F1 2021 Season

senorgregster said:
Yesterday there was some nice analysis on low, medium and high speed corners. As you say, there is no "fastest car". Each car has a sweet spot on different parts of an individual track, and it comes down to how much of that sweet spot is on a particular track, and how that can be balanced.

Let's see how the RB drivers do at Monaco. Surely they should be favourites?
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Exactly, some cars suit some tracks. Red Bull traditionally do great at Monaco due to their car excelling in traction zones and low speed corners. Saying that though, Hamilton was the fastest through sector 3 at Barcelona which is very 'Monaco' with high kerbs and low speed twists. It'll be very close.

It also depends on the setup, your car can be the best package but if you don't get the right level of downforce / top speed you'll be a sitting duck on the straights.

Mclaren for instance seem to be going for the lower downforce route, they're very difficult to overtake down the straight due to the Mercedes engine + higher top speeds with less drag.

Ferrari on the opposite are high downforce and great round high speed corners, but on the straights they're dead slow and struggle to overtake.

The "it's the car" arguement can be made for Verstappen also, but it only ever seem to apply for Hamilton.
 
The problem is that Hamilton's teammate is "never anywhere close" by design. It's a dream scenario for Wolff to be able to waltz to the Constructors without any major clashes between his two drivers. And because of their dominance as a team, the unwillingness to have two highly competitive drivers has essentially nullified the Driver's as a contest.

Bottas is evidently nowhere near Hamilton in points-scoring and that is a compliment to Hamilton as much as a criticism of Bottas. But what we're seeing this season is, now that Red Bull have a comparable car, Bottas looks a distant second to Verstappen too. Yet in the standings over the last few years Verstappen hasn't been able to get close to Bottas. That clearly shows that the Merc has been objectively the far better car in previous seasons and so Hamilton's only genuine threat during that time has been Bottas, who isn't really a threat at all.

At the end of the day you have to maximise results given the conditions, which Hamilton has done to full effect. None of this should reflect badly on him. I just hope that the other teams raise their game enough that Mercedes are no longer comfortable with not having the best available driver in each of their cars.
 
I'd be very intrigued to see Russell join Mercedes, it would gain him a lot of experience being number 2 to Lewis, ready to step up when he retires. Maybe even challenge Lewis himself?

Bottas is just a bit dull, but almost always secures 3rd, while Perez/ whoever toils somewhat in the 2nd Red Bull.

Wonder when C Horner's finger will start to twitch towards the ejector seat button for Perez... hes shown not vast amounts of patience to young inexperienced drivers who are making the step up, I should imagine him having even less patience for what I thought was a strong driver.

Wonder who will sign Bottas up if he does leave? Can't think of many seats that will be empty as surely he won't step down as far as Williams to replace George if he takes Bottas' seat?
 
Although Mercedes have been dominant for years, I think people forget that there have been years where it has been very close. The 2017 Ferrari was looking better than the Merc until half way through the season and I would argue that the Ferrari was the better car for around 10 races in 2018 and equal for another 4 or 5.

This year, it looks close. Mercedes definitely looked at their best yesterday but the track is definitely going to suit the cars differently. The Red Bull has been consistently quicker through speed traps this year too which is slightly surprising and may be down to the car setups.
 
United Hobbit said:
I'd be very intrigued to see Russell join Mercedes, it would gain him a lot of experience being number 2 to Lewis, ready to step up when he retires. Maybe even challenge Lewis himself?

Bottas is just a bit dull, but almost always secures 3rd, while Perez/ whoever toils somewhat in the 2nd Red Bull.

Wonder when C Horner's finger will start to twitch towards the ejector seat button for Perez... hes shown not vast amounts of patience to young inexperienced drivers who are making the step up, I should imagine him having even less patience for what I thought was a strong driver.

Wonder who will sign Bottas up if he does leave? Can't think of many seats that will be empty as surely he won't step down as far as Williams to replace George if he takes Bottas' seat?
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Red Bull when they give up on Perez as per the norm.

If even Bottas can't keep up with Max, maybe they'll realise they need to rethink their strategy for developing their car for both drivers instead of just going all in on Max.
 
While it is perfectly understandable that we focus on the leading manufacturers and drivers, the midfield pack are increasingly close this season. Either McLaren or Ferrari are in front of that pack of cars, but not able to really challenge.
Some very close racing though.
 
elmo said:
Red Bull when they give up on Perez as per the norm.

If even Bottas can't keep up with Max, maybe they'll realise they need to rethink their strategy for developing their car for both drivers instead of just going all in on Max.
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It's a catch 22 for them, Max most likely can't win the championship unless Perez can compete with the Mercs and steal points from them, but at the same time Max wouldn't be as fast if the car wasn't tailored for him.

This is another reason why the Merc is such a superior car to the RB as even an "average" driver like Bottas is miles ahead of the rest of the field in it and their strategists have so many options because of it. Max has to rely on pace alone to stay ahead and I doubt that's going to work over a full season when him and Lewis are so close.
 
I still think Alonso would be up there with Hamilton out of the current drivers though he's getting older.

Max will be a great driver, everyone knows that. He's already good. Merc wanted him. He can match Hamilton on pace and in most races. Hamilton probably has the edge in most people's eyes, you can't negate the amount of experience Hamilton has. Experience usually brings consistency.

This could be one of Max most important years as he will likely fall just short but learn so much just as Hamilton did in his first year.

When Hamilton goes, Max will dominate. Let's hope there is even competition with the new rules giving likes of Leclerc, Russell, and Norris a chance!
 
United Hobbit said:
I'd be very intrigued to see Russell join Mercedes, it would gain him a lot of experience being number 2 to Lewis, ready to step up when he retires. Maybe even challenge Lewis himself?

Bottas is just a bit dull, but almost always secures 3rd, while Perez/ whoever toils somewhat in the 2nd Red Bull.

Wonder when C Horner's finger will start to twitch towards the ejector seat button for Perez... hes shown not vast amounts of patience to young inexperienced drivers who are making the step up, I should imagine him having even less patience for what I thought was a strong driver.

Wonder who will sign Bottas up if he does leave? Can't think of many seats that will be empty as surely he won't step down as far as Williams to replace George if he takes Bottas' seat?
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It's pretty much nailed on the wall isn't it?

He's a Mercedes driver, been tutored by them since a young age.

He was very close to taking Bottas seat for this year, but they've given Bottas 1 more chance to see his contract out. He'll 100% be in the car next year, either next to Hamilton if he carries on or Bottas if he decides to leave.
 
Every 4 races the top 2 drivers should swap cars for a race and see what happens
 
Fully Fledged said:
Yep he would win in either car. He’s just the better driver. The way he reads the tracks is second to none.
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it's the tyre management that he is excels at better than anybody. On outright pace then Verstappen can hang with him, but when it comes to making the best of his tyres and keeping the pace up nobody can withstand his pressure.
 
muller said:
I honestly find it incredible that people still doubt Lewis Hamiltons ability. Or Mercedes brains.

Or Max's potential. Or Lando's. Or Leclerc.

Worlds a tribal place at the moment. Doesn't have to be one or the other.
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Absolutely. Hamilton is on of the best. Once he retires Verstapen has the potential to equal him, if he develops well and gets in a fast car.
 
Red Bull have lead 60% of laps so far, so for the "mercedes are quicker" gang, that isn't a stat that fits.
 
Adam-Utd said:
Red Bull have lead 60% of laps so far, so for the "mercedes are quicker" gang, that isn't a stat that fits.
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The reason RB have led more laps at this point is because Max made a better start than Lewis on sunday on a track where it's incredibly hard to overtake on pace alone, proven by the fact that Lewis and Merc gave up on the idea and instead used strategy to get it done at the very end of the race instead. This means a big chunk of those 60% are simply down to one good start at a poorly designed track. Perez leading laps in Portugal was also down to him doing a forever stint, not because his car was faster than the Mercs.

So considering that Merc would've led more laps if Hamilton or Bottas had made a better start in 1 out of the 4 races so far I don't know if it's such a good stat to use to conclude which car is faster.
 
Adam-Utd said:
Red Bull have lead 60% of laps so far, so for the "mercedes are quicker" gang, that isn't a stat that fits.
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:lol:

Use an eye test buddy. The Merc is the quickest car by far. You will see them pull away as well. They just don't follow very well. Once agead, they are gone
 
The Red Bull is the quicker car in qualifying by all accounts, but it struggles with its rear tyres on the longer runs in race trim. I'd argue that its very close between them and it'll vary from circuit to circuit as to which one has the upper hand.
 
NM said:
:lol:

Use an eye test buddy. The Merc is the quickest car by far. You will see them pull away as well. They just don't follow very well. Once agead, they are gone
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just like max in imola?

horses for courses my friend
 
Adam-Utd said:
just like max in imola?

horses for courses my friend
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Hamilton was catching him hand over fist when he spun off.

I find the Hamilton fans shitting on Mercedes just so they can say he is great weird. He's clearly amongst the greatest, but the people here are overly defensive
 
NM said:
Hamilton was catching him hand over fist when he spun off.

I find the Hamilton fans shitting on Mercedes just so they can say he is great weird. He's clearly amongst the greatest, but the people here are overly defensive
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catching doesn’t necessarily mean he’s faster, max could have been minding his tyres with a huge lead.

anyway the rest of the season will be proof. no doubt it’s very tight.

I think people are fairly defensive when a 7 time champion is reduced to “it’s just the car”. Verstappen and red bull have turned up at the perfect time to cement his legacy.
 
Adam-Utd said:
catching doesn’t necessarily mean he’s faster, max could have been minding his tyres with a huge lead.

anyway the rest of the season will be proof. no doubt it’s very tight.

I think people are fairly defensive when a 7 time champion is reduced to “it’s just the car”. Verstappen and red bull have turned up at the perfect time to cement his legacy.
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It certainly isn't just the car. He nearly won the title as a rookie ffs
 
NM said:
It certainly isn't just the car. He nearly won the title as a rookie ffs
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Exactly. Head and head against Alonso a 2 time world champion and he really should have won. I won't go into conspiracy theories but it seems Mclaren were forced to give it away by the FIA.
 
Adam-Utd said:
catching doesn’t necessarily mean he’s faster, max could have been minding his tyres with a huge lead.

anyway the rest of the season will be proof. no doubt it’s very tight.

I think people are fairly defensive when a 7 time champion is reduced to “it’s just the car”. Verstappen and red bull have turned up at the perfect time to cement his legacy.
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Which nobody here actually said.

ZIDANE said:
I still think Alonso would be up there with Hamilton out of the current drivers though he's getting older.
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Shouldn't he be beating Ocon first? :nervous:
 
Balljy said:
Hmmm, the FIA are going to bring in extra checks to test the flexibility of rear wings. From the way it is worded it suggests that Red Bull will lose out from this.

I'll be gutted if it has an impact on the speed of the Red Bull

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/57086036
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Didnt hamilton claim it was worth 0.3 seconds a lap in the last GP?

If thats true either everybody copies it (if its legal) or if redbull have to change then it seems their speed will be impacted .... either way they will losse any advantage
 
Fantasy League 2021 after Race 4 Spain
Fantasy League Standings after Spain
Hamilton Academical increases his lead to 25 points
Manoucha09 goes in to 2nd
Me ? I am still crap and struggling down the bottom :lol:
1st
senorgregster​
434​
X
2nd
manoucha​
409​
X
3rd
venkman​
407​
X
4th
chaddyp​
398​
X
5th
emm​
EMM​
387​
X
6th
coleworld​
385​
X
7th
impulse​
373​
X
8th
dargonk​
367​
X
9th
christy87​
367​
X
10th
mtf​
362​
X
11th
vangagal​
362​
X
12th
jtw95​
358​
X
13th
tiber​
357​
X
14th
evan7788​
356​
X
15th
f-red​
354​
X
16th
leg-end7​
353​
X
17th
pauldyson1uk​
345​
X
18th
20solskjaer​
323​
X
19th
dpansheth​
Rock​
59​
X
 
Not sure where to put this but I stumbled upon this on youtube and it's ace:


Basically dashcam footage of Stirling speeding through Italy :drool:
 
GoranIvanisevic said:
What makes haas such a bad car?
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GoranIvanisevic said:
So basically they are still running last years car?
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This year is the last year of the currents cars, next year they completely change.

They basically admitted they're the slowest car, financially only just about made it this season. Even if they spent 100m to try and get into the points on a few odd occasions, they'd still be either bottom or 2nd bottom. The prize money just doesn't outweigh the cost it would need.

Throw all the money + development into next years car and they might be fighting the mid pack more regularly.
 
Haas are doing the right thing for sure, they weren’t going to progress this season even if they developed. This way they give Schumacher a low key no pressure season to learn the ropes, develop for 2022.
 
I think HAAS could be decent mid placed team next season, they have admitted they are the slowest this year, no amount of money will make them better this season, throwing all their time and money towards 2022 is the right thing to do.
 
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