United - Soton | EFL Cup Final Build-up Thread

[Yagami]

I've watched Southampton's last few games and am looking forward to seeing how Romeu copes against us. He's been excellent in every Soton game I've watched and is a one man midfield at times. Bertrand is also very good, both attack wise and defensively. He also links up very well with Redmond who's their biggest attacking threat for me. Van Dijk is a huge miss as, in my opinion, along with Romeu and Bertrand, he's been their best player this season.

Gabbiadini's done well there in not only getting his goals but in his general play, too. He has good movement, fights for the ball, and can hold it up. He isn't that strong but he shields the ball with his body and throws himself to the ground at the slightest bit of contact. The ref always gives him the FK so we'll have to watch ourselves with this one.

 

[ElQuesoGrande]

I would swap Smalling for Rojo (Baily - Rojo).

Quality wise Id agree but smalling and Bailly seem to have a good understanding together and so do rojo and Jones so Id choose one of those two pairings. Id go for the former personally

 

[TMDaines]

Just realised we've not won a penalty shootout since the 2008/09 season. Lost all four since then.

That said, if the match did end up going to penalties, I would expect us to now have a strong suite of players potentially taking them: Zlatan, Pogba, Martial to start. I'd be happy with Mata, Herrera, Blind, Mkhi and a few others taking them too.

 

[TMDaines]

If Mkhi and Carrick are out, I think Lingard may get himself a cup final. Either goes with Fellaini for 4-3-3, or a 4-2-3-1 with Lingard joining Mata and Martial.

 

[Android1974]

If Mkhi and Carrick are out, I think Lingard may get himself a cup final. Either goes with Fellaini for 4-3-3, or a 4-2-3-1 with Lingard joining Mata and Martial.

I agree those are the two options. I would try the Lingard one, which is the least disruptive of the way we've been playing lately.

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

It won't happen, but I'd be tempted to play Schweiny if Carrick is out. It's a natural like for like replacement.

 

[RedMaestro]

Just realised we've not won a penalty shootout since the 2008/09 season. Lost all four since then.

That said, if the match did end up going to penalties, I would expect us to now have a strong suite of players potentially taking them: Zlatan, Pogba, Martial to start. I'd be happy with Mata, Herrera, Blind, Mkhi and a few others taking them too.

Thought I'd look at how good/bad the players are at penalties. Total (career) penalty goals in the team:

• | Goal | Miss | Success Rate |

1. Ibrahimovic.............68......................9.........................88,3 %
2. Mkhitaryan............... 6......................1.........................85,7 %
3. Pogba........................5......................1.........................83,3 %
4. Rashford....................3......................0.......................100,0 %
5. Martial.......................5......................1.........................83,3 %
6. Herrera......................2......................0.......................100,0 %
7. Schweinsteiger..........9......................2.........................81,8 %
8. Mata.........................10......................4........................71,4 %
9. Rooney.....................33......................9........................78,6 %
10. Young........................5......................3.........................62,5 %
11. Carrick.......................0......................1...........................0,0 %

 

[wolvored]

I think this will be a tough game but can see us winning it 2-0, probably with the second being in the last 7-8 minutes so will be a tense affair up till then.

 

[NJM78]

Southampton are no mugs but have been very hot and cold this season. Van Dijk is a big miss for them and with our form over the last 20 games being won 15 drawn 4 lost 1, scored 39 and conceded only 9 - I'm feeling very confident about this one. We also have a big game player in Zlatan who I feel will score and probably the winning goal. If Carrick and Micky are ruled out Martial and Mata supporting Zlatan should be strong enough. Fellaini is a disaster of a player and I would even throw Bastian in behind Pogba and Herrera instead of him but I doubt very much Jose will do that. Either way I think we will win a hard thought game 2 or 3-1 and pick up our first major trophy under Jose.

 

[Seven Seas Sardines]

If Mkhi and Carrick are out, I think Lingard may get himself a cup final. Either goes with Fellaini for 4-3-3, or a 4-2-3-1 with Lingard joining Mata and Martial.

In place of Mata, Martial or Rashford? O god no!

 

[Sylar]

4231 would be fine to go with on the wembley pitch. I think the way the pitch is, it will suit Pogba playing a deeper role to ping the ball, and having Martial, Mata + 1 more behind Zlatan would work.
Tony V being back will be key of course.

 

[ChaddyP]

4231 would be fine to go with on the wembley pitch. I think the way the pitch is, it will suit Pogba playing a deeper role to ping the ball, and having Martial, Mata + 1 more behind Zlatan would work.
Tony V being back will be key of course.

How is it any different from our pitch?

 

[pacifictheme]

How is it any different from our pitch?

Bigger i believe.

 

[Sylar]

How is it any different from our pitch?

Bigger i believe.

Strange, I thought it was bigger too especially after hearing it from somebody (and from initial look of being pitch side for both).
But according to google OT is bigger. And St Marys is about the same size as Wembley (thought Wembley was one of the biggest in terms of widths in the country).
Eg Spurs one is small thats why im not shocked they have struggled to play the same type of game at Wembley (eg CL matches). Also why Arsenal struggled when trying to play their home games there years ago.

 

[ChaddyP]

Bigger i believe.

the stadium maybe... not the pitch.

 

[Klopp_De_Klown]

Oh the countdown is on

First Trophy under Jose is just 1 game away, all going our way, as we should expect it to.

And we are really starting to look good too. We are winning games easy as if they are starting to fear us a little. Not expelling too much energy and we have started to find the net. The understanding between the players has really improved and we have genuine competition for places.

But we are without Carrick and Mkhi and southampton have had a lot of rest leading up to this to heal up all them little niggles and knocks. On their day they are a real handful as tough as anybody.

It wont be easy but we have to stay positive. Come on United, lets get this one done and dusted.

 

[Solius]

With Carrick and Mkhi out and Luke Shaw deceased, I'd go with:

de Gea
Valencia - Bailly - Smalling - Blind
Herrera - Pogba
Lingard/Rashford - Mata - Martial
Ibrahimovic​

 

[Sassy Colin]

Oh the countdown is on

First Trophy under Jose is just 1 game away, all going our way, as we should expect it to.

And we are really starting to look good too. We are winning games easy as if they are starting to fear us a little. Not expelling too much energy and we have started to find the net. The understanding between the players has really improved and we have genuine competition for places.

But we are without Carrick and Mkhi and southampton have had a lot of rest leading up to this to heal up all them little niggles and knocks. On their day they are a real handful as tough as anybody.

It wont be easy but we have to stay positive. Come on United, lets get this one done and dusted.

We already have one trophy under Jose.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

Is it certain Mkhitaryan is out?

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Thought I'd look at how good/bad the players are at penalties. Total (career) penalty goals in the team:

• | Goal | Miss | Success Rate |

1. Ibrahimovic.............68......................9.........................88,3 %
2. Mkhitaryan............... 6......................1.........................85,7 %
3. Pogba........................5......................1.........................83,3 %
4. Rashford....................3......................0.......................100,0 %
5. Martial.......................5......................1.........................83,3 %
6. Herrera......................2......................0.......................100,0 %
7. Schweinsteiger..........9......................2.........................81,8 %
8. Mata.........................10......................4........................71,4 %
9. Rooney.....................33......................9........................78,6 %
10. Young........................5......................3.........................62,5 %
11. Carrick.......................0......................1...........................0,0 %

I assume this doesn't include penalty shoot-outs? As i'm sure I've seen Carrick score in a shoot-out for us before.

Edit - Google tells me i'm wrong apparently!

 

[manc exile]

We already have one trophy under Jose.

not really

real trophy not glorified friendlies

 

[Sassy Colin]

not really

real trophy not glorified friendlies

Ask Moyes whether it counts as a trophy or not

 

[Klopp_De_Klown]

We already have one trophy under Jose.

Ah now come on... Youre not banging this old drum are you?

 

[Danillaco]

Is it certain Mkhitaryan is out?

Waiting on that too. Hopefully not, and that hamstring was just precautionary.

 

[Floyd]

I assume this doesn't include penalty shoot-outs? As i'm sure I've seen Carrick score in a shoot-out for us before.

Edit - Google tells me i'm wrong apparently!

You're not wrong. Carrick scored in Moscow and in the 2007, 2008 and 2009 Community Shield!

Missed against Boro in the League cup in 2015 and against Burnley in the PL in 2009.
The ball from the Boro penalty is still not found.

 

[Billy Blaggs]

Ask Moyes whether it counts as a trophy or not

I'd rather not

 

[SSSSnake]

Southampton are not in good form. They have lost two league games on the trot and are away at Sunderland next who will be elated after their last two games. So it could be a three game losing run.

Form goes out the window for cup finals mate.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

You're not wrong. Carrick scored in Moscow and in the 2007, 2008 and 2009 Community Shield!

Missed against Boro in the League cup in 2015 and against Burnley in the PL in 2009.
The ball from the Boro penalty is still not found.

Nice one! I reckon if we look back at our Community Shield penalty scorers there would be some real random ones in there.

Also, feck Google.

 

[Billy Blaggs]

Form goes out the window for cup finals mate.

We'll still win

 

[Michael Edge]

After the two injury setbacks yesterday my side going into it would be:

DDG
Valencia - Bailey - Rojo - Blind
Pogba - Herrera
Rashford - Mata - Martial
Zlatan

Would actually like to see Blind given a shout in replacing Carrick with Shaw at left back but obviously no chance of that happening.

 

[Ixion]

Ask Moyes whether it counts as a trophy or not

Spoiler

 

[Floyd]

Nice one! I reckon if we look back at our Community Shield penalty scorers there would be some real random ones in there.

Not really, all well known good players. 1993 was the first year with a penalty shoot out, up until then the teams shared the title if they drew.

1993
Arsenal 1–1 Manchester United
Wright

40' [21] Hughes

8'
Penalties
Winterburn O
Jensen O
Campbell O
Merson O
Wright X
Seaman X 4–5
OInce
O Bruce
X Irwin
O Keane
O Cantona
O Robson

1997
Chelsea 1–1 Manchester United
M. Hughes

52' Johnsen

58'
Penalties
Sinclair X
Zola O
Di Matteo X
Leboeuf O 2–4
OScholes
O Irwin
O Keane
O Butt

2003
Arsenal 1–1 Manchester United
Henry

20' Report[dead link] Silvestre

15'
Penalties
Edu O
Van Bronckhorst X
Wiltord O
Lauren O
Pirès X 3–4
OScholes
O Ferdinand
X Van Nistelrooy
O Solskjær
O Forlán

2007 (VDS' big day!)

• Chelsea (0):
  • Pizarro (saved)
  • Lampard (saved)
  • Wright-Phillips (saved)

• Manchester United (3):
  • Ferdinand (scored)
  • Carrick (scored)
  • Rooney (scored)

2008
Manchester United 0–0 Portsmouth
Report
Penalties
Tevez O
Giggs O
Carrick O 3–1
X Diarra
O Defoe
X Mvuemba
X Johnson

2009
Chelsea 2–2 Manchester United
Carvalho

52'
Lampard

70' Report Nani

10'
Rooney

90+2'
Penalties
Lampard O
Ballack O
Drogba O
Kalou O 4–1
X Giggs
O Carrick
X Evra

 

[miley_bob]

I assume this doesn't include penalty shoot-outs? As i'm sure I've seen Carrick score in a shoot-out for us before.

Edit - Google tells me i'm wrong apparently!

Carrick scored a penalty in the 2008 Champions league shoot out.

 

[Minimalist]

Control the midfield and don't give any daft goals away (defensive blunders) and we're probably good for a tidy win.

Hope it's good match though.

 

[ZAGREB RED]

Losing Carrick is a blow - but whether he would have played after playing in the Blackburn and St. Etienne games I'm not sure - but losing Mkhitayrahn is an even bigger loss, although I'm sure if they both don't make it, Mourinho will still be able to put together a team capable of winning the game. If Bailly and Smalling is to be the preferred CB pairing, I just hope Rojo doesn't play LB. Blind is the best current option for that position.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Not really, all well known good players. 1993 was the first year with a penalty shoot out, up until then the teams shared the title if they drew.

Spoiler

1993
Arsenal 1–1 Manchester United
Wright

40' [21] Hughes

8'
Penalties
Winterburn O
Jensen O
Campbell O
Merson O
Wright X
Seaman X 4–5
OInce
O Bruce
X Irwin
O Keane
O Cantona
O Robson

1997
Chelsea 1–1 Manchester United
M. Hughes

52' Johnsen

58'
Penalties
Sinclair X
Zola O
Di Matteo X
Leboeuf O 2–4
OScholes
O Irwin
O Keane
O Butt

2003
Arsenal 1–1 Manchester United
Henry

20' Report[dead link] Silvestre

15'
Penalties
Edu O
Van Bronckhorst X
Wiltord O
Lauren O
Pirès X 3–4
OScholes
O Ferdinand
X Van Nistelrooy
O Solskjær
O Forlán

2007 (VDS' big day!)

• Chelsea (0):
  • Pizarro (saved)
  • Lampard (saved)
  • Wright-Phillips (saved)

• Manchester United (3):
  • Ferdinand (scored)
  • Carrick (scored)
  • Rooney (scored)

2008
Manchester United 0–0 Portsmouth
Report
Penalties
Tevez O
Giggs O
Carrick O 3–1
X Diarra
O Defoe
X Mvuemba
X Johnson

2009
Chelsea 2–2 Manchester United
Carvalho

52'
Lampard

70' Report Nani

10'
Rooney

90+2'
Penalties
Lampard O
Ballack O
Drogba O
Kalou O 4–1
X Giggs
O Carrick
X Evra

Cheers for the list... I can barely remember Butt, Keane, Ferdinand or Evra ever taking penalties for us.

 

[Floyd]

Cheers for the list... I can barely remember Butt, Keane, Ferdinand or Evra ever taking penalties for us.

This is from the 2005 Fa Cup final, our most undeserving loss ever, we KILLED Arsenal that day. Keane again scoring from the spot.

Ronaldo was toying with Lauren all day long, Rooney the same with Cole.

Arsenal 0–0 (a.e.t.) Manchester United
Report
Penalties
Lauren O
Ljungberg O
Van Persie O
Cole O
Vieira O 5–4
OVan Nistelrooy
X Scholes
O Ronaldo
O Rooney
O Keane

 

[Skills]

Cheers for the list... I can barely remember Butt, Keane, Ferdinand or Evra ever taking penalties for us.

Rio took one in that FA cup semi against Everton too. Missed that one.

 

[Carlsen19]

Form goes out the window for cup finals mate.

It does to an extent but there are still games that you'd expect to be straight forward, regardless of it being a final or not. This, IMO, is one of those.

 

[AXVnee7]

Don't mean to sound arrogant but it really is ours to lose. Southampton are an excellent team and are deservedly in the final, but we still a tier above. I hope the players don't adopt this attitude though and instead approach the game as if it's the last football match they'll ever play.