In terms of CO2 emitted per year we're doing worse every year though.In any case, that was my point, there has been a hell of a lot of change. We have seen a lot of impact, just in the UK and there are projects and initiatives all over the World.
In terms of CO2 emitted per year we're doing worse every year though.In any case, that was my point, there has been a hell of a lot of change. We have seen a lot of impact, just in the UK and there are projects and initiatives all over the World.
Yes, it is ridiculous. More than that, it's quite sad. Sad that this is the extent to which you can stretch your imagination to imagine what more you, and your generation, could have done to have prevented us from getting into such a terrible position. It's people like you that make it necessary for someone like Greta to do what she's doing. The kind of person that says on the one hand "who cares what little girls say, listen to the scientists" and on the other hand says "we should appreciate what's been done already". You're not fecking listening to the scientists.You are not personally responsible, neither do I hold you personally responsible, you are not the arbiter of the universe either. You can't go round wringing your hands saying "If only I hadn't taken that extra plastic bag in Sainsbury's", that's ridiculous.
If it's any consolation, I could probably count on my fingers the number of times I have eaten McDonalds/Burger King, and I can only think of one time I have brought coffee shop coffee. So from that point of view I have been doing my bit long before it was well known as an issue.
You can't deal with the reality, that much is clear. But it is the reality. What we've done so far is not worthy of celebration, unless your view of humanity is so low that you think pitiful progress is the best we can expect.The landmark report shows oceans “are poised to turn into a huge threat to humanity “unless we massively scale up emission cuts in line with the goal to keep temperature rise to 1.5 degrees”, said Wendel Trio, director of Climate Action Network Europe.
“Without much deeper cuts to emissions, the growing threat of superstorms, rising seas, melting Glazers and permafrost will imperil hundreds of millions of people. The destruction will be far worse if governments don’t adopt more ambitious goals for reducing carbon pollution,” he added.
So far the responses from European leaders to the climate crisis have been maddeningly slow, he said. “After underwhelming commitments made at the UN climate action summit, the EU needs to speed up its work towards adopting a more ambitious climate target by early next year. Bringing it in line with the Paris Agreement’s target to limit temperature increase to 1.5 degrees will require emissions to be reduced by 65 per cent by 2030.”
Half the world’s megacities, and almost two billion people, live on coasts. Even if heating is restricted to just two degrees, scientists expect the impact of sea level rise to cause several trillion dollars of damage a year, and result in many millions of migrants.
“The future for low-lying coastal communities looks extremely bleak,” said Prof Jonathan Bamber at Bristol University in the UK, who is not one of the report’s authors. “But the consequences will be felt by all of us. There is plenty to be concerned about for the future of humanity and social order from the headlines in this report.”
Or better yet, rant online and just vote every 4 years. That's how real change happens.It's better to make speeches, lobby governments and conduct scientific research than block the traffic like a bunch of fecking idiots.
This is not true Colin. Source: All recent human history.It's better to make speeches, lobby governments and conduct scientific research than block the traffic like a bunch of fecking idiots.
@Brwned You can apologise for all of those condescending pro Pogba posts for a start!If you can articulate what you think deserves an apology, I'll be happy to consider. From what you quoted, I can't see anything. On the flipside, you immediately chose to act condescendingly towards me in pretty bizarre fashion. Don't worry though, no apology needed.
tbh, I would have advocated civil disobedience to stop Brexit. However, 6 - 7 M people signed a petition and 1M people marched in London, both of which were completely ignored.This is not true Colin. Source: All recent human history.
The significant positive changes in western society over the past 100 years to so have mostly come about when people have protested and caused disruption.
The peaceful, socially acceptable methods available to in-act change are slow and impotent. We are programmed from birth to not rock the boat, not speak up against power, to just keep quiet and conform.
Asking nicely for change gets you feck all. It's only when people rise up together and say 'feck no!' do things start to happen, for example the civil rights movement or the labor movement.
There are so many examples of a scientific consensus being formed yet feck all changes happening because companies have bought politicians. It took decades for governments to start standing up to tobacco lobbyists. Leaded gasoline was known to be poisonous the day it was invented, but it took more than half a century to get governments to ban it from car fuel. These are examples of how slow the system is when you use the appropriate channels.
There's been a consensus of climate change for a couple of decades yet Trump is walking back regulations on coal consumption.
After the consensus started forming in the early 90s, the first couple of decades was spent denying and discrediting the research led by the likes of the Koch brothers (and other oil companies). The consensus is so emphatic nowadays they've more-or-less given up denying it (much like the Heartland Institute gave up telling us smoking is safe). The tact has changed now towards rhetoric like "enough is being done already" or "well its too late now anyway" or "well volcanoes cause way more C02 anyway" or "you can't protest if you took a flight to get here". Anything to stop the public consensus shifting towards the need for serious action.
The reaction to Greta's speech is extremely telling, the same groups obfuscating the debate are terrified that she will start a movement. Governments hate movements (see Cointelpro).
Check out Murdochs Sky News Australia's output on it;
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=sky+news+australia+greta+thunberg
The scientific research all points towards the fact that not enough is being done. It is governments and businesses that need to make a drastic change, and that won't happen unless people stand up and demand it.
I guess we’re in agreement then?tbh, I would have advocated civil disobedience to stop Brexit. However, 6 - 7 M people signed a petition and 1M people marched in London, both of which were completely ignored.
Surprised at this as I always thought you were a decent poster and I'm sure in most respects you still are!That stupid little girl has been labelled the new Jesus.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....greta-thunberg-successor-to-jesus-christ.html
But I did know you were a massive spanner.I didn't know that Colin was Jeremy Clarkson.
Great post.Surprised at this as I always thought you were a decent poster and I'm sure in most respects you still are!
Just to put some perspective on Greta. Unsurprisingly she is no new Jesus, but I have two daughters aged 8 and 10, they both think Greta is the best thing ever, both have learnt a huge amount about the climate crisis as a result and now both are actively trying to change how we as a family live and along with their friends how their school operates.
You might think this is small fry, but grass root changes can make big changes to societies as whole. To put it in context, we currently live in Cambodia and I work on environmental projects here and in Indonesia. We can see climate change happening before our eyes, I've worked with people forced to abandon their homes and land, who have lost their only sources of income and who have lost family and friends directly to climate change.
It's very easy to sit in Europe and other developed countries and be annoyed by the fact you might have to drive an electric car one day, or that pesky protesters have blocked another bridge, you can feel pleased that you never buy coffee or go to Burger King, but the reality of the situation still feels a million miles away. Like in so many areas it is the world's poorest that are affected first and that's happening right now.
But this will reach you too during the heatwave in the UK this summer deaths per day went up by approx 35% and unless we change now that will only get worse.
If some people listen to the Green politicians and others to Greta then, brilliant more people are getting the message, but what she is doing is vital, we could do with millions more Gretas and with a little luck she is inspiring the people that will have to live with this mess when you and I are gone, right now.
most things don't have the dire consequences that climate change will bring us if we continue on our current course. actually, not us - as in me and you - but our kids. people Greta's age.Let's be honest, nothing is ever enough for anyone on any subject, whatever it is. You still need to recognise what has been done already, and you can do that without resting on your laurels, and continue to with those projects, whilst adding more once the technology/funding is in place.
I’m not middle aged (I’m 24) and honestly she irritates me too. I think it’s the ridiculous hysterics in her speech which all come off as B tier acting and the whole ‘you’ve stolen my childhood’ schtick from a rich little girl growing up in total comfort. It just all appears a bit silly coming from her.nothing you've said justifies calling Greta a stupid little girl, either. i don't even really care, it's just that there is such a reaction to her particularly from middle aged men that i'm just trying to understand it a little better. because it's so weird.
The message is indeed a very good one but unfortunately she presents it as if it's her own words, although it seems to be more like the words of professional speech writers to me. I've a horrible feeling that there's a character assassination bid waiting just around the corner.I’m not middle aged (I’m 24) and honestly she irritates me too. I think it’s the ridiculous hysterics in her speech which all come off as B tier acting and the whole ‘you’ve stolen my childhood’ schtick from a rich little girl growing up in total comfort. It just all appears a bit silly coming from her.
Her message is a very good one and I (and lots of other people I know) generally agree with what is being said, but the manner she puts it across is pretty off putting.
I wouldn’t call her a ‘stupid little girl’ or anything like that, because she’s 16 and trying to do something positive, but I can’t pretend she’d be my ideal spokesperson to unite people.
is there more than just that one speech that you’re basing this on? Ive not heard many other speeches of hers tbhI’m not middle aged (I’m 24) and honestly she irritates me too. I think it’s the ridiculous hysterics in her speech which all come off as B tier acting and the whole ‘you’ve stolen my childhood’ schtick from a rich little girl growing up in total comfort. It just all appears a bit silly coming from her.
Her message is a very good one and I (and lots of other people I know) generally agree with what is being said, but the manner she puts it across is pretty off putting.
I wouldn’t call her a ‘stupid little girl’ or anything like that, because she’s 16 and trying to do something positive, but I can’t pretend she’d be my ideal spokesperson to unite people.
Hear hear.is there more than just that one speech that you’re basing this on? Ive not heard many other speeches of hers tbh
although I don’t really care whether she’s emotional or not. she is garnering support from people her own age and people of other generations too. I have nothing but respect for her.
I’ve seen her speak a few times and I’m not keen on her style, really. She comes off as weirdly distant in some (kinda creepy, actually) and then in others ultra emotional and bordering on hysterics.is there more than just that one speech that you’re basing this on? Ive not heard many other speeches of hers tbh
although I don’t really care whether she’s emotional or not. she is garnering support from people her own age and people of other generations too. I have nothing but respect for her.
The situation is fecked and everyone is criticising her speaking style?!I’m not middle aged (I’m 24) and honestly she irritates me too. I think it’s the ridiculous hysterics in her speech which all come off as B tier acting and the whole ‘you’ve stolen my childhood’ schtick from a rich little girl growing up in total comfort. It just all appears a bit silly coming from her.
The situation is fecked and everyone is criticising her speaking style?!
You are 24... so probably too old. My son's 12, he's very environmentally conscious and concerned about his future, and this girl speaks loudly to him, as a member of the generation which is going to be most affected. Other kids don't see her awkwardness and lack of polish, they see someone their age speaking up for them when nobody else is. More power to her.
yeah, right...I‘m just saying I’m not surprised that a lot of people haven’t warmed to her is all. Personally I couldn’t care less who puts the message across because it’s the correct one, but can I see why some people don’t really like her? Sure. She’s hysterical and it’s hard to take her ‘ruined my childhood’ shit remotely seriously.
I know people younger than people who found her to be a bit cringe, especially the preachy childhood bit when she herself has lived a very privileged upbringing. The idea she’s united ALL the youth is incorrect, I’ve found she’s divisive amongst all age groups as a speaker. A lot of people I’ve spoken to found her UN speech especially to be basically B tier acting with all the hysterics and sharp intakes of breath.
Again though, I don’t want to focus too much on her because it really doesn’t matter, but I just dislike the whole any criticism of Greta = hatred/propaganda angle. You can not take to her delivery while still saying she’s fundamentally doing the right thing.
it's beyond ridiculousThe climate is fecked, we’re on the point of no return and on the caf and elsewhere sadly, we’re discussing whether a 16 year old Swedish girl with Aspergers spoke well when she addressed the UN.
#subscribetopewdiepiesure the planet is dying but she was a bit cringe
Correction. The planet is certainly not dying. It has been here for 4.5bn years and will be for billions more.sure the planet is dying but she was a bit cringe
Very well put.The climate is fecked, we’re on the point of no return and on the caf and elsewhere sadly, we’re discussing whether a 16 year old Swedish girl with Aspergers spoke well when she addressed the UN.
ThanksCorrection. The planet is certainly not dying. It has been here for 4.5bn years and will be for billions more.
It is the human race that will die out because we are making it uninhabitable for ourselves.
If it could, the planet would probably heave a massive sigh of relief when we are gone.
Yup, although multicellular life probably "only" has hundreds of millions of years left on Earth, and any kind of life has maybe a billion and a half.Correction. The planet is certainly not dying. It has been here for 4.5bn years and will be for billions more.
What is really interesting is the massive hurdles that single cell had to make to become multi cellular life, and then to evolve to humans.Yup, although multicellular life probably "only" has hundreds of millions of years left on Earth, and any kind of life has maybe a billion and a half.
Society as a whole will break down in the near future(5-10 years) with climate refugees, food scarcity, unstable weather etc. Northern european countries will do fine if/when they close their boarders, while the people living in the southern part of Europe will act as a "wall" for people trying to get into Europe while Spain turns into a dessert and dependent on aid. Russia will certainly close their boarders. And where will the 100s of millions of Indians go when they are unable to sustain their massive population due to lack of water? Surely the Indus water dispute will escelate and China will back Pakistan and then WW3 will begin (The current conflict in Kashmir will be the match that lights the fire).Correction. The planet is certainly not dying. It has been here for 4.5bn years and will be for billions more.
It is the human race that will die out because we are making it uninhabitable for ourselves.
If it could, the planet would probably heave a massive sigh of relief when we are gone.
And that is precisely why we should all be supporting ER. Especially those with children and or grandchildren.Society as a whole will break down in the near future(5-10 years) with climate refugees, food scarcity, unstable weather etc. Northern european countries will do fine if/when they close their boarders, while the people living in the southern part of Europe will act as a "wall" for people trying to get into Europe while Spain turns into a dessert and dependent on aid. Russia will certainly close their boarders. And where will the 100s of millions of Indians go when they are unable to sustain their massive population due to lack of water? Surely the Indus water dispute will escelate and China will back Pakistan and then WW3 will begin (The current conflict in Kashmir will be the match that lights the fire).
Sorry for being less than optimistic but things going to get bad.
Think it is too late for that now. Been for a few years.And that is precisely why we should all be supporting ER. Especially those with children and or grandchildren.
I saw the world's most self opionated man Piers Morgan this morning laying into a lady supporting ER by continually shouting at her asking if she had a tv. And he thought he was sooo clever.
What a dick.
People eat sand don't they?I don't think Spain will be a dessert in the next 5-10 years, but maybe if Alaska gets a lot warmer it will be Baked Alaska.
Society breaking down in 5-10 years? Really?Society as a whole will break down in the near future(5-10 years) with climate refugees, food scarcity, unstable weather etc. Northern european countries will do fine if/when they close their boarders, while the people living in the southern part of Europe will act as a "wall" for people trying to get into Europe while Spain turns into a dessert and dependent on aid. Russia will certainly close their boarders. And where will the 100s of millions of Indians go when they are unable to sustain their massive population due to lack of water? Surely the Indus water dispute will escelate and China will back Pakistan and then WW3 will begin (The current conflict in Kashmir will be the match that lights the fire).
Sorry for being less than optimistic but things going to get bad.
As far as I understand it, she has autism and looking "distant" is a characteristic of some people with autism so that may explain why she looks distant. Its a spectrum disorder, so its a bit like having a cloud of lots of different traits and people put their hand in the cloud and pick any number of those traits - so everyone with autism is different.I’ve seen her speak a few times and I’m not keen on her style, really. She comes off as weirdly distant in some (kinda creepy, actually) and then in others ultra emotional and bordering on hysterics.
But yeah, I generally agree with you that the message is more important, and on that end she does a lot more harm than good. But I do think she’s always going to divide until maybe she matures a bit as an orator. The over-dramatist approach can make people switch off completely as all they will see is a whiny little girl.
As far as I understand it, she has autism and looking "distant" is a characteristic of some people with autism so that may explain why she looks distant. Its a spectrum disorder, so its a bit like having a cloud of lots of different traits and people put their hand in the cloud and pick any number of those traits - so everyone with autism is different.
Not all over the world but for larger parts of it yes. If Europe closes it boarders to Middle East, Afrika and certain parts of Asia we can be self sufficient (increasing the efficency in agriculture in parts of eastern Europe and Ukraine in particular will do this). If we try to help as many climate refugees as possible and open the boarders then we would not have enough space, food etc to keep everyone that will come satisfied leading to sivil unrest etc. Timeframe is dependent on what parts of the world one looks at, the policy regarding climate refugees the EU/UN will take and what happens with the government in major countries.Society breaking down in 5-10 years? Really?