We are a strange, strange fanbase at times.
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 46
- Clean sheets
- 12
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 6
Would that be because the same people who are writing a player after a handful of games, also think players like Fred should have been kept?
What a strange complaint. At least he isn’t hiding like a lot of our players have done in the past.
When was the last time (after Fergie's time) that any of our players has so honestly and fully accepted responsibility?
I don't know if he can be a star goal-keeper for us (I still hope he can) but as a personality - he is proper mensch.
I don't know if he can be a star goal-keeper for us (I still hope he can) but as a personality - he is proper mensch.
De Gea at the start of last season, after the loss to Brentford. Asked to do the post-match interview and said:
I think it's always more likely to be a goalkeeper who fronts up like that due to the nature of the mistakes they tend to make.
I've been reading that me made a lot of great saves in the second half . Did he ? Or where those just saves any keeper would have made ? A couple of which he spilled
I don't know, I'm asking
I don't know, I'm asking
According to his stats,
13 shots on target in games so far (not including Bayern) 10 conceded
Those aren't the stats, they're some nonsense a twitter account posted. He's made 20 saves - https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/saves
Those are great stats. They show that he is just about three times better than Eddison 20 saves v 7 saves.
Proving we've got a great goalkeeper and City don't.
I really get this, I want a job as a data analyst for a Premier League club. I feel that I'm good at it
Hardly fair to compare with our players who have been here, and failed, for many years.
Thanks, I didn't remember that, but makes sense. De Gea was a stand-up guy, for sure. Always loved him.
I am not sure why only goalkeepers are expected to be that straight, though. Certain CB has scored some decisive own goals - how is that any less decisive than bad save?
This is the first time I have seen Onana's interview, fully admitting that he made a mistake and that he felt the game was lost because of it.
Even though it was a poor goalkeeing error, I have built more respect for the guy than I have for a United player since Ferg. He has taken on the #1 position* who was someone we have seen been part of the furniture for over a decade, 4 times United player of the season (which is crazy when you think about it) yet has the humility to come out and say when he has done wrong.
I wasn't a fan of De Gea leaving and Onana coming in to switch from "goalkeeping" to progressive play, because I felt the squad wasn't there to enforce the City/Liverpool style to do so. What I Do like in a mental capacity, is that Onana will shoulder it and will learn from mistakes. Time will tell if it's just to cover his back, but a few of the big names in our team can learn a thing or two about fronting the mistakes they made
Even though it was a poor goalkeeing error, I have built more respect for the guy than I have for a United player since Ferg. He has taken on the #1 position* who was someone we have seen been part of the furniture for over a decade, 4 times United player of the season (which is crazy when you think about it) yet has the humility to come out and say when he has done wrong.
I wasn't a fan of De Gea leaving and Onana coming in to switch from "goalkeeping" to progressive play, because I felt the squad wasn't there to enforce the City/Liverpool style to do so. What I Do like in a mental capacity, is that Onana will shoulder it and will learn from mistakes. Time will tell if it's just to cover his back, but a few of the big names in our team can learn a thing or two about fronting the mistakes they made
Is January to early to get rid?
I remember De Gea's start. He later turned out to be pretty damn great for us and saved us in several seasons. Give Onana time. He will come good for us.
He made one mistake. Not making a save that a prime DDG or Allison might have made isnt a mistake.
I think a goalkeeper of his standard would expect to have saved the third against Brighton in fairness. I'd be very surprised if Onana himself doesn't consider that to be a mistake. But he'll be fine, not worried about him at all.
Until Onana has 5 consecutive shite seasons he's an upgrade on De Gea.
It's not - but is it fair for United fans to expect their goalkeeper to make those saves? Knowning what a prime De Gea could do...
That's what I'm wrestling with - it probably is very unfair, as prime De Gea is the best pure shot-stopper I've ever seen I think... yet I can't help it.
I'm talking about the two mistakes he made in pre season,
Yes they were pre season so realistically matter little, but errors nonetheless, which go forward to painting a bigger picture.
The shot Vs Bayern was a howler, no hiding from that.
I said this on the "Onana is not very good thread" but it's worth reiterating that six matches is not a large enough sample size to draw any proper conclusions. I don't even think Onana has been as bad as some are making out. He's been below par but some people are acting like he's chucking the ball in the net every week; I think Sane's goal against Bayern was the first real howler we've seen from him.
Regardless, another important consideration is that one of the key reasons we signed Onana, that being his exceptional ability on the ball and general passing range, just cannot be properly showcased with the team in its present state. I think we have seen some signs of Onana's strong technical qualities but it really doesn't count for shite when so many of the other players are technically and/or mentally not at the level they need to be at, because any quality passes from Onana will just go to waste.
I don't agree with those who think we should've just stuck it out with De Gea until the team is ready for a better ball-playing goalkeeper, though. For starters, I don't actually think we'd be any better off right now with De Gea in net - if the choice were between Onana and peak De Gea I might reconsider. I also don't think that "Oh well, we're too crap to be bothering with a ball-playing keeper" is conducive to progress.
I think we're just going to have to be a little patient with Onana.
Regardless, another important consideration is that one of the key reasons we signed Onana, that being his exceptional ability on the ball and general passing range, just cannot be properly showcased with the team in its present state. I think we have seen some signs of Onana's strong technical qualities but it really doesn't count for shite when so many of the other players are technically and/or mentally not at the level they need to be at, because any quality passes from Onana will just go to waste.
I don't agree with those who think we should've just stuck it out with De Gea until the team is ready for a better ball-playing goalkeeper, though. For starters, I don't actually think we'd be any better off right now with De Gea in net - if the choice were between Onana and peak De Gea I might reconsider. I also don't think that "Oh well, we're too crap to be bothering with a ball-playing keeper" is conducive to progress.
I think we're just going to have to be a little patient with Onana.
It's incredibly unfair given that a "prime De Gea" hasn't existed for more than 5 years at this stage.
Not sure why that makes it unfair? He did exist at one point, and we got rid of De Gea in-part because he was no longer that... don't think it's unreasonable to want that sort of level again, its whether thats realistic or not thats the question.
Well because you yourself said that in your view, De Gea was the best pure shot-stopper you've ever seen - which even as a pretty major critic of De Gea I will say is not an outrageous claim as during his peak period his shot stopping levels were genuinely outstanding. I don't know exactly how old you are but I'd put you around my age or probably a little older (I'm 32) so I'm saying you've likely been around to have seen Schmeichel and Van Der Sar up close and also other world class goalkeepers in the Premier League such as Petr Cech, Alisson, David Seaman and others from around the world. So being the best pure shot-stopper you've seen over 20-25 years plus is quite the praise.
As such I'd say it's unfair to expect every following goalkeeper to make saves that the best you've ever seen to do it to do. I agree that's not unreasonable to want that sort of level again, I just think it's unfair to expect what you would consider to be GOAT level shot stopping from the replacement, particularly when the reason we moved that goalkeeper on was because of other areas of his game being poor as well as his shot stopping levels tailing off over a long period. That's all, not trying to dig you out over it.
De Gea didn't settle in right away with us, he made mistakes and got criticisms from everyone at the time. Difference though was he was 21, which is young for a keeeper. Onana is 27, he just played in a champions league final. He may well come good yet, and we hope he does, but comparisons with De Gea aren't apples to apples due to age and experience.
Eh it's just an adjustment on how you view goalkeepers. Ederson isn't the best shot stopper, but he's still a quality goalkeeper and key for Guardiola. You gotta look at the overall picture with them. Shot stopping is just one aspect of goalkeeping. Onana IMO will prove to be above average in that aspect, maybe not elite but I genuinely don't think that aspect makes a huge difference over a season. A lot of goals are just unsaveable in general and I'd say it was just that 3rd Brighton goal and the Sane goals which I'd think could/should be saved. But De Gea was well below average in every single other aspect of goalkeeping. He was a non entity in claiming crosses, which Onana has already shown to be far better. His passing out from the back was shit, which Onana is possibly the best around with. Once de Gea stopped being arguably the best shot stopper ever, then his overall game became exposed and he turned into a completely mediocre goalkeeper on the whole.
im hearing he is injured.... this true?
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Yeah that's well put and makes total sense - it does feel totally unreasonable, (yet I can't help it)!
Calling Onana bad is laughable. He didn't have a great start, but nor did the rest of the team.
The worst thing for a GK is knowing you can't trust your own defenders.
Having defenders you trust means you can get an idea in advance over what kind of shots you are going to get.
When trust isn't there and the defence is that bad, any GK's performance is going to suffer since they got nothing to base themselves on in terms of expectations.
Any shot can become a bigger suprise than it'd normally be.
That's the real issue. Any goalkeeper would underperform with your defence .... so if you are bashing on Onana to find your easy scapegoat it's best you look to your defence instead
The worst thing for a GK is knowing you can't trust your own defenders.
Having defenders you trust means you can get an idea in advance over what kind of shots you are going to get.
When trust isn't there and the defence is that bad, any GK's performance is going to suffer since they got nothing to base themselves on in terms of expectations.
Any shot can become a bigger suprise than it'd normally be.
That's the real issue. Any goalkeeper would underperform with your defence .... so if you are bashing on Onana to find your easy scapegoat it's best you look to your defence instead
Issue is not Onana, he is just a symptom of a leaky defense wich has ben ongoing for a few seasons. He doesn't have super elite shot stopping to mask our poor defending or compensate chances given at the rate we do. People bashing De Gea but he saved so many shots consistently even in his state of decline and most people don’t bother cecking the fact he had to face close to double the ammount of shots other top team goalies face year after year and still maintained a 70%+ saverate year after year.
Defense let Onana face too many shots same as De Gea had to do, and Onana isn't as elite in that aspect like his predecessor. He faced 88 shots with Inter all matches played (24?) and in 5 matches with us he faced 29 shots on target so far. A League winning side relents no more than 75-90 shots an entire season. We let him face a third of that in 5!! Matches.
If thats the way we defend Onana will be horrible for us, but that's not exactly his fault. You can't jam a square peg into a round hole. Poor guy is more and more glued to the line, probably due to feeling insecure with our defense.
The vultures are circling and his performances will be scrutinised more than any other player. People will have amnesia about how poor DDG was, and post videos of him making amazing saves from 3 seasons ago.
I thought that he had a lot of mistakes in him before he came but he is here now and Erik wants him to implement the style he wants to play so lets give the guy a chance FFS!
While I was a fan of Big Dave he was on a shitload of money and it looks like he wanted a similar amount to stay and he was making clangers as well so it is time to move on.
While I was a fan of Big Dave he was on a shitload of money and it looks like he wanted a similar amount to stay and he was making clangers as well so it is time to move on.
You have an unhealthy obsession with De Gea.
It's worth remembering as well our defence keeps changing week in, week out so far this season. We no doubt bought Onana for years ahead rather than to get us results in the first few weeks.
I am confident he will come good as long as the players in front of him are doing their jobs too.
I am confident he will come good as long as the players in front of him are doing their jobs too.
Clearly you havent read my post properly.
Nothing new, it's made of glass. It's only on paper we have AWB/Varane/Licha/Shaw together.
Huge oversight to not get a top class CB in to secure it. And the new goalkeeper is paying the price.
I fully agree with you.
From what I have seen from his time at Inter, Onana's shot stopping is good, but it is not super elite. He has great distribution and, even more than that, a winner's mentality. It was a joy having him in the goal, and the sense of tranquillity he'd give to the defence was immense. Inter defence was a bit better than United's though.
And, on another note .... Onana struggled with Inter too, at the beginning. A good portion of fans wanted him gone at first. As he played more games with us, he got confident and was one of our most important players, and we'd take him back in a heartbeat now. Give him time and buy a couple good defenders at the next market window. You're going to love him, he is just getting adjusted (like he did with Inter)
Burnley 0:1 Man Utd
Looked much more reassured today. Caught everything.
Just feels a bit shaky, technique of catching and saving feels off.
Happy for him to get another clean sheet.