What are the consequences if old people break a curfew? My mum isn't going to stay home for four months.
So on the one hand their plan is based on the premise that people can only reasonably sustain harder measures for a limited period of time, on the other it also depends on old people isolating themselves for four whole months while the rest of the country is becoming infected? Hmmm.And now, as I've been arguing all week it appears the UK is about to make another sound, scientific based request:
Much better we do everything possible to isolate those at the highest risk, those with conditions should be allowed to be off work on full pay and we should pander to their every need. No point all of us going into isolation at this point.
They might die?What are the consequences if old people break a curfew? My mum isn't going to stay home for four months.
Well yeah, because if you're at a much higher risk of dying, that's a much higher chance you isolate.So on the one hand their plan is based on the premise that people can only reasonably sustain harder measures for a limited period of time, on the other it also depends on old people isolating themselves for four whole months while the rest of the country is becoming infected? Hmmm.
Cant wait to tell my DadWhat are the consequences if old people break a curfew? My mum isn't going to stay home for four months.
They've backtracked on that one now. Apparently it's not part of their plan (which is nice considering there's no proof anyone stays immune over the long term), it's just something that may be vaguely helpful later if things aren't going well. Or something.Given the UK's plan is to reach "herd immunity" what exactly are they doing differently to other countries to facilitate this?
It feels more like a prediction/hope about how it'll play out.
If "the plan" is to somehow manage the numbers by turning certain taps on and off then we need to be testing people like mofo's for it to work right? But if that isn't what we're doing then what are we doing?
They might die?
The chances that people in the risk-group will stick to isolation are incredibly higher than those at low risk. You've got about 4 weeks at best for low risk.
This looks to be complete and utter bullshit. No way you can control the virus like that bottle of water once you allow to let the virus spread like UK are now. Pretty much every expert apart from those in the UK and Sweden it seems recommends drastic measures as early as possible. Especially now that influenca is still heavily around and hospitals are overwhelmed already it makes sense to fight it as soon as possible.Latest from the government spokesperson.
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It seems it's only the UK and you that seem to know it better than every other country in Europe and the worldFashionable to slag off the UK response now is it?
They clearly have a plan and are clearly following the advice of their experts.
But yeah, TwoSheds and a bunch of blokes from the caf know better. The models they are basing this strategy on are assuming that the rate of infection is incredibly higher than the reported cases so far. They aren't making political decisions here.
Which is fine. But it's common sense that as the deaths increase in people 70+, if you take:My mother is pretty blase about this whole thing. She doesn't really seem to care if she succumbs.
For four entire months while others have far more freedom? You think old people will really stick that? You think their families will stick to that? Bearing in mind the UK's premise that people won't stick to measures for long generally even when they're applied to everyone equally.Well yeah, because if you're at a much higher risk of dying, that's a much higher chance you isolate.
Common sense tells you that.
I'm in Sweden @Godfather, and we're following similar advice. In fact, our experts here slated Denmark last night, and the Danish experts later came out and agreed, admitting the decisions made were purely political.It seems it's only the UK and you that seem to know it better than every other country in Europe and the world
Has there been any new numbers released since friday in term of UK deaths/infected?
You don't need Paracetamol anyways. Just take it on the chin.I'm reading conflicting advice on whether to treat fever with paracetamol or not. The NHS website recommendations it as a treatment method. However that Dr. John Campbell dude said in one of his videos that he doesn't recommend it as it works against the body's natural defense mechanism to raise the temperature and kill the virus (or something along those lines). I'm not currently sick, just trying to be prepared for when the time comes.
What are your thoughts @Arruda @Pogue Mahone if you don't mind me asking?
Well I already said that we would need to pander to their every need did I not?And what complications come from these elderly people (who are vulnerable to other health problems and may need emergency medical care anyway) being isolated for a third of the year?
Agreed.I don't see why old people can't go out and socialise by keeping distance. Go for walks for instance, sit in the park.
Those were the Friday numbers.Yup the number of deaths has gone up to 21 from 10 while the number of cases is up to 1140 from about 500 a couple of days back
Depends on how thorough you wish to be. Could range from things like simply trying to maintain distance and eating separately to actual physical isolation and aggressive periodic disinfection of potentially shared surfaces.How does isolating old people work then? I'm with my mother currently so would I have to stay quarantined from her?
As I say, common sense tells you that.For four entire months while others have far more freedom? You think old people will really stick that? You think their families will stick to that? Bearing in mind the UK's premise that people won't stick to measures for long generally even when they're applied to everyone equally.
Right. Which will also be extremely difficult to sustain for four months.Well I already said that we would need to pander to their every need did I not?
I have no idea how this plan should work. It makes no sense to me. Not doubting that there are expert behind the plan, experts that know much more about the virus than we do but it just sounds very unrealistic to think that you can let the virus spread to a certain point and then make it stop all of a sudden when hospitals are full.I'm in Sweden @Godfather, and we're following similar advice. In fact, our experts here slated Denmark last night, and the Danish experts later came out and agreed, admitting the decisions made were purely political.
You can hmmmmmmm all you like.Right. Which will also be extremely difficult to sustain for four months.
So you have a government whose basic premise is that tough measures won't last in the UK depending on an extremely tough measure lasting for four months. Thus, hmmmm.
Exactly. Me neither.I have no idea how this plan should work
They sure are. Just like pretty much every other country that decided to do it differently.Exactly. Me neither.
But I'm pleased the UK and Sweden are following expert advice. People like the Prof Whitty and Sir Patrick Vallance, rather than making political decisions.
The UK aren't waiting for hospitals to be full by the way, the numbers @Godfather as based on a MUCH higher number of infected than currently reported, it's all modelled.
I would imagine catching the virus will be the biggest consequence for them, I'm sure it can only be advice to stay at home, rather than a legal order.What are the consequences if old people break a curfew? My mum isn't going to stay home for four months.
Yes, and that's the point, they aren't denying that. But the government ARE being slated in here, for following the advice of their experts.The moment UK has infection rates like Spain they will shut everything down. It's just a matter of days.
Yes I get all that. I've been socially distant for about a week now. There were 4 appointments I couldn't cancel but other than that I've done all of the above voluntarily. I also understand that it's a lot more of a sacrifice for some than for others (depending on life, family situation. I have it easy in that respect).The measures that they'll be talking about soon are things like telling families not to go to a funeral. Telling people not to visit a loved one in a hospice or a care home, not to visit patients at hospitals or go with friends/family as support when they've got difficult appointments. Telling grandparents they won't be able to see their grandkids (or anyone else) face to face for months.
Friends of mine are about to sell their house and buying a bungalow because their current house is too big for them, it needs repairs and their health/age means they don't want to use the stairs anymore. Do they keep preparing to move, or will they be in enforced "quarantine for the over 70s" in a month's time - which is when they are due to move?
Social distancing is easy (though it potentially has significant medium term mental and long-term physical implications). Actual home isolation is easy for a couple of weeks (provided they aren't the wrong couple of weeks in your life). It's not just people getting bored with Netflix, it's that life really does have to go on.
Well I agree and it looks we are on the same page. It just seemed you thought every other country bar Sweden and UK followed expert advice.Yes, and that's the point, they aren't denying that. But the government ARE being slated in here, for following the advice of their experts.
Do you realise how fecking stupid that is? People on redcafe, slating politicians, for following expert advice?
No, but France, USA and Denmark are also making political decisions that are AGAINST the advice of their experts. That's the difference.Well I agree and it looks we are on the same page. It just seemed you thought every other country bar Sweden and UK followed expert advice.
Bang on pal. Opinions from internet keyboard warriors, including us, mean feck all. Do as you’re fecking told for once and stop moaning that the other countries are telling their citizens what to do when you’re doing the exact opposite.Fashionable to slag off the UK response now is it?
They clearly have a plan and are clearly following the advice of their experts.
But yeah, TwoSheds and a bunch of blokes from the caf know better. The models they are basing this strategy on are assuming that the rate of infection is incredibly higher than the reported cases so far. They aren't making political decisions here.
It's not that stupid when other countries, experts, modelling and the WHO are following an approach that suggests that the UK's experts are wrong. Assuming that your country's experts are right just because they happen to be from your country would hardly be evidence of robust thinking.Yes, and that's the point, they aren't denying that. But the government ARE being slated in here, for following the advice of their experts.
Do you realise how fecking stupid that is? People on redcafe, slating politicians, for following expert advice?
Well I'm sure there are a lot of experts in the UK that would recommend a different strategy. It's just a matter what you believe. I for one haven't heard a single expert in Austria recommend letting the virus spread but anyhow. As we've mentioned. The difference result wise won't be much. A shutdown will come it's just a matter of days.No, but France, USA and Denmark are also making political decisions that are AGAINST the advice of their experts. That's the difference.
A shutdown has always been part of the plan in the UK, the only debate is as to when.Well I'm sure there are a lot of experts in the UK that would recommend a different strategy. It's just a matter what you believe. I for one haven't heard a single expert in Austria recommend letting the virus spread but anyhow. As we've mentioned. The difference result wise won't be much. A shutdown will come it's just a matter of days.
It's just a basic explanation for those who don't understand what's going, I'm sure the government didn't commission it.Oh the policy was buckets all along. I'm convinced.