Club Sale | It’s done!

[lostcauz]

I don't see why jim can't do this. Let the cnuts have a teeny bit of a vote and Jim can invest what he wants quicker which in turn helps the club quicker.
Surely thats all the cnuts want and they would benefit more if jim was in a better position to spend unless he can't afford to?

He doesn’t seem to have the money right now to do that and he doesn’t want to buy all the Class A shares at the premium price, wants to get the rest at a knock down when he can.

 

[George The Best]

He doesn’t seem to have the money right now to do that and he doesn’t want to buy all the Class A shares at the premium price, wants to get the rest at a knock down when he can.

That could cause a problem with the A class shareholders

 

[Greck]

It's quite clear they were never entering that stratosphere. It's why they walked away. That's an illogical train of thought.

Clear to whom? All of this is even moot when they still offered several billion more than anybody else. That's still several billion more than the next person!! How can one logically assert it made their candidacy weaker than those who bid less (likely over liquidity issues)? I think it escapes people that things don't need to be zero sum and it's possible to say both bidders made credible offers in line with our current situation. The saudis or qataris or whomever would naturally be inclined not to overpay because they are factoring the extra billion from wiping the debt and doing the stadium. Glazers are staying because of their unfounded belief that the club's value is about to skyrocket in the coming years. That is a dreamland fantasy to put one's bets on.

The three man committee is nothing to do with the board of directors though. That's a proposal for the football side which INEOS want control of.

The committee is for voting rights on the football side. It's relevant because it affects the scope of powers of either set of owners. In this point the scope of powers is the point of relevance not what names they will call their office. INEOS already have all the money leverage. If they manage to secure majority control over the football side before fully buying the club fully then they would have run a masterclass on the glazers and would practically own the club.

INEOS is, in all likelihood, going to buy up the rest of the shares eventually and the Glazers will, unfortunately, end up extremely rich for very little investment upfront. They'll eventually have full control and then probably delist United and take the club private. It's what they do with the rest of their acquisitions apparently. It removes the need to faff about getting decisions from boards of directors and shareholders. Whether any of this is good for the club long term is yet to be seen but I honestly can't envision it being any worse than the last 10 years.

This is a great deal for INEOS, that was pretty much agreed, but it most definitely isn't a great deal for the glazers for reasons already raised. It's just desperation on their part and not knowing when to cash their chips. Selling the club isn't about to get easier.

 

[Withnail]

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You were talking about them having a majority vote at board level because of Brailsford being the third member of the football committee. You were mistaken but that's fine. No need to pretend otherwise.

Also the Glazers want money. This deal means they are getting a lot of money and likely a lot more in the future. How is it a bad deal for them?

 

[joedirt87]

Anyone with even the smallest bit of experience as a sporting director being appointed that position should be an improvement over how things have been run since Fergie and Gills departure. I'm not picky, Mitchell is just fine by me.

 

[Coops73]

feck me it’s depressing being a United fan right now, this bollocks hanging over the entire club, the passing of Sir Bobby Charlton, the problems in the team, every thread on the cafe is so grim it’s hard to look.

The Glazers have sucked the life and joy out of this club, someone said we’ve become like a zombie and that seems really apt, I hope Ratcliffe can destroy the brain of this monster but I fear it’ll be like the scene in Shaun of the dead where they’re throwing records at a zombie in the garden, pointless and futile but bloody funny for those fans of other clubs that are watching.

I’m going to the Winchester to have a nice cold pint and wait for all of this to blow over. How’s that for a slice of fried gold?

 

[spwd]

He doesn’t seem to have the money right now to do that and he doesn’t want to buy all the Class A shares at the premium price, wants to get the rest at a knock down when he can.

I can't see how he can buy them for less.
How much approximately would 50% of each of the A shares and the b shares be?

 

[DownRiver]

I wonder how much INEOS would gain from ‘free‘ branding in one of the biggest clubs in the world?

 

[Greck]

You were talking about them having a majority vote at board level because of Brailsford being the third member of the football committee. You were mistaken but that's fine. No need to pretend otherwise.

Also the Glazers want money. This deal means they are getting a lot of money and likely a lot more in the future. How is it a bad deal for them?

Considering it's my post I think I'm in a better position to know what it intended. Also because this isn't even my first time making that point in this very thread.

 

[Withnail]

Considering it's my post I think I'm in a better position to know what it intended. Also because this isn't even my first time making that point in this very thread.

Well you mentioned the board and the followed it up by using the words 'majority vote at board level'. You then suggested this was proof they were getting rid of the Glazer hierarchy. What am I supposed to infer from that?

Besides that, it will just mean INEOS have control of the football side which the Glazers really don't care about.
I'm really not seeing how this is a bad deal for them.

 

[Rightnr]

Exactly. You don't get to be a billionaire by giving away your money.

I have said multiple times that it's not clear it's a state bid.

But even if it was, there was some talk about how Qatar approached the Harrod's purchase in a similar fashion. They bid up bit by bit to ensure they didn't get Dutch auctioned.

 

[Greck]

Well you mentioned the board and the followed it up by using the words 'majority vote at board level'. You then suggested this was proof they were getting rid of the Glazer hierarchy. What am I supposed to infer from that?

Besides that, it will just mean INEOS have control of the football side which the Glazers really don't care about.
I'm really not seeing how this is a bad deal for them.

Yeah. I can definitely see how the confusing wording structure could cause different interpretations.

 

[Zoo]

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[Berbaclass]

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Good. The less influence those leeches have the better. Although not ideal it's a step in the right direction.

 

[Pexbo]

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There’s no deal yet. It’s basically still being negotiated with Ratcliffe in pole position because Qatar have pulled out.

I think it’s still feasible that no deal happens.

 

[Garethw]

There’s no deal yet. It’s basically still being negotiated with Ratcliffe in pole position because Qatar have pulled out.

I think it’s still feasible that no deal happens.

Hopefully.

I’d rather wait for a full sale.

 

[putzmcgee123]

Hopefully.

I’d rather wait for a full sale.

It seems at least some (if not all) of the Glazer trust fund babies have such a wildly unrealistic price to sell in full and in the present. I have very little faith that rinsing and repeating this process in a few years would yield a different result than now, especially given the reputational damage no transaction after all this would do.

If Ratcliffe strikes a binding agreement that guarantees their grip on this club is removed within 2-3 years, I don't know why we shouldn't all try to get behind that and give him a chance. I fully understand the apprehension towards Ratcliffe and I personally favoured the Jassim bid. This is where we are now though.

 

[Posh Red]

feck me it’s depressing being a United fan right now, this bollocks hanging over the entire club, the passing of Sir Bobby Charlton, the problems in the team, every thread on the cafe is so grim it’s hard to look.

The Glazers have sucked the life and joy out of this club, someone said we’ve become like a zombie and that seems really apt, I hope Ratcliffe can destroy the brain of this monster but I fear it’ll be like the scene in Shaun of the dead where they’re throwing records at a zombie in the garden, pointless and futile but bloody funny for those fans of other clubs that are watching.

I’m going to the Winchester to have a nice cold pint and wait for all of this to blow over. How’s that for a slice of fried gold?

I enjoyed this analogy. Thank you.

 

[Don_Johan14]

Buying 25% of the club and wanting control of the sporting side can be risky.
If results go wrong in the next few years, both the Glazers and the fans may not want Radcliffe to take control of the club.

And right now it's difficult to reverse the sporting situation.

 

[Yorke to Cole]

It seems at least some (if not all) of the Glazer trust fund babies have such a wildly unrealistic price to sell in full and in the present. I have very little faith that rinsing and repeating this process in a few years would yield a different result than now, especially given the reputational damage no transaction after all this would do.

If Ratcliffe strikes a binding agreement that guarantees their grip on this club is removed within 2-3 years, I don't know why we shouldn't all try to get behind that and give him a chance. I fully understand the apprehension towards Ratcliffe and I personally favoured the Jassim bid. This is where we are now though.

Who would likely come in on a full sale in 2 years time? (If the Daily Mail story from about 6 weeks ago taking off the market is correct).

Would it be companies like Apple?

 

[Rood]

It seems at least some (if not all) of the Glazer trust fund babies have such a wildly unrealistic price to sell in full and in the present. I have very little faith that rinsing and repeating this process in a few years would yield a different result than now, especially given the reputational damage no transaction after all this would do.

If Ratcliffe strikes a binding agreement that guarantees their grip on this club is removed within 2-3 years, I don't know why we shouldn't all try to get behind that and give him a chance. I fully understand the apprehension towards Ratcliffe and I personally favoured the Jassim bid. This is where we are now though.

I think it's highly unlikely that there will be any binding agreement for a future full sale - maybe they might have some kind of agreement in principle to move towards that but I doubt there will be any guarantees

We shall see ...

 

[Rightnr]

There’s no deal yet. It’s basically still being negotiated with Ratcliffe in pole position because Qatar have pulled out.

I think it’s still feasible that no deal happens.

Qatar pulling out the way they did might be for multiple reasons.

One, of course, to save face. Two, to make it harder for the Glazers to get what they want from Ratcliffe. This is why he might be taking longer now to make sure he squeezes then to the max.

And if he does, fair play to him. Anything that fecks up the Glazers is good in my book

 

[RedRocket9908]

Qatar pulling out the way they did might be for multiple reasons.

I still dont believe Qatar have pulled out, from what ive read it sounds like they are still very much in the race.

 

[RedChrome]

I think it's highly unlikely that there will be any binding agreement for a future full sale - maybe they might have some kind of agreement in principle to move towards that but I doubt there will be any guarantees

We shall see ...

I 100% agree. Why would the crimson leeches sign anything forcing them to sell the club in the future? I honestly think they view the club not just as a financial asset but also as a foot in the door to the global billionaire club. As Utd owners they get a certain prestige amongst the 1 percenters of the world and all that goes away if they sell. I think they've decided owning Man Utd will open further doors for them in the business world so bad news for us fans.

 

[Garethw]

It seems at least some (if not all) of the Glazer trust fund babies have such a wildly unrealistic price to sell in full and in the present. I have very little faith that rinsing and repeating this process in a few years would yield a different result than now, especially given the reputational damage no transaction after all this would do.

If Ratcliffe strikes a binding agreement that guarantees their grip on this club is removed within 2-3 years, I don't know why we shouldn't all try to get behind that and give him a chance. I fully understand the apprehension towards Ratcliffe and I personally favoured the Jassim bid. This is where we are now though.

It’s because I have no belief that Ratcliffe will push for a full takeover.

I think he’d be more than happy with a 25% stake and sporting control.

Unfortunately it solves non of our financial issues.

 

[pocco]

There’s no deal yet. It’s basically still being negotiated with Ratcliffe in pole position because Qatar have pulled out.

I think it’s still feasible that no deal happens.

It'll get done. It wouldn't get to this stage now if it wasn't going to happen, sounds like last minute discussions to get things in order for running the club, rather than still negotiating.

 

[pocco]

I still dont believe Qatar have pulled out, from what ive read it sounds like they are still very much in the race.

They're done by the sounds of it, and I don't think the Glazers particularly wanted to sell to Jassim.

 

[croadyman]

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The trouble is that longer it takes for Ratcliffe to get ratified by the board,longer we are waiting for a Sporting Director to be appointed. There is also concern when board are happy with top 4 but another owner in Ratcliffe wants success

 

[putzmcgee123]

Who would likely come in on a full sale in 2 years time? (If the Daily Mail story from about 6 weeks ago taking off the market is correct).

Would it be companies like Apple?

That's an excellent question. The serious interest in a controlling stake this go around came from 2 measly parties. I have no idea what they'd expect to find in 2 years if they try again, in the backdrop of no transaction happening the first time. I find it hard to believe they'd see any interest coming from the Gulf states.

I think it's highly unlikely that there will be any binding agreement for a future full sale - maybe they might have some kind of agreement in principle to move towards that but I doubt there will be any guarantees

We shall see ...

I tend to agree when it comes to a full sale, but even a majority would at least represent a material upgrade. The idea of Joel and Avram remaining in any capacity makes my stomach turn, but this is where we are...

 

[NinjaZombie]

feck me it’s depressing being a United fan right now, this bollocks hanging over the entire club, the passing of Sir Bobby Charlton, the problems in the team, every thread on the cafe is so grim it’s hard to look.

The Glazers have sucked the life and joy out of this club, someone said we’ve become like a zombie and that seems really apt, I hope Ratcliffe can destroy the brain of this monster but I fear it’ll be like the scene in Shaun of the dead where they’re throwing records at a zombie in the garden, pointless and futile but bloody funny for those fans of other clubs that are watching.

I’m going to the Winchester to have a nice cold pint and wait for all of this to blow over. How’s that for a slice of fried gold?

That viral thing about men thinking about the fall of the Roman Empire? I do that sometimes but my mind is constantly thinking about the sorry state of affairs the club is in nowadays and I think the fall of United will be constantly on my mind in the years to come.

 

[putzmcgee123]

It'll get done. It wouldn't get to this stage now if it wasn't going to happen, sounds like last minute discussions to get things in order for running the club, rather than still negotiating.

It would be absolutely baffling for it to reach this point and result in no transaction. If it were literally anybody else in the world, I would feel 99% confident that some kind of an agreement would be reached. I just can't shake the lingering fear that the Glazer trust fund babies' unparalleled levels of both incompetence and greed somehow jeopardize this deal.

 

[Lost bear]

I enjoyed this analogy. Thank you.

Likewise. It’s difficult to find much humour in the present state of affairs, but this post managed a little.

 

[putzmcgee123]

I still dont believe Qatar have pulled out, from what ive read it sounds like they are still very much in the race.

What have you read? It seems to have been reported across the board that he withdrew. I don't think he has any reason to do that unless he believes a deal with Ratcliffe is imminent.

 

[samlee86]

Is SJR really borrowing money to finance the deal.

If so we really are ducked aren’t we.

 

[croadyman]

Looks very much like we won't get any clarification on managing the debt and stadium/training ground investment until we get that statement to confirm his 25%

 

[Yorke to Cole]

That's an excellent question. The serious interest in a controlling stake this go around came from 2 measly parties. I have no idea what they'd expect to find in 2 years if they try again, in the backdrop of no transaction happening the first time. I find it hard to believe they'd see any interest coming from the Gulf states.


I tend to agree when it comes to a full sale, but even a majority would at least represent a material upgrade. The idea of Joel and Avram remaining in any capacity makes my stomach turn, but this is where we are...

Something I listened to suggests that the next level ownerships is the Apples, Amazon's etc.. It is related to the technologies and changes to how we watch sport or indeed TV, I guess.

I just hope INEOS get an agreement to aquire full ownership.

 

[sglowrider]

I still dont believe Qatar have pulled out, from what ive read it sounds like they are still very much in the race.

They must be playing some 4D chess then.

 

[putzmcgee123]

Looks very much like we won't get any clarification on managing the debt and stadium/training ground investment until we get that statement to confirm his 25%

I saw it briefly mentioned last week in a few of the articles that they may issue new shares to Ratcliffe as some part of the phased takeover. I wouldn't be surprised to see that happen within the next 1-2 years and put towards those renovations. It makes too much sense not to happen imo. Ratcliffe gets to simultaneously increase his stake and invest in the asset, meanwhile the Glazers are able to continue putting no new investment of their own into the club whilst still getting the infrastructure upgrades they need.

Pure speculation on my part, but I am guessing the first stage will only involve buying some combination of shares from Class A and 4 Glazer siblings that get him to 25% stake, and the next stage may be a capital increase where they dilute and sell new shares to INEOS with money put towards the infrastructure investments.

 

[sglowrider]

Looks very much like we won't get any clarification on managing the debt and stadium/training ground investment until we get that statement to confirm his 25%

None of that will be addressed unless there is some confirmation of future sale --- and I would assume at an agreed price -- which I think is the biggest hurdle. For normal folks, it would be difficult but possible.

But with the greed of the Glazers, agreeing to the future of the value of the rest of the 75% would be a gargantuan task. Failing that, I can't see why INEOS would invest £1.3b.

I really don't think this capital injection is such a sure thing. The devil's in the details as they say.

But Ratcliffe is now dealing with the Glazers who are pretty much the definition of being unscrupulous/cunning with a huge dollop of greed.

Not a good combo.

 

[croadyman]

Surprised that the likes of Pagliuca/Ballmer weren't ever interested in buying us. Could have done with another full sale option on the table after Jassim withdrew.

There will definitely be some disputes in the boardroom between Ratcliffe and the leeches. That's absolutely inevitable when they both want different things for the club