[antohan]

Fred is not a holding midfielder. He is a box to box in the same mould as Lampard and Gerrard

Blimey. I'm not on the knock Fred for everything bandwagon but that's such a depressing statement.

"Same mould", some fecker has been tinkering with that mould quite badly.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Not even close. He’s a mobile ball winning midfielder.

Blimey. I'm not on the knock Fred for everything bandwagon but that's such a depressing statement.

"Same mould", some fecker has been tinkering with that mould quite badly.

You guys clearly never watched him play for Shahktar

 

[antohan]

Not even close. He’s a mobile ball winning midfielder.

Are there immobile ball-winning midfielders?

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Blimey. I'm not on the knock Fred for everything bandwagon but that's such a depressing statement.

"Same mould", some fecker has been tinkering with that mould quite badly.

It's very mouldy mould. Rather insulting to Gerrard and Lampard comparing Fred to them.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

You guys clearly never watched him play for Shahktar

We could make it that we are watching him play for Shahktar.

 

[Red Shorts]

The amount of posts with Quality control on them .

If Liverpool lose, we are still joint top. Panic stations should arrive when we start losing 3-0 against the relegation teams, and consistently.

 

[RoadTrip]

Wait, are we seriously discussing if Fred is comparable, or even a similar style of player, to Lampard and Gerrard? What is going on.

 

[Conor]

Fred is not a holding midfielder. He is a box to box in the same mould as Lampard and Gerrard

If by same mould you mean that they are all human beings, then yes, I agree.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

We had a very good first 30 minutes but once Villa got into the game, it was much more even than the shots suggest. Greenwood was a threat but it didn't come off for him in the final third. The other two of the front three were hopeless. And our defence allowed chances and midfield didn't really boss things.

In the end we don't have a manager who elevates his team, and his quality doesn't match our ambition.

 

[UDontMessWith24]

Are there immobile ball-winning midfielders?

Not anymore at this level at least. And?

 

[RoadTrip]

The amount of posts with Quality control on them .

If Liverpool lose, we are still joint top. Panic stations should arrive when we start losing 3-0 against the relegation teams, and consistently.

It’s certainly not panic stations yet, and one bad defeat isn’t the end of the world. But it is completely right that we question and be skeptical of the situation. Because sadly it’s not just a bad day at the office, the reality is it was a poor performance which isn’t hugely different to some of our other performances this season where, yes, we’ve won, but not convincingly at times. So to query whether it’s just a bad day or whether this result was coming as it’s endemic of our performances recently, is entirely reasonable in my opinion.

 

[soralapio]

h

Cavani's man scored direct from the corner. What was Pogba supposed to be doing?

It's weird that whatever happens, where ever it happens, a lot of people point the finger at Pogba and usually with the same dog whistle complaints about not caring enough or not putting in the effort.

So ultimately the honest answer feels like "not be a black French man who proudly displays his own culture, which is not the culture of the people who use him as their scapegoat for everything".

 

[NK86]

Completely disagree. Every club doesn’t shoehorn a Pogba, Bruno and Ronaldo into the same team. Klopp and Pep are all about the collective - and when Tuchel had to do the equivalent at PSG his team certainly didn’t look cohesive. I guess he was just a shit coach back then though right?

The PSG which won the Ligue 1 two years in a row under him and also reached a CL final (their only CL final appearance so far)!

Yeah, I would definitely want our manager to be that "shite" and our performances to be that "incoherent".

 

[antohan]

You guys clearly never watched him play for Shahktar

Mate, I agree with the role definition, not the mould part. The Gerrard/Lampard mould is Robbo's mould, not Fred's.

 

[Kcocymkcus]

At some point even the most die hard Ole fans have got to realise that even if we had 11 Ronald's on the pitch it still wouldn't make any difference because he's out of his depth.
I'm beyond describing this shower of shjte these days. When you look at the starting 11 we have quality players all over the pitch, we should be mullering teams like Villa but instead we're all chewing our knuckles. Oles time is up.

 

[Smudgers]

He’s got to go , worst coached team in the league by a mile absolute shit show today

 

[UDontMessWith24]

The amount of posts with Quality control on them .

If Liverpool lose, we are still joint top. Panic stations should arrive when we start losing 3-0 against the relegation teams, and consistently.

So the line for what’s unacceptable begins at losing 3-0 to relegation teams?

 

[NK86]

The amount of posts with Quality control on them .

If Liverpool lose, we are still joint top. Panic stations should arrive when we start losing 3-0 against the relegation teams, and consistently.

Amazing, so we need to be absolutely shite for us to start being concerned? Not when we are seeing signs of it (no goals in 2 consecutive games. 3 losses in 4 matches).

I agree, we should put in an alarm when the house is up in smoke. Why bother earlier!

 

[RoadTrip]

h

It's weird that whatever happens, where ever it happens, a lot of people point the finger at Pogba and usually with the same dog whistle complaints about not caring enough or not putting in the effort.

So ultimately the honest answer feels like "not be a black French man who proudly displays his own culture, which is not the culture of the people who use him as their scapegoat for everything".

I think Pogba often gets unfair criticism but it’s a very slippery slope to default down this route of argument. The issue with Pogba is, on his day, he absolutely dominates the game. But on other days, which are far too often, he is a nonentity - for whatever reason that may be. When you have a player capable of being a superstar, it is natural that he will receive criticism when he doesn’t reach that level because his consistency is a real issue at times.

It’s because he can be so good that he gets the brunt of criticism when he underperforms. Which is far too often unfortunately.

 

[Mickeza]

The PSG which won the Ligue 1 two years in a row under him and also reached a CL final (their only CL final appearance so far)!

Yeah, I would definitely want our manager to be that "shite" and our performances to be that "incoherent".

Nobody watched that PSG side against us and thought they were greater than the sum of their parts. His Chelsea team looks far better to me with inferior players because it has BALANCE. That’s what every nob head on here doesn’t get when they moan about McFred. This isn’t even a sodding defence of Ole. He’s bought the players. He needs to make them a team. I just don’t see how you can fit Bruno, Pogba and Ronaldo into the same side and not be a moments team.

 

[Ferguson’s Hairdryer]

The excitement of the transfer window starts to fade when you realise it’s pretty much the same pattern as last season.

Sadly, one of the best squads the prem has ever seen will go to waste let’s be honest it could win the prem it could win the CL, but we all know why none of those two things will happen.

 

[LJJT]

Poor game today. Mctominay was terrible, Ronaldo barely had a kick, Shaw & AWB where bad as well. I’m as gutted as any but again the hysteria is a bit over the top. We had 28 shots again, there goal should have been ruled offside. Never thought I’d see Bruno miss one like that

 

[Withnail]

If you're the man on the post there's only two situations where you're supposed to leave that post. First is when the ball's cleared, second is if you're going to go and attack the ball. Pogba leaves the post to stand somewhere near an opposition player and the ball whistles straight past where he'd previously been and into the net.

Its basic stuff.

My post was a bit rushed sorry, I meant I hadn't noticed Pogba on my crappy stream. I wasn't disagreeing. I'll see it properly on MOTD. Thanks

 

[Pronewbie]

Missed the game today but reading through the forum it appears that we were shite beyond belief...

 

[NK86]

Nobody watched that PSG side against us and thought they were greater than the sum of their parts. His Chelsea team looks far better to me with inferior players because it has BALANCE. That’s what every nob head on here doesn’t get when they moan about McFred. This isn’t even a sodding defence of Ole. He’s bought the players. He needs to make them a team. I just don’t see how you can fit Bruno, Pogba and Ronaldo into the same side and not be a moments team.

That's the problem. You seem to think we have never had an abundance of attacking talent in our team at the same time. We had a midfield which would get overrun regularly and yet we looked threatening and won titles.

This nonsense that the manager is incompetent to not get the best out his squad means the squad is unbalanced is a cop out to somehow justify the shite show we regularly see with Ole.

 

[justsomebloke]

Actually thought the last 5 or 10 minutes in the first half we played well , with a lot of half chances which is why I was surprised by our second half. I wouldnt like to put the blame on any one thing because it was a shitshow all over the pitch. With the players we have we should be carving teams open imstead of going for potshots. I've read somewhere we've had 50 shots at goal with only 7 on target the last 2 matches which is something that badly needs addressing.

Absolutely. Again, something about coherence and patience in the attacking third.

 

[Rightnr]

The amount of posts with Quality control on them .

If Liverpool lose, we are still joint top. Panic stations should arrive when we start losing 3-0 against the relegation teams, and consistently.

Panic stations have arrived when performances like today's have 'fans' such as yourself trying to downplay how dire we are playing week in, week-out.

 

[HailtotheKing]

Greenwood played very well but ruined some of our chances. He was not confident with his passing, can't blame him.
Some players need to understand we have GOAT level poacher in a team, some buildup plays would have finished the game in the first half. But instead, we wasted so many buildup plays by randomly shooting and getting blocked by villa players.
Players made bad decisions in the final third, tactically I don't think Ole got it wrong.
Hope the team will bounce back, and win against villareal.

If that’s the case, surely Ole or one of the coaches should’ve been yelling on the sidelines to stop them shooting all the time? But no, they’re too passive.

 

[Red Shorts]

So the line for what’s unacceptable begins at losing 3-0 to relegation teams?

It was a shit performance, and is unacceptable as a match. But the amount of comments saying Ole/Woodward are cretins are at the same time unacceptable from our fanbase.

If we start getting smashed like Arsenal were at the start of the season, then it's right to be much more critical considering the backi g Ole has got. As it stands, we are early in the season, joint with all the other big teams.

 

[NK86]

We had a very good first 30 minutes but once Villa got into the game, it was much more even than the shots suggest. Greenwood was a threat but it didn't come off for him in the final third. The other two of the front three were hopeless. And our defence allowed chances and midfield didn't really boss things.

In the end we don't have a manager who elevates his team, and his quality doesn't match our ambition.

The last statement. Absolutely spot on. Unfortunately many don't seem to see something that obvious.

 

[antohan]

Yeah struggling to think when we last that inept, especially with the quality we had on the pitch.

Villa were rubbish and beat us.

You reckon? It just felt like our regular lack of ideas on how to unlock a defence in the final third.

 

[stw2022]

The depressing thing is this isn't out of the norm. There is the occasional game or maybe a purple patch here and there but what we churned out today is the standard. We don't always lose. Sometimes the penalty goes in. Other times the opposition don't benefit from dubious decisions. But generally that is how we play.

 

[UDontMessWith24]

Poor game today. Mctominay was terrible, Ronaldo barely had a kick, Shaw & AWB where bad as well. I’m as gutted as any but again the hysteria is a bit over the top. We had 28 shots again, there goal should have been ruled offside. Never thought I’d see Bruno miss one like that

Their goal should not have been disallowed, those 28 shots were not contextual evidence of a dominant performance, and it was not an overall good performance with one or two players having off days. It was a team failure, period end of story.

 

[Red Shorts]

Amazing, so we need to be absolutely shite for us to start being concerned? Not when we are seeing signs of it (no goals in 2 consecutive games. 3 losses in 4 matches).

I agree, we should put in an alarm when the house is up in smoke. Why bother earlier!

We have been very stop-start this season, but even with that being the case we are 6 games in and at the top.

City were incredibly slow last season, yet ended up 12 points ahead of us. The lack of patience with fans is laughable.

And the two games you mentioned had a full B team play, and the other involving playing the game with 10 men for 60 minutes. Not absolute disasters in the grand scheme of things.

 

[acnumber9]

We were creating all the chances in the match at that point. Why would you want to change that match situation?

Stretford End was impatient as feck today.

I wish I could’ve seen what you did. We didn’t have a single good chance in that second half and we could barely string three passes together.

 

[HailtotheKing]

It’s certainly not panic stations yet, and one bad defeat isn’t the end of the world. But it is completely right that we question and be skeptical of the situation. Because sadly it’s not just a bad day at the office, the reality is it was a poor performance which isn’t hugely different to some of our other performances this season where, yes, we’ve won, but not convincingly at times. So to query whether it’s just a bad day or whether this result was coming as it’s endemic of our performances recently, is entirely reasonable in my opinion.

And by recent we don’t even mean the opening of the season we mean most of last. The number of games we pulled out of the fire with last minute winners or equalizers is just untrue. And sure that’s a sign of a team with grit but it’s also a sign of a team with brilliant individual players who can pull something out of the fire. Which is why so often Ole kept those players on the pitch even though they were playing poorly, be it Rashford, Bruno, pogba. Because time and time again they have bailed Ole out so no wonder he trusts them. But this method of playing is just unsustainable. The only way it can work is if you have a brilliant team made up of brilliant individual players where one is always playing well so they can work some magic. And we are pretty damn close. But if your midfield can’t control things and your play of off you can’t hope to beat teams that have good players and are coached correctly. Because we are clearly not.

 

[Longshanks]

It is NOT difficult. Chelsea and Liverpool already dispelled that myth by sacking Frank Lampard and Kenny Dalglish when it was time to go. The problem are 1) the board being so gullible at eating whatever shit our blowhard of a manager is selling to them and 2) the percentage of the fanbase who think to be holier than thou by sticking with the manager instead of facing harsh reality. If Murtough and Fletcher really represent that change of mentality post-Woodward, then the manager better not think he will be as safe as before.

We are not at lampard at Chelsea levels or Dalglish at Liverpool levels yet.

If we are floundering in tenth come Christmas time than I don't think there would be any arguments about sacking Ole. The fact is we are not there yet.

Its our first defeat of the league season, we have had a decent start before today win our next few games and we will still be on course to challenge, lose them we could be in trouble mind.

Ole is definitely at a crossroads (again) not quite looking down the barrel but its round the corner if things don't got well in the next few weeks.

 

[Hammondo]

That was like FIFA. Every shot blocked, every second ball bounced to them, concede a bullshit goal, blast pen over the bar to top it off

Every shot blocked because we took so many stupid shots with players in front of us.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Poor game today. Mctominay was terrible, Ronaldo barely had a kick, Shaw & AWB where bad as well. I’m as gutted as any but again the hysteria is a bit over the top. We had 28 shots again, there goal should have been ruled offside. Never thought I’d see Bruno miss one like that

We had god knows how many shots against West Ham during the week and lost as well. We are toothless, because we are set up to be toothless. Unless we can play Leeds every week.

 

[stw2022]

It won't be 'panic stations' until it's mathematically impossible to achieve what we want to. In other words: unless it's a complete disaster it's good enough.