Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

[CassiusClaymore]

Thought this article had a few decent zingers in it...

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ountry-the-answer-is-too-awful-to-contemplate

“You ain’t no Margaret Thatcher,” leered Leigh in, what was for him, one of his more intelligent contributions to parliamentary life. Even his colleagues appeared embarrassed by that. All but Jenkin, who was hellbent on seeing how high he could raise the stupidity bar. Having earlier in the day declared that business was far too interested in making money, he now suggested that the way to reconcile just-in-time production with longer border checks was to make sure that lorries set out from the EU several days earlier than they currently did. That way it wouldn’t matter if they got held up. If he wasn’t already an MP, Jenkin would be hard pushed to get a job.

wtf

What Davis hadn’t banked on was his own intellect. Or lack of it. In making a pitch for wisdom, he unwittingly proved exactly why he had always been so unsuited to being in office. Not so much gravitas, as levitas. The best way to increase world trade was to trash our trade with the EU. We needed lorries to be stacked up outside Dover. Hard borders? No problem. Best of all, we were bound to get a great trade deal because as the other EU countries couldn’t speak English they wouldn’t be able to understand when we were negotiating in English. Really.

He was heard in near silence by MPs on both sides of the house. Under the circumstances it was the kindest response. Davis is now a stranger not just to government but also to intelligent life.

You've got to laugh otherwise you'd just cry...

Is it just me or does anyone else flick between this thread and the Trump one and actually feel completely and utterly drained and depressed at the state of the world at the moment?

 

[Massive Spanner]

Is it just me or does anyone else flick between this thread and the Trump one and actually feel completely and utterly drained and depressed at the state of the world at the moment?

It's not just you.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Thought this article had a few decent zingers in it...

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ountry-the-answer-is-too-awful-to-contemplate



wtf



You've got to laugh otherwise you'd just cry...

Is it just me or does anyone else flick between this thread and the Trump one and actually feel completely and utterly drained and depressed at the state of the world at the moment?

Not just you. I don’t know if it’s because we’ve more insight and coverage of politicians feckery than we ever did before, or whether this current bunch really are the most catastrophically corrupt/inept ever but we certainly seem to scraping some sort of barrel on both sides of the pond.

 

[711]

So Vote Leave spent £7.5m instead of £7.0m and got fined £61,000 because none of them could be arsed making excuses for it. I think meh is the modern response, isn't it?

Oh no, I take that back, Veterans for Britain reported a donation inaccurately and were fined £250. I just hope the police go in hard on those bastards, if treating democracy this way isn't how Nazi Germany started I don't know what is.

 

[Fully Fledged]

Lesser of 2 evils is such a no brainer. Blows my mind the way Trump got into power because so many Americans were too stubborn/stupid to follow this basic principle.

I totally agree

 

[Massive Spanner]

Not just you. I don’t know if it’s because we’ve more insight and coverage of politicians feckery than we ever did before, or whether this current bunch really are the most catastrophically corrupt/inept ever but we certainly seem to scraping some sort of barrel on both sides of the pond.

I would say it's a lot to do with social media (mainly twitter) and the ease with which we can access their lunacy on a daily, almost hourly basis, now, too. Being able to follow basically every piece of utter horror that unfolds throughout the day, every day, makes it so much worse.

 

[Abizzz]

Thought this article had a few decent zingers in it...

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ountry-the-answer-is-too-awful-to-contemplate



wtf



You've got to laugh otherwise you'd just cry...

Is it just me or does anyone else flick between this thread and the Trump one and actually feel completely and utterly drained and depressed at the state of the world at the moment?

Yeah it's very depressing. The really scary thing about all of this is that the negative consequences are still to come (although i'm still somewhat hopeful that the worst will be avoided for brexit).

 

[Drifter]

Trump got to her , plus the talk of Ukip members reforming.

 

[Green_Red]

Yep but theres a lot of grief to be had before that. Personally I am concerned for my US born wife and son,
both have Irish passports but we all live in the North. Im waiting to see if this will be affected.

The common travel area between Ireland and the UK wont be affected will it?

 

[CassiusClaymore]

Trump got to her , plus the talk of Ukip members reforming.

Well Trump's 'people' have been meeting with the ERG behind her back, so yes, in effect.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-european-research-group-brexit-a8425616.html

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yeah it's very depressing. The really scary thing about all of this is that the negative consequences are still to come (although i'm still somewhat hopeful that the worst will be avoided for brexit).

Something else that is scary is the way they glibly talk about the need to take a very long term view. “We need to do what will be best for Britain in 30 years time”. I mean, that’s all well and good but the rest of us would like the next 10 years to be fairly high on their list of fecking priorities!

 

[unchanged_lineup]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

It could fit in the Trump thread too, but I think it describes May better.

 

[Kentonio]

Something else that is scary is the way they glibly talk about the need to take a very long term view. “We need to do what will be best for Britain in 30 years time”. I mean, that’s all well and good but the rest of us would like the next 10 years to be fairly high on their list of fecking priorities!

They don't give a shit. The economy could collapse tomorrow and they'll probably make money rather than lose it. They seem to have forgotten though what happens when you cost tens or even hundreds of thousands of people their jobs. If they manage to force through this farce of a Brexit, we're going to see rioting.

 

[Oldyella]

Is it just me or does anyone else flick between this thread and the Trump one and actually feel completely and utterly drained and depressed at the state of the world at the moment?

Nope, not just you. Hard to see light at the end of the tunnel atm

 

[C3Pique]

I'm 33, in the middle of trying to buy a house and with a Mrs who wants to start a family next year. 30 years from now means shit to me compared to the next 5. The sad thing is no-one in Parliament represents me. Telling me that everything will be fine by the time I'm retired doesn't wash if I have to try and support a family in poverty.

I'm extremely depressed and anxious right now.

 

[JPRouve]

Something else that is scary is the way they glibly talk about the need to take a very long term view. “We need to do what will be best for Britain in 30 years time”. I mean, that’s all well and good but the rest of us would like the next 10 years to be fairly high on their list of fecking priorities!

They don't care about long term, they only care about their own short term ambitions, the long term talks are just an easy way to kick pressing issues to the side. On a tangent, what bothers me the most is how archaic politic is, we live in a world that has specialized itself since the early 1900s, professionals understand that they don't have all the competences and perspectives but for some reason we are still following political models where a handful of people have a say on incredibly diverse subjects. Brexit is the perfect example of that, the same group of people have to understand regional diplomacy, global economy policies and philosophy, regional security, local and international logistic and many other subjects.

 

[MoskvaRed]

Something else that is scary is the way they glibly talk about the need to take a very long term view. “We need to do what will be best for Britain in 30 years time”. I mean, that’s all well and good but the rest of us would like the next 10 years to be fairly high on their list of fecking priorities!

It’s a sure sign that there are no tangible benefits to Brexit when people who can barely think outside the 5 year electoral cycle start invoking the sunny uplands of 2050.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It’s a sure sign that there are no tangible benefits to Brexit when people who can barely think outside the 5 year electoral cycle start invoking the sunny uplands of 2050.

Reminds me of a study on AI where all the experts consulted predicted the next major breakthrough in approximately 20 years time. Turns out that a similar group of experts had made the exact same prediction 10 years previously. A 20 year horizon is apparently the sweet spot for research funding. Any further out and it’s pie in the sky, any sooner and they might actually have to start delivering on their predictions before their tenure finishes.

Same shit with Brexit. They only make promises on timelines that they know they can never be held accountable for.

 

[afrocentricity]

Reminds me of a study on AI where all the experts consulted predicted the next major breakthrough in approximately 20 years time. Turns out that a similar group of experts had made the exact same prediction 10 years previously. A 20 year horizon is apparently the sweet spot for research funding. Any further out and it’s pie in the sky, any sooner and they might actually have to start delivering on their predictions before their tenure finishes.

Same shit with Brexit. They only make promises on timelines that they know they can never be held accountable for.

Good point.

 

[unchanged_lineup]

Reminds me of a study on AI where all the experts consulted predicted the next major breakthrough in approximately 20 years time. Turns out that a similar group of experts had made the exact same prediction 10 years previously. A 20 year horizon is apparently the sweet spot for research funding. Any further out and it’s pie in the sky, any sooner and they might actually have to start delivering on their predictions before their tenure finishes.

Same shit with Brexit. They only make promises on timelines that they know they can never be held accountable for.

If I remember correctly, professional futurologists usually refuse to predict further than 10 years ahead because it's illogical to.

 

[Ramshock]

The common travel area between Ireland and the UK wont be affected will it?

Its all up in the air

 

[Ramshock]

It would give me enormous pleasure to punch that man repeatedly. On your point about what the DUP think - they simply do not believe there will ever be a united Ireland, they have said as much so I don't think they are giving it a second thought. They believe that if NI deviates in any way from the rest of the UK in BREXIT terms that this will weaken the union. Of course they are more than happy for NI to not follow the rest of the UK on social matters that they believe in such as equal marriage, etc. It's infuriating.

It will hit us in the pocket hard first

 

[Sassy Colin]

https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0717/979174-eu_japan/

But..but.. I thought the UK were the ones who were going to sign all these big trade deals when they left?

This is it though, what makes us think we can negotiate better trade deals on our own than the huge European trading block?

 

[do.ob]

Trump got to her , plus the talk of Ukip members reforming.

When you're relying on Trump to bail you out with a post-Brexit trade deal it's only natural that you suck up to him

 

[SteveJ]

Adam Wagner, lawyer:

'Here’s the ridiculous part. The result of the Brexit Referendum - unlike general elections, local elections or even local council referendums - isn’t subject to the the Election Court. So even though Vote Leave broke the rules, the result probably can’t be challenged.'

 

[JPRouve]

Adam Wagner, lawyer:

'Here’s the ridiculous part. The result of the Brexit Referendum - unlike general elections, local elections or even local council referendums - isn’t subject to the the Election Court. So even though Vote Leave broke the rules, the result probably can’t be challenged.'

Here's the ridiculous part, it was an advisory referendum, you don't have to challenge the result.

 

[SteveJ]

Senior Tory calls for referendum to be re-run in the light of evidence of Vote Leave's 'cheating'

Sarah Wollaston, a Conservative who chairs the Commons health committee and the Commons liaison committee, says the Electoral Commission report reveals deliberate “cheating”. She says Dominic Cummings, the Vote Leave campaign director, said the help his campaign got from AggregateIQ made all the difference. But Cummings now refuses to give evidence to a Commons committee, despite claiming that Brexitwas all about restoring the authority of parliament. And she says the referendum should be re-run.

We cannot have confidence that this referendum was secure. It should be re-run.

 

[Drifter]

When you're relying on Trump to bail you out with a post-Brexit trade deal it's only natural that you suck up to him

Knowing Trump it will probably be no more than crumbs.

 

[C3Pique]

The 80%+ of Tory MPs who don't back Hard Brexit should withdraw their support of the Government. It's clear that May is being controlled by the ERG and they are all complicit.

 

[GloryHunter07]

Fecking Cable and Farron. Useless.

Tories must laughing their arses off.

 

[balaks]

The common travel area between Ireland and the UK wont be affected will it?

Nobody knows - if they are stopping movement over the border then that needs monitored - so you would imagine that this will mean people moving over the border in either direction will need to be verified in some way

 

[MadMike]

The 80%+ of Tory MPs who don't back Hard Brexit should withdraw their support of the Government. It's clear that May is being controlled by the ERG and they are all complicit.

I think the only thing May is controlled by, is her desire to keep her job. She will yield to anyone who is threatening to rock the boat hard enough that it topples her and her government. Her own party have made a mockery of her "strong and stable" mantra as they've undermined her at every turn and now she's barely clinging on with hardly any authority left.

She's as good as gone. Her decision to call a snap election and then effectively not campaign is coming back to haunt her. She thought she would have a strong majority but she's in a coalition that can be toppled by a mere 3 resignations. She is a puppet without strings, pushed whichever way the wind blows harder.

 

[balaks]

I think the only thing May is controlled by, is her desire to keep her job. She will yield to anyone who is threatening to rock the boat hard enough that it topples her and her government. Her own party have made a mockery of her "strong and stable" mantra as they've undermined her at every turn and now she's barely clinging on with hardly any authority left.

She's as good as gone. Her decision to call a snap election and then effectively not campaign is coming back to haunt her. She thought she would have a strong majority but she's in a coalition that can be toppled by a mere 3 resignations. She is a puppet without strings, pushed whichever way the wind blows harder.

You are 100% right - another thing that appears to have been overlooked in all this is that she actually failed to get a mandate for a hard brexit as she was hammered in the snap election and now is dependant on DUP as a result so actually the fact is that a hard brexit is undemocratic. Not that the guys behind this give one toss about this.

 

[balaks]

This is it though, what makes us think we can negotiate better trade deals on our own than the huge European trading block?

I think the plan was to boost our trade in all the countries outside of the EU - the commonwealth, USA, China, etc. They would need to get a sensational deal from those countries because they are going to get a terrible one from the EU

 

[Oscie]

Who replaces her though?

She's a weak leader with a divided party who doesn't have a clue what she's doing on Brexit and is hoping circumstance somehow conspires to mean she doesn't have to make any decision. That is exactly what Corbyn would be if in charge. That is exactly what a Tory remainer would be if in charge. That's exactly what a Tory Brexiteer would be if in charge.

She's doing a horrible job but there isn't a realistic replacement who wouldn't do an equally bad one, if not worse.

 

[711]

I think the only thing May is controlled by, is her desire to keep her job. She will yield to anyone who is threatening to rock the boat hard enough that it topples her and her government. Her own party have made a mockery of her "strong and stable" mantra as they've undermined her at every turn and now she's barely clinging on with hardly any authority left.

She's as good as gone. Her decision to call a snap election and then effectively not campaign is coming back to haunt her. She thought she would have a strong majority but she's in a coalition that can be toppled by a mere 3 resignations. She is a puppet without strings, pushed whichever way the wind blows harder.

If she does have any principles I have no idea what they are.

Who replaces her though?

She's a weak leader with a divided party who doesn't have a clue what she's doing on Brexit and is hoping circumstance somehow conspires to mean she doesn't have to make any decision. That is exactly what Corbyn would be if in charge. That is exactly what a Tory remainer would be if in charge. That's exactly what a Tory Brexiteer would be if in charge.

She's doing a horrible job but there isn't a realistic replacement who wouldn't do an equally bad one, if not worse.

And the worst of this is that if it goes on long enough the public will eventually react by going for a loudmouth but cocksure bigoted 'strong man/woman' Trumpesque figure. Frightening.

 

[Oscie]

If she does have any principles I have no idea what they are.

And the worst of this is that if it goes on long enough the public will eventually react by going for a loudmouth but cocksure bigoted 'strong man/woman' Trumpesque figure. Frightening.

Honestly what I think the public are crying out for is a political leader of the left who actually has an interest in opposing the govt over Brexit. And by opposing I mean lead the charge against them, go heavy in the media and in Parliament attacking them. Be the voice for the tens of millions of people who think this is a complete fecking mess. Which, I'm afraid, is different to having to have your arm twisted by your own MPs on a number of occasions to even vote against the government and show no real interest in making the argument outside Parliament except for when Piers Morgan invites you on with Danny Dyer to have a chat about the footie on a show where ironically Danny Dyer himself summed up the anger of your supporters on this issue more succinctly than you have for 2 years.


But that's just me.

 

[MadMike]

Who replaces her though?

She's a weak leader with a divided party who doesn't have a clue what she's doing on Brexit and is hoping circumstance somehow conspires to mean she doesn't have to make any decision. That is exactly what Corbyn would be if in charge. That is exactly what a Tory remainer would be if in charge. That's exactly what a Tory Brexiteer would be if in charge.

She's doing a horrible job but there isn't a realistic replacement who wouldn't do an equally bad one, if not worse.

The state May is in, she can't do her job because the #1 requirement for a prime minister is to have authority among his/her own party. You can't do the job of a PM if you're teetering.

What you're describing there is a "if I was in your shoes" scenario. I'm not sure anyone would make a better job of it now, because whoever's in her shoes is also without any authority.

If May falls, there'll be a party leadership election. Which is very likely to lead to a general election because ERG won't sit behind an EU-friendly PM and there's no chance moderate or pro-EU Tories will sit behind BoJo or JRM.

This will force the parties to re-ascertain their main policy regarding Brexit. Do you back it, yes or no? Do you prefer no Brexit over hard Brexit? A new election could re-shape things. A new PM will be as strong as the majority he or she brings.

If she does have any principles I have no idea what they are.

I've not seen any strong convictions from her on anything.

And the worst of this is that if it goes on long enough the public will eventually react by going for a loudmouth but cocksure bigoted 'strong man/woman' Trumpesque figure. Frightening.

Maybe, but then maybe that person will be defeated in general elections? I can't imagine JRM being popular outside of a very nationalistic faction of the Tory party.

The irony is that the middle-ground, swing voter equally dislikes a Jezza as a JRM. If New Labour were still around, they would have probably sent this Tory government packing.

 

[Oscie]

There is no reconciliation to be had, the job of the PM at the moment is just getting to the end of each day. Brexit has paralysed this country for 2 years. It's absolutely outrageous.

 

[Adisa]

Ladies and gentlemen, members of the cabinet of her Majesty's government are going to be investigated by the police and there's not even a hint about talk of resignations.