Appointing Solskjaer was a mistake

[Amadaeus]

Ah yes, big Edwin who’s never been a DoF a day in his life should become our new DoF.

What makes the current Ajax side great is that they’ve been basically building for this for ten years, on literally every level.

Ten Hag deserves some credit for sure, but he’s not a better coach than someone like Peter Bosz or 10 other typical Eredivisie managers. He’s just lucky to be there when they’ve managed to assemble a squad with truly great individual quality, which they did step by step.

Everything about Ole so far suggests he’s good and intelligent enough to lead Manchester United. What he needs is a great structure behind him with great scours, and owners who are willing to spend every bit as much if not more as our domestic and European rivals, every season.

Edwin Van Der Sar is the chief executive at Ajax, I assumed he may be able to take on the DoF role and fix the structural defects at our club. He has done a great job at Ajax so far and he knows the clubs. A partnership with Erik Ten Hag, could help ease the transition of their understanding of what the club is about. A read a good article recently about how Edwin Van Der Sar would be a fantastic addition to United.

Spoiler

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.te...armark-edwin-van-der-sar-architect-clubs/amp/

Ole has made a lot tactical mistakes recently. He could have a great structure behind him, but at the end of the day, Ole is the manager and the blame for any tactical decision he makes on the pitch falls mostly on him. Recently we have seen him make unreasonable alterations to the team and has shown that he is struggling to motivate the players to return to the performance they had during the honeymoon period. These faults lies mostly on Ole and not having a bad structure behind him.

 

[anant]

You do realise that we haven't scored from open play in 4 games? feck xG, I couldn't give a shit about it.

Alright, in that case he has higher ppg than Mou did last season

 

[11101]

It will take a lot before I want Solskjaer out. He has made a lot of mistakes this last few weeks but he is not the problem.

Our problem is we're hunting for another Ferguson, but Ferguson was a dinosaur. That style of management finished 20 years ago in every other club in the world. No manager can do what he did and if he were 45 years old again and coming into the modern game even he couldn't do it.

We should be appointing a proper management structure and simply hiring a coach to run the team. Until we figure that out we're going to keep lurching from side to side until we fade into obscurity.

 

[Steerpike]

Ed should bite the bullet and sack him now in order to save him the trouble of doing so in November. 6 defeats in 8 is unprecedented in it's awfulness. It's becoming increasingly clear that he hasn't got a clue how to turn the tide. United need a new manager and staff with a clear vision how to play progressive football.

A few months later and it's like Mourinho never left:

Still faffing about with the defense (is he really the man to shore up this defense?)
Still playing the same formation
Still willing to give the deadwood more chances
Still shunting Rashford to the wing
Still putting Matic straight back into the team
Still calling out the players in the press
Still talking about the past
Still negative

At least Mourinho would have had them fired up to come back from a losing position once in a while.

Burnley? PSG?

Ole has identified the key problem, and that is the team doesn't work hard enough. In the games immediately after his appointment, the team worked harder and got their rewards. Unfortunately the squad is still some way behind our rivals in terms of fitness, and the extra effort has taken its toll in terms of injuries and, lately, a succession of tired performances.

The question Ole needs to ask about every player is whether they are prepared to put the effort in to improve their fitness levels (hence his comments regarding pre-season), and whether, even if they were fitter, they would be prepared to match and outperform their opponents for effort. The evidence is that it is the teams that work hard that achieve success. Ole believes that too, and has said so on many occasions. It's not Ole that needs to go, it's the players who can't or won't buy into that philosophy.

 

[Aloysius's Back 3]

I want Ole to do well here -

But no matter how bad the players are - the staring 11 should be showing a tactical team understanding.

It's not the results that bother me - it's the complete lack of team ethic in the squad to play a certain way & to me that comes with tactics.

I have seen some of the best managers in the PL struggle whilst building their squad - but you could see their tactics and players that were not good enough to continue with those tactics.

Why then does every 14 players we use in a game look unable to play a tactically balanced game - for me that's because of Ole.

He came here and said the players were allowed to play to their freedom & that is becoming more and more clear that this is all that they are doing.

I've got nothing against Ole & I hope he proves people like me wrong - but it just don't seem to be because United even on a bad day should be in control of the matches we play even if we lose them.

 

[r3idy]

Also those clubs have a proper structure, Guardiola transcends from the influence that Cryuff had with Barcelona so he know the ethos of the club to integrate a system.

Zidane is a mogul in the football world, he's also more productive because he has managerial pedigree, just because your a good footballer doesn't mean you adopt a position in management that's why it seldom happens.

We cannot use the example of Ole playing in our most successful periods as a reason why he will be successful here. If that's the case then give the job to Giggs / Neville / Ferdinand but football doesn't work like that.

The Glazer's should have made a logical decision vs an emotive one, we complained about Jose getting the job despite winning virtually everything but recommend Ole on the basis of him coaching for around 90 days.

Fans and media are just as responsible crying that he should be given a permanent role, I have always ascertained that Poch was the better long term prospect because he's proven everything we question at the club, can he be successful, can he build a squad, can he work in cohesion with a hierarchical structure with a DOF the answers are yes.

We give Ole 300 million, I cannot see us making any progress to the extent of reaching the top .

But we don't have a director of football and we look as close to appointing one as Ireland do to getting a man on Mars.

Football by it's nature nowadays is short term. Around January we are all saying Ole is the man to do the job. The team pressing with conviction and aggression, Matic, Pogba and Herrera operating in tandem. The team look great on the break and Ole is giving a few tactical masterclasses. Pochetino was a choker when it mattered. Now we have gone full circle. Sorry no not buying it.

To suggest we sack him now when its still the same players who were pretty much all 7/10's 8/10s six weeks ago and are now 4/10's is madness. Thats not on Ole that goes right to the big door in the execs room. Recruitment and retention of players is absolutely **** poor at this club.

If you are saying that a DoF is the Panacea for our future success then at least give Ole the chance to work under said DoF. A man who understands the club and some of the expectations of playing for the club.

 

[SirAF]

I think Ole will step down at the end of the season if results don’t improve and a decent replacement can be found. Seems to me like someone who would have the clubs best interests at heart.

No way, this is his dream job and a once in a lifetime chance for him.

 

[Macern]

Ed should bite the bullet and sack him now in order to save him the trouble of doing so in November. 6 defeats in 8 is unprecedented in it's awfulness. It's becoming increasingly clear that he hasn't got a clue how to turn the tide. United need a new manager and staff with a clear vision how to play progressive football.

A few months later and it's like Mourinho never left:

Still faffing about with the defense (is he really the man to shore up this defense?)
Still playing the same formation
Still willing to give the deadwood more chances
Still shunting Rashford to the wing
Still putting Matic straight back into the team
Still calling out the players in the press
Still talking about the past
Still negative

At least Mourinho would have had them fired up to come back from a losing position once in a while.

Is this a joke? As if the players would’ve been consistently very good under someone like Pochettino. The problem is in the players, not the manager. It’s evident by the fact that they have had the same types of consistency and mentality issues under several different managers. Pathetic thread if you ask me.

 

[Gambit]

Appointing Solskjaer was the greatest thing we've done recently, the truth has fully exposed itself now and I'm fully behind him to create something new that reflects the old.

 

[TheGame]

Not even had a transfer window and people want him gone. People talk about the state of the club is embarrassing, i would say the same for some of the fans..

Exactly, it’s a joke! We are competing for a top 4 place because of him. Our form at the beginning of the season let us know and has cost us.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

It’s becoming clear that we'll end up having to sack Solskjaer sooner or later, so do we just cut out losses and get rid at the end of the season and almost forget the permanent appointment never happened? The pay off would be small in the scheme of things. Then go all out for Poch.

I know the Board probably wouldn’t swallow their pride but in hindsight this will probably prove to be a good move.

 

[BigRon1985]

If he gets Top 4 he deserves the job simple as that. Hang on!

 

[Member 90887]

This truly is a disgraceful thread. As disgraceful as the performance today. Ole didn't even get a transfer window and the armchair expert here are bashing him already...

Instead of spouting this BS. Support the manager and turn your anger/disappointment towards the people that deserves it : the players and the board.

Armchair experts...

 

[Sandikan]

Compare that to a club like Barca, who according to those Deloitte lists had a similar 2017/2018 revenue to us...

They’re very dominant in the league, comfortably a top 5 team in Europe and still making one big transfer after the other to prevent stagnation. Already signed up de Jong, in pole position for De Ligt. Casually dropped 250 million on two players who aren’t even world class with Dembele and Coutinho.

We finish second and make it to the FA Cup final as well, so of course we buy a teenage fullback and a midfielder from Shaktar and that’s it for a whole season folks

We're funded in totally different ways, and we have a huge amount more competition in this country. Just for two differences.
Plus we haven't had an all time top 3 in history player come through the ranks and not want to move!

 

[Smores]

I think he is somewhat right about this, not completely obviously. These players havent run or worked hard in the last 6 years/ since they've joined United and dont have the fitness levels required to play the United way over a 38 game season. Once he does a pre season to get those fitness levels to the required standards, I'd say atleast some of them will come good

United way? We've been playing exactly the same football as under Jose.

 

[Rightnr]

It wasn't wrong at the time if we had a DoF who could have pointed to him as a source of stability for next season. As it happened, it just gave our lazy players a reprieve and the dross can now comfortably know they're staying for another season.

 

[Gambit]

It’s becoming clear that we'll end up having to sack Solskjaer sooner or later, so do we just cut out losses and get rid at the end of the season and almost forget the permanent appointment never happened? The pay off would be small in the scheme of things. Then go all out for Poch.

I know the Board probably wouldn’t swallow their pride but in hindsight this will probably prove to be a good move.

Hmmmmm, go forth and multiply, not heard this much bullshit for a while

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Reading this makes it feel like we're in 2013 and just appointed Moyes. Give him time, they said. Let him build his squad, they said. Our club shouldn't be a training ground for a manager.

 

[izec]

It’s becoming clear that we'll end up having to sack Solskjaer sooner or later, so do we just cut out losses and get rid at the end of the season and almost forget the permanent appointment never happened? The pay off would be small in the scheme of things. Then go all out for Poch.

I know the Board probably wouldn’t swallow their pride but in hindsight this will probably prove to be a good move.

Doubt he would come. So we sack Ole and appoint another manager we arent really sure of? Not sure about that. We will give Ole the summer and then we will see what the outcome is. Probably likelier that he will get sacked by December than turning the ship around, but he will get his chance i guess.

 

[Bojan11]

People who blame Ole must understand, Ole was literally the only one who was willing to take over this "Manchester big mess in the hell United".

And how do you know he was the only one? Did the board tell you this?

 

[Grylte]

Trying to pronounce his name the way you spelt it in the headline

 

[anant]

This truly is a disgraceful thread. As disgraceful as the performance today. Ole didn't even get a transfer window and the armchair expert here are bashing him already...

Instead of spouting this BS. Support the manager and turn your anger/disappointment towards the people that deserves it : the players and the board.

Armchair experts...

What's more shocking is that people want him sacked because we might miss out on top 4! We were 11 points, I think behind top 4 positions when he came in, we are 2 behind them right now, we have the 3rd best record in the league since he came in, 2 behind Pool and 1 behind City (who have played a game less), beat PSG in CL, something no one expected, reached FA Cup QF by beating Arsenal and Chelsea way! The expectations that a lot of our fans have is just unreasonable!

 

[OohAahMartial]

Good thread this.

Shows me which posters I need to put on ignore.

 

[Patrick220571]

I wonder if Ole will actually be able to sell the players he wants to? Especially those that are Woodward's commercial/social media darlings.

 

[TheGame]

Reading this makes it feel like we're in 2013 and just appointed Moyes. Give him time, they said. Let him build his squad, they said. Our club shouldn't be a training ground for a manager.

Some of the players on thousands of pounds play like they are on the training ground.

 

[gerdm07]

I think Ole will step down at the end of the season if results don’t improve and a decent replacement can be found. Seems to me like someone who would have the clubs best interests at heart.

What?

 

[Macern]

Trying to pronounce his name the way you spelt it in the headline

That’s a proper tongue twister.

I hope he’s drunk, if not it’s just embarrassing.

 

[cedara]

Without a DoF, appointing anyone will be a mistake. Everyone knows that we need a DoF, but why Ed don't know that? Or he doesn't wanna know that, does he?

 

[Macern]

I think Ole will step down at the end of the season if results don’t improve and a decent replacement can be found. Seems to me like someone who would have the clubs best interests at heart.

Step down? You have to be joking. Why would he step down? You think it’s his fault that United lost 4-0 today? Second best team in the league since he came in (at least before todays game), but he should step down yeah?

 

[Henrik Larsson]

Edwin Van Der Sar is the chief executive at Ajax, I assumed he may be able to take on the DoF role and fix the structural defects at our club. He has done a great job at Ajax so far and he knows the clubs. A partnership with Erik Ten Hag, could help ease the transition of their understanding of what the club is about. A read a good article recently about how Edwin Van Der Sar would be a fantastic addition to United.

Spoiler

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.te...armark-edwin-van-der-sar-architect-clubs/amp/

Ole has made a lot tactical mistakes recently. He could have a great structure behind him, but at the end of the day, Ole is the manager and the blame for any tactical decision he makes on the pitch falls mostly on him. Recently we have seen him make unreasonable alterations to the team and has shown that he is struggling to motivate the players to return to the performance they had during the honeymoon period. These faults lies mostly on Ole and not having a bad structure behind him.

It’s not a good article imo, and while Edwin being the mastermind behind Ajax makes for a good image, the reality is that he’s merely one of the many factors responsible for the current succes of Ajax. Rather have him than Woodward though, but that’s another discussion.

Talking about tactical mistakes... You know Ten Hag got trashed 6-2 at Feyenoord a couple of months ago right? Lost 0-3 away at PSV twice, last year and then again this season... Lost to AZ Alkmaar just a month ago, and while being the favourites Ajax might not even actually win the league this year. I’m not exaggerating when I say that someone like Schteve McClaren would probably be more likely to succeed at United than Erik ten Hag

 

[anant]

United way? We've been playing exactly the same football as under Jose.

Uhm,no! OGS is clearly trying for fancy quick 1 touch football, pass and move to open a space for our attackers and then Martial/Rashy to use their pace to finish off the chance- something we did pretty well in those 15 minutes vs Watford. The problem here, is that we need good technical and agile players for it to function and we dont have that.

 

[Sparky_Hughes]

This squad is rotten to the core, arrogant underachieving spineless pussies in every position and there isn't a manager in the world that can turn them around. Every last one of them needs to go, followed by the banker wanker at the top.

 

[Grylte]

That’s a proper tongue twister.

I hope he’s drunk, if not it’s just embarrassing.

To be fair, this thread (and forum) is quite embarrassing already

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Of course the main problem is we lack quality in the squad, but feck some people here claming as if was only that, Ole is crearly fecking it up. We may not have a squad to challenge for the title but for sure we should be playing way better.

What is Ole implementing? What is he working on? We play everygame in attack as if we are improvising, really we have no defined style other than purely counterattack. If I was seeing bad results but a style like Pep or Klopp being implemented and failing I would completely agree on handing him new players to match his system. But we don’t even show a system or tactics, What is he trying to implement? It’s been 4-5 months now, we should be watching his style by now for sure.

Really people may argue that this players have failed under plenty different managers, but feck I don’t think Ole is the man to take us forward.

Exactly, we see defined style of play with Pep, Poch and Klopp. Above all, they play great attacking football albeit to a lesser extend with Poch.

I'm at a point where I don't care about the result. First and foremost, I want to see us play attacking football again. This is absolute minimum for the club.

 

[remo]

A new manager won't fix anything. The problems at the club run deeper than at the manager level. Ed is the one who needs to be sacked.

I 100% agree here. Problems start from top. Too many incompetent people at the top. Why is that City can bring former director of football Begiristain and we are good enough with former banker making important football decisions. Look at our salary structure - it's all over the place.

 

[Cardozo]

It’s not Ole.

Even if you think our tactics aren’t right we’re losing due to shit decisions by individuals generally. Even watching it I can see passes they’re not making fast enough. On football manager you might choose low tempo but on a football field these boys should be able to string a bloody pass together.

Looking forward to next season. Peoples expectations have got too high due to the good start.

Poch didn’t have a clue what to do against city in the second leg. Very lucky boy.

 

[RG 11]

Ole's appointment was as knee jerk as it could get but don't we can't definitely say that it's a bad appointment. He has shown enough to be given a couple of transfer windows and really carry out his vision.

He clearly has a vision for how we should play and showed a lot of tactical acument in the first 15 games or so. He's hamstrung by lack of personnel really as well as an extremely fragile mentality in the players he has inherited. I mean we play with a left winger who's not really a winger. Not an ounce of quality on the entire right side. Passengers in the team like Matic and Lingard. I still maintain it's a miracle that he got us so close.

I'd rather Woodward got his thumb out of his arse and appointed a director of football (not phelan) who will work with Ole cohesively and also overhaul the abysmal scouting structure we have. I don't remember us getting many underhyped players since the days of Evra, vidic, Carrick who've gone on to exceed expectations. That is abysmal for such a big club.

 

[He'sRaldo]

How do you explain that? The same squad is capable of beating the best but can't beat Everton?

It's not the same players. A few have gone, replaced by dross of course, and they're all a year older. Which is problematic in a few positions, our fullbacks for one.

 

[Aloysius's Back 3]

@SAFMUTD

Bingo.

I couldn't care less about losing but we are going in to games with no tactical understanding or background. I don't see how new players are suddenly going to change this just because they run more.

We look lost on the pitch against some really bad teams. The players don't look like they know what they are doing & so whilst I blame the players - I feel there is a lack of understanding of what to do.

 

[Mcking]

1. 81 points
2. Dave was in Godly form, we should have conceded 14 goals more than we did as per xG stats
3. OGS has 38 points from 17 games- which translates to 85 points in a 38 game season

It was once 100+ points in a 38 game season. We've lost 3 of the last five games though, and it is dropping drastically. We could be losing our whole remaining games the way we've been playing in weeks. Exactly the reason why you shouldn't give someone such a top job based on few 10s of good results especially with plently of underwhelming performances.