Jib
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Not good enough on the ball to start for coachs like Guardiola, Klopp, Poch', Sarri and Emery.
This is just not true at all. Before Jose left, lindelof had already stepped up his performances and I believe Smalling was injured at the time. Our first choice pairing for the first half of Ole's tenure here was Lindelof and Jones. Check his thread for these games, he was already getting rave reviews for his performances in these games.Smalling would get into all of those teams except for city. I cannot believe the stick he gets on here. Some poster saying he's overrated. C'mon ffs!
Lindelöf's postive form curve and development is largely down to Smalling. He's been like a rock in that defence every time he's played with Lindelöf. In the beginning when Lindelöf was shaky he was covering for him in a number of instances and he helped him through that difficult period. Now we're seeing a much more confident and stable Lindelöf and much of that as I said is down to Smalling. Time the lad got the credit he's due!
10-15 years ago Rio Ferdinand was approaching his prime.Arsenal. Unfortunately for Chris, CB position is not only about defending these days, he would have been rated much higher some 10-15 years ago.
What a description.Chelsea - easily.
Arsenal - easily.
Pool - better than matip/lovren - yes.
Spurs - alderwield and vertongen are not as bullet proof as people make them out to be. Yes
City - not in a million years. Do you see smallings body when he tries to make a pass? He looks like an average person making a pass with their weaker foot. Very technically limited.
Smalling is a fantastic defensive center back. If he played for any other top team we would want to sign him.
Yep, him being injured while Lindelof was starting with Jones really helped Lindelof.Smalling would get into all of those teams except for city. I cannot believe the stick he gets on here. Some poster saying he's overrated. C'mon ffs!
Lindelöf's postive form curve and development is largely down to Smalling. He's been like a rock in that defence every time he's played with Lindelöf. In the beginning when Lindelöf was shaky he was covering for him in a number of instances and he helped him through that difficult period. Now we're seeing a much more confident and stable Lindelöf and much of that as I said is down to Smalling. Time the lad got the credit he's due!
Weird. I really don't see how Smalling should get the credit for Lindelöf improving when he wasn't even playing alongside him. That's not a slight on Smalling or anything.Smalling would get into all of those teams except for city. I cannot believe the stick he gets on here. Some poster saying he's overrated. C'mon ffs!
Lindelöf's postive form curve and development is largely down to Smalling. He's been like a rock in that defence every time he's played with Lindelöf. In the beginning when Lindelöf was shaky he was covering for him in a number of instances and he helped him through that difficult period. Now we're seeing a much more confident and stable Lindelöf and much of that as I said is down to Smalling. Time the lad got the credit he's due!
What about Southgate? LVG had to use what he had at his disposal. A possession manager doesn't buy Smalling if he isn't already at the clubThat’s what they said when LVG took in charge.
Nothing! I think he is a fine starter for United.I never said Smalling will settle at City. In fact, even DDG would be benched in City because of poor passing. But Smalling would start in Arsenal and Spur, and possibly #3 at Chelsea or Liverpool, so what is wrong with him being #3 at Utd?
2 things defenders at City do well, that Smalling would have to learn:I disagree. Smalling would do the same as at United, or slightly better on the ball because Guardiola would coach him to be more confident with the ball. He wouldnt suddenly be as good as their best CBs on the ball, but he'd be fine. He'd either have the confidence to try slightly harder passes or he'd continue with the safe team passing and not give the ball away. It wouldnt be dangerous for City either way. But the 2nd option wouldnt be as good for their attacking play
Hard things to learn though. Not everyone can be as good at passing like your favorite player Ramos .2 things defenders at City do well, that Smalling would have to learn:
1. Keep/pass the ball while being pressed
2. Split the lines when the midfield is being pressed/marked. (I've seen them provide assists or the assist to the assist pass from deep)
I think he would be fine immediately with other aspects, like holding a high line, or being dominant at set pieces (City surprisingly are very good at this already).
Who gives a shit what Southgate did. We played garbage football at the World Cup and got owned every time we came across good opposition. We were set piece kings and that got us through the Tournament along with a very, very easy fixture list. Southgate makes decent choices about the players he picks but lets not pretend that we played good football at the World Cup because we really didn't.What about Southgate? LVG had to use what he had at his disposal. A possession manager doesn't buy Smalling if he isn't already at the club
You were trying to convince everyone that you (England) were great during the world cup to be fair.Who gives a shit what Southgate did. We played garbage football at the World Cup and got owned every time we came across good opposition. We were set piece kings and that got us through the Tournament along with a very, very easy fixture list. Southgate makes decent choices about the players he picks but lets not pretend that we played good football at the World Cup because we really didn't.
I'm not so sure. His recovery pace is fine but he likes to sit off and have a full view of whats happening and where runs are coming from. Playing a high line means he will have to read movement better than he does now, he wont have the same amount of time to react and recover.Hard things to learn though. Not everyone can be as good at passing like your favorite player Ramos .
But yes, his defending isn't worse than City's players. It is just that them are so much better at playing football.
High line shouldn't be a problem for Smalling. He is quite fast, actually I think that he is faster than any of City's CBs.
This is what I wrote at the time. I stand by it, we were organised and that allowed us to get through the easy fixtures which we did well. But we were outclassed when we came across Croatia and Belgium. We struggled to create chances from open play but did brilliantly at set pieces. I don't think I ever said we were brilliant, simply that we had a very good fixture list and that's why I was optimistic, I mean if we couldn't beat Colombia and Sweden then England may as well have retired from International football.You were trying to convince everyone that you were great during the world cup to be fair.
First English Tournament I remember was 1992 when I was 7 years old. I remember growing up and watching decent English sides playing good football and it stopped when I was in my late teens. I've had to put up with 15 years of shit as an England supporter and this Tournament I see a genuine difference under Southgate.
We probably lack the quality in the team to win the competition, but its probably the most organised England team i've seen in my life time. I also think we have some genuine big game players in the team again, that is reason to be optimistic. Throw in that we've got probably the easiest route to a Semi Final in decades.
I've watched almost every game in the World Cup and the only teams who look dangerous (imo) are Croatia, Uruguay, Belgium and France. Three of those are on the other side of the draw.
Nah, come on. That's utter bollocks. Of course we'd be favourites against Colombia with or without James.
They're not footballing kings all of a sudden. They drew 0-0 against Egypt and Australia in the pre tournament friendlies and struggled (albeit due to the daft sending off in the Japan match) in their group. Nothing to fear from Colombia at all.
Switzerland/Sweden are well organised teams but both should struggle to break us down and we have enough quality in the final third to cause them problems. Neither of them impressed in the group stages, Sweden showed decent resilence against Germany but were let down by poor quality subs. Switzerland are a good team but nothing more than that and certainly not in the calibre of Croatia/Spain.
I'm very optimistic and if you read any of my posts about England since I joined this forum you'd know i'm normally an England grump. I've hated watching us for the past 20 odd years and normally critise the entire setup. It feels weird being this optimistic.
The opinions of managers actually matter if we're to guess whether he would play for those clubs or not. The question isn't whether we would start Smalling if we were the manager at the other top 6 clubs. Managers who empasise technical ability from their CBs aren't likely to go for Smalling if they had the choiceWho gives a shit what Southgate did. We played garbage football at the World Cup and got owned every time we came across good opposition. We were set piece kings and that got us through the Tournament along with a very, very easy fixture list. Southgate makes decent choices about the players he picks but lets not pretend that we played good football at the World Cup because we really didn't.
Smalling keeps the ball while being pressed at United so no difference. But yes the 2nd part is where Smalling would have to improve, but who hasnt improved at that under Guardiola?Nothing! I think he is a fine starter for United.
2 things defenders at City do well, that Smalling would have to learn:
1. Keep/pass the ball while being pressed
2. Split the lines when the midfield is being pressed/marked. (I've seen them provide assists or the assist to the assist pass from deep)
I think he would be fine immediately with other aspects, like holding a high line, or being dominant at set pieces (City surprisingly are very good at this already).
You're assuming all Managers think like Southgate though.The opinions of managers actually matter if we're to guess whether he would play for those clubs or not. The question isn't whether we would start Smalling if we were the manager at the other top 6 clubs. Managers who empasise technical ability from their CBs aren't likely to go for Smalling if they had the choice
Im not a fan of Young. He should be a dressing room DJ and that is all. He does leave the right side exposed. However, Smalling is not vocal enough. Lindelof is younger, from a different league and he leads better. Did you see him pushing Fred forward? How often does Smalling do that? If Smalling had come through an academy he could've been a world class CB. Sadly he didnt, he lacks positional sense off the ball, passing technique is poor and he pulls shirts too much.He's our best organizer and positional player in the defense. That includes De Gea. Smalling is the one who has constantly filled in for other players out of position over the years, particularly right backs who have gone missing.
I dont think screaming at a new player finding it hard to adjust to the league is leadership. Thats the last thing Fred needs, and Lindelof should be the last person throwing stones in a glass house when he had 2 difficult starts the season in his first 2 seasons. Should Jones shout at Lindelof if Lindelof is a few steps further back than is ideal? Would that be the leadership you want to see?Im not a fan of Young. He should be a dressing room DJ and that is all. He does leave the right side exposed. However, Smalling is not vocal enough. Lindelof is younger, from a different league and he leads better. Did you see him pushing Fred forward? How often does Smalling do that? If Smalling had come through an academy he could've been a world class CB. Sadly he didnt, he lacks positional sense off the ball, passing technique is poor and he pulls shirts too much.
4:46 Doesn't look that awkward to me. Looks more like a chance he created, from a pass he made, after stepping into midfield. Displaying numerous qualities only a fool would think a non-league 'lacking-the-basics' type of player could do. There is another clip of him adjusting his body position to protect the ball before he makes a simple pass, in that clip he looks really awkward. Probably a good time to bring that one back up to keep up the facade?He cannot pass a ball for one. The body shapes he throws are way off. Very very awkward.
Yea, he really cannot pass a ball for two.Unfotunately smalling does not improve on the basics. He was non league before fulham and not long after, utd bought him. He still lacks the basics.
He cannot pass a ball for one. The body shapes he throws are way off. Very very awkward.
He is not defensively as good as he should be. His positional play is poor at best.
He can tackle and he can head a ball and thats all i can give him.
Better than stones, laporte, kompany, otamendi ? No
Better than VVD or gomez? No
Better than sanchez, vertonghan, alderweirald? No
Better than christensen, david luiz, rudiger? No
He would get in the arsenal side and thats it. And does anybody consider them a top tesm anymore? No
Says it all really
Van Gaal who is another manager who wants players to be technical started both seasons with Smalling in bench. Smalling eventually became first choice, but it just shows that the manager didn't trust him and only after the other options failed, he started Smalling. If we had Lindelof back then, it is likely that Smalling wouldn't have become first choice under LVG.You're assuming all Managers think like Southgate though.
So you think Van Gaal was a manager who doesnt emphasize technical ability?The opinions of managers actually matter if we're to guess whether he would play for those clubs or not. The question isn't whether we would start Smalling if we were the manager at the other top 6 clubs. Managers who empasise technical ability from their CBs aren't likely to go for Smalling if they had the choice
Not sure where you read this. Read the post again. A subsequent sentence isn't always a contrasting oneSo you think Van Gaal was a manager who doesnt emphasize technical ability?
Can you explain why Blind was playing at CB? Why Tyler Blackett got games when we had better young players for the position?
Regardless, the evidence we have is that the manager we had that does emphasize technical ability in the backline and not only that, but is particular about which foot they use too, used Smalling a lot and Smalling had his best season under him.Not sure where you read this. Read the post again. A subsequent sentence isn't always a contrasting one
That’s the point of this thread isn’t it?What about Southgate? LVG had to use what he had at his disposal. A possession manager doesn't buy Smalling if he isn't already at the club
No this wasn't a preset condition in the OP but we can agree that if he's already at the club the manager will use him. I'm sure if Southgate was our manager he wouldn't have much of a choice either but we saw what happened when he did have a choice. Notice all of my posts emphasise "if they had the choice"That’s the point of this thread isn’t it?
If Smalling already at the club (Liverpool or Chelsea or Arsenal and etc), a possession manager like Klopp, Sarri, Emery would start him ahead of Matip, Rudiger/Luiz & Koscielny/Mustafi.
Actually, at the end of Mourinho's first season, they were starting for us (including the final of Europa) and played quite well. It has easily been our best partnership since Fergie retired, but for whatever reasons Mourinho didn't continue with it on his second season and then sold Blind.Regardless, the evidence we have is that the manager we had that does emphasize technical ability in the backline and not only that, but is particular about which foot they use too, used Smalling a lot and Smalling had his best season under him.
Next to him we picked a left footed, more composed and technical passer.
Why? Because its not about 1 player. Its about the partnership. Smalling made up for the things Blind lacked and vice versa. And together they ended up a fairly good partnership before Mourinho came in
Leicester were an aberration and Terry was fantastic on the ball.I think a lot of people believe these days that football has dramatically changed and that all centre back have to be like prime Scholes on the ball. It seems to be the case but without any actual evidence for it other than everyone wanting to play like City. Morgan and Huth won the league a couple of seasons back, before that Cahill and Terry.
If you looked at our best results over the last few years i wold guess that Smalling has been involved in more than any other player bar De Gea. No one would have been talking about 'ball playing abilities' of our CBs during these victories. He was even right back when we beat Arsenal 8-2.
Robson/Keane are regarded as some of our greatest leaders. Neville, Ferdinand, Vidic and Schmeichel are all regarded as our greatest leaders. So I think all of the above prove what real leadership is.I dont think screaming at a new player finding it hard to adjust to the league is leadership. Thats the last thing Fred needs, and Lindelof should be the last person throwing stones in a glass house when he had 2 difficult starts the season in his first 2 seasons. Should Jones shout at Lindelof if Lindelof is a few steps further back than is ideal? Would that be the leadership you want to see?
Leadership is more like Ander with Sanchez. Building him up in interviews, giving him credit when he comes into a hard working performance and continues the hard work. The celebration at the end of the match where Ander is genuinely giving him credit, not just saying it for the camera. Thats leadership
Tearing people down isnt leadership. Building them up is.
If Lindelof just normally told him get a few steps forward and cut out the animated frustrated gesture burying him and then when Fred went further forward Lindelof was clapping and displaying positively then sure. I can see that as leadership. What Lindelof did was more like Mourinho on the touchline with his frustrated gestures like "look at what i have to deal with" when Rashford missed a chance up front, then had the interview after the match saying "See, thats why Lukaku always plays"
Thats toxic negativity. Not real leadership
When did they shout at players who just joined the club?Robson/Keane are regarded as some of our greatest leaders. Neville, Ferdinand, Vidic and Schmeichel are all regarded as our greatest leaders. So I think all of the above prove what real leadership is.