Javier Hernandez

[SecondFig]

As I see it usually only four strikers can see enough action in a season (cf. Yorke, Cole, Ole, Sheringham).

These two are certain to be part of the first team:

(1) Rooney

(2) Berbatov

Who do you think will fill the 3rd and 4th spots?

I cannot imagine that a player of Michael Owen's seniority will be loaned out. When healthy Owen probably will be on the bench for United. So (3) is Michael Owen.

That means that there is really only one opportunity for playing time with the likes of Hernandez, Wellbeck, Macheda and Diouf looking for a spot. None of these players would benefit from sitting in the Reserves for another season, so three of them should be loaned out for the sake of the club and the players.

Hernandez might seem to be the choice to stay because of his age, Phelan's comments, and his confidence coming off the World Cup, but both Wellbeck and Macheda have more experience of life at the club and in English football. How well will Hernandez adapt to the Premier League?

For me Wellbeck has looked a little lost in matches when he has started, but Macheda has always looked sharp. I think it is a difficult decision as to which player, Macheda or Hernandez should be loaned out. Personally I'd like to see both preferred over Michael Owen's declining form, but I don't think that would happen.

A good summary, though I suspect we'll see at least 5 strikers kept, due in no small part to Owen's injury record/advancing years. But that still leaves us needing to loan out at least 2 strikers, and I'd go for Welbeck and Diouf.

Hernandez should be given until at least January to see how he settles into the league/country/club and see if he hits the ground running or not. Also I think he needs to be assimilated into the squad if he's to really flourish. Macheda has (to me at least) seemed to develop well despite being limited to sub- appearances and reserve games. In comparison Welbeck seems to have plateaued a little, and could do with some regular first team football, Diouf slightly loses out to the sheer number of strikers, but also I think he needs more first team playing time to adjust to the English game.

 

[Rado_N]

If we loan him out then it will be because Fergie thinks that is what's best for his development. And if Fergie decides that then why on earth would you then be ''devastated'' that we loaned him out?

The transfer muppetry comes into play when you say ''keeping the same striking options as last season would be utterly ridiculous''.

You're saying daft things in order to justify to yourself and others your craving for new signings. That's how transfer muppetry works.

We have signed him, which kind of removes your transfer muppet angle. Herdandez is not a transfer muppet signing, in fact most of the regular muppets were likely readying the razor blades upon his signing.

Theres nothing wrong with being excited to see him in action for United, nor with saying you would be disappointed if he were loaned out.

 

[GCHQ]

We have signed him, which kind of removes your transfer muppet angle. Herdandez is not a transfer muppet signing, in fact most of the regular muppets were likely readying the razor blades upon his signing.

Theres nothing wrong with being excited to see him in action for United, nor with saying you would be disappointed if he were loaned out.

The regular muppets now appear to have done a complete u-turn on Hernandez because he scored two goals at the World Cup. They're now treating him as an ''exciting'' transfer so there is definitely a muppetry angle to it. If that ''exciting'' new signing gets loaned out and taken away from them then they'll be ''devastated'' apparently. Not disappointed. Devastated.

And like I said, the comment that it would be utterly ridiculous to keep the same striking options as last season is pure transfer muppetry.

 

[Don't Kill Bill]

We are stacked with young potential and weighed down with older players, in whom for various reasons, faith has dissipated.

That’s the problem and it needs a decision of epic SAF bloody mindedness to solve it. Watch them in training and pre-season pick which he thinks are the best options (name and signing fee no barrier). Let the rest go out on loan or wait their turn in the reserves for the CC chance to shine.

 

[Crustanoid]

Would this account for injuries? Because injuries for Owen and even Rooney are fairly common.

Which is why needing five strikers is a reasonable aim.

 

[SecondFig]

I have no idea what this is about, but he looks so sweet

 

[nimic]

The regular muppets now appear to have done a complete u-turn on Hernandez because he scored two goals at the World Cup. They're now treating him as an ''exciting'' transfer so there is definitely a muppetry angle to it. If that ''exciting'' new signing gets loaned out and taken away from them then they'll be ''devastated'' apparently. Not disappointed. Devastated.

Who are these people, then, who did this U-turn? Really, it's gotten to the point where the incessant complaining and denouncing of "transfer muppets" has become even more annoying than the actual transfer muppets themselves.

Personally, I'll be very disappointed if Hernandez is loaned out for the season. We know we can't rely on Berbatov alone if Rooney gets injured (which he very likely will, if we're honest).

 

[B Cantona]

He's never going out on loan, biggest load of nonsense this summer was that

GCHQ, why shouldn't supporters be more excited when the player they'd never heard of scores two goals for his international side at the World Cup? I'm certainly more hopeful of him now anyway

 

[Allforone]

If we loan him out then it will be because Fergie thinks that is what's best for his development. And if Fergie decides that then why on earth would you then be ''devastated'' that we loaned him out?

The transfer muppetry comes into play when you say ''keeping the same striking options as last season would be utterly ridiculous''.

You're saying daft things in order to justify to yourself and others your craving for new signings. That's how transfer muppetry works.

If i were you id stick to discussing the financial aspects of the club and avoid involving yourself in on field forum discussions such as this, your talking nothing but utter nonsense here.

What I was clearly saying is keeping the same striking options as last year after weve just spent 10 million on what looks to be a very promising youngster who could well add to that department then loaning him out would be ridiculous and something I and many others by the looks of things don’t want to see…..im saying id like to see said promising youngster given a go ahead of a 30 year old injury ravaged Michael Owen and a Berbatov who bless him just cant seem to settle with us and see how he does, he looks an exciting prospect so get him into the action early and see what hes made of, he going to have to get to grips with the English game at some point if hes to be a worthwhile addition so why delay that process for another year.

So yes i do believe it would be utterly ridiculous to loan out Hernandez after spending a pretty decent sum on him and considering what weve seen at the WC what looks to be a player who can certainly add something to the team and squad....how on earth that equates to transfer muppetry of any kind is beyond bizarre really, considering i doubt anyone would consider Javier Hernandez a transfer muppets dream in the first place, very odd.

I don’t believe last seasons striking options were good enough (they werent plain and simple), we were far to reliant on Rooney, this lad looks to have the talent to at least aid that department and who knows maybe with a bit of luck provide significant improvement, so yes it would be ridiculous to loan him out IF indeed weve no further plans to strengthen an area we looked lacking in depth in only a few months ago.

Transfer muppetry? No, wanting to see a promising youngster fergies obviously seen something in after a bright WC showing given a go early? yes.

 

[kouroux]

I hope he'll be given a proper chance to show his talent and I hope he'll take it.We need some new optimism when it comes to our strikers.Our previous strikers except Rooney never provided it on the long term.

 

[Crustanoid]

15 goals next season and I'll be more than happy

 

[Neutral]

15 goals next season and I'll be more than happy

That would be an amazing return, in his 1st season.

 

[Alex]

15 goals next season and I'll be more than happy

I'd be more than happy if he scored that many

 

[Number7]

He's got the pace to come off the bench and punish tired defences...that's what I'm expecting his role to be next season, at the minimum. Hopefully he's good enough to start.

 

[devilish]

The regular muppets now appear to have done a complete u-turn on Hernandez because he scored two goals at the World Cup. They're now treating him as an ''exciting'' transfer so there is definitely a muppetry angle to it. If that ''exciting'' new signing gets loaned out and taken away from them then they'll be ''devastated'' apparently. Not disappointed. Devastated.

And like I said, the comment that it would be utterly ridiculous to keep the same striking options as last season is pure transfer muppetry.

For a team that had been blessed with unknown strikers like the Dong Fangsou, Manucho, Forlan (he is a great player now but in the EPL he was cack) and Nevland you'll be surprised why certain fans where not really entertained with another unknown striker who may end up vanishing in the reserves just like Tosic did.

Lets face it, the only unknown talent we had made who had actually succeeded was Ole. Our last homegrown success (in the forward line) goes back to Mark Hughes. So considering that our alternative to Rooney as a lone striker (Berba) is as good in that role as bull's tits, then no wonder why certain fans where concerned that someone who had never played in Europe may not be enough to solve such weakness.

I've watched Hernandez play in all WC/friendly games and I liked what I saw. He is still raw but there are all the basis of a good striker. I only hope that he doesn't vanish in the reserves just like many others did. If he doesn't play then it will be pretty difficult for him to develop into the player we need.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

He's got the pace to come off the bench and punish tired defences...that's what I'm expecting his role to be next season, at the minimum. Hopefully he's good enough to start.

I'm hoping he's better than Berbatov was last season. In which case he should start.

 

[CasaStreets]

The regular muppets now appear to have done a complete u-turn on Hernandez because he scored two goals at the World Cup. They're now treating him as an ''exciting'' transfer so there is definitely a muppetry angle to it. If that ''exciting'' new signing gets loaned out and taken away from them then they'll be ''devastated'' apparently. Not disappointed. Devastated.

And like I said, the comment that it would be utterly ridiculous to keep the same striking options as last season is pure transfer muppetry.

I guess the big question is, who gives a shit?

If you want to start a thread on the definition of what a transfer muppet is or isn't, then go right ahead. However, to assert that you have some superior knowledge on how to determine or identify such people is 'utterly rediculous'.

As for Hernandez, hope he stays for a bit. Same with Macheda. If one or the other can dislodge Owen from the 3rd spot, I'd say things are headed in the right direction. It will be interesting to see who, if anyone, is loaned out. Seems like Welbeck is probably being ranked lower than Macheda, Hernandez, and Diouf - so he might do well with a year to get more first team appearances.

 

[Walrus]

Im all for the club signing promising young players - and Hernandez seems to be a good prospect indeed, but when we already had 3 young strikers looking to break into the first team, it did seem a bit strange.

Welbeck will surely go out on loan again (at this stage I cant see him forcing a way into the first team - he has moved too far down the pecking order). Then we have Macheda, Diouf and Hernandez - along with our 3 senior strikers. We wont sell Berbatov, but SAF might favour youth over Michael Owen - whom he could save in case Rooney or someone gets injured.
Even with that though, I wouldnt be surprised to see Macheda being loaned out. He seems to be at a stage where he would benefit from first team football, so ideally sending him to another EPL club to get some matchtime would help his development. Diouf and Hernandez are the new signings, and as such they are the ones I would expect SAF to be giving chances to - though if it were me, I would rate Macheda over Diouf based on first team performances.

 

[Raoul]

10 goals - anything more is a bonus.

 

[GCHQ]

If i were you id stick to discussing the financial aspects of the club and avoid involving yourself in on field forum discussions such as this, your talking nothing but utter nonsense here.

What I was clearly saying is keeping the same striking options as last year after weve just spent 10 million on what looks to be a very promising youngster who could well add to that department then loaning him out would be ridiculous and something I and many others by the looks of things don’t want to see…..im saying id like to see said promising youngster given a go ahead of a 30 year old injury ravaged Michael Owen and a Berbatov who bless him just cant seem to settle with us and see how he does, he looks an exciting prospect so get him into the action early and see what hes made of, he going to have to get to grips with the English game at some point if hes to be a worthwhile addition so why delay that process for another year.

So yes i do believe it would be utterly ridiculous to loan out Hernandez after spending a pretty decent sum on him and considering what weve seen at the WC what looks to be a player who can certainly add something to the team and squad....how on earth that equates to transfer muppetry of any kind is beyond bizarre really, considering i doubt anyone would consider Javier Hernandez a transfer muppets dream in the first place, very odd.

I don’t believe last seasons striking options were good enough (they werent plain and simple), we were far to reliant on Rooney, this lad looks to have the talent to at least aid that department and who knows maybe with a bit of luck provide significant improvement, so yes it would be ridiculous to loan him out IF indeed weve no further plans to strengthen an area we looked lacking in depth in only a few months ago.

Transfer muppetry? No, wanting to see a promising youngster fergies obviously seen something in after a bright WC showing given a go early? yes.

It was just over £6m according to Fergie. Not that the size of the transfer fee matters when it comes to deciding what's best for his development. If Fergie does decide that a loan spell is the best move for him then I would be perfectly happy with that. I could maybe understand some people being slightly disappointed, but devastated? Come on.

The Hernandez hype is ''utterly ridiculous'' quite frankly. He's a 22 year old who will have to adapt to a different culture and a far higher level of football in the Premier League. You don't just throw young players like that straight into the first team and see how they get on, especially when you have two experienced and proven PL strikers in Owen and Berbatov to call on. Those two players have been written off to an extraordinary extent by a number of people on here and a lot of that OTT criticism is related to them being desperate for new signings. We'll be extremely competitive next season with last season's striking options and I don't agree that we looked lacking in depth in that department last time around.

Yourself and others appear more concerned with seeing an ''exciting'' new player as opposed to what's actually best for the team and the player's development. That is outright muppetry I'm afraid. As it happens I think Hernandez will stay at the club next season but the most people should be expecting for his first six months at the club, barring an injury crisis, are substitute appearances and a few starts in low profile games.

 

[GCHQ]

15 goals next season and I'll be more than happy

''Build 'em up then knock 'em down'' when he doesn't live up to those absurd expectations.

 

[jveezy]

I expect him to get one goal.

And then another.

And then another.

Maybe some more after that.

In that order.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

GHCQ makes a fair point.

The redcafe u-turn on Hernandez is hilarious.

From a general consensus of "who the feck is he?" "oh noes, another value signing" to people suddenly claiming they'll be devastated if he goes out on loan, or expecting him to instantly displace regular first-teamers and score 10-15 goals in his first season in England.

Make your minds up, folks.

Personally, I've no idea where SAF sees him in the grand scheme of things. Just like I've no idea about his plans for Diouf, Welbeck and Macheda. I'd say two of them will get first-team squad places for next season but feck knows who. Can't say I'm bothered either. They're all decent young players. Happy for SAF to make a call on who is closest to the first team.

 

[BaldwinLegend]

''Build 'em up then knock 'em down'' when he doesn't live up to those absurd expectations.

Someone misspelled headquarters on your tagline...

 

[IhabX7]

GHCQ makes a fair point.

The redcafe u-turn on Hernandez is hilarious.

From a general consensus of "who the feck is he?" "oh noes, another value signing" to people suddenly claiming they'll be devastated if he goes out on loan, or expecting him to instantly displace regular first-teamers and score 10-15 goals in his first season in England.

Make your minds up, folks.

Personally, I've no idea where SAF sees him in the grand scheme of things. Just like I've no idea about his plans for Diouf, Welbeck and Macheda. I'd say two of them will get first-team squad places for next season but feck knows who. Can't say I'm bothered either. They're all decent young players. Happy for SAF to make a call on who is closest to the first team.

Spot on.

 

[FlawlessThaw]

Nothing wrong with getting excited about a player after watching him play. Obviously you will get some trepidation from people about a player they haven't seen play and they should have trusted Ferguson's judgement on the matter. But now having see Hernandez perform at the world's stage who can blame the tards for getting a bit excited. I'd rather that than the downbeat attitude majority of the forum seem to have towards Smalling who either gets ignored or is already seen as a bad signing.

He won't be replacing any guaranteed first teamers though as I can't see him getting in ahead of Rooney. But I suspect he will be on the bench ahead of the likes of Macheda and Diouf, sitting pretty waiting for Berba to flop.

 

[EspadaYdaga]

that goal against argentina was pretty special though

 

[Pogue Mahone]

that goal against argentina was pretty special though

Cracking goal. Manucho's goal in the ACN was better though.

 

[surf]

I read somewhere that he was measured as the fastest player at the world cup.

 

[EspadaYdaga]

Cracking goal. Manucho's goal in the ACN was better though.

i don't think i've seen that one

 

[BaldwinLegend]

GHCQ makes a fair point.

The redcafe u-turn on Hernandez is hilarious.

From a general consensus of "who the feck is he?" "oh noes, another value signing" to people suddenly claiming they'll be devastated if he goes out on loan, or expecting him to instantly displace regular first-teamers and score 10-15 goals in his first season in England.

Make your minds up, folks.

It was always going to be like that. No one had heard of him or seen him before the WC and now he has, as SAF predicted, a 'profile'.

If anyone can be bothered to watch this video you'll hear SAF explain why United were so happy United fans would get to see him in SA before the season began.

He also mentions nearly signing Pato for 14 million when he was 17 which was news to me...

 

[7even]

Hold on a second.

Why on earth should we buy a international striker and then loan him out? He proved himself domestic in Mexico and before the WC he scored several times for his national team and he scored twice in the WC.

He will get his chance right away, if his fit. I can't see why Fergie should hold him back. Berbatov is the one who have something to prove.

 

[B Cantona]

GHCQ makes a fair point.

The redcafe u-turn on Hernandez is hilarious.

From a general consensus of "who the feck is he?" "oh noes, another value signing" to people suddenly claiming they'll be devastated if he goes out on loan, or expecting him to instantly displace regular first-teamers and score 10-15 goals in his first season in England.

Make your minds up, folks.

Personally, I've no idea where SAF sees him in the grand scheme of things. Just like I've no idea about his plans for Diouf, Welbeck and Macheda. I'd say two of them will get first-team squad places for next season but feck knows who. Can't say I'm bothered either. They're all decent young players. Happy for SAF to make a call on who is closest to the first team.

Erm?

Is it that shocking? Who'd heard of Javier Hernandez before we signed him? Let alone seen him play

Yet we've all had the benefit of seeing him in action now, at the World Cup and during the pre tournament friendlies, and let's be honest, he looked the part, and scored twice, both goals absolute quality. It's still a big step up for him to come to United, but having shown he can mix it with the big boys at World Cup, it would make little to no sense farming him out somewhere

I think you and GHCQ are talking holier than thou crap to be brutally honest. The folk you're criticising have done nothing wrong, they've judged a player having seen him play. It's those who claimed he was brilliant having never seen him play but signed him on Football Manager you should save your ire for

 

[MJLD]

I'm looking forward to seeing Javier play. You can expect the u-turn with his exposure at the World Cup, plus the fact we might not sign anyone else. I won't be putting an expectation on him for goals though, but I'm excited by the prospect.

 

[BaldwinLegend]

He will get his chance right away, if his fit. I can't see why Fergie should hold him back.

Wenger always says that players arriving from the popular South American leagues, ie: Brazil or Argentina, need a season to adapt to the pace of English football. I don't know much about Mexican league football and can't remember the last player to come directly from their league to the PL but I'd suspect Hernandez will have to go through a similar process to that which players from Brazil and Argentina have to go through...

 

[CROmanc]

I read somewhere that he was measured as the fastest player at the world cup.

I read that somewhere as well.....I think it was 32 km/h, if I'm not mistaken...

 

[BaldwinLegend]

Erm?

Is it that shocking? Who'd heard of Javier Hernandez before we signed him? Let alone seen him play

Yet we've all had the benefit of seeing him in action now, at the World Cup and during the pre tournament friendlies, and let's be honest, he looked the part, and scored twice, both goals absolute quality.

I could swear I said all that 10 minutes ago?

 

[BaldwinLegend]

I read that somewhere as well.....I think it was 32 km/h, if I'm not mistaken...

19.2 mph I think. Matthew Upson apparently peaked at 2 mph - seriously!

 

[B Cantona]

Word for word?

I said pretty much the same thing yesterday if you take a look so I wouldn't get too accusing

 

[7even]

Wenger always says that players arriving from the popular South American leagues, ie: Brazil or Argentina, need a season to adapt to the pace of English football. I don't know much about Mexican league football and can't remember the last player to come directly from their league to the PL but I'd suspect Hernandez will have to go through a similar process to that which players from Brazil and Argentina have to go through...

He need time to adapt but that doesn't mean he don't get a chance. Maybe he take the opportunity when it comes and then never look back.