12 months since Mourinho was sacked and we've arguably gone backwards

[TwoSheds]

I'm sure it's already been said but we just beat a team managed by Mourinho quite convincingly - a team who were much better than us last year when we were managed by Mourinho.

And our shitty board haven't stuck their hand in their pockets really when you look at the state of the squad. I'm not saying Ole couldn't have done better but I do think he's doing more than his predecessors at the same stage, whether the results reflect that or not.

This year alone we've beaten Leicester, City, Spuds, we're the only team to take points off Liverpool and should have thrashed them really, beaten Chelsea twice...

I'd much rather be dicking the big teams and struggling against the little ones at this point given that our squad just isn't good enough to be challenging for the league and is very young. A bit of quality and depth in the right places and clean sheets and goals against the little teams will come. We know our top level is good enough already and we should be able to do something in the cups at least in the meantime.

 

[RUCK4444]

Who said that ? Try to read before posting first. What I'm saying is the fact the squad is still where it was the previous year, just hoping to finish 4th after spending extra 150m in summer and still look miles away from finishing anywhere close to 2nd or 3rd makes the idea of us moving anywhere forward illogical and clouded by romanticism. Who was responsible for the squad to be in threadbare state ? Or were you expecting us to spend +250m in summer ?

You said that finishing 4th would be an achievement and we should have higher expectations, so I assumed you meant you expected us to finish higher than 4th.

We should have been 2 points off 4th yesterday had the people’s sacred VAR done it’s job.

Ole has this team overachieving. Especially when you consider the long term injuries we've had to some of our best players such as Martial and Pogba still out.

Love or hate Pogba he is by FAR our most creative player, our only world class outfield player.

For perspective had Pogba played as the most advanced midfielder throughout this season (with Fred and Scott sitting) I’m quite confident he would be on around 8 assists with the form Rashford, James and Martial have been in.
Instead we are here hoping Jessie feckin Lingard turns into a world class no. 10

 

[Nikelesh Reddy]

Almost exactly one year ago, Ole was appointed caretaker manager following the sacking of Jose Mourinho. The toxic one was relieved of his duties having led Manchester United to their 5th defeat of the Premier League season with a loss to Liverpool at Anfield. On December 18th 2018, United sat in 6th with 7 wins, 29 goals and 26 points; fast forward a year, two transfer windows, almost £150 million worth of player additions and an improved team culture - we've amassed 1 fewer point, 1 fewer win and 3 fewer goals. Most importantly, we look just as clueless as we did under Mourinho in his final season. Whether you want to blame Ole or not, it's inconceivable that 12 months since the sacking of our most despised manager, we've seen 0 progress or improvement in most of the aspects related to this behemoth of a football club. How does Manchester United, with all its apparent resources, find itself in this position?

Not backing Mourinho in the summer transfer window was a big mistake,but sacking him was probably the right decision.Theres no way that he would have turned the situation around,the differences between him and the players were increasing by the day.There was a toxic atmosphere around the club....I”m still not sure whether Oles the right man for the job,but I”m willing to support him until the end of the season.

We signed 3 good players last summer,we are trying to play a more enterprising brand of football although we are still miles behind where we should be.I don’t think we”ve regressed over the last year,but it’s also too early to categorically state that we are progressing in the right direction.We”ll just have to wait and watch how Ole and the team perform until the end of the season.,.

 

[el3mel]

You said that finishing 4th would be an achievement and we should have higher expectations, so I assumed you meant you expected us to finish higher than 4th.

We should have been 2 points off 4th yesterday had the people’s sacred VAR done it’s job.

Ole has this team overachieving. Especially when you consider the long term injuries we've had to some of our best players such as Martial and Pogba still out.

Love or hate Pogba he is by FAR our most creative player, our only world class outfield player.

For perspective had Pogba played as the most advanced midfielder throughout this season (with Fred and Scott sitting) I’m quite confident he would be on around 8 assists with the form Rashford, James and Martial have been in.
Instead we are here hoping Jessie feckin Lingard turns into a world class no. 10

The other poster was saying we now know our best lineup and players have improved. My replay was most of the lineup will need to be upgraded and that current lineup will have 4th or 5th as an achievement as best which isn't what we were hoping, as 4th isn't the ultimate target for the upcoming year, and the current squad won't be able to achieve more than that, so we actually didn't move forward at all. We are where we were previously, searching for 4th at best and with no hope for being anywhere close to the top 2 never mind challenging for the league any time soon. What's the signs of us going forward, if the results, performance and league position haven't changed much, with a squad that will need loads of money to be close to the top, even after spending 150m last summer ? All I'm seeing is if Ole is sacked now, his period will be pretty forgettable, as it has been nothing special.

 

[RussellWilson]

Of course we have gone backwards. A couple of wins and all us rosey again apparently.

Those wins will send us further back as the club and fans hold on to them in some hope Solksjaer will come good and that he isn't out of his depth as he clearly is.

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

Of course we have gone backwards. A couple of wins and all us rosey again apparently.

Those wins will send us further back as the club and fans hold on to them in some hope Solksjaer will come good and that he isn't out of his depth as he clearly is.

We are much worse compared to our situation 2 years ago. Better than one year ago, but the results are pretty much the same.

 

[TwoSheds]

We are much worse compared to our situation 2 years ago. Better than one year ago, but the results are pretty much the same.

Other than the fact that we've a younger squad with room for improvement, we've shed a number of flops from the wage bill with likely a couple more in the summer to go, and we only need maybe 4 quality signings (CB, DM, AM, maybe RW/ST) to be a proper title challenger again.

Not saying it's going to happen that we get 3/4 really good signings of course, but I finally feel like we might. At least the manager and board are looking for the same sort of player at last instead of constantly being at loggerheads.

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

Other than the fact that we've a younger squad with room for improvement, we've shed a number of flops from the wage bill with likely a couple more in the summer to go, and we only need maybe 4 quality signings (CB, DM, AM, maybe RW/ST) to be a proper title challenger again.

Not saying it's going to happen that we get 3/4 really good signings of course, but I finally feel like we might. At least the manager and board are looking for the same sort of player at last instead of constantly being at loggerheads.

We had players who could improve then too. I think we need a better manager to challenge. Although a top striker could give us a lot too if we play better as a team to give the right service.

 

[RUCK4444]

The other poster was saying we now know our best lineup and players have improved. My replay was most of the lineup will need to be upgraded and that current lineup will have 4th or 5th as an achievement as best which isn't what we were hoping, as 4th isn't the ultimate target for the upcoming year, and the current squad won't be able to achieve more than that, so we actually didn't move forward at all. We are where we were previously, searching for 4th at best and with no hope for being anywhere close to the top 2 never mind challenging for the league any time soon. What's the signs of us going forward, if the results, performance and league position haven't changed much, with a squad that will need loads of money to be close to the top, even after spending 150m last summer ? All I'm seeing is if Ole is sacked now, his period will be pretty forgettable, as it has been nothing special.

Can you not see the absolute mess this squad was in?

The amount of awful signings three so called ‘better managers’ accumulated on hugely overinflated wages was an absolute disgrace.

Make no mistake that this is the single biggest squad rebuild certainly in our lifetimes. Maybe the biggest ever when you consider how expensive a single player is in the modern day transfer market.

Now compare how our board backed Ole to how Madrid’s board backed Zidane.
The different is Night. And. Day.
With the Lukaku sale our net spend was around £70 million, not nearly enough to bridge the gap in one window.

What none of the Ole-Out brigade are allowing for is that he inherited a side that needed much more surgery than his predecessors. It needed a complete change of direction and ethos.

You have given Ole just one single transfer window to undo all the shocking mismanagement and terrible recruitment that his three predecessors have left us with.

Now ask yourself why were these masterminds of the game given multiple windows and hundreds and hundreds of millions to spend, yet Ole has made the best three post Fergie signings in his first transfer window and you want him out!

He has restored morale, he’s working wonders with teenagers who all seem to flourish under him, but with youth comes inconsistency.

Ole had a mammoth task on his hands, if he manages top four whilst playing the hand he was dealt then I for one back him and appreciate just what an undertaking this was. I wish more posters could look at the bigger picture.

 

[el3mel]

Can you not see the absolute mess this squad was in?

The amount of awful signings three so called ‘better managers’ accumulated on hugely overinflated wages was an absolute disgrace.

Make no mistake that this is the single biggest squad rebuild certainly in our lifetimes. Maybe the biggest ever when you consider how expensive a single player is in the modern day transfer market.

Now compare how our board backed Ole to how Madrid’s board backed Zidane.
The different is Night. And. Day.

What none of the Ole-Out brigade are allowing for is that he inherited a side that needed much more surgery than his predecessors. It needed a complete change of direction and ethos.

You have given Ole just one single transfer window to undo all the shocking mismanagement and terrible recruitment that his three predecessors have left us with.

Now ask yourself why were these masterminds of the game given multiple windows and hundreds and hundreds of millions to spend, yet Ole has made the best three post Fergie signings in his first transfer window and you want him out!

He has restored morale, he’s working wonders with teenagers who all seem to flourish under him, but with youth comes inconsistency.

Ole had a mammoth task on his hands, if he manages top four whilst playing the hand he was dealt then I for one back him and appreciate just what an undertaking this was. I wish more posters could look at the bigger picture.

The squad being a total mess is big myth for me. This squad has finished 2nd the previous season and more importantly, this opinion wasn't the one during this time. The opinion was the squad was good enough but the manager was holding them back. These same players went on a winning strike once said manager got sacked and gave our current manager his job, so the squad wasn't a mess, or at least, the opinion at this time wasn't that it was a mess. This only started to be said now as an excuse for Ole, a typical changing narrative to excuse the manager.

Also I can't get the idea of him not being backed. He spent 150m last summer. We gave him a 80m defender, the most expensive defender in the world and 50m right back. What were you expecting us to spend ? +250m ? You can say the previous managers spent 300m and 400m but they spent it on successive seasons. They didn't get anything more than 150m in any of their summers, which is the same sum Ole got so I don't get this idea. What more we should have done than splashing 80 on the defender Ole himself said he was his top target, even though we all know he wasn't worth the price tag ? I said previously, anyone expecting us to spend +200m in a summer is day dreaming. We haven't done it for any previous manager and won't happen to the next manager either. We have never given a checkbook for any manager. This is btw another instance of changing the narrative than how it was previously, because I very well remember people over praising Poch for doing a great job last season despite not buying a single player in summer and that you can still coach your own players even if you don't go mass spending.

Another point of mentioning giving other managers more summers to spend, anyone looking at Mourinho's first summer (in which we also spent 150m on 3 players + a free transfer) would also say he deserved another season of spending. Bailly had a pretty solid season, Mikhi played a big role in our EL campaign, Zlatan was our top goalscorer, beside Pogba. Saying this window is now poor is a hindsight in general. Nothing prevents the current window from looking like crap 2-3 years from now. Maguire might prove to be a big waste of money, AWB might not be liked by a new manager who wants a more offensive fullback and we might end up upgrading on James few years from now. All this is hindsight which is my problem here.

Ole hasn't been any less backed than the previous managers in any of their summer markets and we we'll never spend +200m for a manager or bring every single players a manager wants. Hasn't happened and won't happen, so why should it happen to Ole out of anyone else ?

 

[Hughie77]

Only in results, a few odd games, but I can see improvement, can see the plan, a few more windows and the right players in, we can progress again, the only club tearing it up is pool, the rest are including us trying to catch up with them, it's taken Klopp 4 seasons to get where he's been, and it's the last 2 he's found it? Time to rebuild get the right players in to play the right system, he's built it over time, needed here at OT is patience.

 

[DLE]

Almost exactly one year ago, Ole was appointed caretaker manager following the sacking of Jose Mourinho. The toxic one was relieved of his duties having led Manchester United to their 5th defeat of the Premier League season with a loss to Liverpool at Anfield. On December 18th 2018, United sat in 6th with 7 wins, 29 goals and 26 points; fast forward a year, two transfer windows, almost £150 million worth of player additions and an improved team culture - we've amassed 1 fewer point, 1 fewer win and 3 fewer goals. Most importantly, we look just as clueless as we did under Mourinho in his final season. Whether you want to blame Ole or not, it's inconceivable that 12 months since the sacking of our most despised manager, we've seen 0 progress or improvement in most of the aspects related to this behemoth of a football club. How does Manchester United, with all its apparent resources, find itself in this position?

During change, things often get worse before they get better. That’s why it’s important to support the manager and trust the process.

 

[M4nu4Life]

The squad is in better shape. Less money chasing players. Wage bill is down. This is a win in itself.

 

[lRed]

Can you not see the absolute mess this squad was in?

The amount of awful signings three so called ‘better managers’ accumulated on hugely overinflated wages was an absolute disgrace.

Make no mistake that this is the single biggest squad rebuild certainly in our lifetimes. Maybe the biggest ever when you consider how expensive a single player is in the modern day transfer market.

Now compare how our board backed Ole to how Madrid’s board backed Zidane.
The different is Night. And. Day.
With the Lukaku sale our net spend was around £70 million, not nearly enough to bridge the gap in one window.

What none of the Ole-Out brigade are allowing for is that he inherited a side that needed much more surgery than his predecessors. It needed a complete change of direction and ethos.

You have given Ole just one single transfer window to undo all the shocking mismanagement and terrible recruitment that his three predecessors have left us with.

Now ask yourself why were these masterminds of the game given multiple windows and hundreds and hundreds of millions to spend, yet Ole has made the best three post Fergie signings in his first transfer window and you want him out!

He has restored morale, he’s working wonders with teenagers who all seem to flourish under him, but with youth comes inconsistency.

Ole had a mammoth task on his hands, if he manages top four whilst playing the hand he was dealt then I for one back him and appreciate just what an undertaking this was. I wish more posters could look at the bigger picture.

Thank God we are not alone mate.

 

[90 + 5min]

We are much worse compared to our situation 2 years ago. Better than one year ago, but the results are pretty much the same.

Progress. If you say that we are better than one year ago why cange and stop the progress?

We had players who could improve then too. I think we need a better manager to challenge. Although a top striker could give us a lot too if we play better as a team to give the right service.

Who is that manager. Little tired of people wanting new manager just for the sake. Tell me who and please do explain why he or she would be better managing this group of players.

The squad being a total mess is big myth for me. This squad has finished 2nd the previous season and more importantly, this opinion wasn't the one during this time. The opinion was the squad was good enough but the manager was holding them back. These same players went on a winning strike once said manager got sacked and gave our current manager his job, so the squad wasn't a mess, or at least, the opinion at this time wasn't that it was a mess. This only started to be said now as an excuse for Ole, a typical changing narrative to excuse the manager.

Also I can't get the idea of him not being backed. He spent 150m last summer. We gave him a 80m defender, the most expensive defender in the world and 50m right back. What were you expecting us to spend ? +250m ? You can say the previous managers spent 300m and 400m but they spent it on successive seasons. They didn't get anything more than 150m in any of their summers, which is the same sum Ole got so I don't get this idea. What more we should have done than splashing 80 on the defender Ole himself said he was his top target, even though we all know he wasn't worth the price tag ? I said previously, anyone expecting us to spend +200m in a summer is day dreaming. We haven't done it for any previous manager and won't happen to the next manager either. We have never given a checkbook for any manager. This is btw another instance of changing the narrative than how it was previously, because I very well remember people over praising Poch for doing a great job last season despite not buying a single player in summer and that you can still coach your own players even if you don't go mass spending.

Another point of mentioning giving other managers more summers to spend, anyone looking at Mourinho's first summer (in which we also spent 150m on 3 players + a free transfer) would also say he deserved another season of spending. Bailly had a pretty solid season, Mikhi played a big role in our EL campaign, Zlatan was our top goalscorer, beside Pogba. Saying this window is now poor is a hindsight in general. Nothing prevents the current window from looking like crap 2-3 years from now. Maguire might prove to be a big waste of money, AWB might not be liked by a new manager who wants a more offensive fullback and we might end up upgrading on James few years from now. All this is hindsight which is my problem here.

Ole hasn't been any less backed than the previous managers in any of their summer markets and we we'll never spend +200m for a manager or bring every single players a manager wants. Hasn't happened and won't happen, so why should it happen to Ole out of anyone else ?

Tell that to a class manager like Mourinho or vanGaal. Or why do you think Solskjaer bought players and will hopfully keep replacing some players? Why do you think RedCafe showed its worst side when they went on witchhunt towards many of the players? Same witchhunt (for different reasons) that we see against Solskjaer.

The squad is not catastrofic but it is bad in sense of squad quality. As soon as we got injuries we fell apart. And looking at what players we have behind 14-15 good ones than it is no brainer. With style that we play we need players that suits us. When we get them we will be lot better and I can't believe that you don't see progress made. Both on and of the pitch.

 

[el3mel]

Tell that to a class manager like Mourinho or vanGaal. Or why do you think Solskjaer bought players and will hopfully keep replacing some players? Why do you think RedCafe showed its worst side when they went on witchhunt towards many of the players? Same witchhunt (for different reasons) that we see against Solskjaer.

The squad is not catastrofic but it is bad in sense of squad quality. As soon as we got injuries we fell apart. And looking at what players we have behind 14-15 good ones than it is no brainer. With style that we play we need players that suits us. When we get them we will be lot better and I can't believe that you don't see progress made. Both on and of the pitch.

I don't get this question ? I mean all teams buy and sell players each summer regardless of their current state. City do. What's the point ?

The squad he got was definitely a top 4 team considering the run they put during his honeymoon period.

Yeah I don't see it. We have improved in big games for sure, but otherwise, nothing really changed. Still where we're, with a squad with no clear style that needs loads of money to be spent to be anywhere close to the top.

 

[mattsville]

With mourinho and lvg previously it did not feel like Manchester United, I cannot think of a worse thing, it was torturous, I can now identify with the club again as we are displaying our core values, yes progress is difficult, the standard in the league is very good but there have been enough signs to suggest we are heading in the right direction, the game the weekend was disappointing, we had the opportunity to make a good gain, but I realised I havent shouted that much at a match in ages (well maybe smashing city) and the fact Greenwood came on and displayed his ability to be a difference maker and put the finishing touch to our dominance, looking at the longer term picture I actually finished the day more positive than negative.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

During change, things often get worse before they get better. That’s why it’s important to support the manager and trust the process.

Doesn't have to be. Plenty of big teams have gone through change - they don't hit rock bottom during the process. Look at the team placed 2nd in the league. Didn't see them getting worse before getting better?

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

Doesn't have to be. Plenty of big teams have gone through change - they don't hit rock bottom during the process. Look at the team placed 2nd in the league. Didn't see them getting worse before getting better?

Most of the time good managers have a quick impact in big teams. SAF didn't, but we can't think it will go like that all the time.

 

[RUCK4444]

The squad being a total mess is big myth for me. This squad has finished 2nd the previous season and more importantly, this opinion wasn't the one during this time. The opinion was the squad was good enough but the manager was holding them back. These same players went on a winning strike once said manager got sacked and gave our current manager his job, so the squad wasn't a mess, or at least, the opinion at this time wasn't that it was a mess. This only started to be said now as an excuse for Ole, a typical changing narrative to excuse the manager.

Also I can't get the idea of him not being backed. He spent 150m last summer. We gave him a 80m defender, the most expensive defender in the world and 50m right back. What were you expecting us to spend ? +250m ? You can say the previous managers spent 300m and 400m but they spent it on successive seasons. They didn't get anything more than 150m in any of their summers, which is the same sum Ole got so I don't get this idea. What more we should have done than splashing 80 on the defender Ole himself said he was his top target, even though we all know he wasn't worth the price tag ? I said previously, anyone expecting us to spend +200m in a summer is day dreaming. We haven't done it for any previous manager and won't happen to the next manager either. We have never given a checkbook for any manager. This is btw another instance of changing the narrative than how it was previously, because I very well remember people over praising Poch for doing a great job last season despite not buying a single player in summer and that you can still coach your own players even if you don't go mass spending.

Another point of mentioning giving other managers more summers to spend, anyone looking at Mourinho's first summer (in which we also spent 150m on 3 players + a free transfer) would also say he deserved another season of spending. Bailly had a pretty solid season, Mikhi played a big role in our EL campaign, Zlatan was our top goalscorer, beside Pogba. Saying this window is now poor is a hindsight in general. Nothing prevents the current window from looking like crap 2-3 years from now. Maguire might prove to be a big waste of money, AWB might not be liked by a new manager who wants a more offensive fullback and we might end up upgrading on James few years from now. All this is hindsight which is my problem here.

Ole hasn't been any less backed than the previous managers in any of their summer markets and we we'll never spend +200m for a manager or bring every single players a manager wants. Hasn't happened and won't happen, so why should it happen to Ole out of anyone else ?

So you don’t feel the squad was hugely imbalanced and god awful, considering where we finished last season?

Most people will agree this squad required the biggest rebuild in recent times, there wasn’t a position (including the keeper) that wasn’t under question.

The defence was leaking goals, no settleCB pairing, midfield was awful with an ageing Matic fumbling around, Fred as poor as he’s ever been (much better under Ole), and question marks no matter where Pogba was played.

Sanchez constantly the expensive elephant in the room and couldn’t hit a barn door, Lukaku was the donkey behind the barn door - woeful.

It was a mess, like I say nobody was a guaranteed starter and we played some of the most tumescent football.

My point about money spent is not related to Ole, more so toward the fact that this is a feckin huge club in the middle of a major rebuild and a paltry net spend of £70 odd million was never going to bridge the gap.
Not least to where you expected us to finish this season.

League position aside do you not acknowledge any positives from Ole as manager? None at all?

 

[RUCK4444]

Doesn't have to be. Plenty of big teams have gone through change - they don't hit rock bottom during the process. Look at the team placed 2nd in the league. Didn't see them getting worse before getting better?

Well Leicester won the league and proceeded to have an awful season straight after.
Have rebuilt under a few managers and things are now clicking.
Ole has had less time than what Leicester took to do the above

 

[DLE]

Doesn't have to be. Plenty of big teams have gone through change - they don't hit rock bottom during the process. Look at the team placed 2nd in the league. Didn't see them getting worse before getting better?

That’s true, it’s not always that things need to get worse. But often, and hopefully that’s the case with us.

 

[el3mel]

So you don’t feel the squad was hugely imbalanced and god awful, considering where we finished last season?

Most people will agree this squad required the biggest rebuild in recent times, there wasn’t a position (including the keeper) that wasn’t under question.

The defence was leaking goals, no settleCB pairing, midfield was awful with an ageing Matic fumbling around, Fred as poor as he’s ever been (much better under Ole), and question marks no matter where Pogba was played.

Sanchez constantly the expensive elephant in the room and couldn’t hit a barn door, Lukaku was the donkey behind the barn door - woeful.

It was a mess, like I say nobody was a guaranteed starter and we played some of the most tumescent football.

My point about money spent is not related to Ole, more so toward the fact that this is a feckin huge club in the middle of a major rebuild and a paltry net spend of £70 odd million was never going to bridge the gap.
Not least to where you expected us to finish this season.

League position aside do you not acknowledge any positives from Ole as manager? None at all?

It definitely wasn't god awful considering we reached 4th at one point during his honeymoon period before collapsing after he got the permanent job and for sure that wasn't the narrative during that honeymoon that we needed a major rebuild to play well. The squad he inherited was the one that actually got him the job with their results, or how do you think he got the permanent job ?

 

[90 + 5min]

I don't get this question ? I mean all teams buy and sell players each summer regardless of their current state. City do. What's the point ?

The squad he got was definitely a top 4 team considering the run they put during his honeymoon period.

Yeah I don't see it. We have improved in big games for sure, but otherwise, nothing really changed. Still where we're, with a squad with no clear style that needs loads of money to be spent to be anywhere close to the top.

The point is that he needs time to get the players for the system. Guardiola got time. Klopp got time. Every manager gets time in a well managed club.

The squad is not top4 team. First 11 is. Big difference. Then we got hit with injuries and you saw what you saw. As soon as our best players got back you can see our form. Easy to check. You even finished your messege with "needs loads of money to be spend to be anywhere close to top". So do we or don't we have squad for top 4? You are saying against yourself.

No clear style? Comon. Even you can't ignore our style. Press, controll and quick direct attacking.

 

[mariachi-19]

The squad being a total mess is big myth for me. This squad has finished 2nd the previous season and more importantly, this opinion wasn't the one during this time. The opinion was the squad was good enough but the manager was holding them back. These same players went on a winning strike once said manager got sacked and gave our current manager his job, so the squad wasn't a mess, or at least, the opinion at this time wasn't that it was a mess. This only started to be said now as an excuse for Ole, a typical changing narrative to excuse the manager.

Also I can't get the idea of him not being backed. He spent 150m last summer. We gave him a 80m defender, the most expensive defender in the world and 50m right back. What were you expecting us to spend ? +250m ? You can say the previous managers spent 300m and 400m but they spent it on successive seasons. They didn't get anything more than 150m in any of their summers, which is the same sum Ole got so I don't get this idea. What more we should have done than splashing 80 on the defender Ole himself said he was his top target, even though we all know he wasn't worth the price tag ? I said previously, anyone expecting us to spend +200m in a summer is day dreaming. We haven't done it for any previous manager and won't happen to the next manager either. We have never given a checkbook for any manager. This is btw another instance of changing the narrative than how it was previously, because I very well remember people over praising Poch for doing a great job last season despite not buying a single player in summer and that you can still coach your own players even if you don't go mass spending.

Another point of mentioning giving other managers more summers to spend, anyone looking at Mourinho's first summer (in which we also spent 150m on 3 players + a free transfer) would also say he deserved another season of spending. Bailly had a pretty solid season, Mikhi played a big role in our EL campaign, Zlatan was our top goalscorer, beside Pogba. Saying this window is now poor is a hindsight in general. Nothing prevents the current window from looking like crap 2-3 years from now. Maguire might prove to be a big waste of money, AWB might not be liked by a new manager who wants a more offensive fullback and we might end up upgrading on James few years from now. All this is hindsight which is my problem here.

Ole hasn't been any less backed than the previous managers in any of their summer markets and we we'll never spend +200m for a manager or bring every single players a manager wants. Hasn't happened and won't happen, so why should it happen to Ole out of anyone else ?

And then that Squad got torn to shit because it was clear and obvious that a large part of that sqaud didn't have the mentality to go beyond what they had achieved and were content to rely on past glories. That sqaud was filled with over the hill players who while useful, were or are finished.

Spending 80 million on Maguire is no different than spending 30 million on Berbatov. We won two league titles with Berba and if we can do the same with Maguire, it will be money well spent.

 

[el3mel]

The point is that he needs time to get the players for the system. Guardiola got time. Klopp got time. Every manager gets time in a well managed club.

The squad is not top4 team. First 11 is. Big difference. Then we got hit with injuries and you saw what you saw. As soon as our best players got back you can see our form. Easy to check. You even finished your messege with "needs loads of money to be spend to be anywhere close to top". So do we or don't we have squad for top 4? You are saying against yourself.

No clear style? Comon. Even you can't ignore our style. Press, controll and quick direct attacking.

Can't believe people still keep mentioning Guardiola and Klopp. Next will be Ferguson as usual. Like this has been discussed for 100 times already, don't people get bored of repeating the same points over and over again ? They got time based on what they were doing on the pitch, it wasn't gifted to them. No manager is gifted time at any club. They earn it.

The squad he inherited was an easy top 4, or that was the narrative back then, considering where we finished the season before he got the job and the results we got during his honeymoon period. The fact that after 1 summer in which we spent 150, we still have top 4 as our greatest achievement in a season, with no hope that the next season will be any different. This for me doesn't show any signs of going forward.

And till we prove we can break down low blocks I won't say we have any clear style. Currently this has been a copy of LVG second season, great in big games while crap in the rest of the games.

 

[lysglimt]

Of course we have gone backwards. A couple of wins and all us rosey again apparently.

Those wins will send us further back as the club and fans hold on to them in some hope Solksjaer will come good and that he isn't out of his depth as he clearly is.

So you are saying it would be better for us if we didn't win footballmatches ?

 

[el3mel]

And then that Squad got torn to shit because it was clear and obvious that a large part of that sqaud didn't have the mentality to go beyond what they had achieved and were content to rely on past glories. That sqaud was filled with over the hill players who while useful, were or are finished.

Spending 80 million on Maguire is no different than spending 30 million on Berbatov. We won two league titles with Berba and if we can do the same with Maguire, it will be money well spent.

So if he torn the squad who got him the job to shreds for thinking it wasn't good enough I guess that's his responsibility for the results the current squad he built ? We don't give a free checkbook for any manager. He should have realized that and sold wisely. No one mass sell all the useful bench options when he doesn't have a free checkbook to spend. Sell 1 or 2, keep then others, then sell more the next summer when you have actually bought players to replace them. That's what I'll call a gradual and calculated rebuild, not what we have done imo. It's well and good to think about long term but there's nothing saying we should completely ignore the short term while doing that.

 

[RUCK4444]

It definitely wasn't god awful considering we reached 4th at one point during his honeymoon period before collapsing after he got the permanent job and for sure that wasn't the narrative during that honeymoon that we needed a major rebuild to play well. The squad he inherited was the one that actually got him the job with their results, or how do you think he got the permanent job ?

Yes he got the job through getting an excellent string of results, that’s hardly a stick to beat him with.

He freed the team from the painfully negative reign that was the Mourinho period. They got a huge boost as a result in the change in manager.

The squad largely performed poorly under all three previous managers.

 

[el3mel]

Yes he got the job through getting an excellent string of results, that’s hardly a stick to beat him with.

He freed the team from the painfully negative reign that was the Mourinho period. They got a huge boost as a result in the change in manager.

The squad largely performed poorly under all three previous managers.

So the good results are thanks to him and the poor results are thanks to the players ?

 

[90 + 5min]

Can't believe people still keep mentioning Guardiola and Klopp. Next will be Ferguson as usual. Like this has been discussed for 100 times already, don't people get bored of repeating the same points over and over again ? They got time based on what they were doing on the pitch, it wasn't gifted to them. No manager is gifted time at any club. They earn it.

The squad he inherited was an easy top 4, or that was the narrative back then, considering where we finished the season before he got the job and the results we got during his honeymoon period. The fact that after 1 summer in which we spent 150, we still have top 4 as our greatest achievement in a season, with no hope that the next season will be any different. This for me doesn't show any signs of going forward.

And till we prove we can break down low blocks I won't say we have any clear style. Currently this has been a copy of LVG second season, great in big games while crap in the rest of the games.

Guardiola came third in his first year. With team full of stars. Team that could easly win Premier Legaue. If he were manager here I guess you would be wantng him to be replaced after that season. Because it was not much difference season before when they had Pellegrini. Or would you give him time? Why not keep mentioning Klopp and Guardiola. Nobody is saying Solskjaer is up with them yet in terms of quality. They got time. Check Klopp and count his Liveprool titles before he won CL. He would be long gone if you were director.

You don't see difference in our squad, quality and numbers looking at previous year?

He has a style. If it works or not works against some tactics that is another matter. He got style.

 

[mariachi-19]

So if he torn the squad who got him the job to shreds for thinking it wasn't good enough I guess that's his responsibility for the results the current squad he built ? We don't give a free checkbook for any manager. He should have realized that and sold wisely. No one mass sell all the useful bench options when he doesn't have a free checkbook to spend. Sell 1 or 2, keep then others, then sell more the next summer when you have actually bought players to replace them. That's what I'll call a gradual and calculated rebuild, not what we have done imo. It's well and good to think about long term but there's nothing saying we should completely ignore the short term while doing that.

I would rather him rip the squad to shreds when its full of toxic personalities then let it fester and end up in the same position as every other manager we've had. Irrespective of whether half the clowns on this forum have the brain capacity to understand, he's done the right thing for the future of our club. Just because he's not getting the result we want, doesn't mean there isn't progress. Its this short term bullshit that has plagued our club since Fergie left and the reason he inherited the squad in the position it was.

In summary, rip the band aid off rather than pull it off slowly.

 

[el3mel]

Guardiola came third in his first year. With team full of stars. Team that could easly win Premier Legaue. If he were manager here I guess you would be wantng him to be replaced after that season. Because it was not much difference season before when they had Pellegrini. Or would you give him time? Why not keep mentioning Klopp and Guardiola. Nobody is saying Solskjaer is up with them yet in terms of quality. They got time. Check Klopp and count his Liveprool titles before he won CL. He would be long gone if you were director.

You don't see difference in our squad, quality and numbers looking at previous year?

He has a style. If it works or not works against some tactics that is another matter. He got style.

Pep already implemented his style of football during the first season. They were just leaking goals thanks to their old defense, but it was obvious with few signings in defense it'll work out eventually. This is the biggest gripe with Ole. I bet we would have been more patient with him if we have been having a clear style of football that just looks like it needs few players to tick, but we have been seeing hasn't much changed, we do well in big games while failing to break any low block we come against in the league, considering he has been a year in the job, I'll expect the latter to start improving, but it hasn't. Winning big games is fun and all but LVG were winning them and it didn't help him much at the end.

Keeping mentioning a point that has been replied on for 100 times is weird for me. It's like memorizing points at this point. How many times people have replied on this Klopp point and proved it's nonsense ?

Anyway all I see regarding our squad is that it's in a worse place now than it has been during his honeymoon period. Midfield and attack have suffered and we lack options on the bench to change games.

 

[el3mel]

I would rather him rip the squad to shreds when its full of toxic personalities then let it fester and end up in the same position as every other manager we've had. Irrespective of whether half the clowns on this forum have the brain capacity to understand, he's done the right thing for the future of our club. Just because he's not getting the result we want, doesn't mean there isn't progress. Its this short term bullshit that has plagued our club since Fergie left and the reason he inherited the squad in the position it was.

In summary, rip the band aid off rather than pull it off slowly.

As I said you can make a long term plan while caring for short term as usual. The idea of us scrapping the present at all for the hope of us becoming better 2-3 years from now is a weird logic for me. There's no contradiction between both.

 

[Crashoutcassius]

2 decent results of late. We've done the same all season. A few wins followed by some shockers. Unless you're happy with draws to Sheff and Villa.
We wasn't a decent VAR decision away from a win either.

win at etihad a decent result nowadays

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

I would rather him rip the squad to shreds when its full of toxic personalities then let it fester and end up in the same position as every other manager we've had. Irrespective of whether half the clowns on this forum have the brain capacity to understand, he's done the right thing for the future of our club. Just because he's not getting the result we want, doesn't mean there isn't progress. Its this short term bullshit that has plagued our club since Fergie left and the reason he inherited the squad in the position it was.

In summary, rip the band aid off rather than pull it off slowly.

We ended up second the season before. It was obviously not a terrible squad even if it had a few older players. Not sure about who those toxic personalites was. Sanchez had crazy wages, but not sure he had a negative impact on the rest. We did pretty well just after Mourinho left. He played terribly so getting him out was obviously good.

Lukaku might have wanted to leave, but not sure he was toxic as he did pretty well under Ole when he got the chance. We miss his goals now and should have got another forward in if he wanted to leave.

Herrera always looked like a great team player to me and also played great for Ole. We certainly could have used him now.
Fellaini was always a hard worker that fighted for the team too. Limited, but great when played to his strenght.
Smalling played very well for us and we could have used him now. Certainly not toxic or anything like that.

 

[90 + 5min]

Pep already implemented his style of football during the first season. They were just leaking goals thanks to their old defense, but it was obvious with few signings in defense it'll work out eventually. This is the biggest gripe with Ole. I bet we would have been more patient with him if we have been having a clear style of football that just looks like it needs few players to tick, but we have been seeing hasn't much changed, we do well in big games while failing to break any low block we come against in the league, considering he has been a year in the job, I'll expect the latter to start improving, but it hasn't. Winning big games is fun and all but LVG were winning them and it didn't help him much at the end.

Keeping mentioning a point that has been replied on for 100 times is weird for me. It's like memorizing points at this point. How many times people have replied on this Klopp point and proved it's nonsense ?

Anyway all I see regarding our squad is that it's in a worse place now than it has been during his honeymoon period. Midfield and attack have suffered and we lack options on the bench to change games.

As Ole has. Implemented his style. Now it is getting players to fit in. You said Guardiola needed signings in defense. We need signings further up the pitch. So what is the difference?

Nobody has proved it to be nonsens. Klopp got time. He went trophyless couple of years. That is the fact. Had that happened here in Manchester you'll be the first calling for a change.

And there you go again. Saying against yourself. If the squad is worse than before and Solskjaer somehow makes them compete for 4th place isn't that doing a good job and progressing?

 

[Andycoleno9]

Only in results, a few odd games, but I can see improvement, can see the plan, a few more windows and the right players in, we can progress again, the only club tearing it up is pool, the rest are including us trying to catch up with them, it's taken Klopp 4 seasons to get where he's been, and it's the last 2 he's found it? Time to rebuild get the right players in to play the right system, he's built it over time, needed here at OT is patience.

What is the plan? What is the difference between Jose's style of play and Ole's? Jose at least didn't park the bus against bottom table clubs

 

[el3mel]

As Ole has. Implemented his style. Now it is getting players to fit in. You said Guardiola needed signings in defense. We need signings further up the pitch. So what is the difference?

Nobody has proved it to be nonsens. Klopp got time. He went trophyless couple of years. That is the fact. Had that happened here in Manchester you'll be the first calling for a change.

And there you go again. Saying against yourself. If the squad is worse than before and Solskjaer somehow makes them compete for 4th place isn't that doing a good job and progressing?

The difference is you see he has a style while I don't, but it's your opinion I guess.

No it's nonsense. When he got the job midway in his first season he reached 2 finals. First full season of Klopp they got an easy and convincing top 4. Next one he got a CL final, so there was a clear improvement in terms of results not just performance as well, which improved from day one, so this comparison is nonsense. If Ole gets a top 4 this season I'll be fine with him getting another season. However Klopp wasn't gifted his time, he earned it.

I myself praised him after the last 2 big wins and if you check my opinion post Everton you'll say I wasn't even that mad about result or performance. I think for the moment he's doing decent and I won't sack him currently, however if we keep on fecking up in small games it'll be in vain. The big games are about 10 only during the season. He needs to start getting results against small teams.

 

[Popcorn]

Some aspects we have moved forwards. The football is better to watch, the first team is beginning to show some balance (although our movement needs a lot of work).
in other regards we are worse. Major holes in terms of the first team (midfield and attack), not convinced Maguire was worth the money, and we are lacking any depth to cope with injuries and the number of fixtures we have to play. Overall, a bit better than this time last year, but not much.