Regarding the two penalty incidents, both were clear pens for me. However, VAR has an issue giving pens in these scenarios. I've seen very few actually given but a lot of replays shown a few minutes after showing exactly what happened. I wonder if it is a case of VAR didn't realise there was a foul in time before the next restart. This is more regarding the one on Otamendi?
CA 2019 - Final - Brazil vs Peru
- Thread starter Mark_Barca
- Start date
I didn't watch the game obviously, but fair play to Brazil, they could win it without conceding a single goal.
Wow guess I was wrong, should probably get an old person test.
In Chile for this 
Hoping the atmosphere in Santiago to be electric.
Hoping the atmosphere in Santiago to be electric.
Uruguay pretty much passed the half way line twice and scored 2 goals. We massively outplayed them and we were mostly crap at the World Cup. 20 shots to 6. 62% possession. 10 corners to 2. More than twice as many passes and attacks. Morocco did a lot better.
The level of south american national teams is really low right now and the terrible standard of this tournament is proof of it.
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If it was fixed for Brazil to win and they wanted Argentina out... how did Otamendi and Armani inexplicably escape red card vs Paraguay while 1-0 down? How did the penalty in favour of Qatar not get called? How come the Foyth penalty vs Venezuela wasn't given?I know we didn't have chances to win the game, but the referee made sure of that. To me both situations are really clear.
And it's not only those plays, the general game was in favour of brazil.
Brazilian guys on Conmebol are always complaining saying that conmebol hates brazil and bla bla bla, here you can see it's the same. It was clearly fixed for brazil to win comfortably. Referee's wife is Brazil's referee federation chiefs sister
Argentina wouldn't even have been in the semifinals without ref mistakes.
That game is not the bar to measure either team. Peru got to that third game with qualification pretty much guaranteed and a shot at topping the group only if they won while a draw was enough for Brazil.
They had a go, went behind and kept having a go and being open because ultimately they had nothing to lose and all to win. I've said it before, anyone with a chance to hijack Brazil's route to the final would be in a great position.
Peru are better than that and Brazil were flattered thanks to how incentives were set up.
I'm actually of the idea Peru gave France a tougher game in Russia than we did in the quarters.
Reckon they were better last Summer, just very unlucky to have lost the first game to Denmark (missed pen at 0-0), which forced them to go out for a result vs France as the 0-0 on the final group game was written on the wall.
They are a good team, unspectacular, but with a bit of luck they do have the resilience and fighting spirit to give anyone a game.
I mean, the quality on display in the nations league wasn't exactly Brazil '82 standard either
And Brazil even without Neymar are nigh impossible to beat, as much as they might struggle to score against parked buses
Europeans being surprised/outraged at that will never cease to amaze me. I guess you didn't watch much South American football with Havelange and Teixeira in charge.
The first thing everyone here said when VAR was introduced was how convenient it would be to rig games by choosing whether to VAR or not to VAR. Exhibit A right there for you.
Not that I disagree with your main points, but they are playing feckin' Andorra mate
Fixed for Brazil to win doesn't mean getting all the big teams screwed at every turn. You need bums on seats and attractive broadcasts.
Beating them is always going to require a rub of the green in a tight game, overlook 2-3 key incidents and it is game over. Simples.
It's not even a regular thing any more. It used to go all the way to U-17 tournos, but now it's more a case of "Copa in Brazil, Brazil have won jack for a decade and need a lift. Let's nail this one". I wrote off this Copa on the day the draw was made, you could see it coming a mile away.
The point I rather badly made is I could never see Fernandes, Silva and Ronaldo struggling to create in a way the top SA sides do, even on a pitch that had being hit by asteroids and Portugal are notoriously defensive. The flair seems to be gone out of a lot of the SA sides and they all look workmanlike, the creativity and what used to make SA football great is at an all time low. I'm not buying that Brazilians etc.. who grow up playing football on a beach can't deal with a poor pitch so have to resort to the level we saw last night. I just don't believe the quality is there outside of a few players in each squad.Not that I disagree with your main points, but they are playing feckin' Andorra mate
I'm neither surprised or outraged, but I get your point. However, I am surprised at the lack of comment the incidents have generated. It is two blatant penalties that VAR overlooked. There is no other possible interpretation for either incident. I was initially open to the concept of VAR but its implementation for numerous reasons has made me prefer if it was just was kept out altogether. At any rate, it needs some kind of independent oversight and transparency about its decision making.
It's a fact indeed. It started for Brazil post 82 (tactics trumping flair), got worse with foreigner quotas getting relaxed and a fecktonne of money going into Europe, and has been irreversible since Bosman.
You basically put together a ragged band of mercenaries playing in different leagues, teams and systems and have to make them perform with a few days training. You end up at a common denominator, which will hardly be tiki taka.
Take Spain 08-12 or Germany 10-14, the core of those teams played together every week and were capable of tactical domination. Brazil/Argentina can hardly replicate that.
Only "lesser" teams with lower expectations (and rarely having more than 1-2 "special" players at best, so not banking on flair) have been able to afford managers the time and patience to put a system in place and develop a style over many years.
That's a great point actually, the fact these players rarely see each other and play in very different leagues/styles at club level is an interesting one and as you say success has dried up since the big leagues started buying up everyone.
Messi blaming refs and being salty is more fun and needs less brainpower.
The Argie FA are demanding the recording of VAR conversations is made public and actually immediately available during broadcasting. Pretty sure ref mikes in rugby work like that?
There should always be a couple of VAR calls that can be initiated by the team's manager rather than depending on the ref and/or people in the VAR room displaying consistent standards.
Think it’s just home/big team bias. Uruguay got a very debatable pen v Japan and Japan were denied a much more clear cut pen later on in the game. I did think VAR would reduce bias when it initially came out but pretty sure it’s just made it worse.
Agree our pen was soft as feck. The Japan one would have been as well, but more of a pen by that standard. That was probably more a case of bias against the outsiders than favouring us specifically (else Cavani v Peru would have stood, which I'm still not convinced was offside tbh).
Let's face it, no one wants Qatar or Japan in the knockouts, they are thee to make up the numbers.
The 1st penalty isn't clear at all. Also they'd have to cancel Brazil's goal and the VAR camera shows Aguero stepping on Alves' foot.
If you think that is a clear cut mistake by referee you are crazy. The 2nd one is one of those corner kick penalties I hate, but I agree it may be one. But still its 2-1 Brazil and like 5 minutes left in game.
Also, Uruguayan crying should not be taken into account. They think the world is against them. Just remember the Suarez WC incident, journalists clapping the manager off and the whole shenanigans.
They are literally saying there is a plot because they got 3 offside goals.. correctly called offside! By the LINESMEN! And all the Fox Deportes journalists are now saying "Var eliminated Uruguay" It wasn't VAR's intervention jesus christ.
And if it was rigged for Brazil, why did they overrule their penalty against Paraguay? They went to penalties, seems like their 'plan' to make Brazil win was in huge jeopardy there.
Actually scratch that, if you think everything is a conspiracy, why are you even in a football forum giving opinions? If everything is set up beforehand.
They are literally saying there is a plot because they got 3 offside goals.. correctly called offside! By the LINESMEN! And all the Fox Deportes journalists are now saying "Var eliminated Uruguay" It wasn't VAR's intervention jesus christ.
And if it was rigged for Brazil, why did they overrule their penalty against Paraguay? They went to penalties, seems like their 'plan' to make Brazil win was in huge jeopardy there.
Actually scratch that, if you think everything is a conspiracy, why are you even in a football forum giving opinions? If everything is set up beforehand.
anyone watching?
Oh yes. I've really come to enjoy the Copa America over the last three tournaments. It's a little subdued this year compared to the Centenario but still good.
Well, well, Peru!
Peru 1 nil up. Flores
there's more goals in this
sanchez shit so far
Peruvians rolling around
Unbelievable!
away from goal he has completely lost any ability to beat a player
2 nil Peru.
Chile thought they were going to stroll to a threepeat.
Keeper fecks it up
He is completely finished.
We're going to be stuck with him.
I'd gladly see him transferred and us paying half his wages for the remainder of his contract. Well, not gladly, but it would be a relief.
I'd gladly see him transferred and us paying half his wages for the remainder of his contract. Well, not gladly, but it would be a relief.
Disappointing. Wanted a Brazil V Chile final.
Why is Sanchez always wide or deep?
He is terrible from these positions. He tries to dribble and defender wins it or cuts on his right to try some lofted through ball that never works.
Why dont these managers play him as a striker?
He is terrible from these positions. He tries to dribble and defender wins it or cuts on his right to try some lofted through ball that never works.
Why dont these managers play him as a striker?
Sanchez was pretty decent up to this game. Chile having a mare first half. Thought they'd have enough to edge a tight 1 or 2 nil.
Told ya, take Peru for granted at your own peril. They have spunk, spunk matters.
Yep. I've always thought people underrate the hell out of them. They've been a solid team since before the last world cup. Good ball control, smart passing, patience... I really like watching them play.