What makes you think it’s the majority that don’t care? It’s a shame we have a population that would need such policing during a lockdown.
There is a reason we’re all making these sacrifices, it’s happening all over Europe.
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
What makes you think it’s the majority that don’t care? It’s a shame we have a population that would need such policing during a lockdown.
There is a reason we’re all making these sacrifices, it’s happening all over Europe.
I think you’ll still be allowed to go for a run/walk. Just wrap up warm!
Fair enough.Nah of course not just going to moan about it on here of course
They're young parents and i get the impression struggling for money so I wouldn't have the heart to dob them in.
Really is ridiculous. Had Sage advice in September, ignored it.
It’s easy to blame those in charge but while I agree that these decisions could cost lives, you also have to understand that for every voice shouting in Boris’s ear concerning lives, there are just as many shouting about the economy and livelihoods. It can’t be easy and as far as I can see most leaders are struggling also. It must be like trying to hold water.
Are hairdressing 'non essential'? Otherwise there will be massive rush for short back and sides all over the nation!
The situation isn't as equal as you imply. For some, this entire situation has had a massive impact on personal wellbeing and finances. Asking them to lockdown and be okay with it... well it isn't that simple.
As an example, what becomes of the people who became unemployed as a result of this situation. Do we just ask them nicely to bide their time because the country is shutting down again?
I’ll be going tomorrow for sure!
Sounds like the only difference to lockdown 1.0 will be that educational institutions stay open - which considering that data shows them to be breeding grounds is quite strange. Supermarkets, pharmacies, takeaways to stay open. Everything else to shut.
No Eat Out to Help Out?!I’ll be going tomorrow for sure!
Sounds like the only difference to lockdown 1.0 will be that educational institutions stay open - which considering that data shows them to be breeding grounds is quite strange. Supermarkets, pharmacies, takeaways to stay open. Everything else to shut.
But PL football is still OK right?
I didn’t actually imply anything, just wondered why you think the majority wouldn’t support a lockdown.
And nor did I say it was easy, quite the opposite. I certainly don’t envy the PM at this time.
Not sure about football to be honest? I guess with the athlete bubbles and testing frequency that the league has in place they might be allowed to continue.No Eat Out to Help Out?!
But PL football is still OK right?
My wife got me into that Joe Wicks guy. I feel very basic but lost 3 kg, meals are not that terrible either
He’s even scuffed the economic argument. Listening to scientific advice meant the country will have only had to endure a couple weeks lockdown during a school half term which would have saved lives AND cushioned a further blow to the economy. Now he’s having to belatedly implement a longer lockdown which will only further exacerbate our economic woes.
This inept government should absolutely be held culpable.
Need some more time to leak stuff to Peston, I guess.
surely return/extension of furlough scheme, feel desperately for people’s livelihood though.
Nah Cummings is adjusting the announcement based on the reaction etc. Classic Cummings
I don’t get discouraging outbound flights but no mention of inbound flights
Yes! Ole IN!
Doubt many tourists want to come in November cold and covid infested UK right now?
Im guessing want to keep inbound open for international business, but have to adopt existing quarantine?
I'm sorry about that then and admit assuming wrongly. I thought you were questioning why people wouldn't just accept it without skepticism.
In fairness, that's good if you're in work but I have a few friends who were made redundant earlier in the year (companies folded, etc). I really feel for them as I can totally see businesses putting off hiring decisions until after Christmas.
Useless cnut can't even show up to his own press conference on time.
Another fecking lockdown what a joke. Absolutely killing people's livelihoods. I don't doubt that this virus is horrible and killing lots of people but there's plenty of other illnesses and conditions that kill people too. We can't just keep shutting everything down, people are going to be broke and out on the street if this carries on.
This exactly, using the half term would of been the perfect time to have a circuit breaker because the half term was obviously going to be an increase in spread.
Millions of kids going on holiday.
Government 'advise' not to travel when in Tier 3.. but did not enforce it. So how many millions went galivanting to low risk areas from high risk areas..
I get localised restrictions, makes little sense if an area has 1k cases and another 300miles away has 1 case. Just need to combine that with penalising peoole that leave the heavy restriction areas.
Held culpable to what measure? Seriously, do you think any government would do anything massively different? As far as I can see each country is facing similar situations and as far as I can see each country is resorting to similar actions and as far as I can see outcomes are pretty similar everywhere.
I know it’s easy to throw everything at those in charge but the responsibility to stop this massive surge in transmissions, in my view anyway, stop with us, the populace.
We’ve known how to reduce the spread since April, and it seems to me like large parts of our population have been so eager to live their lives normally that we find ourselves in this mess. I certainly don’t blame the government in isolation for this mess, most of my blame falls at the feet of idiots who just can’t understand the severity of the pandemic and the sacrifices we all will have to make for the next few months. I’m fine with it.
so that do you propose?
Unless UK population are willing to undergo severe loss of freedoms for 2 months with Wuhan style lockdown, then national lockdowns will remain a permanent feature of of UK life until we have mass vaccination.
Has there been an announcement yet or will there be?
Can't understand them not closing Universities. They acted as a super spreader in late September and just seems like a massive waste of time currently with students currently under student flat arrest for 9k + a year.
Surely the academic year could've been started in January and students could've cracked on with a couple of online lectures and reading lists at home in this present time?
Like everything else now it's neither stick or twist.
Surely the academic year could've been started in January and students could've cracked on with a couple of online lectures and reading lists at home in this present time?
Like everything else now it's neither stick or twist.
How can you say that?! It's been a disaster. The track and trace is shit, that's on them because Boris Johnson has given jobs to the boys and the person in charge is married to a Tory mp and has a track record of failures in other companies.
Closing retailers is just going to guarantee that people are going to queue up more come December when these stores reopen for Xmas shopping.
It was supposed to be 4pm. Then moved to 5pm and now 6.30pm.
It was supposed to be 4pm. Then moved to 5pm and now 6.30pm.
You have the same access to the data that I do. It's just google. We know when countries re-opened their schools, we know when peaks in transmission happened, and we know when those two things didn't align. Just from two google searches per country. If you really wanted the answer to the question rather than trying to make a point, you'd be better off just googling these things for your own peace of mind. Instead it looks like you're only googling evidence that fits the narrative you want to put out there. But sure I'll pull up some numbers.
To pick up on your point about the scientific assessment from NI, I think it's worth clarifying a couple of things. They didn't say that closing schools would reduce the R rate by 0.5. They said it oould be as low as 0.2, or as high as 0.5. They gave a more confident prediction that secondary schools would a) be more likely to spread the virus, and b) be around 0.35. So if secondary schools are more likely to spread it, and their best estimate is 0.35 for them, then we can safely assume their estimate for primary schools is closer to 0.2. Very possibly lower. They also said in the same document that overall the assessment is provided with "low confidence, as unclear how much schools may contribute to community transmission." and other measures related to education are "low confidence, as remains unclear how infectious children may be." And their modelling on education settings was based on influenza, because as they said repeatedly, they haven't got any clear evidence on covid spreading in classrooms. Despite the fact that you believe it to be an obvious driver of this second wave, they can't find the evidence for it at all.
Pages 13-15 here, Geebs. The scientists aren't saying different things, they are just being misrepresented. You don't need to trust my words or his words, the advisers laid it out incredibly thoroughly there. The views from NI's expert are entirely consistent with the consensus that older teenagers in secondary school are more likely to spread it than young kids in primary school, and that there is no evidence that schools are hotbeds of transmission.
Test and trace needs to be given a massive kick up the backside. That won't solve everything but everyone's known it can be reasonably effective since mid June and they still can't get the system right.
Thank you!
Obviously being in Wales it’s a bit different but we might end up following England anyway.
I agree with locking down if that’s what the science dictates, it feels a little wrong that work continues but anything fun doesn’t? I get it but it just feels awful.
It sucks but if the numbers keep getting higher and higher it'll be a catastrophe on the health service. You have only have to read how doctors struggled with the first wave and the physical and mental impact it had on them.
Boris and Government were to blame for total inaction during January and February which cost UK 1000s of innocent deaths and massive impact on economy. Then we had Cummings.
Every decision since has been negatively impacted because of that. But Tories think Boris, Rishi and HealthCock did well.
Even now, it seems like taking the circuit breaker during half term could have lessened impact, but we are now facing a month lockdown instead.
Other countries have acted earlier and more firmly - pretty much more consistently since this pandemic took flight back in Spring. Its the constant dithering, and bizarre marginalisation of scientific consensus that has led to us having one of the highest death rates in the world. We had the chance to lockdown earlier and more briefly a few months ago (again, as per strong scientific advice), but of course the government dithered and dismissed it,
You're right in suggesting the blame should always be shared with the hordes of selfish, stubborn idiots within the population, but what do you expect when the PM decides to go all in with shielding his advisor who shamelessly flouts the rules while laughing at us from his rose garden.
Many more doctors will die in next 2 months
Those who are vulnerable and want to shield continue to do so and the rest take our chances and try to get on with our lives. Continue to be sensible with mask wearing/social distancing. Lockdowns just delay. I know so many people who have lost their jobs, this is such a desperate situation. Every day there are risks, if this is all over you could walk out in front of a bus and it kills you, sorry to be so morbid and if I sound callous but everyone has to die of something.
How's South Korea coping? Taiwan seems to be doing ok. Japan doesn't seem that badly affected.
We've bumbled along without effective planning for nine months. Dragged our feet going into the initial lockdown, failed to get the numbers down sufficiently to build and implement a workable track and trace strategy. We've failed to isolate cases. As always it's been too little, too late, piecemeal policy instead of joined up strategy.