SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

Carolina Red

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Sure, it is from Revelation 6. The rider of the white horse with the crown(Corona) and the bow the ancient Greek word (Toxon) can also mean a biological agent, or a virus. The opening ceremony of the 2012 Olympic games in London actually contains many clues to what is going on. There is a plan behind all of this. Go to youtube and search for "olympic games opening ceremony 2012" and take your pick from the results.
1) "Corona" - yeah, that word's language didn't even exist when Revelation was written. So, your etymology is lacking.

2) Toxon - means bow. Toxin comes from a combination of terms that refers to poison tipped arrows, so again, your etymology is lacking.

3) 2012 Olympic "plan" details are... [shrugs shoulders]. Don't tell someone to go on some Youtube scavenger hunt. You're the one bringing it up, you give the evidence.

Basically, all I see here is a shit attempt by you at explaining your confirmation bias.
 

Cardboard elk

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Ecuador suddenly 10977 cases and 1028 deaths reported just now. As I mentioned earlier there has been thousand of deaths propably due to covid-19 there in march/april, but I guess they now have got more testing capabilities.
 

Hound Dog

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If the 0.5% mortality rate turns out to be true (and there is plenty to suggest that), we are actually talking for 30-40m real infections in the world.
Assuming the 0.5% is true, it is more. There are more deaths than reported and there is also a lag between infections and deaths. 30-40 could be a decent estimate for cases two weeks ago or so. Or is it three, unsure what the average lag between infection and death is.
 

jymufc20

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Sure, it is from Revelation 6. The rider of the white horse with the crown(Corona) and the bow the ancient Greek word (Toxon) can also mean a biological agent, or a virus. The opening ceremony of the 2012 Olympic games in London actually contains many clues to what is going on. There is a plan behind all of this. Go to youtube and search for "olympic games opening ceremony 2012" and take your pick from the results.
Shouldn't you be out and about, protesting in America.
 

adexkola

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I have already watched that video and it has several issues:
The experiment they carried out was pretty basic, but interesting and a good start nonetheless. They took images using a laser. They do not appear to carry out any diagnostics to quantify anything meaningful other than how far the droplets reached. The paramaters they need to quantify are droplet size and velocity, surrounding gas velocity, and droplet concentration. Whilst it is very difficult to do these things simultaneously, Particle Image Velocimetry is a well established technique and can be done at different times (i.e. measure the gas conditions and then measure droplet velocity). You can use, amongst others, Phase Doppler or other techniques to measure the size of the droplets too. Phase Doppler also has a limited capacity to measure droplet concentration at a point in space. Not reporting the size or velocity makes the study interesting and a good start, but certainly not conclusive. Similar studies have been carried out for droplets in engineering for decades. The novelty of their work appears to be releasing the droplets specifically from someone sneezing. In engineering it would likely be some spray system, pipe flow etc but the fundamental physics are the same. One condition missing from their experimental study is that the background air is quiescient but in outdoors, you will often have a light breeze at minimum, so you effectively have turbulent motion. Turbulence (or any meaningful laminar flow) is what is really complicating the picture here, not necessarily quiescient conditions.

At 1:30 in the video they say "you can see a large droplet about 1mm in diameter". Well I would disagree. What you see there is just a photo - at best you can say it is a liquid ligament. You can see some droplets, I don't think you can measure accurately the size. You can't say you see droplets of 1mm there unless you've actually measured them. Measuring droplet size with photos is possible with certain conditions, but when you get to microdroplet size and when you also have a large field of view, typically you need to use laser diagnostics such as Phase Doppler or something more sophisticated because the droplets size can't be imaged well due to the diffraction limit. This is an optics issue, something I don't really understand at all, but it is very real and there is I believe something called the Rayleigh criterion to determine it. Maybe some budding photographers will know more about this.

At 1:40 I don't know what they mean by a high sensitivity camera, but okay, it seems to give some useful image data.

2:06/5:53 I've said it several times, water droplets in air are not "light". This is just factually wrong. They are "heavy". "Light" droplets would refer to when the droplet density is smaller than air and I don't believe the droplets here have a lighter density than air because they are "droplets", i.e. liquid. I've already said before, the dynamics of light droplets in air and heavy droplets in air are completely different. I could be wrong, maybe their density is indeed lighter but I doubt it.

2:16 They've previously mentioned that some droplets were 1mm in size, and now they are saying they are just "microdroplets". Which is it? The distinction is important because how the droplets disperse both in still and moving air depends strongly on size. What they really should say is you have a polydispersed cloud of droplets, which means you have a range of different droplet sizes.

3:49 Simulations in multiphase flows are bereft with issues. Without any details given, you should take every simulation with a pinch of salt. For example, does this simulation account for heat transfer processes, e.g. evaporation. Does this simulation use Lagrangian or Eulerian tracking of the droplets (ie. how does it try to "track" the droplets)? What simiplification of the equation of motion of the droplets did they use? Did they study coupling effects/ collisions? Did they use RANS, LES or DNS for the single phase flow? Just a whole lot of questions. Take everything about the simulation with a pinch of salt.

5:03-5:14 Again a factual error and complete nonsense. Even without surrounding air motion, droplets will move due to gravity. Droplets less than 20 micron will also move somewhat due to Brownian motion, and this becomes more pronounced at sizes <1 micron. The reason they remain suspended is because Brownian motion acts in several directions and their terminal velocity (caused by gravity) is extremely small - in other words they fall to the ground very slowly. I know what they are trying to say. They are trying to say that droplets remain suspended within a small confined space for some time, but it could and should be clearer than what they have said. They've also not considered that the droplets may simply evaporate.

5:27 "Opening windows and having air circulation". Just wishy washy words to say that the motion of small droplets becomes correlated with background air motion. This is not new and has been known for decades. Infact, it is exploited by Particle Image Velocimetry to measure gas flow velocity, which I mentioned above. Very high velocity air motion will probably enhance evaporation too.

So to conclude they seemed to ignore or neglect to discuss turbulent motion, which is everywhere when you go outside. They've completely ignored anything to do with evaporation. They've ignored social distancing measures of 2m and the terminology they use is misleading at times. All this video does is create fear amongst people who won't understand the physics which is the vast majority of people. The experiment is a good start, but ideally we need to continue that with more sophisticated experimental conditions and also better laser diagnostics (or other diagnostic) measures. So I don't think that video explains anything to be honest.
You sound like my boring ass 1D gasdynamics professor
 

Dante

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I have already watched that video and it has several issues:
The experiment they carried out was pretty basic, but interesting and a good start nonetheless. They took images using a laser. They do not appear to carry out any diagnostics to quantify anything meaningful other than how far the droplets reached. The paramaters they need to quantify are droplet size and velocity, surrounding gas velocity, and droplet concentration. Whilst it is very difficult to do these things simultaneously, Particle Image Velocimetry is a well established technique and can be done at different times (i.e. measure the gas conditions and then measure droplet velocity). You can use, amongst others, Phase Doppler or other techniques to measure the size of the droplets too. Phase Doppler also has a limited capacity to measure droplet concentration at a point in space. Not reporting the size or velocity makes the study interesting and a good start, but certainly not conclusive. Similar studies have been carried out for droplets in engineering for decades. The novelty of their work appears to be releasing the droplets specifically from someone sneezing. In engineering it would likely be some spray system, pipe flow etc but the fundamental physics are the same. One condition missing from their experimental study is that the background air is quiescient but in outdoors, you will often have a light breeze at minimum, so you effectively have turbulent motion. Turbulence (or any meaningful laminar flow) is what is really complicating the picture here, not necessarily quiescient conditions.

At 1:30 in the video they say "you can see a large droplet about 1mm in diameter". Well I would disagree. What you see there is just a photo - at best you can say it is a liquid ligament. You can see some droplets, I don't think you can measure accurately the size. You can't say you see droplets of 1mm there unless you've actually measured them. Measuring droplet size with photos is possible with certain conditions, but when you get to microdroplet size and when you also have a large field of view, typically you need to use laser diagnostics such as Phase Doppler or something more sophisticated because the droplets size can't be imaged well due to the diffraction limit. This is an optics issue, something I don't really understand at all, but it is very real and there is I believe something called the Rayleigh criterion to determine it. Maybe some budding photographers will know more about this.

At 1:40 I don't know what they mean by a high sensitivity camera, but okay, it seems to give some useful image data.

2:06/5:53 I've said it several times, water droplets in air are not "light". This is just factually wrong. They are "heavy". "Light" droplets would refer to when the droplet density is smaller than air and I don't believe the droplets here have a lighter density than air because they are "droplets", i.e. liquid. I've already said before, the dynamics of light droplets in air and heavy droplets in air are completely different. I could be wrong, maybe their density is indeed lighter but I doubt it.

2:16 They've previously mentioned that some droplets were 1mm in size, and now they are saying they are just "microdroplets". Which is it? The distinction is important because how the droplets disperse both in still and moving air depends strongly on size. What they really should say is you have a polydispersed cloud of droplets, which means you have a range of different droplet sizes.

3:49 Simulations in multiphase flows are bereft with issues. Without any details given, you should take every simulation with a pinch of salt. For example, does this simulation account for heat transfer processes, e.g. evaporation. Does this simulation use Lagrangian or Eulerian tracking of the droplets (ie. how does it try to "track" the droplets)? What simiplification of the equation of motion of the droplets did they use? Did they study coupling effects/ collisions? Did they use RANS, LES or DNS for the single phase flow? Just a whole lot of questions. Take everything about the simulation with a pinch of salt.

5:03-5:14 Again a factual error and complete nonsense. Even without surrounding air motion, droplets will move due to gravity. Droplets less than 20 micron will also move somewhat due to Brownian motion, and this becomes more pronounced at sizes <1 micron. The reason they remain suspended is because Brownian motion acts in several directions and their terminal velocity (caused by gravity) is extremely small - in other words they fall to the ground very slowly. I know what they are trying to say. They are trying to say that droplets remain suspended within a small confined space for some time, but it could and should be clearer than what they have said. They've also not considered that the droplets may simply evaporate.

5:27 "Opening windows and having air circulation". Just wishy washy words to say that the motion of small droplets becomes correlated with background air motion. This is not new and has been known for decades. Infact, it is exploited by Particle Image Velocimetry to measure gas flow velocity, which I mentioned above. Very high velocity air motion will probably enhance evaporation too.

So to conclude they seemed to ignore or neglect to discuss turbulent motion, which is everywhere when you go outside. They've completely ignored anything to do with evaporation. They've ignored social distancing measures of 2m and the terminology they use is misleading at times. All this video does is create fear amongst people who won't understand the physics which is the vast majority of people. The experiment is a good start, but ideally we need to continue that with more sophisticated experimental conditions and also better laser diagnostics (or other diagnostic) measures. So I don't think that video explains anything to be honest.
And yet when I asked you about "fecking droplets, how do they work?" you said nothing :(
 

Pogue Mahone

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This whole social media driven conspiracy bollox about how we can’t trust “MSM” is really taking hold. Which is a disaster because - although the mainstream press has its flaws - the alternative is infinitely worse.

Unless that survey was done in America? In which case, fair enough. Fox news etc
 

jymufc20

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This whole social media driven conspiracy bollox about how we can’t trust “MSM” is really taking hold. Which is a disaster because - although the mainstream press has its flaws - the alternative is infinitely worse.

Unless that survey was done in America? In which case, fair enough. Fox news etc
I have said from the beginning of all this, it's the idiots that will kill us all, not covid-19.
 

Sweet Square

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So everyone around me just started clapping and letting off fireworks........................it's been a tory stronghold for decades.

 

Dante

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The papers have come up with lots of conflicting and contradictory stories, much (but not all) of it for shock value and to boost sales.

They may well be relaying accurate news based on a selection of experts. But that doesn't mean that readers are going to be happy about it.

Media companies tend to sell themselves based on defined narratives. Fox has its narrative, the Guardian has its, the Telegraph has one too. Each of viewerships/readerships want their opinions reinforced and their favourite narratives told over and over in slightly different ways. That's why they choose the media they do.

What these viewerships/readerships don't particularly want is changes or twists in the overarching story. The latter is what's been happening. It's the opposite of confirmation bias, and people are unhappy about their favourite outlets constantly shifting the sand under their feet. A range of opinions might be better for everyone's understanding, but it's not what leads to trust. Which is unfortunate.
 

11101

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It's their own fault.

They're all so desperate to be relevant and get clicks that they're taking any expert's word they can find as gospel, without acknowledging that the experts are learning about this virus too and are being proven wrong all the time as we understand more about it.
 

Penna

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Meanwhile in Birmingham:
Bereavement staff have been spat at and assaulted by mourners who are angry at the six-person restriction for funerals, a city council has said.

Councillors condemned the incidents, which they said put staff at greater risk during the coronavirus pandemic.

Birmingham City Council has imposed a limit of six people per funeral, although other councils are allowing up to 10 visitors.

The council said its bereavement staff had been under increased pressure.

Paul Lankester, assistant director of regulation and enforcement - which includes bereavement services - said: "Emotions always run high when someone has lost a loved one and unfortunately there have been incidents where some of my staff have been verbally abused and that sort of thing.

"We try and work with people but I would just encourage people to remember they're just doing their job, they don't set the policy.

"I think the biggest difficulty has been the volume of emails we're getting, we're getting thousands a week more than we would've done and I can only apologise for that."

The council statement said staff had also suffered verbal and physical abuse.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-birmingham-52396748
 

Sparky Rhiwabon

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Expect an announcement tomorrow from the Welsh Government on loosening the lockdown restrictions. England won't be far behind.
 

The Cat

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Expect an announcement tomorrow from the Welsh Government on loosening the lockdown restrictions. England won't be far behind.
Really? That goes against everything they have said so far - they were at great pains to say they would extend further than England if need be.
 

Sparky Rhiwabon

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Really? That goes against everything they have said so far - they were at great pains to say they would extend further than England if need be.
Maybe they were just making the point that they will do their own thing. Far less deaths in Wales, so it makes sense.
 

Eriku

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Sure, it is from Revelation 6. The rider of the white horse with the crown(Corona) and the bow the ancient Greek word (Toxon) can also mean a biological agent, or a virus. The opening ceremony of the 2012 Olympic games in London actually contains many clues to what is going on. There is a plan behind all of this. Go to youtube and search for "olympic games opening ceremony 2012" and take your pick from the results.
Uh oh, someone pulled Im red2’s cord again.
 

Madthinker

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I reckon that's bunk.

Fag-packet calculation of population future life expectancy for Italy death profile:

Age/deaths/future life
0-9/2/77.8
10-19/0/68.4
20-29/7/58.6
30-39/47/48.8
40-49/197/39.2
50-59/842/29.9
60-69/2515/21.2
70-79/6747/13.5
80-89/9171/7.3
90+/3056/3

Weighted average is c11 years. It's implausible that the future life expectancy of a Covid-19 victim isn't a lot lower.

Edit - reading further, it seems they calculate the normal age/gender-adjusted future life as 14 for men, but 13 taking into account underlying health conditions with the same penetration rate as the victims. The future life expectancy will be lower for the set of people that have underlying health conditions to the extent that getting covid-19 would prove fatal.
 
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Shakesy

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They're all so desperate to be relevant and get clicks that they're taking any expert's word they can find as gospel, without acknowledging that the experts are learning about this virus too and are being proven wrong all the time as we understand more about it.
The general mistrust of the broader public isn't exactly proof that the majority of journalists are doing a bad job. Since when does public opinion matter so much? People are angry. Some direct this anger towards China, some to politicians, and some to journalists. Even trust in scientists is failing - partly because they all have different takes on the matter. The reason behind the mistrust is because one person would read something, hang on to the theory and dump any hypothesis or article that dare cast any doubt on it.

An opinion piece by the media is just that - an opinion. We all have them. An interview with a scientist is just another opinion. All in all, nobody really knows this virus, but everyone thinks they do.
 
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unchanged_lineup

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Bill Gates could not get his Windows virus free, so now he is going to recommend a vaccine to get humans virus free, make it mandatory and before that happens also make sure that no one can sue him if things go wrong? Africa and India come to mind when ever I hear anything about a Bill Gates vaccine. I will not ever take a vaccine from some one who wants to control world population. Bill from 2 mins 22.
Where to even start. Shaky ground cubed.
 

0le

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And yet when I asked you about "fecking droplets, how do they work?" you said nothing :(
Didn't think you were being serious to be honest. Not sure if you still are. I can't speak for evaporation, but regarding dispersion, the main challenge is that the droplets don't really always behave is obvious ways. There are many challenges. Warning, the spoilers below are lengthy and will probably make you want to sleep.

Only open this if you really, really want to read a little about droplet dispersion:
In some of the discussions I've mentioned above and also in some of these articles, they say statements such as "small droplets disperse easily" and "large droplets settle quickly". This is acceptable because broadly speaking it is true and it is okay for a wider audience not involved in the field. The devil is in the detail though. The reality is that it is much more complicated then this when the air is moving quite quickly (turbulent motion). You can't really say these statements anymore in this case because how the droplets disperse now additionally now depends on characteristics of the moving air. Or more specifically velocity fluctuations (momentum) imparted (transferred) to the droplets by the air.

Typically if the air is turbulent, the best way to describe this is as a superposition (an addition of sorts) of lots of different air movements, all of different shapes and sizes, all on top of one another. Think of it like a forest with trees (large scales), flowers (small scales) plants (medium scales) all on top of each other. It is a bit like that but the key difference is that the scales in the fluid are all entangled with eachother. One way to describe the large scales is called the "integral scale". Broadly speaking it measures very large distance air motion. If you are in a room, it will describe the characteristics of really large air motion which spans the entire room. But within this room, within the large scale air motion, don't forget we also have tiny air motions. These tiny, small motions we call "Kolmogorov scales".

The reason these two scales (Integral and Kolmogorov) are important is because they influence greatly how droplets disperse. We use a non-dimensional number (like how biologists use this R number) to describe, qualitatively how droplets move. This is called the Stokes number. It is a measure of how much intertia, i.e. resistance, that the droplet has to any momentum which is imparted onto it. Effectively it is calculated by a characteristic of the droplet divided by a characteristic of the gas. But unfortunately, we don't really know what is the best scale of the gas to use, is it either the Integral scale or the Kolmogorov scale. Whilst there is some agreement as to how to characterise the droplet, it is made complicated because sprays and clouds of droplets have different sizes, so ideally we want a single number describing the entire cloud, and not a number describing just one droplet in the cloud.

When the Stokes number is really small, we can then say, qualitatively, "small droplets disperse easily". This is the reason why we can do Particle Image Velocimetry, a technique used to measure either gas velocity or droplet velocity. You cannot measure size. Think of this like small dust grains moving with the wind.

When the Stokes number is very large, we can say "droplets settle quickly", or better still, they follow ballistic trajectories. This simply means they just basically ignore much of the surrounding air motion. Think of this like a cricket ball moving through a very light wind.

However, when the Stokes number ~ 1, the droplets behave in a strange way. They begin to form clusters in the flow. This is the same as clustering you get in machine learning. In essence, you get regions in the air flow where there are many droplets (clusters) and region in the air flow where there are few (voids). It is called "preferential concentration" in my field. Unfortunately we don't know the mechanisms as to why this occur though some have been proposed. The relevant point here is that there is experimental and simulation evidence to suggest that when the droplets form clusters, their settling velocity, i.e. how quickly the droplets settle, is enhanced! It could be that these droplets, when they get close together, just form a "super" droplet of sorts. I have no idea what the consequences of this effect are for evaporation. This preferential concentration effect is known to also enhance collisions, at least from what we can understand in CFD (computational fluid dynamics) simulations and its influence on the formation of rain in clouds is hotly debated.

So if you know the Stokes number, you can, at least qualitiatively, have some indication on how the droplets disperse. So what Stokes numbers do you have? If the air is very strong, the Kolmogorov scales get smaller. So if you study the dispersion of the droplets using those scales, you could in theory say all the droplets disperse easily.The majority of papers I've read use Kolmogorov scales rather than integral. But again I stress, it is very difficult to first, produce this Stokes number and secondly to try and get a representative Stokes number of the entire spray or cloud.

Unfortuately, if the droplets have initially a large moving velocity, another parameter must be considered as well. This is called the "settling parameter" although I don't see many authors use it at all. The need to use settling parameter is important because a large amount of energy or momentum is transferred to the droplets during sneezing/coughing. Therefore, at least initially, these droplets may ignore all the surrounding air simply because they are moving so quickly, they don't really have time to react to any of the motion. When the settling parameter, described in this way, is unity, the settling velocity of the droplets is enhanced as well! This is called the "crossing trajectories effect" and was described in part in the 1950's I believe. When the velocity of the droplet decays to a situation where they become well correlated with the air motion, you don't really need the settling parameter anymore because it is a function of the Stokes number in this case. Note that a lot of professors believe you only really need the Stokes number, so my understanding here is somewhat limited.

Again note that the settling parameter and Stokes number only give a qualitative indication of what happens. They can't tell you exactly where the droplets will go, just give an indication of roughly how they will disperse. To track exactly where the droplets go requires experiments or simulations.

There has been a lot of work in engineering in studies of particles or droplets in "simple idealised turbulence" i.e. turbulence you typically only get in laboratory, but less fundamental studies in turbulent flows you encounter in nature and engineering. However, a lot of work comes from combustion, studying spray ignition in engines and how the spray behaves in that flow environment but this isn't my field. A lot of simulations have been carried out in cloud physics as I mentioned above. The problem is that whilst we want to believe all turbulent flows are the same, there is some belief that they are not. So a flow in the pipe must be treated differently to the flow of air in your room etc. We just don't know if turbulent flows have any universal properties which are true for all engineering and natural applications. So just because when you sneeze in a room the droplets behave one way, it may be different if you sneeze outdoors where the air motion is different.

The reason why you need to be careful with CFD is that the methods used, RANS and LES don't simulate all the flow using the Navier Stokes (NS) equations of motion for fluid dynamics. Note that the NS equations are simply Newton's second law applied to moving fluids. RANS actually uses an averaged Navier stokes equation and this requires turbulence modelling - i.e. adhoc "best guess" methods - to fix the averaged equations so that they can be simulated. No one knows if the various turbulence models are valid but it is cheap to run and can give results which give "the overall picture" for air flows without droplets. LES does simulate some of the equations, but it cuts of at a certain point and simply models the rest - it claims beyond that point the flow behaves in a way described by a model. Guess where that model is - the Kolmogorov scales, so it isn't clear that you can use LES for problems with droplets because it isn't clear if the models really describe the Kolmogorov scales accurately or not. DNS (Direct Numerical Simulation) simulates all the details of the flow and is in theory the best simulation. But it has a very high computational cost. I'm not sure what they've done in the video, I am skeptical they managed to do DNS but you never know.

Even if you manage to get a DNS you still have to consider how you describe the small droplets. The majority of simulations just say the droplets are "points", so that they don't have an appreciable size. The majority of simulations ignore any "back influence" of the droplets on the air flow. So in other words, if the air flow causes droplets to move, the droplets themselves may change locally the air flow! There may also be collisions between droplets, irrespective of the clustering phenomenon I described above which are ignored and local flow distortions caused by the droplets. If you read the spoiler below, these collisions can lead to droplets of different sizes, which of course may be important. Finally, if the droplets are larger than the Kolmogorov scale air motions, their dynamics is different and there are very few simulations which look at these droplets - most focus on particles/droplets smaller than the Kolmogorov scale. Also note that if the particles or droplets have a density smaller than the density of the surrounding air, the dynamics are different as well.

You may ask why not carry out experiments and brute force our way through this. Laser experiments are quite difficult to carry out. The laser must be aligned with its internal/external optics. If a camera is used, it may need to be synced with the laser. 3D experiments in multiphase flows are exceedingly rare. Tracking individual droplets, in particular their collisions, is generally difficult. So whilst there are some good experiments, they are lagging behind considerably to where we need to be. Couple this with the issues with CFD and this is why particle/droplet dispersion in turbulence is a pretty tricky problem.

Note I've also ignored temperature affects, called thermophoresis and turbulence intensity (the air motion is stronger in one location than another) affects, called turbophoresis. I've not studied these effects but they can also influence particle/droplet dispersion. Note also I don't have a background in simulations, so some of that knowledge may be out of date. Note that for the benefit of this discussion, solid particles disperse in the same way as liquid droplets, with the exception of the discussion on collision outcomes.

Only open this if you really want to read about droplet collisions:
When a droplet collides with a solid surface, the amount of liquid content that remains on the surface depends on various properties. This includes properties of the droplet like its size and velocity, its surface tension and viscosity. Conditions of the surface include surface roughness, how wet it is, temperature etc. The surrounding gas also has an influence, including viscosity of the gas and temperature effects etc. As far as I understand it, the reason why droplets of oil move about in a hot pan is because when the droplet touches the surface, the oil in contact with the hot surface evaporates so quickly that it creates a protective layer, preventing the rest of the droplet from evaporating. This is called the "Leidenfrost effect".

So why is this important for the spread of viruses? If you exhale droplets through sneezing/coughing, those droplets may collide with a surface. In some cases, some of the liquid will break up from the surface and re-enter the air. We call this "secondary atomization" and the small droplets which re-enter the air are called "satellite" droplets. The liquid remaining on the surface will then remain there until it evaporates. I posted some images of these processes in the stickied thread. Note that a spray of droplets colliding on a surface may have different behaviour than individual droplets colliding on the same surface. This is because in a spray of droplets, as one droplet collides onto a surface, whilst its collision is still taking place, another droplet may collide in the same location, and this can change the outcome of original collision. It may be a similar issue with the cloud of droplets produced from sneezing/coughing.

You can also get droplets colliding in mid-air. Again the outcome of the collision depends on various processes as well as some of the processes I described in the previous spoiler. In essence, when two droplets collide, you may get all their liquid forming into one larger droplet. This type of collision is called "coalesence". Alternatively you may get other collisions which lead to a larger droplet, but also some smaller droplets too. There are several collision outcomes which lead to this type of collision. There could be mid-air collisions, at least initially, when the cloud of droplets is produced from sneezing/coughing, because the droplets may move with different velocities due to their differences in size. Alternatively mid-air collisions may occur because the surrounding air around one droplet may differ to the surroinding air around another, leading to those droplets having a different droplet velocity and possibly leading to collision.

A word on nanofluids:
These are fluids with particles that are of the size of nanometer(s). According to colleagues I spoke to, they aren't well understood, but they were researching them to investigate their heat transfer properties. Supposedly for one type of nanoparticle at least, it significantly enhances how much heat can transfer through a liquid. I don't know anything about how nanoparticles move in a fluid, but Brownian motion will almost certainly be important here. Knowledge, at least in this part of nanofluids, remains limited. The reason I've mentioned them is in case the virus can be transmitted in nanosized droplets or whatever - I don't know.
 
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Suv666

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Bill Gates could not get his Windows virus free, so now he is going to recommend a vaccine to get humans virus free, make it mandatory and before that happens also make sure that no one can sue him if things go wrong? Africa and India come to mind when ever I hear anything about a Bill Gates vaccine. I will not ever take a vaccine from some one who wants to control world population. Bill from 2 mins 22.
Are you on Mescaline?
 

Suv666

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Just saw a woman in UK getting a shot of a vaccine as human trials begin.
How long will it take from here for a vaccine to be ready assuming all goes well?
 

Suedesi

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Bill Gates could not get his Windows virus free, so now he is going to recommend a vaccine to get humans virus free, make it mandatory and before that happens also make sure that no one can sue him if things go wrong? Africa and India come to mind when ever I hear anything about a Bill Gates vaccine. I will not ever take a vaccine from some one who wants to control world population. Bill from 2 mins 22.
Huh?
 

Revan

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Fecks sake.
Until the phase A of testing (just a few individuals) does not finish successfully, and candidate vaccines don't start the second stage (administrating it to a few dozens to a few tens of people), the answer is gonna be the same (12-18 months). There are already dozens of candidate vaccines (probably even more than a hundred if the number increased recently), some of which are doing testing. Hopefully, Moderna's results will be really fast (it has passed a month or so since the first person was vaccinated, so it should be interesting to see the number of antibodies there). In any case, most of the time is gonna be spent on testing, not on building the vaccine (which has already happened). The problem is that if the testing results negative, then everything starts from the beginning, so the 12-18 months get reset.