e-Signed.
e-petition to release the govt Hillsborough files
- Thread starter Badunk
- Start date
Hillsborough disaster: Families fight to force police to acknowledge cover-up over statements | Football | The Guardian
Someone asked the question: What exactly is the truth ?
Well, there isn't one particular truth that we are looking for. Because what happened at Hillsborough was far more complex than that. The files contain written statements from a lot of the police officers who were on duty that day. So it is hoped a few 'truths' may come out into the public domain as a result. However, many of the statements were doctored & adjusted by senior officers. So it remains to be seen what answers will be gleamed from the aforementioned files.
The article from The Guardian just prior to the 20th Anniversary of the disaster is an excellent read. It's quite lengthy, but it explains why we feel the disclosure of the files is more in the interests of those who seek the truth, rather than those who want to keep it hidden.
Edit : Apologies. I've just noticed The Guardian piece has already been posted.
Someone asked the question: What exactly is the truth ?
Well, there isn't one particular truth that we are looking for. Because what happened at Hillsborough was far more complex than that. The files contain written statements from a lot of the police officers who were on duty that day. So it is hoped a few 'truths' may come out into the public domain as a result. However, many of the statements were doctored & adjusted by senior officers. So it remains to be seen what answers will be gleamed from the aforementioned files.
The article from The Guardian just prior to the 20th Anniversary of the disaster is an excellent read. It's quite lengthy, but it explains why we feel the disclosure of the files is more in the interests of those who seek the truth, rather than those who want to keep it hidden.
Edit : Apologies. I've just noticed The Guardian piece has already been posted.
Perhaps it would have been best to research the basic facts of the case before wading into a sensitive subject with such absolute bollocks? The families are fully behind this. One of the main groups behind the campaign is called "The Hillsborough Family Support Group" for feck sake.
Signed
I find some peoples opinions on this bizarre. Move on etc?
I said it in the other thread its about closure. Sort of reminds me of the Stardust fire in Dublin, took 19 years for the state to respond properly.signed, over 78,000 now!
91,500 have signed so far. Should be done and dusted by midweek.
Signed.. approaching 93000 now
Signed.
Oh, and Sky1981... you may be sure that the victims' families agree with you, but you're definitely wrong.
Oh, and Sky1981... you may be sure that the victims' families agree with you, but you're definitely wrong.
I'd sign but I'm not a UK resident
Good.
I singed it. i feel that full transparency will help to heal those wounds but i don't think there is anything of significant importance in these documents.
Agreed.
Won't be debated until December according to the BBC
The Rawkites are not pleased at all with Lawro:
An Open Letter to 'Lawro' - First post updated with links regarding Hillsborough
An Open Letter to 'Lawro' - First post updated with links regarding Hillsborough
Signed it.
But if I get a dollar for every e-petitions created by the Kings of Petitions I would have enough shares to prevent the Glazers from the takeover.
But if I get a dollar for every e-petitions created by the Kings of Petitions I would have enough shares to prevent the Glazers from the takeover.
BBC Sport's Dan Roan on Twitter - Breaking: Parliament will debate the release of the Hillsborough files for the first time in 13 years on Oct 17th in the Chamber
Anne Williams, the former Chair of the Hillsborough Justice Campaign, appeared on BBC's The One Show last night:
BBC iPlayer - The One Show: 26/09/2011
BBC iPlayer - The One Show: 26/09/2011
That One Show piece was very informative. For example, I hadn't realised that the original enquiry was only concerned with events up to 3:15pm. This means there are lots of unanswered questions regarding the aftermath - e.g. why were ambulances impounded/not available immediately after the accident? Who was responsible for making that decision?
Sky1981, you're probably best shutting up, you're being a bit of a dick.
Sky, who are you to tell the families it's time to move on? You can't speak on their behalf, when you don't even know what they desire from this. It's fair to say, a lot of that is nonsense. People are taking issue with your comments because you are telling people to 'let it go' and 'move on', when you clearly don't know what the families actually want.
I don't think anyone really has the right to tell others to either sign or not to sign, it's entirely up to them what they do. I won't sign it for personal reasons but I can understand why those that have, have.
I dont agree ,that it is time to move on , 96 went to a football game and never came back and the government , the Police have never really given a proper reason why this happened.
If it had happened to United, I don't think there would be one single fan who would say it is time to move on.
Just release the paper's and let them find put what they want to know , be it good or bad , at least they ill know.
If it had happened to United, I don't think there would be one single fan who would say it is time to move on.
Just release the paper's and let them find put what they want to know , be it good or bad , at least they ill know.
If they're released there'll be an awful lit of redaction, some of it might even be declared.
Let's hope that parliament finally does the right thing and these families get to know the truth.
Yes, I signed the petition a while back, if there's something in those unpublished papers that can bring new light on anything, I'm sure the Families of the 96 victims would like to know, no matter how upsetting.
A lot of very young people got crushed on that terrace and that was the worst thought of all for me - the parents of those, particularly, would be absolutely devastated with their loss and may even blame themselves upto a point.
very sad affair.
A lot of very young people got crushed on that terrace and that was the worst thought of all for me - the parents of those, particularly, would be absolutely devastated with their loss and may even blame themselves upto a point.
very sad affair.
Cameron has promised a full disclosure on the Hillsborough disaster ahead of this evening's debate in the Commons. Presumably that means all cabinet minutes will be released.
Nothing less will suffice. Good luck to the families tonight.
IN dusty box files in the House of Lords, there are thousands of badly photocopied papers.
They look inconsequential. They are anything but.
The boxes contain personal *statements from police officers who witnessed at first hand one of the biggest peacetime disasters in our country’s history. They are painful to read, so terrible are the scenes they describe.
One in particular stands out. It is the hand-written statement of PC 227 from Woodseats Police Station. These are his *recollections in those crucial moments just after 3pm on April 15 1989:
“I realised a great tragedy had occurred. I began to feel myself being overcome with emotion, but soon realised I would be of no use to anyone if I felt sorry for myself.
“I was assisted out of the terracing and onto the pitch. I saw several officers wandering about in a dazed and confused state.
“Some were crying and some simply sat on the grass. Members of the public were running about with boarding ferrying people from the pitch to the far end of the ground.”
PC 227’s words evoke the haunting TV images people were later to see replayed time and time again. There can be little doubt of their sincerity.
But they are not the only words on the page. Attached to the top-right corner of the statement is a note from a senior officer. It reads: “Last 2 pages require amending. These are his own *feelings. He also states that PCs were sat down crying when the fans were carrying the dead and injured. This shows they were *organised and we were not. Have PC rewrite last 2 pages excluding the points mentioned.”
These are shocking words. And they go to the heart of the untold story of Hillsborough.
They open the door to *understanding why, 22 years on, people’s sense of injustice is as strong as ever. “They were organised and we were not” – chilling words which transport us back to a different time: an era of “them and us”, when football fans were the “enemy within”.
They reveal an orchestrated campaign to put a slant on the events at Hillsborough so blame was shifted off the authorities and on to the victims, their friends and families.
PC 227’s statement was not the only one amended. So were many more, removing references to police failure on the day such as the lack of proper radio communications.
In today’s Freedom of Information age, it is hard to imagine how, after a disaster in which 96 poor innocent souls lost their lives, the truth could be shaded in this way.
There are many things about Hillsborough forgotten or not widely known which, when reconsidered by the standards of today, would cause a public outcry: How the Sheffield ground didn’t have a safety certificate. How the first lie was told as early as 3.15pm by the officer in charge, claiming Liverpool fans had forced a gate that was opened by the police.
How an order was given that the bodies, including the youngest, should be tested for booze.
How families at *Hillsborough that night were cross-examined as if they had come to identify a suspect, not their loved ones. How a person in authority could sink so low as to brief lies about Liverpool fans to a *newspaper – that they pick-pocketed victims, urinated on police and attacked one giving the kiss of life – and how that newspaper could write them without a shred of *substantiating evidence. Each one of these things, by today’s standards, is a scandal in its own right.
That is why the sense of injustice remains so strong on Merseyside. But, as time passed, the rest of the country began to forget the detail.
But, in 2009, something changed with the memorial service at Anfield for the 20th *anniversary. I had been invited as Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport. I agonised with my brothers about whether I should go.
Hillsborough affected us all on a personal level and no issue matters more to this Everton fan. We were at the other semi-final that day and had many friends at the Liverpool match. I had doubts about whether I could keep my composure.
But I also knew the presence of a minister would be provocative. I didn’t know what I could say convincingly, as I shared the disappointments many had about my own Government’s record on the issue. In the end, I felt I had to be there and I look back at that decision now as the best I have ever made. The reaction of the Kop reminded the rest of the country there was a deep, unresolved *injustice. In advance, with Maria Eagle MP, I had made a call for full disclosure of papers. Next day, I took this call to the Cabinet and received the full backing of Gordon Brown.
The Hillsborough *Independent Panel was *established and ever since it has been painstakingly reviewing all *documents in the tragedy.
But one issue was not adequately resolved – whether the Panel would be able to break precedent and publish Cabinet papers.
It came to the fore in the summer with a Freedom of Information request. At first, it appeared the Government was fighting the ruling from the Information Commissioner to prevent publication.
An e-petition was launched and support for full publication flooded in from all over the land. These 140,000 voices have now swept Hillsborough back to the Commons. If it votes for the motion, the momentum towards *publication of all documents and the whole truth on *Hillsborough will be unstoppable.
I don’t know what they will reveal. But I know enough about *Hillsborough to be clear about one thing: how our country ever allowed the victims of a terrible disaster to be denied their rights and denigrated is a national scandal that will deserve a national response.
For 22 years, despite the obstacles and insults, the families have pursued their campaign with dignity.
None of us should rest until they have finally prevailed.
3Andy Burnham is MP for Leigh and led the campaign for the full disclosure of Hillsborough papers.
Read more: Hillsborough: We'll get justice for tragic 96, writes Andy Burnham - mirror.co.uk
Go Camping for 95p! Vouchers collectable in the Daily and Sunday Mirror until 11th August . Click here for more information
They look inconsequential. They are anything but.
The boxes contain personal *statements from police officers who witnessed at first hand one of the biggest peacetime disasters in our country’s history. They are painful to read, so terrible are the scenes they describe.
One in particular stands out. It is the hand-written statement of PC 227 from Woodseats Police Station. These are his *recollections in those crucial moments just after 3pm on April 15 1989:
“I realised a great tragedy had occurred. I began to feel myself being overcome with emotion, but soon realised I would be of no use to anyone if I felt sorry for myself.
“I was assisted out of the terracing and onto the pitch. I saw several officers wandering about in a dazed and confused state.
“Some were crying and some simply sat on the grass. Members of the public were running about with boarding ferrying people from the pitch to the far end of the ground.”
PC 227’s words evoke the haunting TV images people were later to see replayed time and time again. There can be little doubt of their sincerity.
But they are not the only words on the page. Attached to the top-right corner of the statement is a note from a senior officer. It reads: “Last 2 pages require amending. These are his own *feelings. He also states that PCs were sat down crying when the fans were carrying the dead and injured. This shows they were *organised and we were not. Have PC rewrite last 2 pages excluding the points mentioned.”
These are shocking words. And they go to the heart of the untold story of Hillsborough.
They open the door to *understanding why, 22 years on, people’s sense of injustice is as strong as ever. “They were organised and we were not” – chilling words which transport us back to a different time: an era of “them and us”, when football fans were the “enemy within”.
They reveal an orchestrated campaign to put a slant on the events at Hillsborough so blame was shifted off the authorities and on to the victims, their friends and families.
PC 227’s statement was not the only one amended. So were many more, removing references to police failure on the day such as the lack of proper radio communications.
In today’s Freedom of Information age, it is hard to imagine how, after a disaster in which 96 poor innocent souls lost their lives, the truth could be shaded in this way.
There are many things about Hillsborough forgotten or not widely known which, when reconsidered by the standards of today, would cause a public outcry: How the Sheffield ground didn’t have a safety certificate. How the first lie was told as early as 3.15pm by the officer in charge, claiming Liverpool fans had forced a gate that was opened by the police.
How an order was given that the bodies, including the youngest, should be tested for booze.
How families at *Hillsborough that night were cross-examined as if they had come to identify a suspect, not their loved ones. How a person in authority could sink so low as to brief lies about Liverpool fans to a *newspaper – that they pick-pocketed victims, urinated on police and attacked one giving the kiss of life – and how that newspaper could write them without a shred of *substantiating evidence. Each one of these things, by today’s standards, is a scandal in its own right.
That is why the sense of injustice remains so strong on Merseyside. But, as time passed, the rest of the country began to forget the detail.
But, in 2009, something changed with the memorial service at Anfield for the 20th *anniversary. I had been invited as Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport. I agonised with my brothers about whether I should go.
Hillsborough affected us all on a personal level and no issue matters more to this Everton fan. We were at the other semi-final that day and had many friends at the Liverpool match. I had doubts about whether I could keep my composure.
But I also knew the presence of a minister would be provocative. I didn’t know what I could say convincingly, as I shared the disappointments many had about my own Government’s record on the issue. In the end, I felt I had to be there and I look back at that decision now as the best I have ever made. The reaction of the Kop reminded the rest of the country there was a deep, unresolved *injustice. In advance, with Maria Eagle MP, I had made a call for full disclosure of papers. Next day, I took this call to the Cabinet and received the full backing of Gordon Brown.
The Hillsborough *Independent Panel was *established and ever since it has been painstakingly reviewing all *documents in the tragedy.
But one issue was not adequately resolved – whether the Panel would be able to break precedent and publish Cabinet papers.
It came to the fore in the summer with a Freedom of Information request. At first, it appeared the Government was fighting the ruling from the Information Commissioner to prevent publication.
An e-petition was launched and support for full publication flooded in from all over the land. These 140,000 voices have now swept Hillsborough back to the Commons. If it votes for the motion, the momentum towards *publication of all documents and the whole truth on *Hillsborough will be unstoppable.
I don’t know what they will reveal. But I know enough about *Hillsborough to be clear about one thing: how our country ever allowed the victims of a terrible disaster to be denied their rights and denigrated is a national scandal that will deserve a national response.
For 22 years, despite the obstacles and insults, the families have pursued their campaign with dignity.
None of us should rest until they have finally prevailed.
3Andy Burnham is MP for Leigh and led the campaign for the full disclosure of Hillsborough papers.
Read more: Hillsborough: We'll get justice for tragic 96, writes Andy Burnham - mirror.co.uk
Go Camping for 95p! Vouchers collectable in the Daily and Sunday Mirror until 11th August . Click here for more information
Good post, mate. The latter sections in bold makes for appalling reading.
Disgusting, isn't it?
Hopefully it shows why the families didn't just 'get on with their lives', as has been suggested.
Hopefully it shows why the families didn't just 'get on with their lives', as has been suggested.
The line about testing the bodies for alcohol is terribly disturbing, and not just on an 'obvious' level. The police authorities were actively looking to deflect blame from the very start, it seems.
Liverpool MP Steve Rotheram speaking brilliantly right now.
I hope the families get justice but knowing this country as I do, I fear the worst.
I hope I'm wrong.
I hope I'm wrong.
fecking right he is. Full page Sun apology being called for. He's almost in tears now reading out the names.