SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I can understand it from both opinions, but worst case scenario, if one of her family did have Covid she'd be taking it to possibly an area that:

If she drives to a Summer house, and isolates there, how is she "taking it" anywhere?

Explain the science to me there?

 

[RedSky]

Like I said, I am playing devils advocate here.

I am worried that there might not be much of a world after this if we remain in lockdown too long. It's a hard choice, I know, but plunge many more millions into poverty than would die of the virus might be a long term better outcome.

That's exactly what my mother says and she's a famed drama queen.

We might not be able to travel abroad for a few years as often as we did before and the Government will need to support small businesses that might be in financial difficulty since the lockdown occurred but humans are extremely resourceful and most people in our society will be determined to kick start the country again. It might actually give us a kick up the arse to respect what we have.

 

[Sandikan]

Ditto.

People are desperate to get pissed about anything right now, use some common sense about what to get angry about. BBQ at her mates with 15 others... get fecking angry.

Off to Summer house in a car, isolated from rest of World... no big deal.

Use the same standards for everyone.

Any extra unnecessary travel risks extra accidents that will require emergency services taken away from where they are needed for one thing.

Plus you don't know if these people are carriers of the virus as you can be asymptomatic.

Plus you can't have people of standing, proclaiming the rules then breaking them!

 

[sullydnl]

Here's that lack of common sense again though. Symptomless and isolated, how on Earth is she gonna spread it?

Has the virus suddenly changed so it can't be spread asymptomatically then?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Has the virus suddenly changed so it can't be spread asymptomatically then?

Has the virus suddenly changed so that is can jump from a person isolated in a car, then in a house, to the general public?

Explain the science.

 

[Drawfull]

Has the virus suddenly changed so that is can jump from a person isolated in a car, then in a house, to the general public?

Explain the science.

It's not about it doing that. What happens when the guy from Asda rocks up? When she goes out for milk?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Any extra unnecessary travel risks extra accidents that will require emergency services taken away from where they are needed for one thing.

Plus you don't know if these people are carriers of the virus as you can be asymptomatic.

Plus you can't have people of standing, proclaiming the rules then breaking them!

Storm in a teacup for me, getting angry at fellow citizens that are social distancing and isolating seems a sure fire way to get angry at everything.

 

[cyberman]

Here's that lack of common sense again though. Symptomless and isolated, how on Earth is she gonna spread it?

Who said she was that isolated?

Local people are irate that holidaymakers and second home owners have ignored the warnings from the chief medical officer to stay at home. The main street was described as being like a motorway and many second homes are full up,” they said.

It seems she was in the middle of nowhere is a notion plucked from thin air?
She would still need to shop etc

 

[sullydnl]

Has the virus suddenly changed so that is can jump from a person isolated in a car, then in a house, to the general public?

Explain the science.

She's going to stay inside at all times? No plan on going to the shop or anything? Has enough food to last her months no doubt. Hmmm.

 

[Smores]

Sorry to disappoint you, but I am neither.

Why would i be disappointed i said not everyone. On the other hand it's always useful to look at who shares your opinion to see if you've misjudged, in this case it's the daily mail opinion peice nuts and the worst of fox news. Not the best company.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

It's not about it doing that. What happens when the guy from Asda rocks up? When she goes out for milk?

She doesn't go for milk, she's not fecking stupid, she brought provisions from the city with her I'd imagine.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

She's going to stay inside at all times? No plan on going to the shop or anything? Hmmm.

Why would she have to shop? Can't she have brought a shit tonne of shopping with her?

She probably has a massive garden too there.

 

[Fully Fledged]

If they ran and stayed in their bolt holes, away from everyone and isolated. Yes, it's stupid.

If they fled to hang out in another smaller town around their population... not stupid.

In line with guidance she stayed within her own household group and observed social distancing with anyone she was in passing in the village.”

She was literally walking through the village. That is what the Scottish Government have said. So she didn't just stay in her bolthole.

 

[Sandikan]

The rule is stupid though. She's not harmed anyone, people wanting to stay in their second homes isn't a problem for me.

How is a rule about no unnecessary travel stupid?

What happens if you have a car accident? You're tying up resource very selfishly.

How do you think this virus spread? Through people travelling. Cut down travel you cut down the spread.

Are you one of the sunbathers? Are you going out doing your usual? Why not? Because youve accepted the risks and taken a reasonable decision to do your bit.

That's what this health woman should have done. Especially as she's instructing people to!

 

[Flamingo Purple]

Has the virus suddenly changed so that is can jump from a person isolated in a car, then in a house, to the general public?

Explain the science.

Travelling increases the risk shouldn't need to be explained. Going on a long distance is particularly bad because it can infect a whole new area.

Stopping for petrol.
Shopping for food in the new area.
The risk of needing medical care.
Exercising.

Of course if you're completely isolated there's no risk of spreading it but if enough people have this mindset one of them is more than likely to transmit the disease.

 

[Drawfull]

Why would she have to shop? Can't she have brought a shit tonne of shopping with her?

She probably has a massive garden too there.

Why not go and read the articles on it instead of spouting unfounded bollocks?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

She was literally walking through the village. That is what the Scottish Government have said. So she didn't just stay in her bolthole.

So she went out in the open and stayed away from everyone. Ok.

Look, if that pisses you off, so be it, but I think there's plenty of other more common sense things to be pissed off about that actual do carry risks.

 

[TheReligion]

She doesn't go for milk, she's not fecking stupid, she brought provisions from the city with her I'd imagine.

And here lies your problem. You're already having to scenario bust and explain it away when the purpose of her trip was really unnecessary.

Just stay at home. I'm really not sure why people can't do this without having to come up with ideas which involve them leaving the house to do X,Y and Z then trying to justify it.

 

[Dans]

That's exactly what my mother says and she's a famed drama queen.

We might not be able to travel abroad for a few years as often as we did before and the Government will need to support small businesses that might be in financial difficulty since the lockdown occurred but humans are extremely resourceful and most people in our society will be determined to kick start the country again. It might actually give us a kick up the arse to respect what we have.

Thanks!

I couldn't care less about not being able to travel, in fact I think the world will be a better place with far less travel. I also think countries should become more self sufficient, that globalisation has plenty of negative effects on society.

But currently, lot's of SME businesses owners risk losing their businesses already, big companies are laying off workers, freelancers have no work, shop owners have no business etc etc etc

How should this all be built up again? The ones who can help and stimulate a rebuild are the banks, but then it will be all on their terms. Disaster.

 

[dwd]

Neighbours just all piled into the car together with the kids and gone out for the third day running. Social distancing has taught me who to avoid forever after all this is over. Sick of selfish arrogant fecking wankers.

 

[Garethw]

Selfish, heartless bastards.
They don't give a feck about 5 year old kids dying on their own and having to be buried the same way or about nurses and doctors risking their lives in apocalyptic conditions. As long as they can have a day at the beach then all's fine in the world.
Calling them idiots is giving them an out. They aren't too thick to understand what is going on they just don't care. As long as it doesn't affect them personally why should their lives be disrupted.

100% agree mate.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Travelling increases the risk shouldn't need to be explained. Going on a long distance is particularly bad because it can infect a whole new area.

Stopping for petrol.

I shop for petrol at a card pump.

Shopping for food in the new area.

Take food with you from the City, or buy online. Get guy/girl to leave outside door.

The risk of needing medical care.

Fair point, unlikely for a fit healthy individual but ok, I'd imagine that'd be a worse strain on the health service in the City though.

Exercising.

Where are the risks here?

 

[Stactix]

The rule is stupid though. She's not harmed anyone, people wanting to stay in their second homes isn't a problem for me.

Except she is the Chief Medical officer, the rules are simple. If she is flouting those rules regardless of how unlikely it is she'll harm someone by doing this.
Other people will look to her example and think, well 'I'll do this and I'll do that, she's the Chief Medical officer, I'll just go to the beach not harming anyone right?

Then record numbers at the fecking beach because everyone has the same idea.
Akin to what happened the weekend before the lockdown.

 

[sullydnl]

Why would she have to shop? Can't she have brought a shit tonne of shopping with her?

She probably has a massive garden too there.

You're asking why she would have to get things from a shop at any point, like the overwhelming majority of people who are isolating will?

Suggesting (apropos of absolutely nothing as far as I can see) that she was about to successfully break all contact with the outside world for weeks on end is quite the position from someone who is supposed to be arguing for the merits of common sense.

 

[cyberman]

She doesn't go for milk, she's not fecking stupid, she brought provisions from the city with her I'd imagine.

She looks as if she has to resign over not following her own advice.
I wouldnt bet my house on her not being stupid

 

[Dancfc]

I could give two shits about anyones education. People can recover from that. Just like the economy can recover. You know who can’t recover? The people dying. So that should be the main priority which is saving lives not your nieces education.

Nobody has even talked about going into lockdown until Vaccine comes. But reducing the number of cases is the priority and having a lockdown will help that.

You say it’s not about wanting to go back to the pub or cinema? Then what is it about? These are the businesses that you talking about that will struggle, but you don’t want to go there. So what is it?

Well you should care about education because in 20 years time the less people properly educated will lead to less nurses, less surgeons etc required to save lives at that point.

And yes you're right people dying can't recover, which will if a lockdown is implemented long term will include scores of children that will starve to death because their parents/guardians won't have a pot to piss in. And that will happen, death through benefit sanctions is already a big problem, that more the government have to pay back from money borrowed during this crisis, the more they will penny pinch afterwards and harsher benefit penalties with even more people who can't work being declared "fit for work" being one of the first things that happen.

Now in an ideal happy clappy world we will find a solution that prevents death from this crisis completely, but that won't happen so the next best thing is minimizing death and the knock on affect for the next generation the best we can.

Reality is at some point (and sooner than people want to admit) the cons of a lockdown will benefit the pros. We will get more and more hospital admissions for failed suicide's, domestic violence, heart attacks through stress (which is already happened to a freinds of mine reliteve) amoung other things which will in itself on top of the virus end up overwhelming the NHS and totally defeating the object of lock down in the first place.

Now just to be clear, I am in no way suggesting that we should soon to straight back to normal, but a happy medium must be found at some point not just for the economy but for general mental well-being, and to do what everyone's saying their doing this lockdown for, to ultimately protect the NHS and save lives.

 

[crappycraperson]

That's not how lockdown works. Subjectively, there can be thousands of cases where people can venture out to their second homes, vacation homes etc. It is not possible for any authority to validate the same so only solution is to have a blanket curb on all such visits.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

That's not how lockdown works. Subjectively, there can be thousands of cases where people can venture out to their second homes, vacation homes etc. It is not possible for any authority to validate the same so only solution is to have a blanket curb on all such visits.

I'd hope that people could be clever enough to travel to a second home and take zero risks. I guess maybe I have more faith in humanity than they probably deserve judging by this thread.

 

[Stactix]

Here's that lack of common sense again though. Symptomless and isolated, how on Earth is she gonna spread it?

It can take days before symptoms show and those that don't have any symptoms can spread it no?

If you enforce a rule and someone at the top behind these rules breaks them regardless of how minor, others will follow.
That grey area becomes a rabbit hole everyone gets the same idea and decides to test those rules..

Weekend before lockdown record numbers were at Snowdonia..

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

You're asking why she would have to get things from a shop at any point, like the overwhelming majority of people who are isolating will?

Suggesting (apropos of absolutely nothing as far as I can see) that she was about to successfully break all contact with the outside world for weeks on end is quite the position for someone supposed to be arguing for the merits of common sense.

Sully, people can travel to a Summer house and successfully isolate and take no risks.

Yes or No?

 

[NinjaFletch]

I shop for petrol at a card pump.



Take food with you from the City, or buy online. Get guy/girl to leave outside door.



Fair point, unlikely for a fit healthy individual but ok, I'd imagine that'd be a worse strain on the health service in the City though.



Where are the risks here?

You don't know you're a fit healthy individual because you can have the virus for weeks without showing symptoms.

At this point I think you're being wilfully stupid. You have the 11th most posts in this thread and don't seem to want to do anything other than spout utter drivel that will get people killed. You're wasting yours and everybody else's time.

 

[Sandikan]

Storm in a teacup for me, getting angry at fellow citizens that are social distancing and isolating seems a sure fire way to get angry at everything.

Imagine if everyone does the same as her.
Maybe change second house to a hotel.
Then see the problem.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

It can take days before symptoms show and those that don't have any symptoms can spread it no?

Not if you maintain all social distances, unless there's something I'm missing?

Anyway, I'll leave it, you're all getting a little too worked up about someone leaving their home so I won't be winning this debate.

 

[Sandikan]

You don't know you're a fit healthy individual because you can have the virus for weeks without showing symptoms.

At this point I think you're being wilfully stupid. You have the 11th most posts in this thread and don't seem to want to do anything other than spout utter drivel that will get people killed. You're wasting yours and everybody else's time.

I think he's one of these sunbathers

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

You don't know you're a fit healthy individual because you can have the virus for weeks without showing symptoms.

Ahhhhh.. to be fair Ninj, I thought you meant require non-Covid-19 attention.

Fair point then, I'd still argue in that case you're a bigger strain on the City but yeah I get you.

 

[Fully Fledged]

It can take days before symptoms show and those that don't have any symptoms can spread it no?

If you enforce a rule and someone at the top behind these rules breaks them regardless of how minor, others will follow.
That grey area becomes a rabbit hole everyone gets the same idea and decides to test those rules..

Weekend before lockdown record numbers were at Snowdonia..

And next weekend is Easter Weekend. People looking for an excuse to go to their caravan or second home for a long weekend.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Imagine if everyone does the same as her.
Maybe change second house to a hotel.
Then see the problem.

If everyone maintains social distance, we'll get through this alright. Whether that be in your first home, or Summer home.

If people don't, the health service will be in trouble.

 

[JMack1234]

People will embrace it if they feel it’s for the greater good, and clearly that’s the case.

I take it you don’t agree with lockdowns?

Believe it or not I do agree with a short lockdown to give the NHS time to get as much capacity as it can.

However, a lockdown is an appalling way of dealing with the virus. It destroys our civil liberties and the economy simultaneously. Unless you're going to lockdown the country until we get a vaccine. (we're not) you need a exit strategy and a better way of dealing it.

I also don't agree with the prevailing mood that to question the lockdown is not being a team player or disrespecting the NHS. It's not. We do need be demanding our liberty back as soon as is possible.

 

[RedSky]

Thanks!

I couldn't care less about not being able to travel, in fact I think the world will be a better place with far less travel. I also think countries should become more self sufficient, that globalisation has plenty of negative effects on society.

But currently, lot's of SME businesses owners risk losing their businesses already, big companies are laying off workers, freelancers have no work, shop owners have no business etc etc etc

How should this all be built up again? The ones who can help and stimulate a rebuild are the banks, but then it will be all on their terms. Disaster.

It's in the banks and Governments interest to spark up the economy after this. They're hardly going to sit on their hands and watch the country freeze and the reason why so many have been layed off is to ensure those businesses survive the next few months with a significantly reduced income. We're a resilient species, the world is hardly going to fall apart. I would think differently if Covid killed people in younger age brackets as that would impact countries infrastructre significantly but currently the situation will leave people with a few rocky months ahead and given it's Summer and most of the population will be able to enjoy the summer weather I don't think it will be too bad. It would be a different situation if this occured in Autumn as dealing with this through the darkness and bad weather would depress the majority of the country.

I do feel sorry for Vegans mind as I imagine the entire urban area of the UK is going to smell of BBQ'd meat for the next 3 months.

 

[NinjaFletch]

I think he's one of these sunbathers

My gut feeling is whenever you see anybody complaining about people policing the lockdown it's because they were out doing it themselves and don't want to be made to feel bad for it. I get everyone is bored and fractious, which is why I cant help get irate with people who can't do what they're told and whose going to make us stay inside Ionger.