Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager

[bosnian_red]

Yes Elanga. On the right with Rashford up front. Worked against Liverpool.
Also his midfield selection was also puzzling.

Look, again I like ETH and I'm not worried about finishing top 4 as I do think we'll finish top 4 this season. However, my post was mainly directed at those that believe we don't have a good enough team to finish top 4 and as if he should be untouchable regardless of our performances this season and where we finish.

Villa is a different team to Liverpool, they don't push up high. Rashford up top works in big games, not against teams who sit back. It made sense, didn't work, it is what it is.

Ten hag should be untouchable as long as he shows progress and we play well, whether we get top 4 or not. It's a process. It takes time. We aren't going to go from last season and the Mish Mash squad into his best form. The improvement speed already has been remarkable to be honest. Also - it's not just us in this top 4 race? Arteta after 3 years with Arsenal finally has them playing well and in a title race with City and Pep, who we don't need to talk about of course as we can only hope we get to a point where Ten Hag can be anything near Pep and our squads can in any way be comparable.

And then there's Klopp and Liverpool. Conte and Spurs. Chelsea with Potter now. All top managers. All but Potter further along in their process and squad building than United. And besides - I'd say in the current situation in the league, we're pretty much looking favourites for 3rd as things stand. So again. Not sure what the big deal is. We'll lose some games of course. An away game to Villa with a new (very good) manager where we are missing 5 key players after an excellent run from us, it's hardly a surprise that this is where we slipped up.

 

[fezzerUTD]

Why would you try to give a feck when you see Ronaldo acting the way he does and then captaining the side.

 

[Telsim]

I'm just not buying that we can't be better than the 9th best team in terms of performance metrics. The team can't be that bad.

What exactly has given you this notion? The negative GD? 9th place in xG? Second to last in progressive passing, in the company of Soton and Forest? The differences between this time last season are we are marginally better defensively, while being worse offensively. This is after spending more than 200 million this summer.

 

[BarryWinks]

Playing the (more or less) same team every game still won't work.

Think a sensible approach, at least as long as we're still struggling and not winning matches convincingly, is only rotating single players. Play Fred over Eriksen today. Elanga over Ronaldo on Thursday and so on. It doesn't disrupt the whole team as long as we aren't settled in the system.

It was one of Ajax fans main complaint about ETH, and I have a feeling he will find out the very hard way that playing the same XI all the time doesn't work in the PL with EL and two cups

I get your point, but not sure managers see it like that. At least not that black and white. It is a result oriented business and most managers want to have a definite first eleven - for team cohesion, better understanding etc. There's a reason certain managers have earned themselves the name "tinkerman", and in all those cases their fans biggest complaint of them is how much they chop and change their eleven.

 

[OrcaFat]

I think ETH is not that bothered, deep down, to lose some of these games. As long as the better players are following his instructions, he is content.

That said, he is a winner and hates to lose, of course, but I think he is clever enough to look at the long term curve. He needs several more good players for the squad and 2 or 3 to go straight into the team. Defeats like today, when we are weakened, reminds the board that ETH is not a magician and there’s a lot of work still to be done.

Very disappointing today, either way.

 

[I’m loving my life]

Early signs he's just not good enough as other managers before him. Shambolic selection and absolutely no pattern of play after more than 20 games and full preseason. Ronaldo as a captain finishing the game. Absolutely not good enough and match fit VDB starting instead of Fred. The msot error prone and passive CB we had in our history Lindelof starting ahead of Maguire etc.

He's just pathetic,it's another game to the long list of the ones we fluked a goal out of nothing after not being able to create a single big chance.

Yep he will get a chance beyond this season but so far he just seems like an okay manager who dominated his One-team league because of the players founds and club structure at his disposal, rather then another big thing and talented manager who could finally implement his style for a former top club like ours. We are becoming mediocre and it's only down to managers decisions now.

Jesus this is such a distorted version of the truth. There were definitely mistakes today and at other times this season but he is also definitely changing the way we play too. Personnel is a massive problem, as is the extraordinary fixture structure this season. Writing him off now is crazy

 

[The United]

The inclusion of DVB in the starting line up while omitting Fred was pretty strange. Yes, he may rate DVB. Yes, DVB may need playing time. But you don't start someone of his quality and give him game times like that in games like these.

 

[Andersonson]

I’m not sure if you noticed, we needed to win by two clear goals.

I know, but if you start your best players they shouldnt need to play the next game 2.5 days later and be expected to be fully ready, because they will not be. Its that easy. They dont recover that fast

 

[devilish]

Watch him start Cristiano against Fulham with some pathetic excuse how he did great in training or whatever. Hopefully I'm wrong, but something feels off in the way he's been treating Cristiano after Tottenham match.

You are probably right

 

[Luka Mora]

You have to be blind not to see all the good he's brought
Our team play and defense is massively improved. We keep possession well. Our attack is hampered by having 4 players out, with only Rashford today being any sort of important player in the whole attack. The rest are bench players at best, or with Donny and Ronaldo, counting their last days as United players. And then the bench, was another who is on his last days in Elanga.

He's done good no doubt but like ETH, good is not good enough for United and people have a right to be questioning his decisions in recent weeks which have been bizarre. All I'm saying is faith and trust has to be earned, not blindly given.

 

[Ace of Spades]

Needs to make the big calls. Players need to be on the pitch based on performance, not reputation. Fred actually had some good games, not sure why he is now frozen again and VDB is playing.

 

[bosnian_red]

Early signs he's just not good enough as other managers before him. Shambolic selection and absolutely no pattern of play after more than 20 games and full preseason. Ronaldo as a captain finishing the game. Absolutely not good enough and match fit VDB starting instead of Fred. The msot error prone and passive CB we had in our history Lindelof starting ahead of Maguire etc.

He's just pathetic,it's another game to the long list of the ones we fluked a goal out of nothing after not being able to create a single big chance.

Yep he will get a chance beyond this season but so far he just seems like an okay manager who dominated his One-team league because of the players founds and club structure at his disposal, rather then another big thing and talented manager who could finally implement his style for a former top club like ours. We are becoming mediocre and it's only down to managers decisions now.

fecking hell this has to be a WUM
You do realize that we are level with 3rd in the league since the first 2 games that were obviously a very different squad and mental state? Just 3 points off city? Excellent big game performances? Had the toughest fixture run by a distance in the league so far, playing pretty much everyone from the top half and almost nobody from the bottom half?

You do realize that we were lacking a plethora of key players today, that we had to play our 5th and 6th choice attackers and had to push Rashford on the right because otherwise you're putting an 18 year old out of position on his debut? Probably not, you seem like you don't actually watch the game and just scream with your head in the sand anytime something bad happens, which has hardly happened this season. But here you come after 1 loss

 

[hellhunter]

Needs to make the big calls. Players need to be on the pitch based on performance, not reputation. Fred actually had some good games, not sure why he is now frozen again and VDB is playing.

It feels like ETH is pretty set on their positions. Eriksen and Fred are CMs, VDB is a 10 in his book. So with Bruno being out, it seems like the only replacement for ETH was VDB. Not saying I agree with that, mind

 

[King7Eric]

Got to say he got it wrong today. Rashford is a proven liability on the right. Elanga doesn't offer much but at least can hold the width down that side and should have started. Garnacho was kept on for far too long as he wasn't getting any change out of Cash. It's to be expected he's a kid and will get better but should have been hooked at HT. Eriksen will get exposed at CM in these kind of games and well DVB is a proven nothing player so don't know why he started. Lindelof is another one I don't understand starting. Maguire is rubbish but Lindelof for me has always been far worse.

To be fair the injuries severely hampered us today and with a full strength team we probably win this one, but the concerning thing was ETH sticking to the same formation despite the personnel just not being there. Hopefully he learns from this and becomes more adaptable going forward.

 

[Augustus Gloop]

Our first defeat since City in September and people are turning on him? This forum is sad sometimes.

The City defeat was at the beginning of October.

I think Ten Hag deserves criticism - his line-up’s have been suspect in the last few games and today we were wretched. The midfield is stacked enough that you can move Eriksen in to no.10 or put Fred further forward. No excuse for playing Ronaldo and VDB.

 

[shabin_d_great]

We have been starting matches like this for some one time now..slow and ok one pace. Just that today opposition was quicker to exploit it. If Moyes had it in him to start fast then last week would have been different.

 

[dubplate warrior]

People are way too reactionary on this forum. There's going to be setbacks and shitty results. You have to take the rough with the smooth folks.

 

[fergies coat]

Early signs he's just not good enough as other managers before him. Shambolic selection and absolutely no pattern of play after more than 20 games and full preseason. Ronaldo as a captain finishing the game. Absolutely not good enough and match fit VDB starting instead of Fred. The msot error prone and passive CB we had in our history Lindelof starting ahead of Maguire etc.

He's just pathetic,it's another game to the long list of the ones we fluked a goal out of nothing after not being able to create a single big chance.

Yep he will get a chance beyond this season but so far he just seems like an okay manager who dominated his One-team league because of the players founds and club structure at his disposal, rather then another big thing and talented manager who could finally implement his style for a former top club like ours. We are becoming mediocre and it's only down to managers decisions now.

If you can't see improvements in our play I suggest you give up watching football. How did this person manage to get promoted? Seriously.

 

[phelans shorts]

I know, but if you start your best players they shouldnt need to play the next game 2.5 days later and be expected to be fully ready, because they will not be. Its that easy. They dont recover that fast

Ok, so who should have played today instead then?

This is just going to go round in circles, we don’t rotate because our bench isn’t up to scratch yet, and then players get leggy and don’t perform up to scratch. At the end of the day the problem you’re talking about all stems back to our attackers being abysmal when Sociedad came to Old Trafford. It made every game in the competition a must win and put unnecessary miles in the legs.

 

[fezzerUTD]

I wonder what’s going on behind the scene. How does a manager go from making absolutely the correct decisions, suspending a player and getting the backing of an entire fan base… to playing that player for 90mins 3 games in a row and making him captain … the media need to get an answer on that. Baffling.

4 games in a row. Media want us to lose, Eth is playing right into their hands .

 

[Waynne]

Our first defeat since City in September and people are turning on him? This forum is sad sometimes.

Starting Ronaldo and making him captain after the diciplinary action against him not too long ago.
Rashford played out to the right.
Starting Van De Beek.
Taking 2 days to make a subsitution.

This looked like a loss the moment the team sheet was read out.

 

[jem]

It's pathetic that people are turning on him - it's the same as any cretin claiming that Martinez is shit and has been overhyped (yes somebody actually said it in the match thread.) Of course, he's going to have rough days as he sets about molding the squad in his image (and think about where this squad was just 6 months ago.)

 

[dove]

Needs to make the big calls. Players need to be on the pitch based on performance, not reputation. Fred actually had some good games, not sure why he is now frozen again and VDB is playing.

I think he tried to make big calls with Ronaldo but I would guess he got some words from the people above him, no other explanation. I just don’t believe ETH went from being visibly pissed at him and dropping from the squad to basically become untouchable in any other way, especially considering that our performances go completely to shite when he plays.

 

[Tony247]

Was an avoidable loss. Bruno and Antony press and contribute immensely in defense. If both not there then obvious choice should be Fred, not lazy arse clueless VdB. Rashford on right is criminal offense. He usually offers nothing to defense. Dalot was isolated against a speedy winger.

Other thing, Martinez will be ruined if he keeps playing every other day in such intense games.

 

[MinGin]

He doesn’t offer anything. Literally would be better to have another midfielder on, or go 352/343 to grind out a draw/try and hit them on a counter. Some of the goals could have been prevented with another midfielder/defender out there.

For the man management, Ronaldo would make a lot of trouble in the dressing room when he sit on the bench so often (And he did already before).
Also, we cannot afford 3 CB on the field and no CB in the bench.
This season is just projecting that our bench is so thin and less quantity.

 

[bosnian_red]

He's done good no doubt but like ETH, good is not good enough for United and people have a right to be questioning his decisions in recent weeks which have been bizarre. All I'm saying is faith and trust has to be earned, not blindly given.

What's bizarre? Bruno is out. Van de Beek had to get a chance at some point. Antony, Sancho and Martial were out (martial finally back on the bench). He gave Garnacho a start, who is an 18 year old. So you don't put him out of position.

It's perfectly logical going with what we did. It didn't work in attack, but like... We had 4 key attackers out, so what do you expect? Take de Bruyne, Haaland, Foden and mahrez out from city's team, and you bet they'd fecking feel that. But even still, Pep has been there for a long time, and has built a squad that he could still pick from Alvarez, Grealish, Bernardo Silva. We have.... A geriatric Ronaldo who is the worst striker in the league this season, an 18 year old Garnacho, Elanga who is a championship player, and van de Beek getting a chance for the first time. Because you might as well since the others are all out.

Have some perspective. It's a loss. It happens. We hadn't conceded from open play in 7 games. We were unbeaten for 9 games. Villa just got a new manager who is a very good manager whole we had a bunch of absences. If you can't understand that we'll have some bad games now and then, let alone all things considered, then you and everyone else here losing their shit are ridiculous.

 

[Telsim]

Twice now terrible selection. Why does Ronaldo keep starting? Why is he captain? Why was Fred phased out after a brilliant Chelsea game? Why is Rashford on the right? Surely, surely he offers more in the middle, than on the right? You are telling me that Ronaldo in the middle and Rashford on the right is better than Rashford in the middle and Elanga on the right? Yeah, right. And this after Ronaldo's temper tantrum, which has obviously worked for one reason or another.

 

[RedDevilQuebecois]

Our first defeat since City in September and people are turning on him? This forum is sad sometimes.

People have more problems with team selection today, especially starting VDB (with not enough playing minutes) in midfield instead of Fred/McTominay and leaving Ronaldo on the pitch when it was obvious that nothing was going right there.

 

[OrcaFat]

Yes Elanga. On the right with Rashford up front. Worked against Liverpool. Even if you want to start Ronaldo, you switch Garnacho and Rashford, Garnacho was getting a lot of space down the left and a simple instruction for Rashford and Garnacho to switch sides was enough, we wasted too many dangerous attacking situations down our left today because of bad decision making by Garnacho and the inability to beat his man...
Also his midfield selection was puzzling.

Look, again I like ETH and I'm not worried about finishing top 4 as I do think we'll finish top 4 this season. However, my post was mainly directed at those that believe we don't have a good enough team to finish top 4 and as if he should be untouchable regardless of our performances this season and where we finish.

Interesting points. I think we have a chance of top 4 but I wouldn’t rush to disagree with the idea that the squad is not up to it. It would be no shock and probably not even below par to finish 5th or 6th. If we do finish higher, it’s a good effort from ETH. I think we can do it but the squad quality is not good enough to expect it.

 

[Judas]

I hope he doesn’t persist on trying to make Donny happen, I can’t get over what a nothingy footballer he is. And today was one of his better games!

 

[KiD MoYeS]

I expect him to quickly drop Ronaldo and van de Beek.

 

[RuudTom83]

Playing a back 3 for large parts of the game on Thursday was always going to kill that trio.

Today came around too quickly and the team wasn't physically and mentally fresh enough to cope with Villa who were enjoying the new-manager bounce.

Simple.

 

[Chairman Steve]

Madness if people want him sacked if we don’t finish Top 4. Competition for those spots is as high as ever, not to mention factoring in a season structure that has never ever happened.

We’re progressing just fine and it doesn’t help that we’re playing a game almost every 3 days because a Winter World Cup has thrown a huge spanner in everyone’s season preparations. I think ETH wants to establish that his strongest XI are in sync with eachother before adventuring in trying the rotation players. Attack and defence are really weak depth wise. Varane and Martinez to Lindelof and Maguire is a huge drop in quality, as is Dalot to AWB (someone who ETH really doesnt rate).

Everyone can see that Ronaldo is a huge hinderance to us on the field. Even the most anti-United fans begrudgingly acknowledge that. I’m sure ETH is counting the days when he can finally be rid of him and replace him with someone else.

 

[pascell]

It's pathetic that people are turning on him - it's the same as any cretin claiming that Martinez is shit and has been overhyped (yes somebody actually said it in the match thread.) Of course, he's going to have rough days as he sets about molding the squad in his image (and think about where this squad was just 6 months ago.)

We've scored 28 goals in 19 games, his selections and subs have been questionable at times, Ronaldo who turned his back on the team the other week is captain today, people have the right to question him.

I've wanted him as manager since Ole got the boot, but even today made me feel apprehensive about this season.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

The caf is as rational as ever.

 

[bosnian_red]

Playing a back 3 for large parts of the game on Thursday was always going to kill that trio.

Today came around too quickly and the team wasn't physically and mentally fresh enough to cope with Villa who were enjoying the new-manager bounce.

Simple.

Not to mention that we aren't an invincible level team yet who can achieve massive consistency. Which is unreasonable to expect anyway. Not to mention having 4 key attacking injuries. And a key CB injury. The meltdown is ridiculous.

 

[MadDogg]

Not sure why so many people are complaining about Ronaldo starting. With Antony, Sancho and Bruno out, and Martial not fit to start, Ronaldo and Rashford were certainties. The choice was which of the kids did we play with them, and unfortunately ETH made the decision to 'sacrifice' Rashford onto the right to play Garnacho. If Garnacho isn't suited to play on the right then either Elanga or Pellistri should have played instead.

I fully expect Ronaldo to start getting dropped again once our other attackers are actually fit. Despite what some want I don't think he'll be completely frozen out, but it'll be back to how things were earlier in the season where he gets rotated (with most of his starts tending to be in easier games).

Ronaldo being the captain is a bit different and I do think De Gea should have got the armband. Even though I don't like him in that role either.

 

[Cela]

Early signs he's just not good enough as other managers before him. Shambolic selection and absolutely no pattern of play after more than 20 games and full preseason. Ronaldo as a captain finishing the game. Absolutely not good enough and match fit VDB starting instead of Fred. The msot error prone and passive CB we had in our history Lindelof starting ahead of Maguire etc.

He's just pathetic,it's another game to the long list of the ones we fluked a goal out of nothing after not being able to create a single big chance.

Yep he will get a chance beyond this season but so far he just seems like an okay manager who dominated his One-team league because of the players founds and club structure at his disposal, rather then another big thing and talented manager who could finally implement his style for a former top club like ours. We are becoming mediocre and it's only down to managers decisions now.

Wow, this is hash. The past three performances have not been good but surely there has been obvious improvements in how we control games.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Got to back this manager.

I think the problem now is fatigue and ETH knows it, which is why he is desperately trying to rotate. Problem is we don't have the quality. VDB is shite. Maguire is shite in defence, worth a try in attack mid week. Just to rest some legs.

 

[Irwin99]

Sounds annoyed at the defending and the collective 'not following the plan' from the post match.