You make an excellent point about centre backs last season.
Moyes knew full well that Rio and Vida were leaving, he should have been making far more of an effort to bring Jones, Smalling and Evand though than he was.
12
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 29
- Clean sheets
- 8
- Goals
- 4
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 3
- Red cards
- 1
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) are here to talk about United's dreadful home defeat at the hands of Big Ange's Tottenham Hotspur. Should this have been the end of Ten Hag? How long does he actually have left? And does Nik finally want ETH out?!
You make an excellent point about centre backs last season.
Moyes knew full well that Rio and Vida were leaving, he should have been making far more of an effort to bring Jones, Smalling and Evand though than he was.
After his stupidity against City a few weeks back he looks like he's turned a corner. Good display against Arsenal and even better performance yesterday.
After the City game if you scroll back you'll see I didn't give a shit, I wanted him gone to punish stupidity which may have been a slight over reaction but the emotions were high due to the opposition and he effectively cost us the game. BUT there's light at the end of the tunnel, since then he was immense vs Arsenal coming out with unbelievable stats (literally) and yesterday he decided he was Beckenbauer or a more suited Rio. Although it was ''only'' Hull, he put in the perfect performance both defending and bombing foward, could of had another goal too!
He's clawing his way back onto my good list.
He's clawing his way back onto my good list.
It's not the thread to get into a Moyes discussion but one of my biggest bugbears was the excuse of transition being used. In truth, he hadn't even started. If Smalling & Jones played at centre half every week and that was costing games at least it was a means to an end. This season was going to be the transition season (where players would turn over and you would expect a dip). I shudder to think where that would have taken the club.
He was absolutely superb yesterday. He's got to produce that standard now over a significant number of games. Now's his chance and hopefully he stays fit to give him the opportunity to do so.
Hull didn't put up much of a challenge, but he was outstanding yesterday. Definition of composure.
I didn't jump on his back after the City game because I knew (as some others on here too) he was much better than that.
I didn't jump on his back after the City game because I knew (as some others on here too) he was much better than that.
Said many times that I think he is not just United's, but also England's best centre half.
Unbeatable more often than not.
You know the hashtag by now!
Unbeatable more often than not.
You know the hashtag by now!
Don't know if he is better than Cahill, but in this form he is way better than Jagielka !
Very good in the last two games, will need to be again on Tuesday as Stoke will be much more dangerous than Hull and I still think rojo hasn't settled yet.
Have maintained it for a while, easily our best CB. People just went mentally overboard after the City nonsense.
Yesterday, He was good at the things he is normally bad at. Distrubution and composure.
He's the one consistant CB we have. Thats been the main feature of his time since he joined. He had 1 bad game
He was stupid in the City game no question, but before and after that he's been consistently very good for us this season. He's looking like the player that kept Tevez tucked in his pocket shortly after joining. No stupid injuries and no daft suspensions and we'll see the best of him.
I don't disagree with you. I don't mean consistency in his level of performance. What he needs is consistency of position and to be consistently fit. IMHO the reason he isn't already established as a first choice centre back is due to not being able to do either. Performing to a consistent standard is great but if you miss the next game through injury or move to right back you will not establish yourself in the side. I really hope he can string a long sequence of consecutive games together now.
Still think we should?
I couldn't believe I was watching Chris Smalling on Saturday
I think that was his best performance since his breakthrough season in 2010-11 where I remember watching him and thinking we have the next England captain on our hands. Very promising.
Well he's made Garth Crook's team of the week. He must be made up
I'm sure I can list several performances of a similar standard since then. He is usually very good. Very good in Munich last season I reckon. And I think the 2-3 win in Persie's first season was another top game. Remember him stopping two certain goals from Dzeko and Aguero.
I think he is defensively as good as almost any centre-half out there, honestly.
Always said this. Also a lot of people he has played against said he is one of the hardest defenders to get past. He can combine pace on the turn with the ability to defend which is rare in a defender as well as being great in the air and at getting his foot in at the right time. One on one he's pretty much unbeatable.
Some people feel he's not good based on his performances at RB or because he's not amazing on the ball. I don't care too much for that, he doesn't need to be spraying the balls 30yards to feet aslong as he can defend. Or they see Jones throwing himself into challenges or blocking the ball heroically and decide that is how a defender should defend. Most great defenders hardly need to do this due to good positioning in the initial phase to negate the danger. Players like Jones will get praise for a last ditch tackle while someone like Smalling will sense the danger 20 yards further up the pitch and make a simple interception that may not look as good.
This may seem slightly harsh on Jones as I feel he can also develop into a good defender but he's quite raw in terms of natural defending.
Now that we actually have a midfield, our CBs shouldnt be required to play constant, raking 50 yard passes either.
Agree with all of that. As the founder of the #SmallingPlusOne petition, it is no secret of my views on the man. That said, I do think you have been a bit harsh on Jones though. I think injuries are much more of a hinderance than any ability deficit. He started the season very well, and while not as strong in the air as Smalling, he is also close to unbeatable on the deck in an one-on-one I'd say. I still (just about), hold out hope for Smalling and Jones forming a top partnership. Evans, I'd have no issue with us selling however.
Smalling got four yellows in his first four seasons with us (that's fewer than Rio). Jones got 15 in his first three. In terms of positioning and technique, as a defender Smalling is light years ahead of Jones. It's also worth remembering that, when he joined United, Smalling's distribution was excellent - the idea that he can't pass, or that he has a limited range, is quite a recent development - possibly related to his time at RB.
I've been a massive fan of Smalling since he first joined us. We've been saying this for quite some time, but if just his injuries will clear up then he's going to become the first defender to go on the team sheet.
He's doing great, but what happens with Evans and Jones? My fear is LVG will drop him once Evans retains match fitness.
Evans is nowhere near Smalling, he hasnt been defending properly since SAF.
So far not a chance, mate. Physicality is what LVG will be looking for in upcoming transfer windows.
Smalling has height and mobility taken straight from NBA in the 90's not to mention that he's finally catching miraculous form. I think we're gonna rely on that plus Jonny is almost non-existent this season but they will probably rotate at some point anyway, especially in two matches a week dynamic and also when FA Cup will fully kick in.
So far Rojo and Smalling looks almost like a monster combo.
I agree, but Evans always seems to retain his place when he's fit. We'll see what happens, but Smalling and Rojo should be our starting CBs
I still believe he's our best defensive player, just frustrating he's injury prone and it's obvious his footballing development was at a low level when he was younger.
Sure as hell hope not, at least with evans. Evans will have to wait for someone to get injured to get his chance as he was awful when he did play. Jones was at least decent when he did play, so which ever of those 2 are fit should start.
Smalling has some impressive numbers
Smalling is our best defender. He's rapid as well, against Arsenal, Welbeck got a yard on him but he made it up in no time. Like others have said it's his distribution which really lets him down and it's very noticeable against teams who sit back and allow him the ball.
I think his distribution has improved this season. He just needs to stay fit and he'll easily be our most reliable CB.
Yeah but he looks stupid so how can he be a good footballer?
Indeed. Send him back to Maidstone!
I see what you're saying, but for me Smalling's performance against City was an anomaly. I don't think he's turned a corner as such. He's incredibly solid most of the time, just picked a terrible game to make some truly moronic decisions. He was good before the City game, he'll be good for the rest of the season.
I've never really understood why he gets so much stick.
If he wasn't injury prone he'd be the best defender in the league by now imo.
If he wasn't injury prone he'd be the best defender in the league by now imo.
Highest pass completion, and a good amount of them also go forward (70%). I think the distribution argument is a bit outdated, this season his distribution has massively improved.
His distribution will keep improving - Van Gaal will make sure of it. Strangely enough, playing at right back probably helped him take the ball forward. Seems extremely confident taking the ball into midfield.
He's always been a complete tank defensively though and I just hope he can stay fit. Ridiculously talented defender.
He's always been a complete tank defensively though and I just hope he can stay fit. Ridiculously talented defender.