Classical Mechanic
Full Member
What's your beef with swans?He’s literally the stereotypical Tory. A swan in a human’s body.
What's your beef with swans?He’s literally the stereotypical Tory. A swan in a human’s body.
Fascist c*nts.What's your beef with swans?
In a way all solutions to this have the potential to be declared a success. It all depends on how much pain people are prepared to take and for how long. Is the EU system the best there is? The Aussies among others might disagree.No way, he can't possibly be that deluded. He's a calculating lying prick. His plan is (and has been) to throw in a spanner into anything that might work to reap the profits of the chaos that ensues. Have no doubt, he is in it for personal gain.
They're aggressive. I'll give you that.
To be fair they always seemed a little chippy to me too.
Maybe you're right. But if we crash out in the worst of circumstances leading to massive job losses and 8% negative growth then Nigel Farage (who is a genuine charlatan) will be nowhere to be seen. I think JRM would face the music.I think he's deceitful and trying to manipulate the public to get the conclusion he will profit the most from, which is for the UK to crash out of the EU.
Hopefully history will reveal his true reasons in time.
Right, we can have a discussion whether there's possibly better ways of organising oneself than the EU currently does, I completely accept that. I accept that many Britains thought/think Britain is capable of better, it is understandable.In a way all solutions to this have the potential to be declared a success. It all depends on how much pain people are prepared to take and for how long. Is the EU system the best there is? The Aussies among others might disagree.
I was not entirely happy with the EU but voted remain - on the don't-rock-the-leaky-boat or better-the-devil-you know basis.
If the UK does crash out and the subsequent economic carnage does happen then all of those responsible for the lies should be held to account . Criminally they'll get away with it but hopefully the public will realise that they have been conned and these people will be finished as politicians/public figures.Maybe you're right. But if we crash out in the worst of circumstances leading to massive job losses and 8% negative growth then Nigel Farage (who is a genuine charlatan) will be nowhere to be seen. I think JRM would face the music.
JRM will bring back the pounds he took abroad before the referendum and they will be worth twice as much.Maybe you're right. But if we crash out in the worst of circumstances leading to massive job losses and 8% negative growth then Nigel Farage (who is a genuine charlatan) will be nowhere to be seen. I think JRM would face the music.
I think with Mogg at least the woes are genuine. He is stuck in a time warp. The others are a lot more sinister IMO. I think net immigration in terms of the rate of increase was a concern of many in the UK. Sovereignty? Nah. The ECJ? I suspect in some quarters people thought that was an earth moving vehicle. The degree of vitriol towards the EU just plain did not exist across the population as a whole. Most, like me, found it mildly irritating from time to time but for the most part were not that arsed about it.Right, we can have a discussion whether there's possibly better ways of organising oneself than the EU currently does, I completely accept that. I accept that many Britains thought/think Britain is capable of better, it is understandable.
But when the person who says it lies all day and night for years on end (any of the major brexiteers, any!) why would I believe them when they say so? Why would I believe some lying populist caricature of an upper class Brit when he says we'll be so much better off? I've listened to JRM, i've listened to BOJO, i've listened to Farage. There's loads of things one can criticise the EU for, but not remedying their made up woes isn't one of them. At some point I lost respect for these people (brexiteer politicians), lie to me 10 times and I'll listen to you an 11th time to see if you speak truth. But lie to me a million times and I'll start thinking those that still believe you are mentally inept.
(Royal you, not you personally @Honest John)
He's Sideshow Mogg.
They should then confiscate it under the unexplained income rules.JRM will bring back the pounds he took abroad before the referendum and they will be worth twice as much.
It’s all just posturing. What he actually wants is a general election and he will lie through his teeth to try end get the outcome he wants. He’s a politician. That’s what they do."Jeremy Corbyn had a constructive meeting with Scottish first minister Nicola Sturgeon. They discussed their common opposition to Theresa May’s botched Brexit deal and determination to work across parliament to prevent a disastrous no deal outcome."
So they don't want May's deal, they don't want No Deal, the only other choice is to Remain in the EU. There is no other deal.
Yes, for sure he wants a general election, which I highly doubt will happen and which he would probably lose anyway.It’s all just posturing. What he actually wants is a general election and he will lie through his teeth to try end get the outcome he wants. He’s a politician. That’s what they do.
I suspect also the government are also considering making a free vote (like they did in 1971)If the government has approved it being made available then it must rate the WA + FTA very favourable.
Even JRM admits there are not enough letters.Does anyone actually trust the conservative party to actually tell the truth over whether there are enough letters to call for a vote of no confidence? Is there anyone verifying it or is it all on one person?
It wouldn't be beyond a May loyalist to lie or delay telling the truth until it's in her favour, then pretend they made a mistake if called out on it.
It's one guy. He's said that people who have publicly claimed to send a letter in haven't, that would be easy to disprove considering it's a short list.Does anyone actually trust the conservative party to actually tell the truth over whether there are enough letters to call for a vote of no confidence? Is there anyone verifying it or is it all on one person?
It wouldn't be beyond a May loyalist to lie or delay telling the truth until it's in her favour, then pretend they made a mistake if called out on it.
nothing other than we are one day closer to it all going wrongIs there any actually news today?
129 days to go, 129 days ago England lost to Belgium in the WC 3rd place play-off.nothing other than we are one day closer to it all going wrong
I read up again about Heath's strategy in 1971. The free vote thing was a bit of a master stroke. With most commentators saying they'd lose or it was too close to call, they wound up with a 112 majority.I suspect also the government are also considering making a free vote (like they did in 1971)
Yes this will probably loose them another 5 cabinet votes... but it will make it impossibe for labour to put up a 3 line whip to compel members to vote against it without looking like they are putting party politics first and potentially therefore carrying most of the blame for a no deal...
its a roll of the dice but shes out of other options so they will release everything they can to get labour mps on board - especially those who know that momentum is going to de-select them anyway so why not actually vote for a deal if they think its better than the alternative
its going to come down to how is hated most in their own party - may or corbyn - and its gonna be close - the state of uk politics eh
it was ken clarke who talked him into it apparently...I read up again about Heath's strategy in 1971. The free vote thing was a bit of a master stroke. With most commentators saying they'd lose or it was too close to call, they wound up with a 112 majority.
Amazing Ken Clarke's still around, if somewhat past it. One of the very few tories I've ever had any time for.it was ken clarke who talked him into it apparently...
and of course it was a key reason the labour party split...
Nah, they were gonna lose a vote on it anyway so spared themselves the added anguish.If the government has approved it being made available then it must rate the WA + FTA very favourable.
I don't know if it would happen but the worry of being deselected I image plays a part. Considering it a lot easy to do now.it was ken clarke who talked him into it apparently...
and of course it was a key reason the labour party split...
I have to say Im not sure there are enough MP's who would vote with the conservative party this time... I also dont think many would want to be seen to abstain on the issue so labour MP's really would be throwing their career under a bus I think to side with May?
That said if there was a new centrist Remain Party formed Im sure there would be plenty more who might jump ship and sail into the election on that particular lifeboat - but I hoestly dont think there is time for that.
Gut feel Mays vote fails by 20 or so votes
yes - he came to office in 1970... same election as the beast of bolsoverAmazing Ken Clarke's still around, if somewhat past it. One of the very few tories I've ever had any time for.
i have to say if there was a snap general election they might be safe - or does labours new selection policy come into effect if an election is called... because I think if one is called then it 6 weeks to the polls and thats going to be messy if there is infighting over who the candidate is and incumbent mps standing as independents etc.I don't know if it would happen but the worry of being deselected I image plays a part. Considering it a lot easy to do now.
He should have been the Tory Party leader at some point in his career, but he was too pro-Europe, or something.Amazing Ken Clarke's still around, if somewhat past it. One of the very few tories I've ever had any time for.
He finiahed 2nd to haigue I think in 97He should have been the Tory Party leader at some point in his career, but he was too pro-Europe, or something.
That's exactly my memory of it. He as good as threw away his chance to be PM because he wouldn't give up or hide his views on Europe.He should have been the Tory Party leader at some point in his career, but he was too pro-Europe, or something.
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Yeah f*ck the people. The union is way more importantTweet
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A tweet from a BBC NI reporter. Says alot when local NI business leaders and even farmers are now saying they back May's deal. Unsurprisingly the DUP aren't happy about that and it has upset Arlene and Sammy as they are more concerned about the Union than the people back home having a few quid.
that is the tl:dr of their manifestoYeah f*ck the people. The union is way more important