SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

[djembatheking]

Other people in 'selfish dicks' shocker.

For the record, I feel the same. Nobody has been allowed in my home since March. Seems very few people around here is doing the same and somehow numbers are creeping up. Who'd have thought actions have consequences?

I just find it really strange , it isn`t hard to have visitors outside , the weathers been good but no one seems to bother or care . I suppose a lot of people don`t have vulnerable friends or relatives and therefore have less reason to worry .

 

[Baxter]

They've ordered all pubs, cafe's and restaurants to close in Aberdeen just now.

Cases still rising. Two Aberdeen players have got it, and the National running a story that several were out in the City Centre after losing to Rangers on Saturday.

 

[noodlehair]

At some point there at least has to be an acknowledgement that this is all doing more harm than good at this point, because we desperately need to change th way we are dealing with this and it's now going into "too late" territory for a lot of people.

I get that case numbers are not going down, but it's a virus. That's generally what happens. It isn't just going to go away by keeping people out of bowling alleys a couple of weeks longer.

We've completely changed everything we do and most people are living in some degree of either uselessness or misery or both, and the fact is that there will be a second wave in the winter regardless. There will be significant increased death rates through poverty, unemployment, depression etc. People cannot meet, date, interact, learn off each other, make friends, etc. There's literally no benefit to anything that anyone is doing outside of the effect on case numbers...and even then if that's what it's about the plan fails to make any sense because what we are doing will not do anything other than subdue the virus until the winter, at which point there will be no plan and there will still be no reliable treatment.

People are acting like what we are doing is sustainable but it is absolutely the opposite. Working from home does not work. Historically we change how we work to be more productive based on new technology and science. What we have now is Microsoft teams and zoom, which is basically just a shite version of making a phone call. Productivity is down, employment is down, education is evidently a complete and utter mess. It's gone a long way past the point where it stopped being a workable solution. Anyone who works in a restuarant, cafe, anywhere that relies on office workers for income, is fecked...and that's an awful lot of people. What's the solution there?

We're heading into a winter where a significant number of people's health either physically or mentally will have suffered since March and that, even without Covid, is going to put a big strain on the health system. Then on top of that Covid numbers are going to go up significantly again, aided by the fact we've spent all summer hiding from it but not actually doing very much to get rid of it. The solution for this is to ban deals on junk food?...yet at the moment you can get a McDonalds half price 3 days a week. People who are sat at home drinking, smoking, ordering takeaways more, have had treatments cancelled or delayed for various conditions, etc. Aren't suddenly going to crop into full athletic health because a pizza costs 50p more.

I'm still at an utter loss to what the plan is and why people are so ignorant of the wide range of problems building up. Some of which have now reached the point of being absolute mammoth issues in themselves. It's like people are just happy to live in unproductive misery, which you could maybe argue is a sacrifice except that by the end of this we will have saved next to no one and killed a frightening amount of people who we didn't need to. Some of the stuff coming from the governments "scientific" advisors is fecking scary. It's the sort of thing you'd think was stupid coming from a 7 year old.

 

[Maluco]

At some point there at least has to be an acknowledgement that this is all doing more harm than good at this point, because we desperately need to change th way we are dealing with this and it's now going into "too late" territory for a lot of people.

I get that case numbers are not going down, but it's a virus. That's generally what happens. It isn't just going to go away by keeping people out of bowling alleys a couple of weeks longer.

We've completely changed everything we do and most people are living in some degree of either uselessness or misery or both, and the fact is that there will be a second wave in the winter regardless. There will be significant increased death rates through poverty, unemployment, depression etc. People cannot meet, date, interact, learn off each other, make friends, etc. There's literally no benefit to anything that anyone is doing outside of the effect on case numbers...and even then if that's what it's about the plan fails to make any sense because what we are doing will not do anything other than subdue the virus until the winter, at which point there will be no plan and there will still be no reliable treatment.

People are acting like what we are doing is sustainable but it is absolutely the opposite. Working from home does not work. Historically we change how we work to be more productive based on new technology and science. What we have now is Microsoft teams and zoom, which is basically just a shite version of making a phone call. Productivity is down, employment is down, education is evidently a complete and utter mess. It's gone a long way past the point where it stopped being a workable solution. Anyone who works in a restuarant, cafe, anywhere that relies on office workers for income, is fecked...and that's an awful lot of people. What's the solution there?

We're heading into a winter where a significant number of people's health either physically or mentally will have suffered since March and that, even without Covid, is going to put a big strain on the health system. Then on top of that Covid numbers are going to go up significantly again, aided by the fact we've spent all summer hiding from it but not actually doing very much to get rid of it.

I'm still at an utter loss to what the plan is and why people are so ignorant of the wide range of problems building up. Some of which have now reached the point of being absolute mammoth issues in themselves. It's like people are just happy to live in unproductive misery, which you could maybe argue is a sacrifice except that by the end of this we will have saved next to no one and killed a frightening amount of people who we didn't need to. Some of the stuff coming from the governments "scientific" advisors is fecking scary. It's the sort of thing you'd think was stupid coming from a 7 year old.

Just throwing caution to the wind and prioritizing mental health and the economy when we don’t even know enough about the virus would be incredibly stupid.

Several studies are now showing heart inflammation and potentially permenant damage to the heart among even mild case patients who have recovered months ago.

How would society deal with a sizeable percentage of the population with different heart issues in the next 5, 10, 15 years?

We simply don’t know enough about the virus or it’s future consequences to prioritize anything else other than the physical health of the population at this stage.

Skype and Zoom will have to do for now.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Several studies are now showing heart inflammation and potentially permenant damage to the heart among even mild case patients who have recovered months ago.

How would society deal with a sizeable percentage of the population with different heart issues in the next 5, 10, 15 years?

What percentage of mild symptoms suffering these issues are the studies showing?

The UK are an utter mess, first they didn’t want a lockdown and now they’ve gone all in and appear to still have no fecking plan. Loads of places did quick short lockdowns to get a lay of the land but have now been relatively normal for months. The UK see a few small rises and shits the bed, with zero fecks given to the rest of society and especially the kids and poor.

The more you keep locking people in and changing rules at the tip of a hat, the more people are gonna go fecking mental every post lockdown. Teach people to change behaviour in subtle ways for a while to ensure a slow spread, think longterm you fecking numpties.

 

[Maluco]

What percentage of mild symptoms suffering these issues are the studies showing?

The UK are an utter mess, first they didn’t want a lockdown and now they’ve gone all in and appear to still have no fecking plan. Loads of places did quick short lockdowns to get a lay of the land but have now been relatively normal for months. The UK see a few small rises and shit the bed, with zero fecks given to the rest of society and especially the kids and poor.

There have been several small scale studies, most notably a German one testing a group of middle aged sufferers, a few months after recovery. Published in JAMA Cardiology.

100 patients with a median age of 49. 78 experienced structural changes to the heart, 76 showed injury to the heart and 60 showed continued inflammation. Two thirds of those recovered at home from the actual virus.

Now, obviously that’s not enough information to deduce that this is permanent damage, but it’s also too early to declare that it isn’t. It’s too small a scale to deduce anything, but what it does show is that we have no idea of the long term implications of the virus and it seems to confirm that it does attack the heart in some form.

A decent article that summarizes the findings...

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/07/30/heart-studies

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

There have been several small scale studies, most notably a German one testing a group of middle aged sufferers, a few months after recovery. Published in JAMA Cardiology.

100 patients with a median age of 49. 78 experienced structural changes to the heart, 76 showed injury to the heart and 60 showed continued inflammation. Two thirds of those recovered at home from the actual virus.

Now, obviously that’s not enough information to deduce that this is permanent damage, but it’s also too early to declare that it isn’t. It’s too small a scale to deduce anything, but what it does show is that we have no idea of the long term implications of the virus and it seems to confirm that it does attack the heart in some form.

A decent article that summarizes the findings...

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/07/30/heart-studies

nothing mentioned about “mild symptoms” of corona there that I can see.

Actual sounds like it’s people who had a tough time with corona Covid-19.

 

[Maluco]

nothing mentioned about “mild symptoms” of corona there that I can see.

Actual sounds like it’s people who had a tough time with corona Covid-19.

Specifically states that two thirds recovered at home and were completely unaware of any problems prior to the exam.

I am not following any agenda, I don’t have one. What I am saying is that, very clearly, we don’t know enough yet to be throwing caution to the wind and prioritizing anything but people’s health.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Specifically states that two thirds recovered at home and were completely unaware of any problems prior to the exam.

I am not following any agenda, I don’t have one. What I am saying is that, very clearly, we don’t know enough yet to be throwing caution to the wind and prioritizing anything but people’s health.

ah fair enough, recovering at home doesn’t mean “mild” in my view, I think that’s a hell of a leap.

 

[Maluco]

ah fair enough, recovering at home doesn’t mean “mild” in my view, I think that’s a hell of a leap.

I know it might well be a leap, but all I’m saying is, it’s too early to tell. It needs more research before we can declare anything.

It could be a massive problem in the future, even if it only effects those who have had it that bit worse.

 

[Drifter]

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[Pogue Mahone]

ah fair enough, recovering at home doesn’t mean “mild” in my view, I think that’s a hell of a leap.

There is literally no milder category for symptomatic covid patients. How is that a leap to call them mild?!

Obviously, within that category you will get individual variations in how sick they feel but anyone who fights the virus off without any need for oxygen or admission to hospital gets categorised as “mild”. That’s been the classification from day one in Wuhan.

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

Started the new job yesterday. Only one COVID + patient on ward. Finished shift today, 3 definite COVID + with up to 5 being actively tested for it.

October time will be second wave in my eyes. I think people will be too relaxed at that stage.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Talking to medic friends in Ireland. Batten down the hatches. Hospitals starting to fill up and GPs ordering shitloads of tests. We’re in for a rough ride.

 

[christy87]

Talking to medic friends in Ireland. Batten down the hatches. Hospitals starting to fill up and GPs ordering shitloads of tests. We’re in for a rough ride.

The outer Dublin commuter zone is taking a hammering at the moment, being reported another 80 at a sliced ham factory in Kildare tomorrow.

 

[Port Vale Devil]

Jeez the scaremongering on here is immense and any time there is some bad news everyone piles in with jubilation and I told you so but any good news it is crickets.

We have been threatened on here with 2nd waves since March and maybe we will have spikes but it seems more locally and it isn’t going undetected in the population for months with no action.

Take a chill, look after yourself and your nearest and dearest with help and advice but ffs don’t wish for the worst.

 

[The Cat]

Jeez the scaremongering on here is immense and any time there is some bad news everyone piles in with jubilation and I told you so but any good news it is crickets.

We have been threatened on here with 2nd waves since March and maybe we will have spikes but it seems more locally and it isn’t going undetected in the population for months with no action.

Take a chill, look after yourself and your nearest and dearest with help and advice but ffs don’t wish for the worst.

If there were a clapping smilie I would use it. Well said.

 

[NYAS]

The thing to keep in mind about a second wave if/when it happens, is although of course we’d rather it not happen anyway, I find it unlikely that it would be as bad or worse than the first one, given we had absolutely no clue what the feck hit us and had almost zero preparation. I find it hard to believe that the behavioral changes since then, as well as (hopefully) better government preparedness wouldn’t result in a much better situation than the one earlier in the year.

 

[Wibble]

Jeez the scaremongering on here is immense and any time there is some bad news everyone piles in with jubilation and I told you so but any good news it is crickets.

We have been threatened on here with 2nd waves since March and maybe we will have spikes but it seems more locally and it isn’t going undetected in the population for months with no action.

Take a chill, look after yourself and your nearest and dearest with help and advice but ffs don’t wish for the worst.

It isn't scaremongeing. It is merely reality.

 

[Dan_F]

At some point there at least has to be an acknowledgement that this is all doing more harm than good at this point, because we desperately need to change th way we are dealing with this and it's now going into "too late" territory for a lot of people.

I get that case numbers are not going down, but it's a virus. That's generally what happens. It isn't just going to go away by keeping people out of bowling alleys a couple of weeks longer.

We've completely changed everything we do and most people are living in some degree of either uselessness or misery or both, and the fact is that there will be a second wave in the winter regardless. There will be significant increased death rates through poverty, unemployment, depression etc. People cannot meet, date, interact, learn off each other, make friends, etc. There's literally no benefit to anything that anyone is doing outside of the effect on case numbers...and even then if that's what it's about the plan fails to make any sense because what we are doing will not do anything other than subdue the virus until the winter, at which point there will be no plan and there will still be no reliable treatment.

People are acting like what we are doing is sustainable but it is absolutely the opposite. Working from home does not work. Historically we change how we work to be more productive based on new technology and science. What we have now is Microsoft teams and zoom, which is basically just a shite version of making a phone call. Productivity is down, employment is down, education is evidently a complete and utter mess. It's gone a long way past the point where it stopped being a workable solution. Anyone who works in a restuarant, cafe, anywhere that relies on office workers for income, is fecked...and that's an awful lot of people. What's the solution there?

We're heading into a winter where a significant number of people's health either physically or mentally will have suffered since March and that, even without Covid, is going to put a big strain on the health system. Then on top of that Covid numbers are going to go up significantly again, aided by the fact we've spent all summer hiding from it but not actually doing very much to get rid of it. The solution for this is to ban deals on junk food?...yet at the moment you can get a McDonalds half price 3 days a week. People who are sat at home drinking, smoking, ordering takeaways more, have had treatments cancelled or delayed for various conditions, etc. Aren't suddenly going to crop into full athletic health because a pizza costs 50p more.

I'm still at an utter loss to what the plan is and why people are so ignorant of the wide range of problems building up. Some of which have now reached the point of being absolute mammoth issues in themselves. It's like people are just happy to live in unproductive misery, which you could maybe argue is a sacrifice except that by the end of this we will have saved next to no one and killed a frightening amount of people who we didn't need to. Some of the stuff coming from the governments "scientific" advisors is fecking scary. It's the sort of thing you'd think was stupid coming from a 7 year old.

There are valid points in there, but what do you mean by people can’t meet, socialise etc. Apart from the local area lock downs, there’s no real restrictions on that.

Personally my quality of life has probably gone up with commuting less and using Teams for communication. My carbon footprint will have been massively reduced too. I understand this is specific to me, but I certainly won’t be going back spending my money on over priced food and coffee for the sake of convenience. We shouldn’t have a system where the economy is relying on me spending more money than I need too on something like food.

I agree the government is a shambles. They locked down at least a week too late and have been on the back foot ever since, but you’re asking for a solution that basically no one has at the moment. In an ideal world we can close our eyes and pretend we can go back to normal, but then you end up with 160k deaths and rising cases.

Im sure I’ll be told we should have just copied Sweden and everything would have been fine.

 

[Dancfc]

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Cases have been slowly rising for a month now but despite that hospitalisations keep going down. I'd like to think it's because the virus is weakening but in reality it's probably because more younger people are catching it combined with more targeted testing in hotspots and the random testing Imperial College London are doing (which is catching more asymptotic cases).

 

[finneh]

At some point there at least has to be an acknowledgement that this is all doing more harm than good at this point, because we desperately need to change th way we are dealing with this and it's now going into "too late" territory for a lot of people.

I get that case numbers are not going down, but it's a virus. That's generally what happens. It isn't just going to go away by keeping people out of bowling alleys a couple of weeks longer.

We've completely changed everything we do and most people are living in some degree of either uselessness or misery or both, and the fact is that there will be a second wave in the winter regardless. There will be significant increased death rates through poverty, unemployment, depression etc. People cannot meet, date, interact, learn off each other, make friends, etc. There's literally no benefit to anything that anyone is doing outside of the effect on case numbers...and even then if that's what it's about the plan fails to make any sense because what we are doing will not do anything other than subdue the virus until the winter, at which point there will be no plan and there will still be no reliable treatment.

People are acting like what we are doing is sustainable but it is absolutely the opposite. Working from home does not work. Historically we change how we work to be more productive based on new technology and science. What we have now is Microsoft teams and zoom, which is basically just a shite version of making a phone call. Productivity is down, employment is down, education is evidently a complete and utter mess. It's gone a long way past the point where it stopped being a workable solution. Anyone who works in a restuarant, cafe, anywhere that relies on office workers for income, is fecked...and that's an awful lot of people. What's the solution there?

We're heading into a winter where a significant number of people's health either physically or mentally will have suffered since March and that, even without Covid, is going to put a big strain on the health system. Then on top of that Covid numbers are going to go up significantly again, aided by the fact we've spent all summer hiding from it but not actually doing very much to get rid of it. The solution for this is to ban deals on junk food?...yet at the moment you can get a McDonalds half price 3 days a week. People who are sat at home drinking, smoking, ordering takeaways more, have had treatments cancelled or delayed for various conditions, etc. Aren't suddenly going to crop into full athletic health because a pizza costs 50p more.

I'm still at an utter loss to what the plan is and why people are so ignorant of the wide range of problems building up. Some of which have now reached the point of being absolute mammoth issues in themselves. It's like people are just happy to live in unproductive misery, which you could maybe argue is a sacrifice except that by the end of this we will have saved next to no one and killed a frightening amount of people who we didn't need to. Some of the stuff coming from the governments "scientific" advisors is fecking scary. It's the sort of thing you'd think was stupid coming from a 7 year old.

Great post. I couldn't agree more.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

There is literally no milder category for symptomatic covid patients. How is that a leap to call them mild?!

Obviously, within that category you will get individual variations in how sick they feel but anyone who fights the virus off without any need for oxygen or admission to hospital gets categorised as “mild”. That’s been the classification from day one in Wuhan.

My neighbour (68) recovered at home, and feck me, he had a horrid few weeks, absolutely horrid. I could see and hear it daily as we live so close, I was pretty certain he was gonna be picked up any day and die at the hospital. He had the team showing up in full PPE like a scene from E.T after a day where he didn’t stop coughing up his guts from morning to night, he didn’t move his head off the kitchen table all day and several times we were certain he’d gone.

I know a quite a few people now that have taken antibody tests since it became free in Stockholm and had it confirmed that their sore throat or cough in March was actually Covid-19.

So they are both categorised as “mild”? Me personally, I’d call it a massive leap to classify everyone who didn’t end up hospitalised as “mild” and I’m certain my neighbour would give you a few choice words if you said to him that his Covid experience was mild.

If Eddie, 68 years old has some heart damage I wouldn’t be surprised in the slightest, if the sore throat and cough group have it, I’d be blown away and shocked to my core.

Like the majority of “studies” during this pandemic, it’s another tiny portion and even within the study groups there’s no definition of how severe their Covid-19 was, quite frankly it’s junk science and I’m surprised you wouldn’t call it yourself.

 

[Wibble]

My neighbour (68) recovered at home, and feck me, he had a horrid few weeks, absolutely horrid. I could see and hear it daily as we live so close, I was pretty certain he was gonna be picked up any day and die at the hospital. He had the team showing up in full PPE like a scene from E.T after a day where he didn’t stop coughing up his guts from morning to night, he didn’t move his head off the kitchen table all day and several times we were certain he’d gone.

I know a quite a few people now that have taken antibody tests since it became free in Stockholm and had it confirmed that their sore throat or cough in March was actually Covid-19.

So they are both categorised as “mild”? Me personally, I’d call it a massive leap to classify everyone who didn’t end up hospitalised as “mild” and I’m certain my neighbour would give you a few choice words if you said to him that his Covid experience was mild.

If Eddie, 68 years old has some heart damage I wouldn’t be surprised in the slightest, if the sore throat and cough group have it, I’d be blown away and shocked to my core.

There are certainly some cases where people with very mild symptoms later have ongoing damage and symptom ranging from stroke and death to ongoing fatigue. However, it seems likely that most long term illness is probably suffered by those with medium to severe symptoms. Hopefully, the vast majority will suffer no ongoing issues.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

There are certainly some cases where people with very mild symptoms later have ongoing damage and symptom ranging from stroke and death to ongoing fatigue.

Yeah but in a pandemic where almost 20m cases have been confirmed, isn’t that always going to be the case? Don’t we also find that some “mild” viruses like the flu can for example cause blindness in a tiny percentage?
Didn’t we also find that the Bird Flu vaccine caused narcolepsy in a very small percentage of younger people?

It’s extremely important in these studies that a distinction is made.

 

[Wibble]

Yeah but in a pandemic where almost 20m cases have been confirmed, isn’t that always going to be the case? Don’t we also find that some “mild” viruses like the flu can for example cause blindness.

For sure. I guess the worry is that we don't really know how common long term damage is for those with very mild symptoms.

 

[Stack]

Has Sweden reached a level of Herd immunity? I get the impression Swedens case rates have dropped away both death and new cases.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

My neighbour (68) recovered at home, and feck me, he had a horrid few weeks, absolutely horrid. I could see and hear it daily as we live so close, I was pretty certain he was gonna be picked up any day and die at the hospital. He had the team showing up in full PPE like a scene from E.T after a day where he didn’t stop coughing up his guts from morning to night, he didn’t move his head off the kitchen table all day and several times we were certain he’d gone.

I know a quite a few people now that have taken antibody tests since it became free in Stockholm and had it confirmed that their sore throat or cough in March was actually Covid-19.

So they are both categorised as “mild”? Me personally, I’d call it a massive leap to classify everyone who didn’t end up hospitalised as “mild” and I’m certain my neighbour would give you a few choice words if you said to him that his Covid experience was mild.

If Eddie, 68 years old has some heart damage I wouldn’t be surprised in the slightest, if the sore throat and cough group have it, I’d be blown away and shocked to my core.

Like the majority of “studies” during this pandemic, it’s another tiny portion and even within the study groups there’s no definition of how severe their Covid-19 was, quite frankly it’s junk science and I’m surprised you wouldn’t call it yourself.

If you have a better way to categorise these patients, you should write it up. You could probably get a publication out of it. I’m just telling you how the people whose job it is to study this disease have been classifying cases in all the medical literature to date. Broad strokes categorisation like this is nothing new. It’s the best way to study the large numbers needed to understand a disease.

 

[Stanley Road]

We are finally getting stricter measures in NL, cinemas and other places to close for 2 weeks. Stopped short of shooting young party goers unfortunately.

 

[Abizzz]

Have we seen the last of this now ? Is it all over? The house next door to me is a holiday home and there is 10 people in it from 3 households (Canvey Island , Birmingham and Sheffield) , I was chatting over the fence yesterday .
There is a retired couple just moved into the house the other side of me , ex military , been there just over a week now and had a constant stream of visitors in the house .
My family are still social distancing and don`t have anyone in the house . When I visit my in laws we do it outside as they are in their 80`s with other ongoing illnesses . Are we wasting our time as no one else seems to be bothering and everything seems ok . When I go in a shop very few people are wearing masks and don`t seem to care. I honestly don`t know what to think anymore.

The same is happening around me. I dread to say a lot of my friends (even the more responsible ones) are like this now too. All the reason for me to be even more careful, I just can't see it leading to anything other than a second wave while it's still circulating.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Has Sweden reached a level of Herd immunity? I get the impression Swedens case rates have dropped away both death and new cases.

The short answer for all of Sweden is no.

With Stockholm, they don’t wanna say as much but Tegnell is confident there will be no huge second wave in Stockholm.
Reading between the lines here, they believe that the antibody results together with T-Cell studies match up rather well with their model, which isn’t herd immunity but levels high enough to put the brakes on.
What we know for certain is that our problem areas in Stockholm, sadly as with every city, the poor, often immigrant populated areas such as Tensta are approaching 40% in antibodies alone. Lots of people living in these areas work in elderly homes, bus drivers, taxis etc and live in close proximity. It’s pretty much impossible for them to social distance.
Norra Djurgården, a very rich area has around 5%. There’s inequality for you in two simple numbers.

So even if the model is incorrect and the early T-Cell studies overstate the levels, the levels in the problem areas no doubt give the Health Authority that confidence regarding Stockholm.

Malmö (Skåne) still has better numbers than Copenhagen regarding deaths per 100,00 so you’d imagine they are very much a risk zone for an autumn wave.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

If you have a better way to categorise these patients, you should write it up. You could probably get a publication out of it. I’m just telling you how the people whose job it is to study this disease have been classifying cases in all the scientific literature to date. Perhaps they don’t know what they’re doing?

You could certainly start with classing them as:

• home recovery - mild symptoms, cough, sore throat
• home recovery - medium flu like symptoms
• home recovery - severe flu and upper respiratory symptoms. Shortness of breath, severe fatigue, etc etc.

Nothing difficult about that whatsoever.

 

[redshaw]

The UK are an utter mess, first they didn’t want a lockdown and now they’ve gone all in and appear to still have no fecking plan. Loads of places did quick short lockdowns to get a lay of the land but have now been relatively normal for months. The UK see a few small rises and shits the bed, with zero fecks given to the rest of society and especially the kids and poor.

The more you keep locking people in and changing rules at the tip of a hat, the more people are gonna go fecking mental every post lockdown. Teach people to change behaviour in subtle ways for a while to ensure a slow spread, think longterm you fecking numpties.

Big overreaction here?

Where to start and aren't you the sensitive swede and you're calling us fecking numpites.

People have changed their behaviour here, what the hell are you on about?

UK hasn't shit the bed over a few cases and went all in. First we had a soft lockdown, other similar countries had much stricter ones, other countries have done local lockdowns where needed. Cases are rising in similar regions like Spain, Belgium, France. Not really concerned if Estonia have been tops with this.

No one is locked in here for Christ sake. We had a soft lockdown compared to many across Europe actually and any so called regional lockdown is more a slightly cautious headups up if anything to prevent cases rising, there's no Italian style lockdown going on in Greater Manchester, quite the opposite.

In Belgium you still can't go to the shops with someone from your household, kids in Spain were not allowed out the house for months during their lockdown. Things in the UK were relaxed and free before and even more so now with people just changing their behaviour and managing the situation. We have some saying we're too strict and others saying we're too lax and need to clamp down hard like Italy and Spain.

If there's one country which need some criticism it's Spain but I don't see any at all for some reason. I can't imagine the hysteria and finger pointing from the world if UK had been the first to have gone back to posting the equivalent of about 4k cases per day. Both have excess deaths in the 950 per million range.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Big overreaction here?

Where to start and aren't you the sensitive swede and you're calling us fecking numpites.

I’m British and I’m calling Bojo and his cronies fecking numpties.

Have another go at that post now @redshaw

And yes, Brits were locked in, it wasn’t soft at all. Brits were allowed out once a day for exercise.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

You could certainly start with classing them as:

• home recovery - mild symptoms, cough, sore throat
• home recovery - medium flu like symptoms
• home recovery - severe flu and upper respiratory symptoms. Shortness of breath, severe fatigue, etc etc.

Nothing difficult about that whatsoever.

Those categories are useless. Entirely subjective. It’s well known how different people can perceive the same severity of illness differently. There’s even a running joke about “man flu” because of it. Science needs objectivity. The existing classifications provide it. Your effort to improve them does not.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Those categories are useless. Entirely subjective. It’s well known how different people can perceive the same illness differently. There’s even a running joke about “man flu” because of it. Science needs objectivity. The existing classifications provide it. Your effort to improve them does not.

So my neighbour, felt and looked like he was knocking on deaths door and my mate with a sore throat provides “objectivity” when studying long term effects on the heart of “mild” cases.
Sure.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

So my neighbour, felt and looked like he was knocking on deaths door and my mate with a sore throat provides “objectivity” when studying long term effects on the heart of “mild” cases.
Sure.

That’s correct. You’re getting there. Next lesson: why anecdotes about individuals has no place in science.

 

[Dancfc]

I’m British and I’m calling Bojo and his cronies fecking numpties.

Have another go at that post now @redshaw

And yes, Brits were locked in, it wasn’t soft at all. Brits were allowed out once a day for exercise.

Yeah I hate the narrative we had it easy just because we were given a basic right to exercise outside that even prisoners get.

Out of all the things I love doing the only thing I had left for an entire eight weeks was gaming, now before a certain someone tries to twist that I didn't complain i knew it had to he done at that point but this notion we had it easy/soft is a load of bs.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

That’s correct. You’re getting there. Next lesson: why anecdotes about individuals has no place in science.

ha ha, yeah I get that, but I think it’s dangerous to start claiming mild cases are showing heart disease in 70+% of subjects, unless you believe there’s any truth in that?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Yeah I hate the narrative we had it easy just because we were given a basic right to exercise outside that even prisoners get.

Out of all the things I love doing the only thing I had left for an entire eight weeks was gaming, now before a certain someone tries to twist that I didn't complain i knew it had to he done at that point but this notion we had it easy/soft is a load of bs.

Soft was Denmark, Germany etc when they were allowed to roam freely, but all aside from essential businesses were all shut down.
Being “allowed out” for exercise once a day and not allowed to national parks or walks in the Peak District aint “easy” lockdown.

Does @redshaw actually think Bojo and co have done a good job? I’d argue along with the US they’ve been the most inconsistent numpties throughout this entire pandemic. The difference with Ireland for example is night and day.