Yes, sorry, my mistake and happy to be corrected. I agree with the rest of what you have said.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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Around 150,000 Irish trucks use the 'land bridge' across the UK each year to export goods to the rest of the EU. Two-thirds of Irish goods exporters, I believe.
Yes but if the UK do the unthinkable then passing through the UK would not be an option and the ferries between the north of France and Ireland could become very busy and they will avoid the inevitable queues (even with a deal and no insanity) at Dover and Liverpool/UK Irish Sea port now that there is no customs union with the UK so it could even be quicker strangely enough.
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No that's not what you pointed out, you talked absolute nonsense and are now trying to wiggle your way out of it with even more nonsense.
Not sure there is currently anything like the ferry capacity that would be needed to circumvent UK transit. And apparently the sea journey (40 hours minimum) is generally too long for perishable goods.
By the way, my money is still on the UK conceding the major points at the 11th hour to agree an FTA and looking the fool. And then repeated legal skirmishes over interpretation and implementation of the agreement in the years to come.
You confused me here, the issue is with the custom arrangement and the fact that according to the NI protocol in the absence of an FTA the commission are the ones calling the shots in NI and the Irish sea either becomes a border or the UK as a whole have to follow EU laws. My understanding is that the government wants to ignore that part.
Yes, you are right. I think I was talking at cross purposes which confused matters.
In that scenario the ferries to the UK would no longer be needed so they could be diverted from Dover/Calais for example. The crossing is about 14/18 hours and perishable goods are kept in refrigerated trucks. Even if you add a few extra hours for north/east EU destination goods it could still be a lot quicker than queuing to get across the Irish Sea, driving across the UK and queuing again at Dover and the same on the return journey. I think this route could be used much more even with a deal.
Many things that were taken for granted before this charade will change.
They won't be considered foolish by those who voted for them, it'll be spun as a great victory. They voted for a win and they'll have got a win.
I was contemplating the other day that it's actually a very rare feeling to vote for something and get a direct sense of return/achievement. As much as I'd mock brexiteers reasoning i can certainly understand the value in that. They won't give that up due to details
When was the last time a UK government spoke about plans to break international law in Parliament?Ha, ha... the sort that clears the nostrils and the head and allows you to recognize that a government with an 80 seat majority can do almost anything it wants ...and will!
Boris doesn't care. All he cares about is his rich backers.
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...nt-hammond-was-right-to-query-no-deal-backers
Ex-top civil servant: Hammond was right to query no-deal backers
‘They are shorting the pound and the country’ warns Nick Macpherson of Boris Johnson’s hedge fund supporters
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Morons who are perfectly happy to trash our economy for what. A pipedream.
Taking back control of our borders? What about the last month. A record net immigration influx of some 350,000.
Some taking back control.
It is ludicrous. The EU have some of the sharpest trade negotiators on the planet, people who are on the detail and know how to calculate the trade offs, while we have a bunch of amateurs who think negotiations are like bluffing and folding in poker.
Not without consequences.
FFS that's why we have trade deals - to agree how these distortions will be smoothed out and the mechanisms for doing so. A level playing field is about eliminating distortions within a free trade area so competition is fair.
Well done for noticing one of the great benefits to us of the single market (which we helped birth) we are about to jettison.
We are free to trade with anyone we want. But it is blindingly obvious that if we want to access the single market, we have to accept the rules that enable that market to work equally for all its participants.
But let's put this another way, about the realities of power, since you seem to understand it in a domestic context: the EU is an economic superpower and thus gets to set the rules of the game. Arguments about "sovereignty" are for children, this is about who has the power and where the leverage and mutual interests lie on each side. The fact is the UK's range of negotiating options is narrower than the EU's, that is just a function of our relative sizes.
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fecking A.
Every time I think I can't hate these utter twats more, or that I can't be even more ashamed of our government and frankly much of the population of the country, they find a new and unexpected way to prove me wrong.
Oh man. I feel for you. I’m probably a little unusual for an Irish man in that I’ve a lot of love for Britain and British people. We’re way more similar than most Irish people would like to admit. So it breaks my heart to see what’s happened over there in the last 10 years. Obviously, makes me glad I moved home when I did but it’s such a crying shame to see what’s happened to the place.
Hundreds of years of putting up with you brits and your fecking bullshit
*Cries in Jock*
My newspaper suggested the UK is playing these games to try and get the EU and US to compete with each other to obtain a trade advantage with the UK. Looks like that might not work out quite as planned, then.
I hardly recognise the place.
That'd be a really, really dumb negotiating strategy. Which makes it very pausible.
Same.
You keep slinging out the word 'nonsense', but with no explanation... I respectfully suggest that' is what is nonsense...absolutely!
so control over our money, borders and no chlorinated chicken... thats gonna be the cummings / brexit spin right?
You used China as an example in a conversation about FTAs, that's nonsensical, China do not have an FTA with the EU.
Agreed, but not quite sure why you keep going on about the EU's level playing field since we are now outside that playing field and must look at life differently, this will of course influence what will be required to 'sell into' the EU in future. As will the EU countries that wish to 'sell in to us' realize they will need to look at life differently as well.
I was always worried from the start when people described the UK's leaving the EU as a 'divorce situation', because in such situations old grievances rumble on and will (for years probably) affect how both sides view the other, sad, but fairly inevitable. The current rumpus over possible changes to the WA are a good example of that. I suspect negotiations are going to get even more hyped and disjointed as a no deal becomes...well virtually inevitable., with both sides 'banging the door' as they leave.
Because the UK are trying to get free access to the single market, that's why there are trade negotiations. If the UK wanted to be outside they would not negotiate a deal and simply put borders and customs checks where they are supposed to in accordance with WTO rules.
Wonder how Cummings and Johnson will spin economic sanctions.
How many MPs will actually knowingly vote for a BIll that contravenes International Law?
In the meantime the UK have decided to have a new National Anthem:
How many MPs will actually knowingly vote for a BIll that contravenes International Law?
In the meantime the UK have decided to have a new National Anthem:
Im not sure they will get the opportunity
most likley we get an amendment proposed by a back bench conservative MP associated with the original deal (theresa may?) that basically preserves the original conditions
I think she could carry 20 - 30 mps who would back her amendment and perhaps the same amount who would abstain as they eye the future and think it might look bad on their voting records
If the opposition parties backed it (I think the regional parties and libs would - pretty sure starmer would (though there may be some brexity labour MPs who wouldnt back a conservative amendment?) they would have enough votes and the bill would pass amended without an opportunity to vote on a version that actually contravenes international law
Though who knows Boris might just bumble along for a month or two then try and prorouge parliament again for some unfathomable reason (but i can imagine Mogg looking for precedent from hundreds of years ago)... and again we get the pro eu judges, remoaners lines trotted out again that boris and cummings seems to think they need to get his core support energized
I used China's dumping of steel on the EU markets, because the demand in China itself diminished, creating an excess which they dumped, all over the world, it was nothing to do with having a FTA, they were able to access the single market without a FTA, and as I think Paul the Wolf pointed out, the tariffs were then change.
It was simply to illustrate (see rest of that post) the point that all countries (if they are able to) will try to protect certain industries they see as being vital.
Taking things out of context is of course nonsense!
Song no.4 ...
I also saw that EU lawyers have the opinion that the UK government have already breached International Law just by tabling the Bill.