Waiting to the 87th Minute Before Subs

SilentWitness

ShoelessWitness
Staff
Joined
Jan 14, 2010
Messages
31,980
Location
London
Supports
Everton
Pretty much every time that a side dominates a game in a 15 minute spell, has 1253581346 chances and doesn't score from them, the other team ends up getting a goal after. It's indefensible to not have changed it after that dominance/Sevilla getting back into the game, let alone not changing anything immediately after they scored.

Yeah, the bench is poor but you were on top and a bit of freshness would have been useful, even if it was from a subpar player. Even putting Bailly on and switching to a 5 might have helped.
 

Heardy

Full Member
Joined
Apr 6, 2009
Messages
8,879
Location
Looking for the answers...
No, we just don’t have any good players on the bench. I’d leave Rashford, Martial, Greenwood and Bruno on too. All are capable of something special even on an off day. The entirety of our bench isn’t.
This is our problem in a nutshell. We’ve got no real value on our bench to come on and win the game for us.
 

ivaldo

Mediocre Horse Whisperer, s'up wid chew?
Joined
Nov 15, 2012
Messages
28,701
Exactly. If we had good options on the bench then I'd get the criticism but when this is the reality it's no surprise we expect more from a knackered Rashford/Greenwood than a fresh James/Mata/Lingard.
If we had Sancho starting and Greenwood on the bench, then Ole makes the change.
 

el3mel

New Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2016
Messages
43,736
Location
Egypt
What the feck was he thinking with this management of subs and timing.

We bring Ighalo on loan to play him only 4 minutes max a match, what the feck. Why did we bring him then ?
 

Castia

Full Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2011
Messages
18,582
There’s nothing on the bench. Forsu-Mensa, James and Mata? They’re wank. We have no squad depth what so ever.

Rashford was useless but knowing Mata or James was coming on Is even worse.
 

Anustart89

Full Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2013
Messages
15,962
I don't see any scenario where bringing Mata and James on at the same time makes any sense.

One's a counter-attacking player and the other's a player suited for a possession based game. Surely you'd want to pick one or the other depending on in which manner you want to change the game? I'd have brought Mata or Ighalo on for Rashford and tried to change the game that way. Bringing James on at 2-1 down against a team that's only interested in sitting back is interesting, to say the least.
 

Dan_F

Full Member
Joined
Dec 17, 2012
Messages
10,595
Needing a goal and he put on Fosu Mensa instead of changing the system and getting a striker in the box.
 

Lay

Correctly predicted Italy to win Euro 2020
Joined
Jan 29, 2013
Messages
20,395
Location
England
We have no depth at all. I wouldn't bring a single player on other than Ighalo. Oh and Matic if we are winning. The rest give us nothing.
 

Lebowski

Full Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2010
Messages
707
Location
Collyhurst
Substitutes
  • 3 Bailly
  • 8 Mata
  • 13 Grant
  • 14 Lingard
  • 15 Andreas Pereira
  • 21 James
  • 22 Romero
  • 24 Fosu-Mensah
  • 25 Ighalo
  • 31 Matic
  • 39 McTominay
  • 71 Mengi
Very harsh to blame Ole given the absolute lack of quality, form and match fitness on the bench.

Especially since our first eleven were on top throughout the second half and were in total control until Lindelof and Wan Bissaka completely switched off to let them score against the run of play.

I know that in the heat of the moment people want somebody to blame, but Ole gets an insane amount of stick for managing with the squad he's got because of his inexperience. There is a massive drop off in quality between our starting 11 and bench, so we're going to have to win matches with our first team. We were still creating chances and you'd fancy a tiring and I'd fancy an off form Rashford or Greenwood producing the magic to get us the equaliser over any on the bench.

We had over 20 shots and should have had the match sewn up. It's just one of those days.
 
Last edited:

Skåre Willoch

Full Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2014
Messages
4,259
With the players available, why even bother to make any subs at all. We have 12 good players. And that’s the biggest issue with this squad.
 

sammsky1

Pochettino's #1 fan
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
32,841
Location
London
What the feck was he thinking with this management of subs and timing.

We bring Ighalo on loan to play him only 4 minutes max a match, what the feck. Why did we bring him then ?
Should have taken Rashford off after 65m replaced with Ighalo and put martial out left
 

Carl

has permanently erect nipples
Joined
Mar 6, 2008
Messages
45,496
Yeah, game management is Ole's great weakness, we've seen it time and time again. Rashford and Greenwood were both clearly not gonna produce anything today, and he waited way too long.
Pretty much this. Granted a lack of options doesn't help but its amazing Rashford made it until 85 mins before coming off.
 

NinjaZombie

Punched the air when Liverpool beat City
Joined
Dec 7, 2011
Messages
10,216
Yeah. I don't know why Ole does this. Rashford was having a bad game and he had Ighalo on the bench and could've put Martial on the left. He could even have put James on to exploit the space Sevilla were leaving for us.

At the very least, he could've made subs because it looked like the some of the 1st team were exhausted out there.

If Mourinho had done this, people would be saying he was sabotaging the club to make a point about transfers.
 

Annihilate Now!

...or later, I'm not fussy
Scout
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Messages
50,084
Location
W.Yorks
We have no depth at all. I wouldn't bring a single player on other than Ighalo. Oh and Matic if we are winning. The rest give us nothing.
Because our players on the pitch were giving us so much from 60 minutes onwards.

Honestly this "no depth" excuse is such bollocks at this point.
 

TheGame

Full Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2002
Messages
19,938
Location
In the Land of Saints and Sinners
Substitutes
  • 3 Bailly
  • 8 Mata
  • 13 Grant
  • 14 Lingard
  • 15 Andreas Pereira
  • 21 James
  • 22 Romero
  • 24 Fosu-Mensah
  • 25 Ighalo
  • 31 Matic
  • 39 McTominay
  • 71 Mengi
Very harsh to blame Ole given the absolute lack of quality, form and match fitness on the bench.

Especially since our first eleven were on top throughout the second half and were in total control until Lindelof and Wan Bissaka completely switched off to let them score against the run of play.
Mata who changed the game in the last round and Ighalo who has scored goals this season.
 

Zlatan 7

We've got bush!
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
11,977
It’s not as if he had anything worldbeating on the bench. Persist with tired quality or change for fresh shit is different to changing to fresh quality.
 

GenZRed

Full Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2019
Messages
634
God knows why. He should make the sub straight after we conceded, especially when conceding so late in the game.
 

Yagami

Good post resistant
Joined
Jan 27, 2013
Messages
13,745
Mata changed the game in just our last match.

Our rubbish depth doesn't wash here. That was stupid from Ole.
 

Red Stone

Full Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2011
Messages
8,782
Location
NZ
I took a look at our bench, and it just kept getting worse with each name I read. None of them would have won us the game, no matter how early they were subbed on.

This loss wasn't down to delayed subs. It was down to the fact that we've been pissing away money on mediocre players for the better part of a decade, which has left us completely devoid of quality and depth, and the fact that we were missing chances my dead nan would have scored. Ole can't go out there and score the goals for them. We did well tonight, all things considered. We should have scored at least four goals.
 

charlenefan

Far less insightful than the other Charley
Joined
Aug 17, 2005
Messages
33,052
Truly absurd

And get fecked with your poor bench bollocks. A fresh players who will not do tired things is far more useful then someone who is clearly knackered.
Like James and Mata when they came on?

That's bollocks, even knackard good players are better than shit ones
 

GenZRed

Full Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2019
Messages
634
It’s not as if he had anything worldbeating on the bench. Persist with tired quality or change for fresh shit is different to changing to fresh quality.
Instead he should chnage with 4 minutes to go. What a difference that would make.
 

Untd55

Full Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2018
Messages
1,516
I think he got his subs all wrong today. Matic and Mctominay (though, I don't rate him) are bigger goal threats than James and Mata.

Giving Ighalo only 4 minutes was ridiculous. Even the best player struggle to make an impact in that time.

Subs were done too late overall. Williams should have been subbed earlier as he struggling badly against their winger.
 

Jev

Full Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2008
Messages
8,123
Location
Denmark
Pretty much this. Granted a lack of options doesn't help but its amazing Rashford made it until 85 mins before coming off.
Also, it's always like-for-like subs. I mean, I know he subbed AWB for James today but that was just an obvious gung-ho situation. We've yet to see him actually change the tactical approach with 30 or 45 minutes left, which is what you have to do if it is to have an impact.

Today, I felt like the most dangerous players were on the pitch for the first 75 minutes but we were clearly tiring before their goal and he should have reacted instantly with two or three subs right after they scored.