Ryan Giggs - 900

[Eriku]

Ah feck it. He's untouchable. Forget the fact his mobility and inability to play simple passes and constant playing of the "flick on" leads to us constantly getting over run in midfield. I've given him credit for coming up with the odd assist but it cannot be over looked that his actual play is becoming detrimental to our overall play.

Over the last 2 months, his form has tailed off. But like I said, it's Giggsy and he's immune from criticism.

Sorry for not being a top red.

Curious... he's been like this ever since he couldn't blaze past full backs, and has become a creative passer.

It's what it looks like when he's a bit off the boil, but the margins that'll see him cut open defences are quite narrow indeed... I've always given him patience and I've always been vindicated. You're going to regret this, or try to explain it away.

 

[Pexbo]

Curious... he's been like this ever since he couldn't blaze past full backs, and has become a creative passer.

It's what it looks like when he's a bit off the boil, but the margins that'll see him cut open defences are quite narrow indeed... I've always given him patience and I've always been vindicated. You're going to regret this, or try to explain it away.

I just feel there is too much sentiment directed towards him these days and it's blasphemy to point out that his performances are starting to drop. People are calling on the odd goal and assist as proof but the proof is in the fact that our midfield is consistently out played when he is in it and I'm not talking just about teams like Bilbao. Look at his performance against Newcastle, Tiote ran the show, against Swansea in November Carrick might as well have been on his own, Swansea over ran us and only when he came off for Fletcher did we get a grip and see the game out.


This is exactly what I didn't want to happen, me to find myself becoming increasingly disappointed with Giggs' performances and to feel like I do when I see him starting in midfield.

 

[IrishLegend]

Ah feck it. He's untouchable. Forget the fact his mobility and inability to play simple passes and constant playing of the "flick on" leads to us constantly getting over run in midfield. I've given him credit for coming up with the odd assist but it cannot be over looked that his actual play is becoming detrimental to our overall play.

Over the last 2 months, his form has tailed off. But like I said, it's Giggsy and he's immune from criticism.

Sorry for not being a top red.

So....because your talking bollocks that makes me a top red? Awesome.

If you make attacking passes there's always the chance your going to give away possession, playing side ways and backwards passes all game isn't going to get you goals otherwise you become Arsenal. As said earlier the margin of error in attacking through balls is slim and Giggs still is the best player in the squad at them.

Giggs is one of the only central midfielders who can actually play a decent last pass.

And off the boil the last two months? Are you forgetting the Norwich result?

It's not sentiment it's fact. Carrick is much more of a deep lying player who starts off attacks rather than produces the final ball, Anderson is fat and injured, Cleverly has been injured for ages and is out of form, Scholes plays alot deeper than he used to, Fletcher is out for the conceivable future, Pogba is unproven, Park can't play CM.

So tell me, who do we have at the moment thats better than Giggs in CM that will provide assists.

 

[Pexbo]

So....because your talking bollocks that makes me a top red? Awesome.

If you make attacking passes there's always the chance your going to give away possession, playing side ways and backwards passes all game isn't going to get you goals otherwise you become Arsenal. As said earlier the margin of error in attacking through balls is slim and Giggs still is the best player in the squad at them.

Giggs is one of the only central midfielders who can actually play a decent last pass.

And off the boil the last two months? Are you forgetting the Norwich result?

It's not sentiment it's fact. Carrick is much more of a deep lying player who starts off attacks rather than produces the final ball, Anderson is fat and injured, Cleverly has been injured for ages and is out of form, Scholes plays alot deeper than he used to, Fletcher is out for the conceivable future, Pogba is unproven, Park can't play CM.

So tell me, who do we have at the moment thats better than Giggs in CM that will provide assists.

That's my point, we are relying on him at times and I just hope both him and Ferguson know when it's time. His attacking passes though are too hit and miss. For every gem there is 10 balls he floats in from deep in midfield which is easily cleared as well as the flicks which concede possession and come off 1 in 20 at best.

His mobility is my main gripe though, he's a pedestrian and too many average midfielders are being allowed to perform against him because they have the legs to get in and around him. There are still elements of his game which are obviously beneficial but as a whole, certainly in a two man midfield and sometimes in a three man midfield we're allowing the opposition too much space and time because he just can't get amongst them.

You look at the difference a player like Cleverley makes who gets around midfield offering himself and tracking the opposition. We need to invest this summer, if we don't we can't expect too much more from Europe next year. Too many youngsters, too many older players and not enough inbetween.

I've always felt you need to phase youngsters into successful teams, we need to keep this team successful so they will grow in a successful environment. How much do we learn from defeats like the one against Basel? Judging by the Ajax and Bilbao games, not a lot. How much did our players learn from Semi and Quarter Finals of the UCL season upon season?

 

[Gazza]

Giggs has been his usual self this season, to me. Inconsistent, occasionally frustrating, but one of our most creative users of a ball in attacking areas and probably second only to Rooney at finding space in midfield areas. His contribution at Emirates, for instance, was great and he has made important contributions and will make more before season's end. Certainly, when he has his occasional atrocity day when nothing comes off for him, it can be tempting to point to his age, but really he's always capable of having an off-day. He's still worth a place in the squad, blatantly, and he deserves plenty of match time too.

 

[Striker10]

I just think Welbeck should have played (if he was fit). His link up play, mobility are far superior and i think he would have caused them problems. Giggs is a legend but I don't think the champions league final was a shock and Bilbao, the way they played pretty much made him ineffective.

 

[IrishLegend]

That's my point, we are relying on him at times

Which is both a testament to his quality and clear indication that we need younger players of his class to replace him when he hangs up his boots

His attacking passes though are too hit and miss. For every gem there is 10 balls he floats in from deep in midfield which is easily cleared as well as the flicks which concede possession and come off 1 in 20 at best.

You'll find similar stats for any attacking player like that, I bet you Silva's is very similar in that respect, the difference is you probably only watch the highlights of other teams games rather than the full 90 minutes.

His mobility is my main gripe though, he's a pedestrian and too many average midfielders are being allowed to perform against him because they have the legs to get in and around him.

Yes he doesn't have the out and out speed anymore but he still has the composure and the agility to turn in tight spaces, Look at how he dicked all over Richards last season

You look at the difference a player like Cleverley makes who gets around midfield offering himself and tracking the opposition. We need to invest this summer, if we don't we can't expect too much more from Europe next year. Too many youngsters, too many older players and not enough in between.

I've always felt you need to phase youngsters into successful teams, we need to keep this team successful so they will grow in a successful environment. How much do we learn from defeats like the one against Basel? Judging by the Ajax and Bilbao games, not a lot. How much did our players learn from Semi and Quarter Finals of the UCL season upon season?

I actually agree with you here. We have some fantastic young players who are absolute quality but who are still error prone and inexperienced, especially in europe.

The thing is there isn't many quality European caliber players around the 26-29 bracket readily available especially at a reasonable price. As most decent CL teams aren't going to let their star performers go in their prime especially as most have already 'paid' for their experience in terms of the mistakes they'd previously made playing for them.

 

[Pexbo]

Just thought I'd point out that he proved my case once again tonight.

He shouldn't be playing in the centre of a two man midfield for us and I'm sceptical of him in a 3 man midfield these days as well.

That, for me, isn't good enough for a United midfielder, especially at home and especially when we are 1-0 up for 45 minutes and should be retaining possession.

Like I've said before, love the man to bits but it's pretty clear his performances have had an adverse effect on our actual play at times this season.

 

[gooDevil]

That's 79% passing, which is actually a bit higher than average for Giggs. He takes a lot of chances and makes a fair few high-risk passes, but he also gets a lot of assists because enough of them get through.

I can't help but wonder if having Scholes running the midfield for so many years has skewed people's views of what one should expect from a midfielder. Giggs has a different style but its very effective imo.

 

[Pexbo]

That's 79% passing, which is actually a bit higher than average for Giggs. He takes a lot of chances and makes a fair few high-risk passes, but he also gets a lot of assists because enough of them get through.

I can't help but wonder if having Scholes running the midfield for so many years has skewed people's views of what one should expect from a midfielder. Giggs has a different style but its very effective imo.

That's the problem. It's not Scholes who has skewed it at all. Carrick has passed more than anyone else in all but a couple of games that he has played this season and completed 90%+. Cleverley, aside from the Bilbao games has averaged 85%+ in the games he has played and moving away from United, Silva, even in a poor game by his standards at Stoke averaged 85%.

Possession is 9/10ths of the game right now and again and again and again our midfield has come under real pressure in the games he has played there.... and looked comfortable without him. The only game we haven't been comfortable in possession without him was the Tottenham game.... where Carrick was the top passer once again with 72/81 passes completed.

I'm going to get a reputation for knocking him soon but I think if people actually look at it objectively and not sentimentally they will realise how our game has suffered due to his lack of retention play and lack of mobility. He made no interceptions tonight and completed no tackles while attempting just one and despite all his speculative passing he created just once "chance" which was for Rafael just inside the area on the right flank. Is that really good enough?

 

[manutddjw]

I thought Giggs did good today, he made quite a few of his mazey runs that always impress the hell out of me.

In regards to Giggs the Central Midfielder:

He is not a natural Central Midfielder and lacks alot of key components that make a good central midfielder. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. The problem is alot of times, when teams play United, they use 3 in the middle vs our 2. That's when Giggs's midfield shortcomings are exposed, especially if we're playing a side with quality midfielders.

If it's a game against another side who also use 2 in the middle, Giggs is fine, because his footballing quality is good enough to make up for his lack of defensive work.

 

[Grunge]

We have to expect that players are by no means perfect and find it impossible to bring their A game very week. Especially if they are in their 30's ffs. (Maybe Messi?)

I do think Scholes should have come on a half time in place of Giggs but our only other creative option would have been the injury-prone Cleverly?

I've watched todays game a couple of times now, and a lot of players (not least of which was Giggs) gave the ball away a) needlessly and b) in positions that could have caused us a whole heap of trouble. Luckily Fulham were even more wasteful with the ball than we were.

The game should have been done and dusted by half time band yet with only a couple of exceptions, most red shirts under-performed today imo. The result was a nervy match and a fortunate three points in many ways.

 

[SirAF]

98 to go!

96 to go!

 

[Neutral]

Not one of his better games - but I'm not sure why so many people are going mental with regards to his passing....

This is how he always plays, he takes a lot of chances, and plays a ton of marginal balls...when they come off, great, but when they don't we cede possession to the opposition. Sure he longer plays on the wing, but that mentality hasn't left him....

 

[Brwned]

Obviously that image proves nothing because everyone already knew that's his game. Some people just happen to think that Giggs' good qualities - his willingness to go for the difficult ball, his dribbling to open up space - outweigh his bad qualities - poor ball retention. We're not a team that needs to have 60% possession to win 4 or 5 nil, in fact in the 5 games we've scored 4 or more we've never had over 60% possession and against Wolves we had just 51%. To the same degree we don't need all of our midfielders to be hitting 90% passing accuracy. The obsession with Barcelona's possession football and them has completely skewed people's opinion on how football should be played, IMO.

 

[marjen]

I'm going to get a reputation for knocking him soon but I think if people actually look at it objectively and not sentimentally they will realise how our game has suffered due to his lack of retention play and lack of mobility. He made no interceptions tonight and completed no tackles while attempting just one and despite all his speculative passing he created just once "chance" which was for Rafael just inside the area on the right flank. Is that really good enough?

He played Valencia completely through for a 100 % chance.. With a gloroiously weighted pass.

Say Rafael and Valencia put those away, you're left with a central midfielder getting two assists in a match - which isn't excactly ordinary. And which vindicates his 79 % passing completion.

But even without those two chances, his driving runs takes pressure off our midfield as well, and he's never afraid to demand the ball under pressure and try to find a forward pass.

Some of the decisions and passes he tried yesterday infuriated me, but that's Giggs for you. When it comes off he's absolutely magical, and this season he's provided enough assists for his inclusion to be merited.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

Obviously that image proves nothing because everyone already knew that's his game. Some people just happen to think that Giggs' good qualities - his willingness to go for the difficult ball, his dribbling to open up space - outweigh his bad qualities - poor ball retention. We're not a team that needs to have 60% possession to win 4 or 5 nil, in fact in the 5 games we've scored 4 or more we've never had over 60% possession and against Wolves we had just 51%. To the same degree we don't need all of our midfielders to be hitting 90% passing accuracy. The obsession with Barcelona's possession football and them has completely skewed people's opinion on how football should be played, IMO.

This times a hundred. Also I think it was 59% possession against Wolves but that still fits in with your point.

 

[Brwned]

There was Wolves 0-5 and then Wolves 4-1, I think we only had 51% in the home game.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

Oh ok, fair enough.

 

[Pexbo]

He played Valencia completely through for a 100 % chance.. With a gloroiously weighted pass.

Say Rafael and Valencia put those away, you're left with a central midfielder getting two assists in a match - which isn't excactly ordinary. And which vindicates his 79 % passing completion.

But even without those two chances, his driving runs takes pressure off our midfield as well, and he's never afraid to demand the ball under pressure and try to find a forward pass.

Some of the decisions and passes he tried yesterday infuriated me, but that's Giggs for you. When it comes off he's absolutely magical, and this season he's provided enough assists for his inclusion to be merited.

"But that's just Giggs for you" sums up the sentimental attitude towards him. Yes he comes up with a reasonable amount of assists for the season but in my opinion not nearly enough for the constant speculation his game is based on. I don't think we should be settling for that as a club, I don't think we should be settling for anything. It's a clear weakness in my eyes and we should be looking to improve on it. We're the top team in England and I don't think it's too much to expect us to have a midfielder who can both retain the ball and also play key passes.

It'd be forgiven if he also put in a shift defensively but he doesn't offer any protection to the defence and he's looked a pedestrian at times against good pass and move teams.

It's a clear weakness for us and we're blinkered because it's Ryan Giggs.

 

[RyanGoggs]

Looking purely at the analysis above, only one misplaced pass was in our half. The majority of them were medium to long range passes and a lot were in and around the opposition area. I think it shows that a lot of Giggs passes are of an ambitious nature rather than someone like Carrick who generally keeps it simple (and that not a dig at him)

Obviously trying harder passes is going to mean a lower accuracy, he could easily spend the whole game playing two yard passes to give himself a high passing percentage but that isn't entirely what the game is about.

Ok it wasn't his best game but bloody Hell he wasn't as bad as some are making out.

 

[Pexbo]

Looking purely at the analysis above, only one misplaced pass was in our half. The majority of them were medium to long range passes and a lot were in and around the opposition area. I think it shows that a lot of Giggs passes are of an ambitious nature rather than someone like Carrick who generally keeps it simple (and that not a dig at him)

Obviously trying harder passes is going to mean a lower accuracy, he could easily spend the whole game playing two yard passes to give himself a high passing percentage but that isn't entirely what the game is about.

Ok it wasn't his best game but bloody Hell he wasn't as bad as some are making out.

I'm not saying he's constantly losing the ball in high risk situations though, speculative passes into the opposition half are generally detrimental to our tempo though, our best play this season has been when we have held possession and pressed high up the field while moving the ball around and probing for an opening.

 

[Amar__]

I agree with Pexbo here.
I swear, I am starting to hate Giggsy because of his Hollywood passes. In first half yesterday I thought he gave every ball to Fulham, eventough his stats don't tell that. It's not the pressing that's the problem, since he probably has still best first touch in our team, but it's the unneccesary long hollywood passes for our strikers who our fail 9/10 times. I don't know, he is still great player obviously, but I think both Cleverley and Scholes can do better in that position than him. I believe Scholesy made more interceptions in last few minutes than Giggs made in whole game yesterday.

 

[Pexbo]

I agree with Pexbo here.
I swear, I am starting to hate Giggsy because of his Hollywood passes. In first half yesterday I thought he gave every ball to Fulham, eventough his stats don't tell that. It's not the pressing that's the problem, since he probably has still best first touch in our team, but it's the unneccesary long hollywood passes for our strikers who our fail 9/10 times. I don't know, he is still great player obviously, but I think both Cleverley and Scholes can do better in that position than him. I believe Scholesy made more interceptions in last few minutes than Giggs made in whole game yesterday.

I'm not starting to hate him, I'm not capable of ever doing that but I am starting to get that sinking feeling every time I see him lining up in midfield for us as every time he has played this season we've had poor possession and we've completely failed to dictate the game.

As I said before, Giggs didn't make a successful tackle (1 attemted) nor a single interception. Now I know people will argue that is not his role as he plays further up the field but that is totally wrong. Interceptions and tackles in the opponents half are as important as in your own half as this is when a lot of goals are created due to the opposition being caught off guard and out of position. The thing is, technically Giggs is excellent in the tackle and always has been it's just he's never mobile enough to harass the opposition any more.

I think it's pretty fecking clear that Ryan Giggs is no longer a good enough central midfielder for Manchester United.

 

[Cutch]

I'd rather he played the percentage game a little bitter. I dont mind him so much attempting the odd difficult pass, but he regularly tries passes that aren't on and eye of the needle stuff, when we'd be better retaining the ball a little longer for a better opening to develop. He was also guilty last night of a number of passes hit either too hard or too high, making it very difficult to control. The last 10 minutes especially it called for a cool head in possession and i didnt think he provided that, which invited a lot of pressure onto us.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

He plays like he's not a natural CM, it's a mixture of his remit as a CM and his lack of sensitivity for the tempo of play. He can still do a job there mind, especially when we need to chase games or close them out. Also I don't think you can criticise Giggs for lack of mobility, obviously defensively he's not great but yet again we have to keep in mind what his job is, his age and the fact he's not an out and out CM. The first 20 mins after HT he was excellent in the middle, he still has a lot to offer but I'd like to see him on the wing more often.

 

[Amar__]

I'm not starting to hate him, I'm not capable of ever doing that but I am starting to get that sinking feeling every time I see him lining up in midfield for us as every time he has played this season we've had poor possession and we've completely failed to dictate the game.

As I said before, Giggs didn't make a successful tackle (1 attemted) nor a single interception. Now I know people will argue that is not his role as he plays further up the field but that is totally wrong. Interceptions and tackles in the opponents half are as important as in your own half as this is when a lot of goals are created due to the opposition being caught off guard and out of position. The thing is, technically Giggs is excellent in the tackle and always has been it's just he's never mobile enough to harass the opposition any more.

I think it's pretty fecking clear that Ryan Giggs is no longer a good enough central midfielder for Manchester United.

I know you are not starting to hate him, neither do I, I said that in hyperbolic way. I don't enjoy watching him anymore in midfield, that's it.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

His pass completion this season is 80.5% only .3% worse than Rooney's. He also averages more key passes per game (pass leading to chances I presume) than any of our central players and he has as many assists as Rooney, Cleverley, Scholes, Anderson and Carrick combined. He also makes more accurate through balls per game than any other player in our squad. He's not a classic CM but he's very efficient.

http://www.whoscored.com/Teams/32/Show/England-Manchester-United

 

[Pexbo]

His pass completion this season in 80.5% only .3% worse than Rooney's. He also averages more key passes per game (pass leading to chances I presume) than any of our central players and he has as many assists as Rooney, Cleverley, Scholes and Carrick combined. He's not a classic CM but he's very efficient.

Statistics and miniskirts in my opinion and that assist statistic is wrong.

Giggs has 11 assists for the season.

Scholes has 0 in just 8 starts.
Carrick has 4.
Cleverley has 4.
Rooney has 4.

It's also ignoring the fact that Giggs has played off the front man where he picked up 2 assists in the Basel game at Old Trafford. So that's 9 assists for the season from midfield, one of which was a pass to Rooney 40 yards out when Rooney blasted it in. Hardly a "key pass" it was literally a 10 yard sideways pass and a similar one was a sideways pass from the right wing for Carrick's 30 yard drive against Bolton. It just goes to show that statistics hide the facts.

He's carried in midfield by Carrick, Scholes and Cleverley, they do the work of central midfielders while he is afforded the luxury of speculative pass after speculative pass with a high percentage of them not pulling off and actually losing us possession, losing our grip on the game and losing our tempo. I'd much rather see Scholes and Carrick afforded the luxury of the speculative pass as both are hugely better at passing than him.

 

[Pexbo]

His pass completion this season is 80.5% only .3% worse than Rooney's. He also averages more key passes per game (pass leading to chances I presume) than any of our central players and he has as many assists as Rooney, Cleverley, Scholes, Anderson and Carrick combined. He also makes more accurate through balls per game than any other player in our squad. He's not a classic CM but he's very efficient.

http://www.whoscored.com/Teams/32/Show/England-Manchester-United

So he sits just below Park and Berbatov in terms of average rating. Lovely.

 

[FlawlessThaw]

I don't think he's been great that season either but I hate to rag on him after that Norwich winner

 

[ArmchairCritic]

Statistics and miniskirts in my opinion and that assist statistic is wrong.

Giggs has 11 assists for the season.

Scholes has 0 in just 8 starts.
Carrick has 4.
Cleverley has 4.
Rooney has 4.

It's also ignoring the fact that Giggs has played off the front man where he picked up 2 assists in the Basel game at Old Trafford. So that's 9 assists for the season from midfield, one of which was a pass to Rooney 40 yards out when Rooney blasted it in. Hardly a "key pass" it was literally a 10 yard sideways pass and a similar one was a sideways pass from the right wing for Carrick's 30 yard drive against Bolton. It just goes to show that statistics hide the facts.

He's carried in midfield by Carrick, Scholes and Cleverley, they do the work of central midfielders while he is afforded the luxury of speculative pass after speculative pass with a high percentage of them not pulling off and actually losing us possession, losing our grip on the game and losing our tempo. I'd much rather see Scholes and Carrick afforded the luxury of the speculative pass as both are hugely better at passing than him.

It all depends what source you use, look at the link I have provided. Also I was talking about assists playing from central areas so count those Basel ones. He's hardly played in midfield next to Scholes and Cleverley IIRC so they aren't carrying him.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

So he sits just below Park and Berbatov in terms of average rating. Lovely.

And? I presume that's people rating him on the site, as I have said he's not a natural midfielder in that he can dictate the tempo but he does get the job done and provide something in that role. They gave him a 5.1 for the Tottenham away due to the error for the Defoe, ignoring the fact he helped us see out the game and gave us some much needed control even at 2-0 up.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Thought he gave up possession far too much last night, and tried the hollywood ball far too often.

But on the other hand some of his passes were beautiful, especially the 1 for valencia.

That tackle for his yellow card also was very rash.

I think he just looked a little out of match practise, it showed he had not played for 2 weeks or so.

But we know our ryan isnt the most consistent, im sure next game he will be back to his best.

 

[marjen]

So he sits just below Park and Berbatov in terms of average rating. Lovely.

I think you just needs to appreciate the different kind of quality he brings to our midfield.

I saw a statistic around the halfway mark of the season, which showed that Giggs was the player in the league that provided the most assists per minute played. In the whole league. That's including your Valencia's and your Silva's.

And this from a central midfield position. Something none of our other players are capable of providing from that position.

Added to this, normally he does a decent job of tracking back when partnered with Carrick, and he opens teams up with running at them from midfield, something few other players do for us.

I'll take those kind of qualities in exchange for a more risky approach to passing. Some games he will inevitably infuriate, but for the most part, Ferguson is the master of picking the right horse for the right course. And Giggs is quite an option in a lot of those courses.

 

[::sonny::]

Nice interview on italian football

http://video.gazzetta.it/gallese-manutd-parla-nostro-calcio/ce115630-778a-11e1-8d2d-960f07a82cab

 

[Bross]

In games where we play Carrick and Rooney who drops deep and helps out a lot of the time Giggsy's style is perfectly fine in midfield, especially against a poor side like Fulham. Carrick and Giggs complement each other nicely. We know what we get from Giggs, and against a defensive side parking the bus like Fulham his high-risk style is worth it.

If we dont play Carrick, Giggs shouldnt ever be played as part of a midfield 2. He also shouldnt play against good counter attacking sides (like Bilbao )

 

[Beachryan]

Despite their (now hyped up to virtuouso) performances together against Chelsea in the CL last season, I don't actually think the Giggs/ Carrick midfield pair works that well. The major issue is mobility and positionning.

Carrick showed yesterday that despite his fantastic form, he's still not the man you want chasing after midfielders. Any time he got closed to Dembele, the Belgian skinned him and was through at the defence. Normally you'd have another midfielder there covering - something even Scholsey does pretty well - but Giggs is always looking forward and doesn't fill the space.

There's nothing wrong with Giggs' forward thinking in his passing - that's what he's there for. But, the issue arises when he inevitably tries something too tricky when Carrick is also up the field. Some midfielders (Cleverley for example) are seriously mobile, so can get back and catch a counter attack. But Carrick and the now not sprinting Giggs are always left behind.

So either Carrick has to sit all game and never venture forward, or we need to stuff someone else in the midfield when the two of them are on the pitch together.

Neither is ideal, imo, and for me Giggs' true worth these days is as a pure AMF who is brought on for 30 minutes to unlock stubborn defences.

 

[Big Papi]

tis my first ever effort

edit ....and it's late

shit, it's bigger than I thought it would be
edit....thats what she said last night

 

[Pexbo]

Retire now please.

fecking joke.


26/35 Passes tonight.

10 of which were in the second half so no bull shit excuses of "attacking player trying things" thanks.

0 Chances created.

0 Successful take ons.

1/2 Tackles Completed.

Someone tell me what the point in him is again please?

Ruining his legacy. feck off and retire.

....and feck off it's not a knee jerk, I've been criticising him for being dogshit in exactly this way all season.