we’d buy anyone from them.
You think it’s less weird to have a love-in for a sacked Spurs manager than it is for our own current manager?
Solskjær going on about the Everton game as if he’s improved us from a team that gave up the minute we went 2 behind and reinstalled the drive we had under SAF. Just remember last year under Mourinho losing 2 nil to Newcastle came back and won 3-2. First points dropped under Ole losing 2 nil to Burnley came back and drew 2-2....
And the poll is virtually 50/50
Well yeah, of course. Just like how our fans still adore Keane, while rival fans wouldnt hesitate to call him a cnut. There will be some bias, but the defending (love in) like you said, is a result of the exaggerated criticism. Im sure many of the Keep side are just staying silent, making it seem like the majority of the forum has turned against him.
It just gets my goat when people underrate them as just championship or league one players. Norwood was always a decent lad with an engine, a tough tackler with a lot of heart, and while the likes of Fred and Pereira may be better on paper with a better CV, they aren't necessarily better. Especially since Pereira was being played out of position, no way he would walk into the SHU side as a CM. Other areas i agree we are better and should've done better, Wilder deserves a lot of priase for the work he's done over there.
I think Ole is tactically limited, I still see the team with no real shape in the build up to attacks. We seem to be incapable of doing anything but rely on our forwards pace to score goals. That said, our midfield is complete and utter shit at the moment, without Pogba and (cant believe im saying this) McTominay we are absolutely fecked. Fred and Perriera as a midfield two would not start for any top side. I think it was a colossal mistake not to sign any midfielders in the summer, everyone looking at the squad knew that but the club failed miserably.
I'm really torn about this one, there are some good managers sitting on the sidelines right now but if the club goes ahead and sacks Ole right now we will start over, again, for the fifth time in seven years. I also think that it does not solve the problems of the owners, Woodward, and recruitment strategy to sack the manager yet again. And whos to say that it will work out if we get Poch or Alegri? With idiots running the club it almost doesnt matter whos the manager.
I'm really torn about this one, there are some good managers sitting on the sidelines right now but if the club goes ahead and sacks Ole right now we will start over, again, for the fifth time in seven years. I also think that it does not solve the problems of the owners, Woodward, and recruitment strategy to sack the manager yet again. And whos to say that it will work out if we get Poch or Alegri? With idiots running the club it almost doesnt matter whos the manager.
Totally agree, suddenly we need a squad full of world class players to be able to challenge not for titles, but to challenge any team. Excuses are getting ridiculous now, people claiming Sheffield haves a better squad, ffs.
Not sure who claimed Sheff U has a better squad , certainly not me and It may have escaped you but the gap between teams is getting closer with each season, there is no top 4 anymore or top 2 when it was us head to head with arsenal most seasons then Chelsea for a while. Any premiership team is capable of beating anyone on their day (apart from Liverpool and their VAR get out of jail card).
I’m not saying they are bad players or Perreira walks into their team, but Ole wouldn’t buy any of them even if they were on a free transfer. He probably wouldn’t but Fred or Perreira either but I doubt he’d sea them for anyone at Sheff Utd.
I just thinks it’s odd people make this excuse for Ole and exaggerate how good other teams players are. That Sheff Utd team is a lot worse but they are managed and coached better. Put Ole in charge of that team and they’d be relegated.
Thats because it seems all we train is counterattacks, which have come handy against top sides which tend to take control of the game and leave spaces back that we can take advatage of, differente from other sides where we get the ball and have absolutely no idea of what to do with it without the open spaces.
Another one saying this. Where has anyone claimed that?
And when the same players get him a good result who gets the credit?
I like Pep, Klopp and Poch much more than I like Ole (as a manager) because Ole happens to be inept at this job. Is it weird? If so, I am weird, okay.You think it’s less weird to have a love-in for a sacked Spurs manager than it is for our own current manager?
Don't see the point is sacking ole at this point of time. The season is a write off from the get go given the mix and match squad we have and the sheer volume of deadwood we managed to accumulate.
Would rather give him time till the end of the season and the benefit of getting some key players back from injury. If at the end of the season or even in April, we are still languishing in this position and not at least challenging the top four, then by all means replace him.
Would rather give him time till the end of the season and the benefit of getting some key players back from injury. If at the end of the season or even in April, we are still languishing in this position and not at least challenging the top four, then by all means replace him.
Of course theres a clear top 4, and the gap hasnt got closer. It has only gone closer for us because we have fallen so much but you just need to look at the table to see the difference in quality.
Between the top 4 and the rest theres a 7 point gap, between 5th and 17th theres a 7 point gap as well. I think its pretty clear the gap there is between the top 4 and the rest.
"Any premiership team is capable of beating anyone on their day" Liverpool has lost just 1 of their last 51 games, City only 7 of the last 51 games. The statement that anyone can beat anyone is completely false, of course there's the luck factor but its highly unlikely that a low table team will beat a top table team.
So we basically write off another season just on the off chance that he might be good enough? He is a ten year managerial veteran, what we see is what we are going to get with him. Giving him a better squad might see us improving to 5th or 6th but we have the capacity to do better with the right man in charge.
I'm still Ole in but i will admit, after going two down i was like, you know what, Ole out. It wasn't necessarily the score, but the way we were getting mauled. Now, after we went back up 3-2 i calmed down and went back to my Ole stay for now position, but i will say this: If you are standing still, you are going backwards.
We've had mixed results, some really bad, but overall, not sure i'm seeing enough to say we are moving forwards. At best we are treading water. If we continue like this to the end of the season, i'll be in full support of us replacing Ole with Poch.
We've had mixed results, some really bad, but overall, not sure i'm seeing enough to say we are moving forwards. At best we are treading water. If we continue like this to the end of the season, i'll be in full support of us replacing Ole with Poch.
1) we still have the europa league to fight for a place for the UCL
2) feck me, wait until the end of the season to see if we are still floating around mid/low table...
Its not about single results, its about getting results constantly. You can't praise or criticize a manager on a one game base, and in the grand scheme of things, Ole has failed miserably.
Norwich beating city, saints getting beat 0-9 then nearly beating arsenal. Top 4 is who?
I read it on this forum, don't have the paciencie or will to look for the comments, but by saying that he can't win a game with Pereira and Fred its kind of accepting that our squad is way worse than the opponent.
No it isn't, you've most likely just made it up in your head because nobody would be so daft to say such a thing.
Starting a make shift midfield of Fred and Pereira against a settled, well functioning Sheff Utd midfield was never going to be easy though. You might think it should be but that just shows a lack of appreciation of other teams.
my comments on Villa were in relation to someone asking name any other manager who turned things around after 6 months so I did.
Any other club probably wouldn’t have stuck by Ole after this start of the season.
If you can’t see why Oles trying to do, then I think you’re not watching the games properly. There’s a style, we just need the right players to suit it and I think we’re 1 or 2 central midfielders from having it.
yeah we were trash against Sheffield United and there’s been some shit performances along the way. But you go back to Klopp getting the players in that he wanted, No one is giving Ole the time to do this, well I say no one, some logical people are.
As you seem to always go back to Klopp, some of his first signings were Matip, Karius and Klavan. He’s built a team over a number or seasons, he didn’t have one magical transfer window in which, Robertson, Alison, van Dijk, Firminio, Salah, The Ox, but Ole should have, apparently.
Yh we have multiple issues, one of which is squad depth but we can't erase the past and we should accept where we are now and think about how to fix it. This goes for the owners and Ed as well, they are where they are and not every issue the club has lies at their feet, we should be able to rationally look at the situation and say what we can realistically expect to improve and where it's acceptable that we are falling short given the process we are trying to put in place.
People make out like we've suddenly become some Championship fodder team without realising the reason we look so so bad on the pitch is because of how we're playing, not who is playing. No one is going to argue Sheffield United have a better squad than us, I'd argue we have a better XI in pretty much every position (and this can go for any of our losses or draws with teams like So'ton, Bournemouth, Palace etc), but yet we are consistently outplayed. One big sign of how tactically inept we are is that every discussion about us now evolves into if players are 'fighting' which is the way people usually discuss weaker teams who are expected to lose but as a minimum have to put everything on the line to even dream of getting a result. We don't have a squad to match the very best but it's easily better than where we are.
On the Molde point, that's a real reach. If we were a Championship club looking for a manager, he'd probably still be considered a risk but the size of this task is gargantuan and it's just so clearly beyond him. It sucks because this forum is just so negative and we all want United to do well - I honestly think this team can play exciting football but we need the right person to set the tone and teach this group of players because there is a lot of potential hidden in the team. Once that person is in place, it's the well thought out and small number of additive transfers that make all the difference in closing the gap to the top top teams.
I never said it would be easy, matter of fact it was stupid to send a two man midfield composed of Fred and Pereira. But that's not the point, the point its that some here are claiming that sending a two man midfield of Fred and Pereira was the only choice since we have such a poor squad, which is false.
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