By virtue of playing so many more minutes than any of the other likely suspects maybe. For key passes per 90mins for players that have played more than 10 games this season, he's 5th behind Mata, Lingard, Pereira & Young. Not so impressive when looked at in that light.Most chances created for Manchester United this season was the stat on commentary today.
Not sure I can trust that by the way, but I disagree, Fred is a very good player.
Not really considering 3 of them play much more advanced than him and the other threw in 20 crosses per gameBy virtue of playing so many more minutes than any of the other likely suspects maybe. For key passes per 90mins for players that have played more than 10 games this season, he's 5th behind Mata, Lingard, Pereira & Young. Not so impressive when looked at in that light.
I think he's similar level to Herrera really. Good player but not a top one. Take away his running and you have a mediocre ball player at the top level.Not really considering 3 of them play much more advanced than him and the other threw in 20 crosses per game
I couldn't disagree more with you about Fred, I'm a CM myself, was only at conference level granted (and a cup game vs. Gothenburg once upon a time) but Fred is a class act in the position.
Take away Kante's running and you have a mediocre ball player at the top level. I disagree though, Fred's a much better ball player than you're willing to give him credit for, always available and makes excellent choices.I think he's similar level to Herrera really. Good player but not a top one. Take away his running and you have a mediocre ball player at the top level.
That was my point. 3 play more advanced (Fred, Pereira, Mata) and one throws in shit loads of crosses per game. Young is probably top of the pile at Inter too in recent games.Only Young made significantly more crosses per 90. He was on 1.3 crosses per 90, Mata on 0.6, Fred and Pereira on 0.4 each and Lingard on 0!
I agree that running is very important, especially in the modern game. But your original point was to discredit Herrera for his attitude and combative nature. Fred isn't a shit-house but shows great attitude by running so hard. It's tantamount to the same thing. They're dedicated and reliable.Take away Kante's running and you have a mediocre ball player at the top level. I disagree though, Fred's a much better ball player than you're willing to give him credit for, always available and makes excellent choices.
That was my point. 3 play more advanced (Fred, Pereira, Mata) and one throws in shit loads of crosses per game. Young is probably top of the pile at Inter too in recent games.
And I stand by the original point, Ander Herrera is overrated, much like Gabby Heinze due to his attitude. He was dropped by both LVG and Mourinho in favour of other players, for a reason.I agree that running is very important, especially in the modern game. But your original point was to discredit Herrera for his attitude and combative nature.
Herreras performances can be backed up by insane stats. When you win the ball back more times than Kante per 90 minutes, or the team having a significantly higher win percentage he was in it, not to mention winning player of the the year, it's a bit harsh to say it's only because of his attitude.Of course he has.
Herrera reminds me of Gabby Heinze, a decent player for us but overrated to feck because of his attitude.
And then by the end of the season had become an integral part of the side, for a reason.And I stand by the original point, Ander Herrera is overrated, much like Gabby Heinze due to his attitude. He was dropped by both LVG and Mourinho in favour of other players, for a reason.
Over his time at United? I'm interested to see those stats @ivaldo, very interested.Herreras performances can be backed up by insane stats. When you win the ball back more times than Kante per 90 minutes, or the team having a significantly higher win percentage he was in it, not to mention winning player of the the year, it's a bit harsh to say it's only because of his attitude.
They were brought up sporadically in his performance threads. Plenty of times in the season where Kante won player of the year though I can't be arsed to dig them out. Memory is a big hazy, but Kante shaded tackles won/lost, but everything else was significantly weighted towards Ander. And as I said, managers tried to replace him, realised what a big mistake that was, then ended up relying on him by season's end. Having him in the mix would have been a massive plus this season. My guess is we would be comfortably in the play off positions if he were. Would've loved to see him play with Fred and Bruno. The pressure would be relentless!Over his time at United? I'm interested to see those stats @ivaldo, very interested.
As for winning player of the year, that takes us nicely back to my original point today, here's another who won the Sir Matt Busby Player of The Year in 2005 and it was equally as ridiculous ....
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It's slightly annoying we lost him on a free but that's more on Woodward. Even in his late twenties he should command a reasonable fee.Great respect for Ander. He went to a big club, new challenge and a pay rise - it made sense for him. But he left with a lot of love for the fans and the club, leaving on good terms.
I think hes underrated. Not a highlight reel player and wont rack up the assists and goals, but he did the basics very well and kept the play ticking in midfieldOf course he has.
Herrera reminds me of Gabby Heinze, a decent player for us but overrated to feck because of his attitude.
Great post. Herrera is extremely under rated on here.People really do form random, rubbish opinions over football players these days. This guy just played in a CL final, and helped prevent Bayern from running over PSG in the first half. After he came off in the second half, Bayern dominated the midfield.
And yet some are calling him a "nothing" player.
He's not World Class, but he definitely has quality and character. He also seems to do very well on the big stages, which is a useful feature to have. This is also the guy who played alongside Pogba in his best run of form in our side. After he was injured, was when the wheels started to come off.
Some of you, remind me how many of the current United players have played well in a European Cup final that you decidedly choose to rep? In fact, remind me of how many of our players have done well in the latter stages of a knockout competition that you consider quality, and not call a nothing player?
Double standards and agendas everywhere.
It’s really, really annoying how bad we seem to be in securing good faith with our own players. If they decided they didn’t want to offer Herrera more than what they did then fine, but the way we go about this stuff always seems to be the wrong way.New article on Sky: https://www.skysports.com/football/...ted-didnt-show-me-the-love-after-third-season
Extracting the quotes:
"My intention was not to leave the club and I was happy there - as happy as I am now here"
"It was not a secret. I was negotiating for more than one year but I expected more from the board after my third season at the club when I was player of the year. They didn't come to me that summer, they didn't even call me. And that was very painful for me because I had a feeling that I was giving everything."
"In saying that I have a huge respect for Ed Woodward, a huge respect for the board. They have always treated me fantastically."
I know they want the best for Manchester United but in football, in life and in every company in the world sometimes you don't think the same way and I respect that. If I see Ed I will give him a hug. We just had different opinions about Manchester United and, in my opinion, what the club should have done.
"I want to make sure everyone understands there is nothing personal at all. That's life. But it's true - after the third season when I was player of the year, when I had the respect and the love from the fans, I didn't feel that love from the club."
Fixed.Still rather have him in the team than Matic, Fred or McTominay. Good player, hope he's terrible against us if he starts though If he doesnt he'll at least come off the bench I'm sure.
Wouldnt put it past him to get two quick yellows in succession on purpose so they go down to ten men
Perfect way to throw shade on the board, well done AnderNew article on Sky: https://www.skysports.com/football/...ted-didnt-show-me-the-love-after-third-season
Extracting the quotes:
"My intention was not to leave the club and I was happy there - as happy as I am now here"
"It was not a secret. I was negotiating for more than one year but I expected more from the board after my third season at the club when I was player of the year. They didn't come to me that summer, they didn't even call me. And that was very painful for me because I had a feeling that I was giving everything."
"In saying that I have a huge respect for Ed Woodward, a huge respect for the board. They have always treated me fantastically."
I know they want the best for Manchester United but in football, in life and in every company in the world sometimes you don't think the same way and I respect that. If I see Ed I will give him a hug. We just had different opinions about Manchester United and, in my opinion, what the club should have done.
"I want to make sure everyone understands there is nothing personal at all. That's life. But it's true - after the third season when I was player of the year, when I had the respect and the love from the fans, I didn't feel that love from the club."
Yeah good ladPerfect way to throw shade on the board, well done Ander
See I don't understand why a lot of people never understood Herrera's annoyance at this as he explains. He had a good/decent first season, a poor second season, and was excellent in the third year and beat Ibra to our POTY award. He sees people like Young, Rojo, and Phil fecking Jones get contract extensions for making nowhere near his contribution and yet he's not given a deal? I'd tell the club to get stuffed if that was me too.New article on Sky: https://www.skysports.com/football/...ted-didnt-show-me-the-love-after-third-season
Extracting the quotes:
"My intention was not to leave the club and I was happy there - as happy as I am now here"
"It was not a secret. I was negotiating for more than one year but I expected more from the board after my third season at the club when I was player of the year. They didn't come to me that summer, they didn't even call me. And that was very painful for me because I had a feeling that I was giving everything."
"In saying that I have a huge respect for Ed Woodward, a huge respect for the board. They have always treated me fantastically."
I know they want the best for Manchester United but in football, in life and in every company in the world sometimes you don't think the same way and I respect that. If I see Ed I will give him a hug. We just had different opinions about Manchester United and, in my opinion, what the club should have done.
"I want to make sure everyone understands there is nothing personal at all. That's life. But it's true - after the third season when I was player of the year, when I had the respect and the love from the fans, I didn't feel that love from the club."
QftSee I don't understand why a lot of people never understood Herrera's annoyance at this as he explains. He had a good/decent first season, a poor second season, and was excellent in the third year and beat Ibra to our POTY award. He sees people like Young, Rojo, and Phil fecking Jones get contract extensions for making nowhere near his contribution and yet he's not given a deal? I'd tell the club to get stuffed if that was me too.
Never a world class player but a damn sight better than a lot of the dross that have kept their places in this squad for years on end.
Annoying as he’d be an amazing No 6 with Bruno and Donny/Pogba in front of him right nowSee I don't understand why a lot of people never understood Herrera's annoyance at this as he explains. He had a good/decent first season, a poor second season, and was excellent in the third year and beat Ibra to our POTY award. He sees people like Young, Rojo, and Phil fecking Jones get contract extensions for making nowhere near his contribution and yet he's not given a deal? I'd tell the club to get stuffed if that was me too.
Never a world class player but a damn sight better than a lot of the dross that have kept their places in this squad for years on end.
Like you said in the Fernandes thread, his leadership qualities were very valuable and it's fortunate we picked Fernandes when we did up otherwise we'd be leaderless on the pitch, it's no coincidence Pogba always looked at his best next to Herrera. I feel we need to we get another player like him to fill Matic's role.Still rather have him in the team than Matic, Fred or McTominay. Good player, hope he's terrible against us if he starts though If he doesnt he'll at least come off the bench I'm sure.
Wouldnt put it past him to score an important goal either
I was thinking of the same thing. Our players bar Bruno (and once upon a time, Herrera) know nothing about the dark arts and are extremely gullible - expect a lot of playacting, rolling around, exaggerated contact, referee hounding and wind-ups from PSG while they try to win fouls in our half. Bruno will have Herrera dovetailing his shadow all night as cherry on top.He'll do a Hazard on Bruno tonight and be his fecking shadow. Exaggerate every foul and try to get him booked early.
yeah he’s going to follow him around all game. Hopefully Bruno can pull him around the pitch and the rest of our players can exploit the space.He's going to do a number on Bruno tonight isn't he?
The epitome of a big game player. Yes he wasn't world class but his mentality certainly was. I was gutted to see him leave, truly. Thanks Woodward!
Park never asked for 250k on his twilight years.Letting him go signifies everything that is wrong with post fergie Manchester United. Fergie simply kept players like Park around even though he could've been upgraded because a player is a lot more than the set of attributes. A
like Phil Neville?Letting him go signifies everything that is wrong with post fergie Manchester United. Fergie simply kept players like Park around even though he could've been upgraded because a player is a lot more than the set of attributes. A
I'd say 250k now is not that far off what Park was on. Also, the way transfer fees have gone up gives players with contract running out a lot more leverage when signing that extension. For example Park when he was 29 wouldn't be worth more than 10 million whereas Herrera is easily worth 30 million IMO. So, giving him 250k a week for 3 years only comes down to 39 million which is equivalent to the fee we paid to sign Matic.Park never asked for 250k on his twilight years.