Thanks for that, explains a lot, the FA should know this as well.
Cavani gets 3 match ban from FA for his social media post
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Absolutely. It was just bullying normalized. I'm almost 40yo now, so things have changed a bit now for the new generations.
There wasn't a big deal with using the words Negro or Negrito because we didn't have many real black people in Chile, Uruguay or Argentina. There wasn't a connection/implication with the pain suffered by black African slaves in Brazil or USA. Ignorance is bliss as they say.
But now (at least in Chile), we have plenty real black skinned people arriving from Haiti, Colombia, Venezuela, etc, so there is some re-education going on. Some people, specially the older generations, are quite racists towards them an treat them like shit. It's not surprising to read racist comments in the online newspapers.
But the newer generations are more open minded and the future looks brighter.
Cavani should wait till he is retired than sue the uck out of the FA for defamation of character and donate all the proceeds charity
Should teach them a lesson
Should teach them a lesson
Yes. Whenever he likes because the word is not a problem for anyone other than the racist FA.
Nice to see so many players and the Uruguayan FA getting behind Cavani and even accusing the FA for discriminatory act. Negative press is the only way to stop these idiots from thinking they are Gods (apart from somebody actually suing them and 100% winning).
Firstly you obviously don't know me as this is probably the first interaction we have ever had. Secondly I do not think you or Cavani are racist people based on this.
I want to state my opinion very clearly, when the word that he used is directed towards another person it sounds like the Spanish version of a horrible word that obviously should upset people. There have been examples of this causing an issue for people in the past. As such when representing Manchester bloody United from a very fortunate position you would be doing a more kind thing to avoid it. EVEN if it is a complete misunderstanding due to the different context and histories of the word.
Horrible word? You have no idea what that word even means if you say that...
I am not talking about the Spanish version if you read my post.
It means buddy or mate. There's no direct translation for either, just "negrito" and other words such as "gurí" (little boy), "guacho" (which literally means orphan and obviously isn't used with orphans), "papo" (akin to big daddy), etc.
I'm not sure that's what he asked. He asked where does the word originate from.
I applaud the Uruguayan FA!
You reckon the average person reading the news here makes that distinction. All they ever hear from is the FA, the press, Brexit, or Boris at his worst. Forgive them if they think you are bunch of clowns.
The FA are bringing all of you into disrepute.
Laws, rules, fines should only be applied when something bad and preciously forbidden was done. Else you don’t know when or why you are gong to get punished.
Is a basic legal principle that no one should be punished for a conduct that isn’t previously forbiden,.
Cavani greeted a friend in a way commonly used in latin america. There is no way he could know that by doing so he would be punished. Because there was not a rule agains what he did. The FA rule under which Cavani was punished has nothing to do with what Cavani did.
The FA is trying to force a square into a circle to punish Cavani.
I don't think they think they're gods. I just think they have no idea what they're doing and have somehow whilst trying to tackle racism, piss off an entire culture. Only the FA could do that.
In Chile? Yes, absolutely. Probably more often than not.
Anyone acquainted with such nuances would not misinterpret "gracias negrito :thumbsup:"
Those not acquainted with them (or simply the Spanish language) are just making shit up when they say it is an offensive term in the UK. FFS, we had posters here thinking he referred to our black away jersey
If he was not a United player, many here would be calling him a racist. All of a sudden we have a tonne of experts in South American Spanish.
Whether he meant it or not, the fact of the matter is, he has been in Europe for over 10 years and has full exposure to the culture here. For years and years there have been high profile circumstances of players being racially abused. There was also the case of Suarez. Now i do not understand what the statement means, but at the end of the day, he should know much better than to post that on Social Media - he is addressing the world, different cultures and countries and wearing the badge of one of the most high profile clubs around in sport. I should probably also mention that he is mid 30s so I would expect greater maturity. I really like Cavani, but there is really no excuse for what he did. I dont care if he is not a racist, in this country that language is unacceptable and encourages the younger generation to think it is fine. Life evolves and becomes more sophisticated, language should too. He deserves his 3 match ban and education classes, he should take it as a learning experience instead of trying to fight it. Generally, when you go to other countries, you respect there cultures there. That should be the same for the UK and Europe.
Whether he meant it or not, the fact of the matter is, he has been in Europe for over 10 years and has full exposure to the culture here. For years and years there have been high profile circumstances of players being racially abused. There was also the case of Suarez. Now i do not understand what the statement means, but at the end of the day, he should know much better than to post that on Social Media - he is addressing the world, different cultures and countries and wearing the badge of one of the most high profile clubs around in sport. I should probably also mention that he is mid 30s so I would expect greater maturity. I really like Cavani, but there is really no excuse for what he did. I dont care if he is not a racist, in this country that language is unacceptable and encourages the younger generation to think it is fine. Life evolves and becomes more sophisticated, language should too. He deserves his 3 match ban and education classes, he should take it as a learning experience instead of trying to fight it. Generally, when you go to other countries, you respect there cultures there. That should be the same for the UK and Europe.
You are right at the very beginning re the wipeout of indigenous population.
The main driver in Uruguay was that different from, say, the incas or guaranitic tribes where agriculture had led to building civilisations, the ones here were base level hunter-gatherers. They would not be appeased or turned to Christianity, so much so that the guy that discovered the River Plate landed with his mirrors and colourful glass to make trades and ended up being their lunch.
In any case, by 1900 90% of our 1M population were Italian immigrants from the last 30 years. That's before the arrival of Spanish Republic refugees (largely from separatist "nations"), Jews and Eastern Europeans escaping Nazism and the war after it. That took us to about 2.5M.
In a nutshell, neither the natives, the original Spaniards or their very few (domestic "help") slaves have any significant representation in the makeup of our population. The "darker skin" is for the most part different tones of Mediterranean, not actually mixed race for the most part.
That is, your entire take on using it as a slur to put people down or discriminate based on ethnicity is a myth. It may well apply to Chile, but not Uruguay.
Sure thingThere's no origin based on ethnicity (explained above). Just like we call some "el Flaco" (thin), "el Gordo" (fat), "el Ñato" (big nose), "el Mono" (monkey), etc we call some "Negro" which doesn't refer to ethnicity but being darker skinned/haired in relative terms to their circle of friends.
"Negro" is a nickname, "Negrito" gets used as a proxy for buddy/pal/mate.
Same goes for Negra and Negrita, although negrita is also bold font. The button on Microsoft Word is called negrita FFS. Someone should prank the FA switching their MS Office to Spanish.
Suarez, as all other high profile cases you mention, racially abused a rival player. All Cavani would know about the Suarez case was he was trying to wind up Evra, a black player, and he would know full well he must have resorted to abusive terms. It's Suarez, he does that shit, anything, to unsettle a defender.
I’m from Argentina, south america, spanish speaking country, Cavani did nothing wrong. It has nothing to do with him being a Manchester United player, it has everything to do with the FA trying to punish someone for using his native language in a correct manner.
As many posters you think that doing something that is not wrong is still punishable. In the modern civilization if you dont do something against the law you can’t be punished.
Well, Cavani clearly was not addressing the whole world. He was addressing his personal friend. He is a public figure, but it surely doesn't mean every word he utters has public significance, does it? That is not fair.
Should he be allowed to behave like a real Uruguayan? Is there something called cultural understanding? Digging out a racist where there is only affectionate message between friends? Is that a good way to influence young people? Probably not. Offence-taking is not helpful for anyone.
I am sure the fact that he is a Manchester United player is playing a part in the indignation here, but it has little to do with the argument that FA is losing the plot.
As someone married to a latin woman who has been known to be called negrita by her family (to provide some context) this issue is really tricky.
On the whole it is clear as other posters have said that Cavani was using this in a friendly context and therefore I don't think he should be punished. I also don't think the English FA should be saying what is culturally appropriate.
However, I do think latin culture should probably reflect on its use or nicknames in a modern era which seem to largely be based on physical characteristics and can be pretty cruel even if that isn't the intention.
I know a fair few people called Chino simply because physical aspects look a bit like tropes of asians. Whilst the intent is not negative I'm not sure how globally acceptable it is. Almost like giving someone the nickname English for example because they had bad teeth.
Then you also have so many people called Gordo or flaco (fatty or skinny) which again doesn't intend harm and seems very friendly when used but could have quite a damaging impact on that person's self esteem and confidence.
These things are complex though and need to be looked at by Latinos, not another country, let alone a bunch of largely middle aged white men.
On the whole it is clear as other posters have said that Cavani was using this in a friendly context and therefore I don't think he should be punished. I also don't think the English FA should be saying what is culturally appropriate.
However, I do think latin culture should probably reflect on its use or nicknames in a modern era which seem to largely be based on physical characteristics and can be pretty cruel even if that isn't the intention.
I know a fair few people called Chino simply because physical aspects look a bit like tropes of asians. Whilst the intent is not negative I'm not sure how globally acceptable it is. Almost like giving someone the nickname English for example because they had bad teeth.
Then you also have so many people called Gordo or flaco (fatty or skinny) which again doesn't intend harm and seems very friendly when used but could have quite a damaging impact on that person's self esteem and confidence.
These things are complex though and need to be looked at by Latinos, not another country, let alone a bunch of largely middle aged white men.
Arsenal legend Lee Dixon apologises to American viewers for 'fag' slip-up during Chelsea derby coverage
https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/fo...p-during-chelsea-derby-coverage-a3915056.html
https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/fo...p-during-chelsea-derby-coverage-a3915056.html
Thanks for acknowledging that after all that coulda/woulda/not sure stuff.
We are fine as it is and nobody gives a shit what their nickname is or else friends would drop them.
Not having a go at you, I see you are trying hard to reconcile both views... but it's obvious you clearly see first hand that everybody is fine and dandy with it and all the ifs and buts are completely foreign to the customs and actual/real interpersonal dynamics.
Human decency, my ass, it's cultural racism. We do not have the right to tell the rest of the world how they should speak/act.
How can a 3 game ban and a fine of £100k be a slap on the wrist?
He should have just received a warning.
Which rule? He did nothing racist, so could not have brought the game into disrepute.
What rule or law did he actually break?
Well said.
Only if they were so slow that they were unable to understand context, much less basic cultural nuance.
Ironically a classic UKIP talking point.
"The second you step foot in GREAT Britain you speak our language and adapt to our culture. None of that foreign muck. Neg-what? I don't care what you think it means, it sounds a bit like a word I've heard in The Queen's English and it's not on. You won't be using it anymore with your foreign mates. End of."
Truly horrifyingly dystopian.
That was riddled with sarcasm.
We all know this ban will be upheld, the fact it's still dragging on is more than annoying.
All hail the mighty English language
Luis Suarez leaping to your defence is a bit like Jack Grealish offering you a lift home.
Can you show me any evidence where he disrespected british culture?
He was talking to his friend from uruguay, in his own language/dialect, from his own home. He said a word in Uruguayan spanish that is not racist at all. Are you saying that when you travel / live in a foreign country you're not allowed to speak in your mother tongue to people from the same country as you?
He's probably someone who goes to Spain and orders a full english for breakfast, then gets pissed off at the waitress for not being able to speak English properly.
3 match ban for PL or all comps? will he be able to play vs Liverpool?
To be fair that's not the point I was making. Although there are two bits and on one I have no doubt it needs to be challenged. This is that having spoken to some people in my extended family it is obvious that "friendly" names like flaca or chapparo can have an impact on ones self esteem, confidence and make people self conscious. If you have a culture that normalises these names then it is harder for people, especially when often young, to challenge this. It may be intended with love but doesn't mean it doesn't have unintended consequences and that it always should be this way. Cultures evolve and adapt.
The other bit is defo more complex as the potential for offense is with those outside the immediate relationship so frankly intent is not a valid point of view but I can see why people would say it is.
The other bit is defo more complex as the potential for offense is with those outside the immediate relationship so frankly intent is not a valid point of view but I can see why people would say it is.
Have to ask any of the many here who have made this out to be the greatest injustice ever, are you the same people who wanted suarez shot for saying the same thing to evra, the same people who when pool fans defended their guy like you lot are, to be banned from matches and their actions shameful and doglish given a touchline ban ?
Always love the double standard's from our fans.
Always love the double standard's from our fans.
why don't you actually do some reading before you post utter crap?