Magnificent. Delighted for him - he went from what looked like being the face of the unlucky / nearly / heartache era of the Argentina NT to conquering both SA and the world at age 33 and 35. What an accomplishment.
Lionel Messi is OFFICIALLY the Greatest Player of all Time (CONFIRMED OFFICIAL)
- Thread starter Pexbo
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The system of measure that you have all put in place is designed purposely so that Messi can literally never fail. Ronaldo's strengths are given no weight what-so-ever. Ronaldo making a run is using his vision to read the game, timing to create the opportunity and skills to control the pass. Why is the passer automatically doing more? It's bullshit. Without creative and skillful off the ball movement there would be no pass to begin with. In the analysis of a game Ronaldo's movement, placement and timing isn't valued or statistically tracked. Even though this is a shared proposition. This is just one example of how judging a player is skewed towards Messi and the list goes on.
Have you seen Ronaldo operate in a crowded midfield? There is a plethora of examples where he drops back, plays short concise passes, links up, penetrates with his dribbling, makes outlet passes to the wing, side-steps defenders, etc. There is no skill or ability he lacks to operate in deeper areas. He looks just as natural or accomplished as any true midfielder when he moves to the center. He has dominated the wings his entire career. These attributes which makes him successful do not diminish in the middle of the field.
But what you do is overvalue Messi's contributions in a possession based team compared to Ronaldo's contributions in a direct/counter-attacking team. I don't believe Messi has the speed, stamina or strength to run or move off the ball like Ronaldo chasing down balls and sprinting down the flanks an entire game.
Have you seen Ronaldo operate in a crowded midfield? There is a plethora of examples where he drops back, plays short concise passes, links up, penetrates with his dribbling, makes outlet passes to the wing, side-steps defenders, etc. There is no skill or ability he lacks to operate in deeper areas. He looks just as natural or accomplished as any true midfielder when he moves to the center. He has dominated the wings his entire career. These attributes which makes him successful do not diminish in the middle of the field.
But what you do is overvalue Messi's contributions in a possession based team compared to Ronaldo's contributions in a direct/counter-attacking team. I don't believe Messi has the speed, stamina or strength to run or move off the ball like Ronaldo chasing down balls and sprinting down the flanks an entire game.
Just great that we got to enjoy him on the big stage again, and he turned it on as he usually does. An incredible talent, but with a mindset and drive to match. Best to just enjoy him while he is still around, may be a while until another like him comes along.
The euro where Portugal faced European giants like Switzerland, Poland, Wales in knockout stage? Where Ronaldo destroyed Wales with his only goal in the whole knockout stage? Player of tournament indeed
Or the Nation League where he was absent for the most part of it?
I think Sporting’s take on Messi/Ronaldo is disingenuous and wildly inconsistent… but I think he has a point here.
The idea of him being threadbanned because he doesn’t share the majority opinion is crazy. We can laugh at his views (I have), but there’s no need to silence him. He’s not being abusive, just (in my opinion) somewhat self-contradictory.
I agree. This thread would be boring without Sporting's takes.
Ronaldo can keep harping he got 5 ucl medals.
Pele was far superior to Maradona in club level tbh. It is just Eurocentric footballing history, because of which exploits of that great Santos team is brushed aside.
Pele vs Maradona logically should never have been a debate. Yes Maradona was an exceptionally talented player, but when it comes to accomplishments he is nowhere near Pele. People argue Pele played for better teams, yes he did, yet just like Messi or Cristiano or Di Stefano or Cruyff, he was so ahead of everyone else in the team. As they say being a big fish in a big pond, not as easy as some people try to make it. Playing with world class players, and still making yourself a level above them, is not something easy.
Jordan, Messi, Brady, Federer, Hamilton
Mount Rushmore
Mount Rushmore
No ban for Sporting, not a chance, keep him for comedy sake.
Nations league more competitive than Copa.
If Ronaldo was Brazilian and won the Copa he'd dish NL like a worst competiton ever but the fact Ronaldo won it makes it far bigger.
Nations league more competitive than Copa.
If Ronaldo was Brazilian and won the Copa he'd dish NL like a worst competiton ever but the fact Ronaldo won it makes it far bigger.
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Think he said somewhere in this thread that Euros and World Cup are equals or something, his 1/1 vs 2/4 nonsense so small time, its funny. Got schooled when someone mentioned the same logic in the UCL, came out swinging as well.No ban for Sporting, not a chance, keep him for comedy sake.
Nations league more competitive than Copa.
If Ronaldo was Brazilian and won the Copa he'd dish NL like a worst competiton ever but the fact Ronaldo won it makes it far bigger.
At this point I am convinced that it is better to either not challenge him directly or even just agree with him, for the sake of his mental wellbeing. His gospel is perhaps even a form of escape from reality, sometimes people need that and it is more common than people think
Yeah to be honest he's quite obviously not mentally well.
He's the football equivalent of a Qanon follower, he was probably chanting "Stop the count" after Mbappes opening goal in the shootout.
What the feck is this?The system of measure isn't geared to suit Messi. Messi is simply a better footballer who offers both prolific goalscoring and is a creative / playmaking force of nature.
l o l at federer hes PR machine like Ronaldo. Nadal and mostly Djokovic are clearly better players with better resumes, better h2h etc
This amount of idolizing someone you never met is disturbing. There are Ronaldo fans and there's Sporting. If Ronaldo burned his house down he'd say he did it like a goat he is and has better statistics of burning houses than Messi, 4 in 6. Messi only burnes houses, ronaldo burnes buildings.
Probably still living in 2007/2008, watching the most exciting version of CR7. Even that version is no match for the 2009-2015 versions of Messi but whatever
The system of measure isn't geared to suit Messi. Messi is simply a better footballer who offers both prolific goalscoring and is a creative / playmaking force of nature.
Not even worth responding to some, amol. They’re going through a really difficult time, much like their idol.
The system of measure isn't geared to suit Messi. Messi is simply a better footballer who offers both prolific goalscoring and is a creative / playmaking force of nature.
Federer was not better than Djokovic or Nadal. I love him, and he might be my favorite sportsman ever, but it is very hard to argue that he was better than them, especially Djokovic.
Is Hamilton considered better than Schumacher?
No debate for Messi and Jordan.
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You would have had a point if Messi wasn’t as good as Ronaldo (if not better) at scoring.
The thing is, they are pretty much equal at scoring, with Messi being quite better at assisting and way better at play making. The only argument in favor of Ronaldo is that he was better at UCL (while Messi better in the league), and with UCL being more important than the league, there was still an argument (especially when Ronaldo had won Euros but Messi had no international trophy). Unfortunately for him, Messi pretty much shut it down the debate when he won Copa (having better performances than Ronaldo ever had in international competitions), and made the debate absurd after winning World Cup in one of the finest performances by a single player.
I love Ronaldo, but he never managed to score or assist in KO stage of 5 World Cups. That is why he belongs in the next tier, with Di Stefano and Cruyff, instead of the top one with Messi, Pele and Maradona.
Not near as disturbing as people who diminish another great. Just in the last few pages we had posters calling Ronaldo a fraud, or not even belonging on the next tier of footballers, or being more than one tier below Messi, or not having contributed in Portugal’s Euro trophy, or having had better teammates at Portuga during his career than Messi with Argentina. Totally objectively false.
I think there are way more Messi fans who hate Ronaldo and diminish his success than the other way around. Messi’ fans are much more bitter which is weird considering that he is the better player of the two, and at this stage it is a vast majority consensus opinion, almost unanimous.
There is no debate, Messi is the GOAT and the better of the two. So they should stop pretending that Ronaldo was just an ok player, no need for that.
Imagine how good he would have been without years of growth hormones.
And this is why Messi on another level because he is not just simply great goal scorer. That passing ability and vision is what makes Messi unique. He will draw 2-3 players and then find passing lane nobody could even predict - it's just amazing. How often we hear this - "how did he do it"?
The system of measure isn't geared to suit Messi. Messi is simply a better footballer who offers both prolific goalscoring and is a creative / playmaking force of nature.
Nah. Its still more disturbing. But I agree about absurdity of calling Ronaldo a fraud. Also both camps are as irritating as each other.
of course is my humble opinion, you can have an argument in favour of Lebron as well.
Yeah we all know that growth hormones are amazing for first touch, ball control and play making ability.
Yes. But one of them have the excuse that they’re right though.
Sporting and Amadeus are the legends of this forum. Thank you for participating! 
That is true.Yes. But one of them have the excuse that they’re right though.
Great montage of the 22 WC
It is really sad for the Messi haters when they are reduced to this growth hormones argument. Even Sporting’s argument are less sad than this lul
Yeah, debate about who's better is basically about growth hormones or not, without those he would have left Ronaldo in the dust long, long time ago.
I mean, you're completely discounting the fact that football is a physical game too. The fact that he was given the hormones to aid his development in the first place, is pretty indicative of the importance it held for the future of his career in order for Barcelona to agree to pay for the treatment.
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For me, Ronaldo's record in the cl knockouts is why I have him as the best, it's by some distance the highest level of football in the world, and Ronaldo is miles ahead of anyone else in it, with that difference getting more pronounced if you take out the last 16. Messi was definitely a better league player and while neither ever replicated their club level at international, this tournament for Messi was enough to make him a better international player. But I think the performances in the later rounds of the champions League hold more weight personally.
But Ronaldo looks like he's done and Messi could have another few years at PSG so that's still possible. I realise this opinion isnt shared by everyone but it's the same way I've felt for years and why messi is far clear of maradona and Pele, because what you do over 15 years of your career is a better indicator of ability than 7 games every 4 years
But Ronaldo looks like he's done and Messi could have another few years at PSG so that's still possible. I realise this opinion isnt shared by everyone but it's the same way I've felt for years and why messi is far clear of maradona and Pele, because what you do over 15 years of your career is a better indicator of ability than 7 games every 4 years
Up there with the greatest, yes. The greatest...there's no "greatest" in a team sport. There are so many variables to this it's not even possible to even imagine pointing to someone and saying "He's the greatest."
And yet chile and Uruguay smacked Ronaldo out of various tournaments. He would struggle a lot in Copa America.
At least Messi is able to get to the finals.
hows Ronaldo’s world Cup record by the way? Far worse than anyone else in top 10 all time? Face, Messi winning WC has destroyed any chance of Ronaldo having an argument for GOAT. It’s over. Deep down, you know it. It’s done a a dusted. Ronaldo will always be behind Messi,
Pele and maradonna. He’s been an absolute non factor in knockout rounds despite playing in five World Cup. He’s nowhere near the GOAT.
I'm not really, it's just the last actions of a desperate fanbase (Ronaldo fanboys or whatever you want to call them) pulling the hormone stuff out of their arse cause their hero is in the dust once and for all!
I would never put a man who plays a sport only really played by two countries on a sport mount rushmore, even Formula 1 driving is a very closed market in terms of participation, I didn’t know anyone growing up who had the resources to be a professional formula 1 driver, but everyone I knew played Football.
A sport mount rushmore should be from world sports, not NFL or Formula 1.
So Pele and Ali above Federer Hamilton and Brady for me.
Nah, he is the most famous but Sugar Ray Robinson is pretty much as a consensus choice for the greatest boxer ever as it can be.