Divock Origi

[Rozay]

I'm not purporting to be an expert on him or anything, and in fact other than on one highlight clip, the only time I'd seen him play was against Algeria the other day.

What I will say is that he gave me that impression you get sometimes when you see a player and you feel you don't need to observe him for two years to know he has something.

For anyone who is more qualified though, how good is he? Or perhaps more specifically, how good can he become?

 

[Ish]

Never heard of him

 

[GledTheRed]

I know this about him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divock_Origi

 

[Rozay]

Never heard of him

Young striker in the Belgian squad.

Any watchers of Ligue 1 @kouroux ?

 

[SilentWitness]

The way some people were talking about him in comparison to Lukaku made me think he was on a similar level in terms of goals. No idea how many full games he's played for his club so that could be a factor but Lukaku has hit 17 + 15 goals in the PL in two seasons which is a great return for a Striker between the ages of 19-21. Origi is 19 now. He did look energetic when he came on though, seems like his all round game is better than Lukakus at the same stage - From watching Lukaku this season his overall game isn't the best, but it's not horrific like some make out, he is a rough diamond.

 

[Elliott]

Thought he looked good against Tunisia, was surprised to learn how young he is. One to watch.

 

[kouroux]

Young striker in the Belgian squad.

Any watchers of Ligue 1 @kouroux ?

I haven't watched a lot but then again he barely played. The few times I did he looked very raw, nothing really stood out about his game.

 

[Rozay]

The way some people were talking about him in comparison to Lukaku made me think he was on a similar level in terms of goals. No idea how many full games he's played for his club so that could be a factor but Lukaku has hit 17 + 15 goals in the PL in two seasons which is a great return for a Striker between the ages of 19-21. Origi is 19 now. He did look energetic when he came on though, seems like his all round game is better than Lukakus at the same stage - From watching Lukaku this season his overall game isn't the best, but it's not horrific like some make out, he is a rough diamond.

I agree with your assessment of Lukaku. He seems a productive Heskey to me, and not what I would call 'naturally gifted'.

In addition to being ridiculously fast, Origi seemed a very good footballer - touch, poise, decision making even. If he has a good goals return he looks like he may have the basics needed to become a top player. Always on the look out for talented young strikers, there seems a shortage just now.

I will continue watching closely.

 

[Ling]

I agree with your assessment of Lukaku. He seems a productive Heskey to me, and not what I would call 'naturally gifted'.

Sorry for OOT, but what you consider as 'natural gift'? From your post I can assume you don't really count body type, strength, ability to win aerial duels and pace as 'natural gift'.

 

[Rozay]

Sorry for OOT, but what you consider as 'natural gift'? From your post I can assume you don't really count body type, strength, ability to win aerial duels and pace as 'natural gift'.

No, I don't. Phil Mitchell has those gifts.

I watch the ball bouncing metres away from Lukaku as he tries to trap it, or his feet get knotted up as he runs with the ball, simple short passes going astray etc and don't feel he is a gifted footballer per se.

I think seemingly effortless technical ability is what I would consider 'naturally gifted'.

 

[Ling]

No, I don't. Phil Mitchell has those gifts.

I watch the ball bouncing metres away from Lukaku as he tries to trap it, or his feet get knotted up as he runs with the ball, simple short passes going astray etc and don't feel he is a gifted footballer per se.

I think seemingly effortless technical ability is what I would consider 'naturally gifted'.

I strongly disagree then. You can learn to control the ball, you cannot learn how to jump high or how to be fast. Those are natural gifts, one that cannot be learned or taught. Messi is gifted for his low center of gravity, exceptional acceleration and instinct. I would agree that it comes more natural for some players to control the ball better, but nothing that would make one player significantly better than the other.

 

[Rozay]

I strongly disagree then. You can learn to control the ball, you cannot learn how to jump high or how to be fast. Those are natural gifts, one that cannot be learned or taught. Messi is gifted for his low center of gravity, exceptional acceleration and instinct. I would agree that it comes more natural for some players to control the ball better, but nothing that would make one player significantly better than the other.

Those qualities do not make you a naturally gifted footballer, they make you a natural athlete. The attributes could be applied to almost any sport, running and jumping is not footballing ability.

Not sure what your Messi example meant, or if it was to imply he isn't what you would call a naturally gifted footballer.

Messi is what you would call a naturally gifted footballer, not Micah Richards.

 

[Ish]

Young striker in the Belgian squad.

Any watchers of Ligue 1 @kouroux ?

Thanks bud. Didn't think he'd even get a look in in that squad.

 

[Ling]

Those qualities do not make you a naturally gifted footballer, they make you a natural athlete. The attributes could be applied to almost any sport, running and jumping is not footballing ability.

Not sure what your Messi example meant, or if it was to imply he isn't what you would call a naturally gifted footballer.

Messi is what you would call a naturally gifted footballer, not Micah Richards.

They are both gifted, Richards with strength and pace, Messi with other stuff. Natural gift/ability is something you cannot learn or be taught, that's in your genes. Best players are usually more gifted than the others.
Example for Messi was that he isn't most technically gifted player, yet he's arguably the best. Same goes for Ronaldo. But it's their physical qualities that separates them from other top footballers. If Bolt could have Messi's close control that came from his low center of gravity, he would probably be the best player. Messi might not have strength, but he's blessed with amazing balance, acceleration and ability to change direction without loosing too much speed. His ability to run with ball close to his feet at almost full speed is amazing. He couldn't learn that, that game naturally for him. Shooting can be learned. To be fair, you can get stronger by going to the gym, but not all people can reach the same level of physical strength/pace. So my point it, as much is technical ability a gift, call it natural gift if you want, so is physical stuff. You cannot separate them. Perfect example is Zidane, amazing technique and body strength, but not the fastest. And he was best in the world.

 

[The Neviller]

No, I don't. Phil Mitchell has those gifts.

I watch the ball bouncing metres away from Lukaku as he tries to trap it, or his feet get knotted up as he runs with the ball, simple short passes going astray etc and don't feel he is a gifted footballer per se.

I think seemingly effortless technical ability is what I would consider 'naturally gifted'.

Pace, body type, ability to win aerial duels. Have you seen Phil Mitchell?

 

[Rozay]

They are both gifted, Richards with strength and pace, Messi with other stuff. Natural gift/ability is something you cannot learn or be taught, that's in your genes. Best players are usually more gifted than the others.
Example for Messi was that he isn't most technically gifted player, yet he's arguably the best. Same goes for Ronaldo. But it's their physical qualities that separates them from other top footballers. If Bolt could have Messi's close control that came from his low center of gravity, he would probably be the best player. Messi might not have strength, but he's blessed with amazing balance, acceleration and ability to change direction without loosing too much speed. His ability to run with ball close to his feet at almost full speed is amazing. He couldn't learn that, that game naturally for him. Shooting can be learned. To be fair, you can get stronger by going to the gym, but not all people can reach the same level of physical strength/pace. So my point it, as much is technical ability a gift, call it natural gift if you want, so is physical stuff. You cannot separate them. Perfect example is Zidane, amazing technique and body strength, but not the fastest. And he was best in the world.

They are both gifted but they are not both gifted footballers. One (Messi of course) is a gifted footballer, the other is a gifted athlete. It does not make Micah Richards a 'naturally gifted FOOTBALLER'. He clearly isn't.

 

[Ling]

They are both gifted but they are not both gifted footballers. One (Messi of course) is a gifted footballer, the other is a gifted athlete. It does not make Micah Richards a 'naturally gifted FOOTBALLER'. He clearly isn't.

So footballers aren't athletes? Football isn't sport?

 

[Rozay]

Pace, body type, ability to win aerial duels. Have you seen Phil Mitchell?

I was taking the piss tbf.

 

[Rozay]

So footballers aren't athletes? Football isn't sport?

Obviously they are. But I imagine Jessica Ennis, no matter how good an athlete she is, isn't particularly gifted at football. Or perhaps she is, by your logic. She can run and jump.

 

[Ling]

Obviously they are. But I imagine Jessica Ennis, no matter how good an athlete she is, isn't particularly gifted at football. Or perhaps she is, by your logic. She can run and jump.

That's her gift bud. Being physically good. If you want to be top footballer, you have to have both, they are both part of 'natural gift'. Like I said, and I won't repeat again, 'natural gift' is something you cannot learn or be taught. You cannot learn to be fast. I can train to be faster, but I will never be able to run below 10'' on 100m sprint. However, I can score a basket from free throw line 9 times out of 10. Does it make me naturally gifted basketball player? No, I worked on my shot year after year until I was safe from that distance. That why I laugh when someone say 'hes naturally gifted shooter'. No, he trained how to shoot, how to be more accurate. Strength of shooting is something you cannot learn. Roberto Carlos had a cannon, that's one of his natural gifts. Heskey was strong as a bull, but his technical ability, or lack of it, made him average at best.

 

[Rozay]

That's her gift bud. Being physically good. If you want to be top footballer, you have to have both, they are both part of 'natural gift'. Like I said, and I won't repeat again, 'natural gift' is something you cannot learn or be taught. You cannot learn to be fast. I can train to be faster, but I will never be able to run below 10'' on 100m sprint. However, I can score a basket from free throw line 9 times out of 10. Does it make me naturally gifted basketball player? No, I worked on my shot year after year until I was safe from that distance. That why I laugh when someone say 'hes naturally gifted shooter'. No, he trained how to shoot, how to be more accurate. Strength of shooting is something you cannot learn. Roberto Carlos had a cannon, that's one of his natural gifts. Heskey was strong as a bull, but his technical ability, or lack of it, made him average at best.

My general point was that Lukaku wasn't gifted at football, not that he wasn't a gifted athlete, mathematician or anything else. I accept that some people are natural athletes. My point was about being naturally gifted at football.

 

[Ling]

My general point was that Lukaku wasn't gifted at football, not that he wasn't a gifted athlete, mathematician or anything else. I accept that some people are natural athletes. My point was about being naturally gifted at football.

I don't understand. So you're saying being good athlete isn't a gift? Take athleticism from Cristiano Ronaldo, what do you have left? Take quick feet and balance from Messi, and what do you have left? Athleticism is part of football, part of most sports. Lukaku is gifted at football. Maybe not technically gifted as Zidane, but he compensate that with strength and pace. Just like young Drogba, Andriano, Shearer, Sherwood and the list goes on. Rare are players like Jan Koller or Ibrahimovic who have both technical ability and physical ability. Anyway, this is boring, I said everything I had and you won't change your opinion and I strongly disagree about your opinion about physicality not being part of football, because that's what you're saying when separating physical part of football from technical part.

 

[Rozay]

I don't understand. So you're saying being good athlete isn't a gift? Take athleticism from Cristiano Ronaldo, what do you have left? Take quick feet and balance from Messi, and what do you have left? Athleticism is part of football, part of most sports. Lukaku is gifted at football. Maybe not technically gifted as Zidane, but he compensate that with strength and pace. Just like young Drogba, Andriano, Shearer, Sherwood and the list goes on. Rare are players like Jan Koller or Ibrahimovic who have both technical ability and physical ability. Anyway, this is boring, I said everything I had and you won't change your opinion and I strongly disagree about your opinion about physicality not being part of football, because that's what you're saying when separating physical part of football from technical part.

*Sigh* I'm not saying good athletism isn't a gift, i'm saying that good athletism is the gift of good athletism and genius technique is the gift of good footballing ability. Given that I am speaking about people who are naturally gifted footballers, and not naturally gifted athletes, or painter and decorators - I do not care much for those who are simply well built or whatever.

Jason Roberts was a gifted athlete but not a gifted footballer. If you don't get that then I give up as I have explained myself as well as I can.

 

[AllezLesDiables]

Lukaku is a very gifted athlete. He has great goal scoring instincts. However, his control/ first touch is mediocre and he had a limited ceiling. Benteke is the best aerial dualist in the world and he has quite an excellent first touch. Touch is something that is an innate gift that can be improved but no matter how much one practices the touch cannot go beyond a certain range.


As for Origi he's burner who is gifted with great touch. He's a different type of player than Lukaku (Poacher) or Benteke (Target man)

 

[Ling]

*Sigh* I'm not saying good athletism isn't a gift, i'm saying that good athletism is the gift of good athletism and genius technique is the gift of good footballing ability. Given that I am speaking about people who are naturally gifted footballers, and not naturally gifted athletes, or painter and decorators - I do not care much for those who are simply well built or whatever.

Jason Roberts was a gifted athlete but not a gifted footballer. If you don't get that then I give up as I have explained myself as well as I can.

I get what you're saying, I just can't understand how you can separate athleticism from being a 'gifted' footballer. Athleticism, technical ability, tactical awareness, I don't know what else, they are all part of being gifted footballer. Anyway, that's it from me, this is one of the most pointless discussions I had in a while.

 

[Rozay]

Got the winner today to put Belgium through, and generally looked much better than Lukaku when he came on. I expect him to replace Lukaku in the lineup before long the way both are playing.

 

[Brwned]

Pretty sure he's already replaced Lukaku following that performance. It'll be interesting to see whether it's his pace and energy against tired legs that makes him look much superior to Lukaku or whether he's simply the better footballer.

 

[Lane]

Quick, okay-ish young forward. Nothing really special or remarkable about him yet. But given his age he can develop into a very good player. His goal return is very poor for the club, but he is very young, so next year or even 15-16 might change it.

 

[Cristiano_RAFC]

Quick, okay-ish young forward. Nothing really special or remarkable about him yet. But given his age he can develop into a very good player. His goal return is very poor for the club, but he is very young, so next year or even 15-16 might change it.

From the interviews I've seen with him, it seems he has regularly been used on the wing which may explain the goal return.

He does get himself into goalscoring positions and he isn't shy to try and take shots so I bet it's only a matter of time before his goalscoring record improves.

He's been fairly new even for Belgians so we too have only been able to witness a limited amount of games from him. The Belgian U19 coach (the international level he was playing at before the world cup) has said that the first thing he noticed about Origi is that he's a very graceful footballer. He's also a very level headed person. He strikes me as the kind of player who can handle pressure which is important.

I thought that Lukaku and Benteke would be fighting it out for the CF spot in the next few years, but with Origi we may have uncovered an even beter striker. I can't wait to see him develop in the next few years.

 

[Paolo Di Canio]

Anybody know if Michy Batshuayi has featured for Belgium in this WC or even made the squad?

 

[Lane]

From the interviews I've seen with him, it seems he has regularly been used on the wing which may explain the goal return.

He does get himself into goalscoring positions and he isn't shy to try and take shots so I bet it's only a matter of time before his goalscoring record improves.

He's been fairly new even for Belgians so we too have only been able to witness a limited amount of games from him. The Belgian U19 coach (the international level he was playing at before the world cup) has said that the first thing he noticed about Origi is that he's a very graceful footballer. He's also a very level headed person. He strikes me as the kind of player who can handle pressure which is important.

I thought that Lukaku and Benteke would be fighting it out for the CF spot in the next few years, but with Origi we may have uncovered an even beter striker. I can't wait to see him develop in the next few years.

A lot of people are playing on the wings and score a lot. Playing on the wing might explain why somebody is not scoring 30+ goals a season. But 2 goals in 26 games is a poor return in any attacking position.
He is young and might get better, of course.

 

[limerickcitykid]

A lot of people are playing on the wings and score a lot. Playing on the wing might explain why somebody is not scoring 30+ goals a season. But 2 goals in 26 games is a poor return in any attacking position.
He is young and might get better, of course.

He's made 30 appearances in the league with his average appearance being 43 minutes. He also scored 5 goals.

 

[AllezLesDiables]

He also just turned 19

 

[AllezLesDiables]

Anybody know if Michy Batshuayi has featured for Belgium in this WC or even made the squad?

No on Michy he was on Standby for the WC

 

[Cristiano_RAFC]

A lot of people are playing on the wings and score a lot. Playing on the wing might explain why somebody is not scoring 30+ goals a season. But 2 goals in 26 games is a poor return in any attacking position.
He is young and might get better, of course.

Don't know where the 2 goals in 26 comes from? He scored 6 goals last season and was often used as a sub too. It's not as impressive as Lukaku's scoring record at the same age (which is better than anyone at that age), but considering the context it's not that terrible.

 

[sincher]

What Divock is all this about?

 

[RoadTrip]

I must admit I wasn't massively impressed by him.

 

[Lane]

He's made 30 appearances in the league with his average appearance being 43 minutes. He also scored 5 goals.

Don't know where the 2 goals in 26 comes from? He scored 6 goals last season and was often used as a sub too. It's not as impressive as Lukaku's scoring record at the same age (which is better than anyone at that age), but considering the context it's not that terrible.

Yep, sorry. I've checked wikipedia to see who this guy is, when he came on against Russia. They usually are reliable when it comes to the stats, but for some strange reason his stats are completely wrong. It says there two goals over two years actually in 26 games.

Checked whoscored. Yeah his record is much better of course, it's okay-ish, esp for a young player i agree.

 

[Rozay]

The main thing for me is I kind of thought he would be all pace, but he looks very skilful and technically gifted. That tells me that coupled with his extreme speed and of course considering his age, he has a chance.

 

[GledTheRed]

Looked very good tonight when he came on.

One to keep an eye on.