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2022-23 Performances


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6.2 Season Average Rating
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58
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25
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JB7

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My point is that all keepers have flaws. The only keeper that I would swap for Dave would be Alisson and he ain't coming here.

All these names suggested aren't playing at big clubs and their flaws will only be exacerbated at this club and picked through by hypercritics.

De Gea is playing very well this season and is a big part of our upturn IMHO
Indeed, the various data driven statistical analysis metrics of performance that have been used throughout this thread are more obviously much more critical on Manchester United goalkeepers than those of any other clubs. Great point which I hadn't considered.

Are you seriously trying to say he's the second best goalkeeper in the world by the way?
 

Olecurls99

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Indeed, the various data driven statistical analysis metrics of performance that have been used throughout this thread are more obviously much more critical on Manchester United goalkeepers than those of any other clubs. Great point which I hadn't considered.

Are you seriously trying to say he's the second best goalkeeper in the world by the way?
No, I'm saying he's the best keeper for Man United.

Say that other paragraph fast 5 times

The stats will say Ederson collects more crosses but won't cover that goal he let in on Wednesday trying to collect a cross. He should've stayed on his line and made the save.

Stats schmats
 

JB7

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No, I'm saying he's the best keeper for Man United.

Say that other paragraph fast 5 times

The stats will say Ederson collects more crosses but won't cover that goal he let in on Wednesday trying to collect a cross. He should've stayed on his line and made the save.

Stats schmats
Yeah "stats schmats", that's why we had nearly as many analysts as players at the Nou Camp last week.

The only person continually bringing Ederson up as an example of a goalkeeper people want is you; it's quite bizarre actually. But you are correct that he stops more crosses, twice as many in fact despite facing half as many crosses.

So yes, give me a goalkeeper who successfully deals with 9% of crosses into the box but messes up on one a season over a goalkeeper who deals with 2% of them and as a result regularly faces headers from inside his own six yard box.
 

Olecurls99

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Yeah "stats schmats", that's why we had nearly as many analysts as players at the Nou Camp last week.

The only person continually bringing Ederson up as an example of a goalkeeper people want is you; it's quite bizarre actually. But you are correct that he stops more crosses, twice as many in fact despite facing half as many crosses.

So yes, give me a goalkeeper who successfully deals with 9% of crosses into the box but messes up on one a season over a goalkeeper who deals with 2% of them and as a result regularly faces headers from inside his own six yard box.
Oooh, 9% of crosses. Imagine all the trophies we'll win.
 

frostbite

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A ball playing goalkeeper (that some people believe is very important) ... how many additional goals would create per year?

I may be wrong, but I don't think that any goalkeeper in the PL creates that many goals that really makes a difference. Especially compared to the contribution of a world class striker. For example, I don't think that Haaland or Kane are going to score less if they don't have a ball playing goalkeeper behind them.

Then perhaps people believe that a ball playing goal keeper will save more goals? Perhaps because he is more "press resistant"? But then again this depends much more on the outfield players, not on the goalkeeper. No matter how "press resistant" the goalkeeper is, I don't think he will save us many goals because of his exquisite passes.

So, in my opinion, for a goalkeeper, it is nice to have this "ball playing" ability, but it is not very important at all.

Am I wrong?
 

Red in STL

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A ball playing goalkeeper (that some people believe is very important) ... how many additional goals would create per year?

I may be wrong, but I don't think that any goalkeeper in the PL creates that many goals that really makes a difference. Especially compared to the contribution of a world class striker. For example, I don't think that Haaland or Kane are going to score less if they don't have a ball playing goalkeeper behind them.

Then perhaps people believe that a ball playing goal keeper will save more goals? Perhaps because he is more "press resistant"? But then again this depends much more on the outfield players, not on the goalkeeper. No matter how "press resistant" the goalkeeper is, I don't think he will save us many goals because of his exquisite passes.

So, in my opinion, for a goalkeeper, it is nice to have this "ball playing" ability, but it is not very important at all.

Am I wrong?
No but certain stats obsessed posters will insist you are
 

Bebestation

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He hasn’t done it all the time but has come out to punch crosses more from corners.
 

Adnan

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A ball playing goalkeeper (that some people believe is very important) ... how many additional goals would create per year?

I may be wrong, but I don't think that any goalkeeper in the PL creates that many goals that really makes a difference. Especially compared to the contribution of a world class striker. For example, I don't think that Haaland or Kane are going to score less if they don't have a ball playing goalkeeper behind them.

Then perhaps people believe that a ball playing goal keeper will save more goals? Perhaps because he is more "press resistant"? But then again this depends much more on the outfield players, not on the goalkeeper. No matter how "press resistant" the goalkeeper is, I don't think he will save us many goals because of his exquisite passes.

So, in my opinion, for a goalkeeper, it is nice to have this "ball playing" ability, but it is not very important at all.

Am I wrong?
What you should be asking is how a goalkeeper with ball playing ability will aid the development of a play-style that Erik ten Hag wants to implement. And it's that play style which will eventually lead to us being a team that has the potential to control all phases of play, hence the likes of Klopp and Guardiola have had sustained success due to signing Allison and Ederson.

So when the machine is well oiled, progression from back to front will be much smoother and the potential to create and score goals will increase like we've seen with Liverpool and Man City for the last 6 years. So there's a clear purpose behind world class managers wanting their goalkeeper to create the first superiority in the build up phase which aids the development of a play-style which benefits the team as a collective.

A striker can score loads of goals as a individual but a Roberto Firmino in a Liverpool team that progresses play effectively through the thirds will score and create more goals as a collective.
 

tenpoless

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He's so laughably bad at distribution - zero composure under pressure. Instead of opening up his body to pass to Varane or Bissaka he boots (badly) it straight to Sergi Roberto.


And he didn't even kick it straight, the ball moved like this.. how on earth did he do that?
 

themanguydude

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A ball playing goalkeeper (that some people believe is very important) ... how many additional goals would create per year?

I may be wrong, but I don't think that any goalkeeper in the PL creates that many goals that really makes a difference. Especially compared to the contribution of a world class striker. For example, I don't think that Haaland or Kane are going to score less if they don't have a ball playing goalkeeper behind them.

Then perhaps people believe that a ball playing goal keeper will save more goals? Perhaps because he is more "press resistant"? But then again this depends much more on the outfield players, not on the goalkeeper. No matter how "press resistant" the goalkeeper is, I don't think he will save us many goals because of his exquisite passes.

So, in my opinion, for a goalkeeper, it is nice to have this "ball playing" ability, but it is not very important at all.

Am I wrong?
You're not wrong if our manager is still Jose.

But it's not.

For all the talk about needing the manager to be ruthless, literally the only argument that can be made for extending him are from sentimental reasons.
 
Last edited:

Santoryo

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Some posts are trying to present this idea of ball playing goalkeeper as weak when it comes to making saves and stops. No one is arguing for acquiring just a ball playing keeper who doesn't excel at anything else. We want a keeper that is good overall but is also integral in helping us build play from the back. DeGea can't provide that which is why he doesn't even get selected for his national team.

We will never be able to control games as much as we want with a keeper who can't help us in that aspect of the game. The fact that every pass back to DeGea is almost an automatic loss of possession is egregious. There is no reasons to tie ourselves to DeGea because he makes good and great saves yet shockingly lack of a very integral aspect of the modern game. There are keepers out there who can get you saves but also can actually be integral in helping teams build from the back and control games, those are the ones we should be going after. Not those who can play from the back but lack other goal keeping aspects nor a DeGea type who is good at saving, making stops but can't play on the ground.
 

Ayush_reddevil

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Again while discussing these ball playing abilities some people seem to make it seem like that DDG is just bad with the ball at his feet while being very good at everything else. There is zero evidence to suggest this. All the keeping stats seem to suggest that he is a middle of the field shot stopper and the worst in the league in terms of crosses. These stats were not created by someone who hates DDG but rather they are just there and he seems to be doing badly in them

Also some United fans are obsessed with this idea of mentality and how hard it is to be a keeper at a big club like somehow there are no other big clubs who have changed keepers ever. Forget the big PL clubs but even the big European clubs have routinely upgraded on keepers when they felt that the time was right . I am pretty sure being the keeper at Madrid is probably even harder because their fans crush you if you do badly but they seem to change when they need to do it’s not that hard just because United had a hard time under Saf
 

Olecurls99

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These stats were not created by someone who hates DDG but rather they are just there and he seems to be doing badly in them
I've already pointed out why these stats are bollox.

Ederson collects 4 times more crosses at 9% (Wow by the way), but the stats won't talk about how he cost his team the win on Wednesday by getting under a cross rather than staying on his line.

Stats schmats
 

Ayush_reddevil

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I've already pointed out why these stats are bollox.

Ederson collects 4 times more crosses at 9% (Wow by the way), but the stats won't talk about how he cost his team the win on Wednesday by getting under a cross rather than staying on his line.

Stats schmats
That’s because there’s no way to prove that they wouldn’t have conceded if he had just stayed on the line. DDG concedes all the time while staying on the line. There are always going to be some grey areas for stats, just like stats won’t tell you that Casemiro & Varane saved 2 goals on Thursday and someone like you will be posting in this thread soon how few goals he has conceded. Overall there’s hardly any stats I can see this season that tell me that as a pure goalkeeper (forget with the feet) he has been great this season


You know what greatness looks like. In 2017-2018 DDG saved 80% of the shots on target & his Psxg was +12.3 . This season he has saved 70% of the shots on target and Psxg is -1.1 . The first guy was playing at a level where you could probably ignore all other aspects of keeping but the second guy isn’t playing anywhere close to that level
 

Olecurls99

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That’s because there’s no way to prove that they wouldn’t have conceded if he had just stayed on the line. DDG concedes all the time while staying on the line. There are always going to be some grey areas for stats, just like stats won’t tell you that Casemiro & Varane saved 2 goals on Thursday and someone like you will be posting in this thread soon how few goals he has conceded. Overall there’s hardly any stats I can see this season that tell me that as a pure goalkeeper (forget with the feet) he has been great this season


You know what greatness looks like. In 2017-2018 DDG saved 80% of the shots on target & his Psxg was +12.3 . This season he has saved 70% of the shots on target and Psxg is -1.1 . The first guy was playing at a level where you could probably ignore all other aspects of keeping but the second guy isn’t playing anywhere close to that level
Disagree. I think he's won us loads of points this season. That's the consensus amongst pundits too
 

Malone_Post

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I've already pointed out why these stats are bollox.
Because they don’t suit your agenda. Stats aren’t biased. They are facts.

They obviously can’t show absolutely everything but they can give a good idea of a players strengths/weaknesses & performances. And in this case they absolutely align with the eye test. De Gea’s shot stopping ability no longer outweighs the multiple weaknesses in his game.
 

Oranges038

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A ball playing goalkeeper (that some people believe is very important) ... how many additional goals would create per year?

I may be wrong, but I don't think that any goalkeeper in the PL creates that many goals that really makes a difference. Especially compared to the contribution of a world class striker. For example, I don't think that Haaland or Kane are going to score less if they don't have a ball playing goalkeeper behind them.

Then perhaps people believe that a ball playing goal keeper will save more goals? Perhaps because he is more "press resistant"? But then again this depends much more on the outfield players, not on the goalkeeper. No matter how "press resistant" the goalkeeper is, I don't think he will save us many goals because of his exquisite passes.

So, in my opinion, for a goalkeeper, it is nice to have this "ball playing" ability, but it is not very important at all.

Am I wrong?
Its not just about how many goals they create. It's more a question of team style and how the keeper like any other player suits that style. And how that impacts the team as a whole.

Harry Maguire doesn't suit it - Dropped

McT - doesn't suit it - Dropped

Ronaldo - doesn't suit it - Gone

DDG - doesn't suit it - ???? But looking like new 250k a week contract.

Look every keeper in the league has almost a 70% save ratio. A few are below it, DDG is middle of the road in that respect. He makes a few wonder saves, but overall he's pretty average at the one thing everyone keeps banging on about.

If you want to play a high press game, where ypu recycle and rotate possession through the keeper and want to create quick transitions higher up the pitch. You need a keeper who is a) good with the ball at his feet b) comfortable being away from goal and c) dominates the space on behind his defence to sweep and claim high balls. He's none of those things.

I've posted this often but Schmeichel explains it quite clearly here. Ben Foster is a great comparison to DDG in this respect.


 

Borys

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A ball playing goalkeeper (that some people believe is very important) ... how many additional goals would create per year?

I may be wrong, but I don't think that any goalkeeper in the PL creates that many goals that really makes a difference. Especially compared to the contribution of a world class striker. For example, I don't think that Haaland or Kane are going to score less if they don't have a ball playing goalkeeper behind them.

Then perhaps people believe that a ball playing goal keeper will save more goals? Perhaps because he is more "press resistant"? But then again this depends much more on the outfield players, not on the goalkeeper. No matter how "press resistant" the goalkeeper is, I don't think he will save us many goals because of his exquisite passes.

So, in my opinion, for a goalkeeper, it is nice to have this "ball playing" ability, but it is not very important at all.

Am I wrong?
Ball playing GK can help in both scenarios. In attack he will start a quick counter (that's why coming for crosses IS important). De Gea usually dwells on the ball until everyone takes their positions and the chance is gone.

Defending because it's easier to get ball into midfield and attack if your keeper can pass, and beat the first pressure wave. So if you watch ball-playing goalkeepers you will see how this works.

In most EPL games it's not a big deal, but at the top level it's a big difference.

Like already stated in this thread, football is changing, United is changing under Ten Hag and I'd welcome a modern keeper.

De Gea’s shot stopping ability no longer outweighs the multiple weaknesses in his game.
This. I understand this line of defence, but him being a top shot stopper is no longer the case.
 

sullydnl

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No, I'm saying he's the best keeper for Man United.

Say that other paragraph fast 5 times

The stats will say Ederson collects more crosses but won't cover that goal he let in on Wednesday trying to collect a cross. He should've stayed on his line and made the save.

Stats schmats
I've already pointed out why these stats are bollox.

Ederson collects 4 times more crosses at 9% (Wow by the way), but the stats won't talk about how he cost his team the win on Wednesday by getting under a cross rather than staying on his line.

Stats schmats
Except they will, as below:

 

Trequartistry

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Disagree. I think he's won us loads of points this season. That's the consensus amongst pundits too
The pundits point is a hilarious thing to say to back your point, pundits are generally known to be clueless and casuals about the sport. I’d rather trust the analysts, and my own eyes. Once you understand that many many goalkeepers can make the save De Gea makes, you’ll realise he’s not ‘saving’ us, he’s just there in goal. Stats back this up. Eye test back this ups (unless you’re obviously turned on by camera saves)

I really think this thread exposes the casuals of the sport - how anyone thinks 1) he ‘saves us’ 2) he isn’t a problem 3) he doesn’t need immediate replacing is BEYOND me
 

MikeKing

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The pundits point is a hilarious thing to say to back your point, pundits are generally known to be clueless and casuals about the sport. I’d rather trust the analysts, and my own eyes. Once you understand that many many goalkeepers can make the save De Gea makes, you’ll realise he’s not ‘saving’ us, he’s just there in goal. Stats back this up. Eye test back this ups (unless you’re obviously turned on by camera saves)

I really think this thread exposes the casuals of the sport - how anyone thinks 1) he ‘saves us’ 2) he isn’t a problem 3) he doesn’t need immediate replacing is BEYOND me
You fail the eye test if you haven't been a little bit turned around after seeing his saves lately. He is making it look easy, but it's not. Sometimes he get too much praise for basic saves, because the team play bad but these days all the credit goes to our outfield players despite him being an absolute wall when time calls for it.
 

CM

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Fair play to him for the save but his misplaced passes could've costed us game.
Again, it's a net zero.
I don't think I'd even be that generous. The save from Kounde was a decent one but it wasn't in the category of saves other goalkeepers couldn't make. The pass he made was entirely brainless and could've easily cost us the tie on another night.
 

Borys

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You fail the eye test if you haven't been a little bit turned around after seeing his saves lately. He is making it look easy, but it's not. Sometimes he get too much praise for basic saves, because the team play bad but these days all the credit goes to our outfield players despite him being an absolute wall when time calls for it.
I get the compete opposite impression. His saves look effective but when I look closely, usually it's a save that I would expect decent keeper to make.
That doesn't mean he's not a good shot stopper. He is GOOD but nothing more.

De Gea certainly likes to throw himself into the ground, watching other keepers I get the impression they catch more balls comfortably. I certainly don't think De Gea makes any save look "easy".

For example Kounde shot. The shot was to his left, and he somehow defended it with his right hand. It seems like he could comfortably defend it with left hand as well. It was a good save still.

The problem is you need to be an outstanding shotstopper if you have glaring weaknesses in many other areas of goalkeeping.
 

JB7

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Oooh, 9% of crosses. Imagine all the trophies we'll win.
I'm sure Dave would happily swap his trophy cabinet over the past 5 years with Ederson tbf.

A ball playing goalkeeper (that some people believe is very important) ... how many additional goals would create per year?

I may be wrong, but I don't think that any goalkeeper in the PL creates that many goals that really makes a difference. Especially compared to the contribution of a world class striker. For example, I don't think that Haaland or Kane are going to score less if they don't have a ball playing goalkeeper behind them.

Then perhaps people believe that a ball playing goal keeper will save more goals? Perhaps because he is more "press resistant"? But then again this depends much more on the outfield players, not on the goalkeeper. No matter how "press resistant" the goalkeeper is, I don't think he will save us many goals because of his exquisite passes.

So, in my opinion, for a goalkeeper, it is nice to have this "ball playing" ability, but it is not very important at all.

Am I wrong?
Yes I think you are because you're looking at it the wrong way. Nobodies looking at a ball playing goalkeeper as a creator of goals. Sure it happens now and again from the likes of Ederson (who in fairness is distribution above all else as a goalkeeper and not the way to go IMO) and Alisson when they hit longer balls forward; but that isn't what they are there to do. The purpose of a ball playing goalkeeper is to allow your defence to play higher up the pitch because you know the goalkeeper will sit in the space in behind the defenders and sweep balls over the top; this works three fold, a) when you're in possession offensively the defenders can play higher and compress the play with more players in a smaller space which benefits the clubs trained to play close compact football like City & Liverpool over the last few years, b) in transition where teams win the ball back and realise the higher line team are pressed high their only option is to hit a long ball in behind, goalkeeper picks up possession and team are back on the attack, c) when team are playing high and are being pressed by the opposing attackers, the goalkeeper becomes an option to pass to to relieve pressure and build again.

I think what you're getting at with the goals creation specifically is the quick distribution rather than ball playing, as it relates to quick throws or long kicks, which directly result in goals. De Gea's distribution has never been quick regardless of which coach he's worked under; whereas Schmeichel and Van der Sar for example were great proponents of moving the ball quickly when the opportunity presented itself and it made a different to our overall play but I wouldn't put that down to either of them being "ball playing goalkeepers" it was them reading the picture in front of them quickly. Some goalkeepers do and some don't, and it's very difficult to coach so not something I've ever held against De Gea.

For me having a progressive on ball goalkeeper is less important than most; my view tends to be as long as you're at a reasonable level with the ball at your feet you'll be good enough in most teams; see Courtois & Donnarumma for example (the issue with De Gea is that he's a level below them as well which becomes problematic). My gripes with De Gea are much more related to areas of goalkeeping that have been part of the game for 30 years or more at this point. You expect your goalkeeper to relieve pressure on the defenders, be that by catching crosses, sweeping behind the defenders so they don't have to run backwards into space unnecessarily thus turning their backs on the attackers, being an option for the backpass (heck the backpass rule was brought in because goalkeepers were making themselves an option to pass to to relieve pressure far too often!). We've never really had that with De Gea, he doesn't generally take the sting out of games as he doesn't deal with crosses and pushes balls out and allows sequences to play out that if he was more proactive he could easily have dealt with. Preventing opportunties which you refer to is far more down to a goalkeeper being proactive than their "ball playing" ability.

For Ten Hag it is clear playing from the back is very important to him, so it's pretty clear that while a top "ball playing" goalkeeper might not be a priority for you I'd be very surprised if it isn't for him.
 

Remember the geese

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I've seen so many posters make the same mistake in their defence of De Gea. For some reason there's a desire to make this a binary situation. 'Shot stopper vs hipster ball playing goalkeeper'. Nothing in between. It's as if they feel that the only slight issue with his game is that he isn't Ederson in possession. If only that was the case.
 
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I've seen so many posters make the same mistake in their defence of De Gea. For some reason there's a desire to make this a binary situation. 'Shot stopper vs hipster ball playing goalkeeper'. Nothing in between. It's as if they feel that the only slight issue with his game is that he isn't Ederson in possession. If only that was the case.
very succinct and well made point, will be ignored though because stats are satans work according to some. You are either a good honest shot-stopping keeper who boots it long or you are a pansy continental ball player who can’t stop a pea roller.
I’d hazard that most of us who want de Gea replaced to progress would not ideally want Ederson as a keeper either.
 

Sylar

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Our ddg replacement might end up 'worse of' but you don't worry about failure if you're trying to succeed in improvement

Said it time and time again, bravo and karius were worse than hart and mignolet. However that failure led to ederson and Allison

This whole mentality of 'be careful what you wish for' is a way to be left behind.

I like ddg and what he's done for us. But it's so weird that when people point out weaknesses the response is 'you have an agenda' or 'dont hate' etc.

Using an example, people made the same comments about Smalling (he defends, it's his job, what's the point of a ball player when they can't defend). It took some time but you see the difference having somebody like Martinez makes to us as a team.
 

Olecurls99

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The pundits point is a hilarious thing to say to back your point, pundits are generally known to be clueless and casuals about the sport. I’d rather trust the analysts, and my own eyes. Once you understand that many many goalkeepers can make the save De Gea makes, you’ll realise he’s not ‘saving’ us, he’s just there in goal. Stats back this up. Eye test back this ups (unless you’re obviously turned on by camera saves)

I really think this thread exposes the casuals of the sport - how anyone thinks 1) he ‘saves us’ 2) he isn’t a problem 3) he doesn’t need immediate replacing is BEYOND me
Yes, I am a casual of the sport. What are you? A professional fan? :lol:
 

Olecurls99

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Our ddg replacement might end up 'worse of' but you don't worry about failure if you're trying to succeed in improvement

Said it time and time again, bravo and karius were worse than hart and mignolet. However that failure led to ederson and Allison

This whole mentality of 'be careful what you wish for' is a way to be left behind.

I like ddg and what he's done for us. But it's so weird that when people point out weaknesses the response is 'you have an agenda' or 'dont hate' etc.

Using an example, people made the same comments about Smalling (he defends, it's his job, what's the point of a ball player when they can't defend). It took some time but you see the difference having somebody like Martinez makes to us as a team.
I think it's the fact that the same 6 or 7 people make the same points every 3 or 4 days that make us think there is an agenda.

I've heard it all 20 times from each of you.
 

Olecurls99

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I've seen so many posters make the same mistake in their defence of De Gea. For some reason there's a desire to make this a binary situation. 'Shot stopper vs hipster ball playing goalkeeper'. Nothing in between. It's as if they feel that the only slight issue with his game is that he isn't Ederson in possession. If only that was the case.
I'm just pointing out the grey areas in stat keeping.

They don't tell you everything.
 

Sylar

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I think it's the fact that the same 6 or 7 people make the same points every 3 or 4 days that make us think there is an agenda.

I've heard it all 20 times from each of you.
So if we got an agenda, we can say the same about you in the opposite direction.

You have the third most posts on this thread ...
 

Olecurls99

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So if we got an agenda, we can say the same about you in the opposite direction.

You have the third most posts on this thread ...
Yep my agenda is defending our legendary goalie from hypercriticism. Guilty
 

ThinkTank@Cafe

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Great analysis here. I recommend this channel.

ps. I love DDG. He is a proper club legend who has been with us through all these inglorious years.
 

MikeKing

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I get the compete opposite impression. His saves look effective but when I look closely, usually it's a save that I would expect decent keeper to make.
That doesn't mean he's not a good shot stopper. He is GOOD but nothing more.

De Gea certainly likes to throw himself into the ground, watching other keepers I get the impression they catch more balls comfortably. I certainly don't think De Gea makes any save look "easy".

For example Kounde shot. The shot was to his left, and he somehow defended it with his right hand. It seems like he could comfortably defend it with left hand as well. It was a good save still.

The problem is you need to be an outstanding shotstopper if you have glaring weaknesses in many other areas of goalkeeping.
I get what you mean, looking at some examples I do see your point but my point is based on also considering his initial positioning as the main thing that makes those saves look easy. Then he makes them look cool if he wants to. His positioning and reading of potential shots is great, he has control over shots he has no right to reach, much like someone like Neuer. He isn't perfect but hey I'm here to give him his dues right now because I can be too critical of him as well.
 

Sylar

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Yep my agenda is defending our legendary goalie from hypercriticism. Guilty
Which part is the hypercriticism though?

I'll be happy to debate you, but again, which part of any of my posts regarding ddg have been excessive?

I read a lot 'be careful what you wish for' but it really does seem like ddg defenders just can't stand any criticism of him and go the opposite way to make it out like he's making saves that no other keepers have the ability to do.

I don't understand putting a player above the club.
 
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