Lukaku's response at the time:
Everyone who hates pc culture is defo a racist. Defo.
Go to Google Image search.
Epic Zlatan? No way!
I get a lot of dolls & loads of this dude...
There’s no fecking way Romelu Lukaku was going practically to enter a civil litigation suit against a majority shareholder of a massive football club. The public threat of suing is what Lukaku had to get out, and that’s what he did.
Good post that sums up my understanding of the situation too.I once again find myself in uncharted waters with racism nuances. A comment by Moshiri was surely racist (if it wasn't true, mind, but that's a bit hard to believe in) — as it was a generalisation based on Lukaku's heritage/ethnicity.
But when Ibra uses it, it's the opposite of a generalisation — it's a very direct dig at a situation that happened with Lukaku and no one else (unless you believe that Ibra has made a random racist comment that miraculously mirrored an actual scandalous situation that happened with Lukaku — again, that's highly unlikely); it doesn't allude to his race etc., but to a real story from Lukaku's life.
And then there's a bit that confuses me though. If Moshiri's comment was racist, did Ibra made a second-hand racist comment? Or, since it wasn't officially disputed in court (like Lukaku threatened to) and Moshiri hasn't apologised for it, is it a fair game for Ibra to use it?
Personally, I'd probably go with intent and I'm pretty sure that Ibra was going for a direct hit to Lukaku's personal history rather than on his race (if only for a simple reason that real situations tend to hurt more), but I'm open to people trying to argue otherwise.
P.S. none of that wooden shed lunacy, please
This is a much more nuanced view on it.I once again find myself in uncharted waters with racism nuances. A comment by Moshiri was surely racist (if it wasn't true, mind, but that's a bit hard to believe in) — as it was a generalisation based on Lukaku's heritage/ethnicity.
But when Ibra uses it, it's the opposite of a generalisation — it's a very direct dig at a situation that happened with Lukaku and no one else (unless you believe that Ibra has made a random racist comment that miraculously mirrored an actual scandalous situation that happened with Lukaku — again, that's highly unlikely); it doesn't allude to his race etc., but to a real story from Lukaku's life.
And then there's a bit that confuses me though. If Moshiri's comment was racist, did Ibra made a second-hand racist comment? Or, since it wasn't officially disputed in court (like Lukaku threatened to) and Moshiri hasn't apologised for it, is it a fair game for Ibra to use it?
Personally, I'd probably go with intent and I'm pretty sure that Ibra was going for a direct hit to Lukaku's personal history rather than on his race (if only for a simple reason that real situations tend to hurt more), but I'm open to people trying to argue otherwise.
P.S. none of that wooden shed lunacy, please
P.P.S. I'd also argue that the voodoo story in itself isn't trying to offend Lukaku on the base of his race, it's meant to highlight his hypocrisy (as in... wanted to go to Chelsea, but chose United's money); what makes it racist is that Moshiri uses voodoo instead of any other possible reason for the original decision to join Chelsea
Since we're on the topic of Italy, I'm reminded of the excuses/explanations from the ultras, managers, press and a few Redcafe posters every time there's racial abuse from the stands. The story is that it's not actually racism. They don't do monkey chants to liken black people to apes, and they don't shout racial slurs because they believe certain things about black people. They only do it because they know the black players don't like it and that they might get a reaction. If they could use something else then they would, thus it can't be real racism. This was a defense trotted out for Suarez as well.Personally, I'd probably go with intent and I'm pretty sure that Ibra was going for a direct hit to Lukaku's personal history rather than on his race (if only for a simple reason that real situations tend to hurt more), but I'm open to people trying to argue otherwise.
P.S. none of that wooden shed lunacy, please
I keep getting like 30 pics of the same doll with shirt buttons as eyes?
Agreed, It was stupid from Ibra because he clearly didn't think much before using it. He should know better at his age.
Wummy’s obviously getting tonnes of images that we aren’t based on his history, location & data.
For sure, something that can be bantered about between teammates isn’t always something that can then be thrown out in a heated argument.
Found the Norwegian in the thread.
I would think Zlatan but I wouldn't stick a nail in it.
fecking hell.
I think what we learnt with Cavani is that personal intent is irrelevant and how it is viewed in general is everything.I once again find myself in uncharted waters with racism nuances. A comment by Moshiri was surely racist (if it wasn't true, mind, but that's a bit hard to believe in) — as it was a generalisation based on Lukaku's heritage/ethnicity.
But when Ibra uses it, it's the opposite of a generalisation — it's a very direct dig at a situation that happened with Lukaku and no one else (unless you believe that Ibra has made a random racist comment that miraculously mirrored an actual scandalous situation that happened with Lukaku — again, that's highly unlikely); it doesn't allude to his race etc., but to a real story from Lukaku's life.
And then there's a bit that confuses me though. If Moshiri's comment was racist, did Ibra made a second-hand racist comment? Or, since it wasn't officially disputed in court (like Lukaku threatened to) and Moshiri hasn't apologised for it, is it a fair game for Ibra to use it?
Personally, I'd probably go with intent and I'm pretty sure that Ibra was going for a direct hit to Lukaku's personal history rather than on his race (if only for a simple reason that real situations tend to hurt more), but I'm open to people trying to argue otherwise.
P.S. none of that wooden shed lunacy, please
P.P.S. I'd also argue that the voodoo story in itself isn't trying to offend Lukaku on the base of his race, it's meant to highlight his hypocrisy (as in... wanted to go to Chelsea, but chose United's money); what makes it racist is that Moshiri uses voodoo instead of any other possible reason for the original decision to join Chelsea
Oh yeah, I seem to recall that ultras letter (was it about Balotelli?), it was astonishingly ridiculous in its unhinged racism.
Eh? You said do a google search, posters are telling you how theirs came back, obviously different to yours.
I know what voodoo is and I've never known it to be associated specifically with black culture. I thought it was witches and shit.
If you have searched Google for voodoo on images it is obvious you will get images of primarily black people among other images of 'dolls' and assorted images that have connotations of voodoo.
