Yes. Would improve our off the ball movement and pressing game massively. He'd still need to buy 2-3 quality attackers though to implement his style
Would you sack LVG if it meant we could get Guardiola at the end of the season?
- Thread starter Rooney24
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Lot of ifs and buts.
That said, I'd rather we got a manager like Pep in over some git like Giggs. So as harsh as it would likely be on Van Gaal - yes.
That said, I'd rather we got a manager like Pep in over some git like Giggs. So as harsh as it would likely be on Van Gaal - yes.
I rate Pepinho as much as i rate Giggs. He has had amazing teams in leagues where the rest of the clubs are either feeders or non-threatening.
Not this again.
No white text?
Yup, got to agree that we fed his Barcelona team in the CL finals pretty well.
Only if in this imaginary scenario, Guardiola already wants to come to United.
Van Gaal is a bit of a cnut himself, so I think he'll understand United's "cuntishness", should this scenario ever happen.
Van Gaal is a bit of a cnut himself, so I think he'll understand United's "cuntishness", should this scenario ever happen.
Who is we? This is just a hypothetical on a fan forum, is hardly like the people who matter in taking these decisions are thinking along this line. And I assume people on here have more than one brain cell, so they can support Van Gaal and for a few seconds, give this imaginary situation some thought.
The truth is you can't really answer a hypothetical without looking at what might be the alternative. If the option were to keep Van Gaal for another year and end up with Giggs in 2017, I'd say clearly most fans would opt for Guardiola, harsh as it would be on Van Gaal. If the other option were Van Gaal continuing to build his team, as he's currently earning the right to do, with someone like Ancelotti coming in afterwards... Then I'd say that option would make sense.
Truth be told the most preferable for most people would be to keep Van Gaal until 2017/2018 and then for Guardiola to succeed him. It's probably a pointless hypothetical though as Guardiola will be aware that we'll be looking for a new manager within the next 2 years, so if he wants the job he'll probably bend his career around our timeline, rather than vice versa.
Truth be told the most preferable for most people would be to keep Van Gaal until 2017/2018 and then for Guardiola to succeed him. It's probably a pointless hypothetical though as Guardiola will be aware that we'll be looking for a new manager within the next 2 years, so if he wants the job he'll probably bend his career around our timeline, rather than vice versa.
I disagree with that, our current manager's contract ends in 18 months and we should concentrate an important part of our energy to what we will do at the end of his contract or before.
I'd be uncomfortable sacking LvG. I think at the very least he should see his contract out (which is only another season anyway). Also who knows what we will achieve this season?
I would like Pep to be LvGs successor though.
I would like Pep to be LvGs successor though.
LVG should/will only be sacked if he fails to reach agreed targets. At the moment we're 2 points off the top of the PL table, top of our CL group, defensively solid and slowly improving in attack.
There's obviously room for improvement and some of our bore draws have been hard to take but I don't even think Leeds would sack LVG with the way things stand.
There's obviously room for improvement and some of our bore draws have been hard to take but I don't even think Leeds would sack LVG with the way things stand.
Yes. Of course. LvG has only one or two more seasons before he wants to retire anyways and Pep could be here for at least 3-4 years depending on how long he wants to stay and 3-4 years seems to be usually the case.
This, I feel that not going after Guardiola would equate to prioritize the short term over the medium term.
Without a shadow of a doubt I would..
Yep. Especially when combined with vigorous pressing to win the ball back early, defenders comfortable enough in possession not to give the ball way and a defensive five quick and perceptive enough to defend on the half way line.
only if we massively upgrade our attacking options, no point letting pep suffer with having to build around rooney.
Someone reared on a diet of naff video games or highlights packages from football games, all drama music, all exciting action, might be startled by the discovery that in between the orgasmic moments of slow-mo shots hitting the back of bulging nets, is something that might be called ... actual football. All the pressing, the marking, the stepping up; the running without the ball; all the less glamorous stuff. The way (actual) football is played in the elite European clubs today is something constantly evolving. To a large extent Britain has missed out on these developments, and this thread kind of inspires me to look back a bit, and fill in some of the historical gaps in my own knowledge. It's an amazing story.
The soccer of Guardiola seems spontaneous, but it is not. - Jorge Valdano. Football has been on one helluva journey over the past thirty years, and both LVG and Guardiola will go down in history as huge figures in that history. The poetry/football of Barca and Bayern of today did not come from another planet, although it sometimes seemed that way. It came from a long evolution that started in the seventies in Holland, which football writers called 'Total Football'. Later it developed further, steered by the likes of... Cruyff. Van Gaal. Rijkaard. A lot of them were Dutch coaches in Spain. The Barcelona academy at La Masia, which started I think in the seventies, was a crucible of the modern game. One of most innovative thinkers of this particular era was Louis Van Gaal. In 1999 Louis was the coach of Barca, and the man he appointed his captain was ... Pep Guardiola. Interesting article here on the influence of Louis on the tactics of Pep.
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2013/jan/17/football-tactics-pep-guardiola
As to the question posed by the OP. No. But some day...
The soccer of Guardiola seems spontaneous, but it is not. - Jorge Valdano. Football has been on one helluva journey over the past thirty years, and both LVG and Guardiola will go down in history as huge figures in that history. The poetry/football of Barca and Bayern of today did not come from another planet, although it sometimes seemed that way. It came from a long evolution that started in the seventies in Holland, which football writers called 'Total Football'. Later it developed further, steered by the likes of... Cruyff. Van Gaal. Rijkaard. A lot of them were Dutch coaches in Spain. The Barcelona academy at La Masia, which started I think in the seventies, was a crucible of the modern game. One of most innovative thinkers of this particular era was Louis Van Gaal. In 1999 Louis was the coach of Barca, and the man he appointed his captain was ... Pep Guardiola. Interesting article here on the influence of Louis on the tactics of Pep.
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2013/jan/17/football-tactics-pep-guardiola
As to the question posed by the OP. No. But some day...
No. We gave the man a 3 year contract. I'd like us to honor it as he is trying to build something and isn't out of his depth like his predecessor.
No, not unless van Gaal fails to achieve his objectives. As much as I don't like the football under him, sacking a manager just because a better one is available would be a move I'd hate to see my club do.
Yep I'd even order and pay for his taxi to the airport.
I agree with this. If there is an opportunity to get Pep at the end of the season then we should take it (and thats a big if), and thank LVG for his service.
It isnt about whether LVG has been good or bad, but rather that we should always be planning for the long term, and if LVG plans to leave after the 16/17 season anyway then we should be looking and planning for life beyond. No hard feelings, just doing what is best for the club.
If we do keep LVG for next season however then I imagine that it will be Giggs who takes over afterwards.
Edit: This applies to Pep, not Ancelotti, who I do not rate as highly, and only if Pep joining was a certainty/pre-agreed.
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No. Sets a terrible precedent.
I dont see moving the manager on early as cruel or machiavellian at all. We should do what is in the best interests of the club.
Would Pep be a long term solution? That's the question for me. Could he settle in Manchester? The last thing we want, is change ever few years. Even next summer it's a problem as players will know LVG has one year left - thought some may be happy under Giggs. It's not so easy. It's a process. The United job is unlike any he would have dealt with before. LVG has done a lot of good but maybe pep would have the guts to push them forward. That said, you never know who we might bring in to improve the team.
No,
Stick with LvG, he's organised our defense into the best in the League. He sorted out our terrible midfield by making some excellent signings, so let him do the same with the attack. He's basically rebuilding our entire squad after the Moyes Mess. Alright we're not playing great football at the moment, but when you look at our attack he's only purchased Martial and Memphis. We need more reinforcements so let him have time to finish the job and rebuild our attack, it's the last piece of the puzzle.
Stick with LvG, he's organised our defense into the best in the League. He sorted out our terrible midfield by making some excellent signings, so let him do the same with the attack. He's basically rebuilding our entire squad after the Moyes Mess. Alright we're not playing great football at the moment, but when you look at our attack he's only purchased Martial and Memphis. We need more reinforcements so let him have time to finish the job and rebuild our attack, it's the last piece of the puzzle.
I would. It seems like classless thing to do but it's reasonable. LvG isn't gonna be here for a long time, in fact he'll leave in another year or two years top anyway so If we had a chance to get one of the best manager out there why not ?
Same here, because it will result in an unending cycle of sacking; it is setting bad precedent. Being better is always a snapshot in time, who knows how things are in a year. As much as I like Pep, saying he is 'better' is still for discussion and if he is better here is even more of a gamble. I rate and like Pep, but that Barca team was full of enormous talent, he shaped them nicely but with Messi, a shiteload of cash and a very good generation at La Masia everything gets so much easier. Then he went to Bayern and with all due respect the way Heynckes left it even a donkey could win the league over there. The financial disparity between Bayern en the rest of the Bundesliga is uncanning, they just stripped their fiercest competitor of all their stars to let them partially warm the bench ffs. That has little to do with Pep being the best, rather the way Bayern was run the past decade. Still Pep has to show he can do it in Europe this season with Bayern, if he gets booted out again in the quarter or semi of the CL he actually did worse than his two predecessors. The point I am trying to make is the Manchester United job is much more demanding than he is used to and there is no certainty he will perform as he did at Barca. A club should fire their coach if confidence is lost, he does not meet the objectives or there are clearly way more competent managers on the market. Otherwise let the manager do his job, that vicious cycle of changing managers on the go is very damaging to a club on the long term.
I don't see why not. How is sacking a manager to get a significantly better one wrong? We do the exact same thing when we buy and sell players. If we had
Personally I find it hard to believe that Guardiola couldn't achieve the same results and better than LVG is currently getting while playing more attractive, exciting football.
Personally I find it hard to believe that Guardiola couldn't achieve the same results and better than LVG is currently getting while playing more attractive, exciting football.
Would Pep take the job if it meant we sacked van Gaal for him?
Why? Maybe he could maybe he couldn't. Pep does not guarantee great football and great results immediately. It's his third year at Bayern and it's hardly been perfect up to now. They've played some very dull football at times in the previous two seasons. He's had his fair share of doubters, as well, and he'd arguably have an even harder time at United than Bayern.
To answer the question - no, absolutely not. Van Gaal inherited a mess and started building something new. He's laid the foundations and they look more than solid. It's only fair that he gets his chance to finish what he started and be judged on the whole thing. If Pep really wants the job he can another break or stay a year longer in Bayern. I'm sure they'll take him.
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Yeah
Only when a player fails to perform. No one gets rid of a player that's doing what's asked of them.
If at the end of the season Guardiola was available then yes, I'd thank Louis for his services and give him a nice pay off. And I'm a fan of what the manager has done here so far.
We need to look at the long term picture. Plus, anything that keeps Giggs out of the hotseat is fantastic news for the safety of the club.
Guardiola would feel like the natural successor to Van Gaal given the foundations put in place already.
We need to look at the long term picture. Plus, anything that keeps Giggs out of the hotseat is fantastic news for the safety of the club.
Guardiola would feel like the natural successor to Van Gaal given the foundations put in place already.
Keep Louis, he has us on the right track... Don't whore yourself out and pull your pants down at the first stud that comes along and looks at you, we have more class than that, thats a chelsea type move.
Lets keep our dignity and honor the commitment we have made, also it sets a terrible precedent for the players and future managers that our managers are now dispensable in that manner.
Lets keep our dignity and honor the commitment we have made, also it sets a terrible precedent for the players and future managers that our managers are now dispensable in that manner.
Yeah you do, if a better player in the same position becomes available you absolutely do.
I guess the analogy falls down because you only have one manager, whereas you have multiple players competing for one position. But if you have a fantastic centre back, say, but an upgrade becomes available, you buy the upgrade and bench the capable and loyal but inferior player. And sell him if he is struggling to get games or would prefer to play first team football.
It happens all the time.
Nope
Indeed.
No. Not for Guardiola.
No