I don't think we're quite there either. We, Liverpool, still have a couple of years before our main players need replacing. City need rebuilding before us with the likes of Aguero, Fernandinho getting up there.Not quite yet. City will drop when Pep leaves, not a doubt about that but they're also aging more so I can see them dropping sooner. Liverpool have a couple more years of being the top club IMO before Klopp leaves in line with the team needing a rebuild. Lines up with us as I think we'll start peaking in a couple of years.
I don't think what you're saying is that different to what we had, every year there would be the debate from journalists that "When Ronaldo leaves they are finished", "this is Sir Alex's last season", "Giggs and Scholes are retiring" etc. You can apply the same arguments to Salah, Klopp and your older players. We did fall off but not because of the reasons the journalists said.You had Ferguson though... As long as we have Klopp we will be there or thereabouts to compete for the title, but let's say he leaves and our squad isn't heavily invested in at that point (so all our top players would be around 30 or older), then we have to be very cautious not to regress to the 2010-2014 mean, or fall of a cliff like Arsenal have.
Of course this is still a long way off right now but I'd like to see us invest while we're on top (and able to attrack top tier players) rather than rest on our laurels and be happy with what we're doing right now. The behavior of our owners, e.g. not even bidding for Werner, unfortunately suggests the latter.
If Klopp would stay with us for 26 years I'd confidently say that we'd be challengers more often than not. He's however bound to leave around 2022-ish, and once that happens and the quality of our team isn't all that, we'll go through something similar like Utd has when SAF left - unless maybe we replace him with someone like Simeone or Pep himself.I don't think what you're saying is that different to what we had, every year there would be the debate from journalists that "When Ronaldo leaves they are finished", "this is Sir Alex's last season", "Giggs and Scholes are retiring" etc. You can apply the same arguments to Salah, Klopp and your older players.
Arguably the most important part of your side is your wingbacks and they have many, many years to go. I think replacing the rest of the players won't be as hard whenever you get to that point.
Think the difference is our recruitment fell of a cliff and Woodward was given the reigns, the signs are that yours is very strong and you've been identifying holes in your squad. Arguably that's even more important than the manager as anyone can take over a good team like Barca, Madrid, Bayern - regularly changed managers.If Klopp would stay with us for 26 years I'd confidently say that we'd be challengers more often than not. He's however bound to leave around 2022-ish, and once that happens and the quality of our team isn't all that, we'll go through something similar like Utd has when SAF left - unless maybe we replace him with someone like Simeone or Pep himself.
City don't falter after scoring 198 points in two seasons (this season is a mini falter but we're saying they won't falter again right?) And Liverpool don't falter after potentially scoring 200+ points in two seasons!!!Who knows?
Maybe the OPs fairly plausible reasoning is correct in that their squads get older, the heights they achieve become more difficult to emulate, the players may want to move onto better challenges, the personnel aren’t as hungry as they were and then they begin falter.
Maybe it coincides with the rise of a new team who can hang in there with them in the league table. It could be Chelsea, Spurs or Man Utd... maybe it’s more than one team.
Maybe Liverpool and City don’t really falter... and they get overtaken by a team or even teams who are just better.
I whole-heartedly endorse this message and wish to subscribe to your news letter.Liverpool are cnuts. Does anything else matter? Why bother analysing rats?
Тhis is hands down one of the funniest things I've ever read in a post on redcafe.However, those Liverpool players are all explosive high energy attackers. If history shows us anyhing, those types of players tend to have a rapid decline unless they're able to mould their game around certain assetts.
The issue for Liverpool is that Firmino's game revolves around explosivness and he is a key cog in their front line attack. He doesn't have the genuine technical ability to evolve his game beyond what he currently is. Replacing him is not going to be easy and it may involve bringing in a player that doesn't necessarily work with their overrall balance.
Further, I forsee other teams coming in for Mane or Salah in the next year or so as Liverpool will try to cash in before they hit their decline.
Really, this season falls in line with Klopps two or three oustanding seasons at Dortmund before it turned to shit.
Im actually quite curious about City's first post Pep season (i wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be next).Guardiola might leave in the summer so that'd impact City negatively. I don't think they'll find another manager who can get 90+ points like Pep can in such a dominating way. I've also noticed the same thing about the age of certain players within their squad.
This is true. We had Giggs play for us well into his 30's and was brilliant. I feel the players who really look after their body can play on e.g. Ronaldo, Giggs, Zlatan and players have to adapt their game to suit.I think age is only important for certain players. For example, if you are a wingback who bombs up and down all game every game, then as you age the speed and fitness Decline naturally - we saw that with usain bolt.
same applies for any player whos game is built mainly around pace.
if your game was never built on that, you can play to a high level well into your 30’s
Exactly!Gosh. You write as if Liverpool have been in the top-two of the Premier League for a long, long time - like four, five years!
Liverpool finished 8th in 2015-16 when Leicester won the title.
They barely scraped past fifth-placed Arsenal in 2016-17 when Chelsea won the title.
They again finished fourth in 2017-18 when City won the title.
They have been good for one full season (2018/19) and in another asterisked season (2019/20). That's it.
People should stop talking them up as a team that has been in the top-two of the Premier League for ages.
I like this postLiverpool are cnuts. Does anything else matter? Why bother analysing rats?
Yes, great first reply to read, not going to bother looking at the rest of the thread. Perfectly put.Gosh. You write as if Liverpool have been in the top-two of the Premier League for a long, long time - like four, five years!
Liverpool finished 8th in 2015-16 when Leicester won the title.
They barely scraped past fifth-placed Arsenal in 2016-17 when Chelsea won the title.
They again finished fourth in 2017-18 when City won the title.
They have been good for one full season (2018/19) and in another asterisked season (2019/20). That's it.
People should stop talking them up as a team that has been in the top-two of the Premier League for ages.
1 title is far too much though. This season feel like taking ages and does too.Exactly!
THE END OF AN ERA.. of 1 title and 1 second placed finish.
It's this simple really. If Pep and Klopp hang around, we can forget it for the foreseeable future.A player is 29 and some people act like he's months from retirement. More than anything City / Pool's future wins depend on how long their current managers stay there (plus money, of course). Klopp has contract until '24, Pep until '21 but doesn't sound like he's against extending so I'd think he'll agree to stay until '22 or '23.
ThisI hate it when people club Pool with City. They've been relevant at the top for 1.5 years for feck sakes.
I thought the same Liverpool's team has a few years left in yet. Far too early for this thread.Why you lumping the 28 year olds under the old players for Liverpool but putting them under in their primes for us?
Chelsea's young players are pretty much playing all in the same positions, so a bunch of them would probably end up on the bench or leave the club.
Thats the worst possible description of Firmino. He's basically the reverse of thatHowever, those Liverpool players are all explosive high energy attackers. If history shows us anyhing, those types of players tend to have a rapid decline unless they're able to mould their game around certain assetts.
The issue for Liverpool is that Firmino's game revolves around explosivness and he is a key cog in their front line attack. He doesn't have the genuine technical ability to evolve his game beyond what he currently is. Replacing him is not going to be easy and it may involve bringing in a player that doesn't necessarily work with their overrall balance.
Further, I forsee other teams coming in for Mane or Salah in the next year or so as Liverpool will try to cash in before they hit their decline.
Really, this season falls in line with Klopps two or three oustanding seasons at Dortmund before it turned to shit.
It’s staggering, isn’t it?Thats the worst possible description of Firmino. He's basically the reverse of that