[stevoc]

It is clearly coincidental. For example in the league, with Blind and De Gea in the team we've P30, W14, D8 and L8. Those are horrible numbers, completely coincidental with the fact that they've played pretty much every game.

Well we just aren't that good a side right now and as you say they have played every game so you can't really glean anything from the sides w/d/l ratio that would indicate whether those two are a positive/negative to the side

But our stats with and without Fellaini starting shows a stark contrast in the teams fortunes whenever he plays. To argue otherwise is silly.

 

[Sunny Jim]

Odd inclusion for a feature on Football focus today. Clearly his PR people arranged it.

Must have said "I'm not dirty I just protect myself" about 20 times.
Bizarre

attack is the best form of defense

 

[Robbie Boy]

I just don't get Fellaini.

 

[settembrini]

– United’s record (all competitions) this season when Fellaini starts: P18, W6, D6, L6.
– United’s record (all competitions) this season when Fellaini doesn’t start: P29, W16, D7, L6.

So half the games we have won when starting Fellaini have been against teams in either the championship or league one?

 

[stevoc]

So half the games we have won when starting Fellaini have been against teams in either the championship or league one?

Correct Ipswich, Sheffield United and Derby. The other 3 being 2x against Liverpool and 1x vs Stoke.

Here's a breakdown of our stats in all comps with and without Fello starting.

Without Felllaini:---------------------With Fellaini:
P - 30--------------------------------P - 18
W - 17 = 56.6%---------------------W - 06 = 33.3%
D - 07 = 23.3%---------------------D - 06 = 33.3%
L - 06 = 20.0%----------------------L - 06 = 33.3%

Our record in the games where he starts is the very definition of bang average, if he started every game we would probably be 12-13th going off those numbers.

 

[Oneunited26]

Exactly. He may put in a decent individual performance at times but he brings others around him down.

And the worry? he does not really praise morgan, but when fellaini was playing VG could not wait to praise how well he played, one of many reasons why VG is the wrong man for the job. We will see next game if VG cannot help himself, and shoehorn this clumsey idiot again in our starting 11

 

[MThomas]

Fellaini does have a purpose, which i admit is easy to forget at times.

He's a bit like a bog brush, in the sense that he's shit and that he's only good at one thing. If you try using a bog brush to wash the kitchen sink, you're in for a nightmare, if you try using it as a walking stick, you'll struggle, if you try using it as a deodorant, you're in for a treat. It's only good for one thing, and when there is no need for that spesific task it's easy to forget that it even exists. Until you use it, and you think "there really should be a better way of doing this". Which coincidentally is how the majority feels when they watch Fellaini play, "There really should be a better way"

Fellaini reckons he's a defensive midfielder, which is pretty much a bog brush in denial thinking it's a beautiful rose. He's not a defensive midfielder. It's far more likely that he doesn't understand what defensive means, and that if you ask him, he'll elbow you in the throat.

 

[iKeano]

A club like Sunderland may well shell out £10 million or so. He'd do well for them and it's about his level.

Harsh on Sunderland that....

 

[theyneverlearn]

When we went on a good run with him in the team last year, he was played in a target role further up the pitch. He was able to get the ball down in tight spots in the final third and move the ball on.

This year for some strange reason, LvG is starting him in a CM role where he is expected to pick the ball up off the defense and link the midfield to attack. Clearly he doesn't have the ability to do this and he makes whoever his unlucky CM partner for the day is look terrible too.

I'm not defending him, but he is being asked to play a role he doesn't have the ability to play. It's clear for the fans to see, but stubborn LvG continues to persist, even though the evidence points towards it being a massive mistake.

Hopefully we move him on in the summer.

 

[MThomas]

Fellaini's good run is being glorified like it was the holy grail of good runs, it's slightly bizarre.

Was he good, yes. Was he superb, no. It was just a surprise that he went from utter shit to good.

The other teams had no plan for him, a bit like the infamous match against us which he is still remembered for, when we allowed him to roam between midfield and defence and unchallenged he kept chesting the ball down and caused us huge problems.

We then played Chelsea, who nullified him with ease, and he then went off to be complete shite for the rest of the season, with the added bonus of an insanely daft red card.

 

[Walrus]

Fellaini's good run is being glorified like it was the holy grail of good runs, it's slightly bizarre.

The fabled "good run" is brought up far more by the critics than the supporters of Fellaini at this point. It is the latest flavour-of-the-month much like "he isnt actually that good in the air" was last month.

 

[Jacob]

So you're saying that we shouldn't criticize bad players at all?

No. I am saying the criticism should take the players ability into account.

 

[Boycott]

Who would have thought two years after Moyes' departure that Fellaini will still be one of the most discussed players on the forum...

 

[Cheesy]

Fellaini's good run is being glorified like it was the holy grail of good runs, it's slightly bizarre.

Was he good, yes. Was he superb, no. It was just a surprise that he went from utter shit to good.

The other teams had no plan for him, a bit like the infamous match against us which he is still remembered for, when we allowed him to roam between midfield and defence and unchallenged he kept chesting the ball down and caused us huge problems.

We then played Chelsea, who nullified him with ease, and he then went off to be complete shite for the rest of the season, with the added bonus of an insanely daft red card.

He was consistently decent over the course of the season to be fair, although his excellent run did happen to come at a time when we were playing our best football in a while as a team. It was a bit like Cleverley and Anderson's early 2011/2012 runs of form. Excellent for a while, but soon faded away.

The fabled "good run" is brought up far more by the critics than the supporters of Fellaini at this point. It is the latest flavour-of-the-month much like "he isnt actually that good in the air" was last month.

Well, he's not that good in the air, in all fairness. He doesn't score/create chances anywhere near often enough, loses a surprising number of aerial duels, and is only consistently good at defensive set-pieces because he's taller than other players, meaning it's easier for him to make contact with the ball. His technique/aim from headers is average.

 

[Perrick Dubois]

Well we just aren't that good a side right now and as you say they have played every game so you can't really glean anything from the sides w/d/l ratio that would indicate whether those two are a positive/negative to the side

But our stats with and without Fellaini starting shows a stark contrast in the teams fortunes whenever he plays. To argue otherwise is silly.

To try and extrapolate some form of conclusion out of those stats is equally silly. They mean nothing.

 

[stevoc]

To try and extrapolate some form of conclusion out of those stats is equally silly. They mean nothing.

Using the stats on their own perhaps not i would be inclined to agree, but all these stats are providing is statistical evidence to confirm what the majority of United fans already think from watching United's performances this season when Fellaini starts in CM. Which he has done for the majority of his games this season.

Whenever he starts in there we are a worse side, we can all see it even if we don't all want to admit it yet. He offers little if anything in attack, slows down play and abandons his midfield partner and leaves our midfield wide open to be overran.

In that context when you then look at these stats, well they paint a picture.

Without Felllaini:---------------------With Fellaini:
P - 30--------------------------------P - 18
W - 17 = 56.6%---------------------W - 06 = 33.3%
D - 07 = 23.3%---------------------D - 06 = 33.3%
L - 06 = 20.0%----------------------L - 06 = 33.3%

For whats its worth last season whenever he played in the side further up the pitch in his more natural position (which he did for the most part) i thought we were a better side with him than without and i'd bet the same sort of stats would back that up.

Edit: Heres the same stats from last season.

With Fellaini:-------------------------Without Fellaini:
P - 23--------------------------------P - 21
W - 14 = 60%-----------------------W - 09 = 42%
D - 03 = 13%------------------------D - 08 = 38%
L - 06 = 26%------------------------L - 04 = 19%

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Fellaini does have a purpose, which i admit is easy to forget at times.

He's a bit like a bog brush, in the sense that he's shit and that he's only good at one thing. If you try using a bog brush to wash the kitchen sink, you're in for a nightmare, if you try using it as a walking stick, you'll struggle, if you try using it as a deodorant, you're in for a treat. It's only good for one thing, and when there is no need for that spesific task it's easy to forget that it even exists. Until you use it, and you think "there really should be a better way of doing this". Which coincidentally is how the majority feels when they watch Fellaini play, "There really should be a better way"

Fellaini reckons he's a defensive midfielder, which is pretty much a bog brush in denial thinking it's a beautiful rose. He's not a defensive midfielder. It's far more likely that he doesn't understand what defensive means, and that if you ask him, he'll elbow you in the throat.

Are you Lord Byron? Great post

 

[Drifter]

Louis van Gaal is not using “very good” Manchester United midfielder Marouane Fellaini correctly, according to Belgium coach Marc Wilmots.

Fellaini’s performances have come under heavy criticism from United supporters this season, but Wilmots believes he has been hamstrung by Louis van Gaal’s preferred 4-2-3-1 formation.

Fellaini himself has previously said he sees himself as a defensive midfielder, but Wilmots says the 28-year-old is better without a partner in the deep role. Wilmots believes the former Everton man’s best position, however, is as a box-to-box midfielder.


“I know him by heart,” Wilmots told The Times. “In my eyes, he is a box-to-box [midfielder]. He could also play as No. 6 by himself, but not with a partner.

“He has the ability to play on the offensive too, as Everton used him. He is the best goal scorer I have. He is a very good player with a unique profile, but he is a player who must be used taking his qualities into account.”

 

[dichinero]

Louis van Gaal is not using “very good” Manchester United midfielder Marouane Fellaini correctly, according to Belgium coach Marc Wilmots.

Fellaini’s performances have come under heavy criticism from United supporters this season, but Wilmots believes he has been hamstrung by Louis van Gaal’s preferred 4-2-3-1 formation.

Fellaini himself has previously said he sees himself as a defensive midfielder, but Wilmots says the 28-year-old is better without a partner in the deep role. Wilmots believes the former Everton man’s best position, however, is as a box-to-box midfielder.


“I know him by heart,” Wilmots told The Times. “In my eyes, he is a box-to-box [midfielder]. He could also play as No. 6 by himself, but not with a partner.

“He has the ability to play on the offensive too, as Everton used him. He is the best goal scorer I have. He is a very good player with a unique profile, but he is a player who must be used taking his qualities into account.”

Fellaini says #6
Wilmots says #8
Moyes says #10
LvG says #9

I say Left Back, left back on the bench!

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

The position Van Gaal played him at the back end of last season is the position i'd play him. He was excellent and unplayable at the time.

 

[Cee90]

Whenever (and wherever) he played for Everton he was an absolute menace to play against.

I don't know exactly what that position was, but I feel we can get more out of him and utilise him better.

One thing I do know, is that he's clearly not suited to play in a central midfield pairing.

In an age where footballers have to be flexible (in terms of positions they can play and styles), he is very one dimensional, but he does have some useful qualities.

 

[MThomas]

The position Van Gaal played him at the back end of last season is the position i'd play him. He was excellent and unplayable at the time.

It was a very short time

 

[MThomas]

Whenever (and wherever) he played for Everton he was an absolute menace to play against.

Not really.

He was a menace against us for one match.

 

[dichinero]

It was a very short time

I wonder if we will talk about it next season too.

 

[finneh]

The position Van Gaal played him at the back end of last season is the position i'd play him. He was excellent and unplayable at the time.

Except that after maybe 3 games of him playing well in that position Mourinho realised that all you have to do is stick a mediocre centre back on him and not only does he become useless, but the entire tactics that playing him is based around become useless to.

 

[Cee90]

Not really.

He was a menace against us for one match.

Sorry, but that's simply not true.

 

[Amir]

I remember him doing big damage against us in that 4-4 game and when we lost 0-1 to Everton in the first game of the following season. So much, that Fergie put Jones to man mark him when we beat Everton 2-0 later on.

 

[Amar__]

He is the best goal scorer I have

You must feel sorry for Belgium.

 

[Beachryan]

The only thing he's bringing us right now is defensive headers. With Blind injured (FFS) perhaps we'll have 2 centre backs in there that can do their jobs, and not need a dedicated corner clearer in central midfield.

He's awful at CM, we play awful with him at CM and it really is that simple.

He should be a last 25 minutes optino when we're losing, should stick at the edge of the area and create havoc. That's all he's good for, and he's good at that. LVG's misuse of him is astonishing.

 

[dirkey]

I honestly believe if he starts any game between now and the end of the season, it puts a huge dent in our ambitions to finish top 4.

 

[Loublaze]

Louis van Gaal is not using “very good” Manchester United midfielder Marouane Fellaini correctly, according to Belgium coach Marc Wilmots.

Fellaini’s performances have come under heavy criticism from United supporters this season, but Wilmots believes he has been hamstrung by Louis van Gaal’s preferred 4-2-3-1 formation.

Fellaini himself has previously said he sees himself as a defensive midfielder, but Wilmots says the 28-year-old is better without a partner in the deep role. Wilmots believes the former Everton man’s best position, however, is as a box-to-box midfielder.


“I know him by heart,” Wilmots told The Times. “In my eyes, he is a box-to-box [midfielder]. He could also play as No. 6 by himself, but not with a partner.

“He has the ability to play on the offensive too, as Everton used him. He is the best goal scorer I have. He is a very good player with a unique profile, but he is a player who must be used taking his qualities into account.”

He must have dirt on Wilmots too.

 

[Loublaze]

You must feel sorry for Belgium.

I feel sorry for Lukaku and Benteke

 

[Perrick Dubois]

Wilmots believes he has been hamstrung by Louis van Gaal’s preferred 4-2-3-1 formation.

Correct. Along with Herrera and Schniederlin who are both predominantly box to box players who operate in the space rather than in the position.

“I know him by heart,” Wilmots told The Times. “In my eyes, he is a box-to-box [midfielder]. He could also play as No. 6 by himself, but not with a partner.

Correct. I've seen him play well as a anchor style #6 under Martinez before his transfer to United and for Moyes for a consistent spell. But he never played as part of a midfield two, more as the base of a three (or the a central role dropping off if ever in a two). After those two seasons under Moyes he played that Tim Cahill style withdrawn forward role in which he scored a healthy but not extortionate amount of goals and showed some goal scoring worth.

I think if we had have stayed playing 4-3-3 we might have got some more worth out of him post-injury at the start of the season. But then Young or Memphis would have been bumped out of the side and he certainly wasn't worth the first choice or system change going into the season coming off an injury. He's had a handful of decent to admirable performances in the variety of roles we have used him in this season but playing him as a forward was definitely awful. He's not a striker and can't hold the ball up when it is humped at him, he's better off in the space or free with an all-round role.

 

[shamans]

Not really.

He was a menace against us for one match.

Ehh No. He was a menace a lot of times against many teams. He was Everton's key player

 

[Welsh Wonder]

Louis van Gaal is not using “very good” Manchester United midfielder Marouane Fellaini correctly, according to Belgium coach Marc Wilmots.

Fellaini’s performances have come under heavy criticism from United supporters this season, but Wilmots believes he has been hamstrung by Louis van Gaal’s preferred 4-2-3-1 formation.

Fellaini himself has previously said he sees himself as a defensive midfielder, but Wilmots says the 28-year-old is better without a partner in the deep role. Wilmots believes the former Everton man’s best position, however, is as a box-to-box midfielder.


“I know him by heart,” Wilmots told The Times. “In my eyes, he is a box-to-box [midfielder]. He could also play as No. 6 by himself, but not with a partner.

“He has the ability to play on the offensive too, as Everton used him. He is the best goal scorer I have. He is a very good player with a unique profile, but he is a player who must be used taking his qualities into account.”

wat

 

[iKeano]

I feel sorry for Lukaku and Benteke

Lukaku - 12 goals in 47 appearances. 25.5%. 1 goal every 202 minutes.
Benteke - 9 goals in 31 appearances. 29%. 1 goal every 228 minutes.
Fellaini - 15 goals in 67 appearances. 22.4%. 1 goal every 343 minutes.

Clearly Wilmots has been dabbling in Van Gaal's hazy dutch stash.

 

[RedDevil@84]

wat

He is correct I think. Fellaini with 15 international goals and good amount in the qualifiers is the top scorer in the entire team

 

[iKeano]

He is correct I think. Fellaini with 15 international goals and good amount in the qualifiers is the top scorer in the entire team

Moot point. Rooney is England's top scorer of all time... but he isn't even the best striker in the team.

 

[MThomas]

Sorry, but that's simply not true.

Against us ? Yes, it is...

 

[Kostur]

wat

As the RDevil says above, iirc he was their top scorer in the qualifiers or in 2015.