Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager

[Abraxas]

Thing is, I'm pretty sure there were reports on ETH having complete authority in incoming players prior to him being hired.

Could be.

From a logical point of view I thought the club's idea was to allow him a lot of authority in the first season, to quickly get us up to speed in the market.

With Murtough taking on more responsibility there was talk of improving the recruitment and having an overarching approach that supercedes the manager and gives continuity. But I'm inclined to think little has changed except some window dressing (new data analytics people etc). Still too much decision making power by the manager. I personally don't think a competent recruitment department have Amrabat that far up a list all summer, I think that's manager rather than scouting and data driven. So either he's convincing them to reccomend a player like that or he is able to put forward a suggestion and it doesn't get much if any pushback. Onana is someone he knows. Mount he saw in Holland, but that's a fairly tenuous link I suppose, but it's certainly not a signing that required much lateral thinking.

 

[The Hilton]

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This is a great video, and shows one of our main problems, both against Wolves and Spurs - some of the players are really struggling to adapt to what's required of them when pressing. In particular, so many on this forum are placing the blame on Mount and the midfield setup when the press is broken, but Rashford and Garnacho are letting the side down by not pressing when they should, which opens gaps for opposition teams to waltz through the middle.

The problem gets more pronounced when things are going badly for us - after the Spurs goal several players were reverting to what they know best, trying to be really direct and settling into last years more pragmatic shape.

 

[TsuWave]

watching other teams play is just pissing me off all over again

 

[mav_9me]

Yeah I don't like how our players lose composure when chasing games. Ties in with their lack of composure when finishing chances.

That 2nd half went to shit the moment we started losing the ball by spraying it all over. Can't press all the time, need to rest in possession. Also the more they have the ball the more we have to press.

 

[Castia]

Look at the technical level of their squad. Can you see players losing the ball recklessly like Bruno or Casemiro or Rashford or Garnacho or Wan Bissaka

Not anymore but last season for sure. Sterling couldn’t beat a defender last season he’s dancing around this West Ham defence today

They have an unproven striker and young kid on the left wing and everything they do seems to be with a purpose, every player seems to know his role.

We look like a team of strangers who don’t even follow a tactic, I mean players aren't even following the basics like making runs off the ball or moving into space it’s bizarre

 

[Mickeza]

watching other teams play is just pissing me off all over again

Yeah - West Ham are winding me right up.

 

[Marwood]

Our recruitment has been woeful for a decade. Ten Hag being wary of our scouts is pretty justified.

Is that down to bad scouts or previous managers also ignoring the scouts?

 

[Castia]

Not to pick on you but I see this from a lot of people. Not sure why. The identity is clear. We want to press high, regain the ball more in thier half for quick turnovers and attacks. The other part of that is what's lacking right now, which is the ability to keep the ball, patience, probing with the ball. Fairly similar approach to City and Arsenal. Except it isn't working great right now.

The first half gave a glimpse of how we want to play. 2nd half everything went to shit.

Thats what I keep hearing but it’s not happening and hasn’t happened in 12 months. We don’t press as a team it’s all disjointed. Will Rashford bother to press? will the midfielders close the space and press through the middle? you can flip a coin because there’s a 50-50 chance. It seems to be if the player can be arsed running to close down or not

And then when we actually have the ball incredibly we look even worse. Passing sucks, movement sucks, runs in behind suck….hell even Onana seems to pass it to AWB at right back 90% of the time….the opposition are delighted to see our right back who isn’t comfortable on the ball starting attacks it’s a complete mess

 

[Its all gone Shane Long]

So who is ETH out then? Certainly not me yet

 

[Marwood]

Just watching Chelsea who have a new manager and what feels like 50 new players and they looked settled with a game plan and tactic that lets them dominate games

I just don’t understand that after 12 months and 2 pre seasons we don’t seem to have an identity or way of playing it’s unacceptable

You can't have an identity with players who don't look after the ball. Well the only identity you can have in that scenario is Dyche/Allardyce.

Beyond that its impossible to create a style when your front four are only interested in that last pass or shot.

What I can't understand is ETH going for another midfielder(Mount) who doesn't like being in the ball. It's crazy stuff. A complete repeat of existing midfielders.

We needed the exact opposite of that.

 

[Castia]

You can't have an identity with players who don't look after the ball. Well the only identity you can have in that scenario is Dyche/Allardyce.

Beyond that its impossible to create a style when your front foor are only interested in that last pass or shot.

What I can't understand is ETH going for another midfielder(Mount) who doesn't like being in the ball. It's crazy stuff. A complete repeat of existing midfielders.

We needed the exact opposite of that.

Yeah I agree

I really like Mount but I have no idea how ETH is trying to play with essentially 5 front players who cant look after the ball.

Infuriating and Ming boggling I don’t know what he’s trying to do

 

[JediSith]

Yeah Antony is the prime example

I think Antony is one of the better players in regards to playing the system. Can he and should he improve his end product? Yes. But look at the position that is his primary responsibility more often than not that’s an area where we are usually in control of the play.

Similar with Mount. look at what the media have called him out on: 0 goals, 0 shots 0 assists. But if you look at our play in the areas of his responsibility again he’s not doing a terrible job. Room for improving? Yes. But too much emphasis is placed on stats.

If a player takes 10 shots from 25 yards a match. It might look good, but most of the time they are just wasting possession when really they had better options doesn’t have to be a killer a pass. Being able to recycle possession in the final third until there’s an opening is actually the most difficult and important skill. It’s what City do fantastically, it’s what Barcelona under Pep were known for. Iniesta one of the best attacking CM’s had very low assists/goals.

The problem with United is to often we try to force the shot or killer pass. And many of our fans, media and pundits and up rating the players that do so and waste possession while views those that play with more structure and patience as being rubbish.

 

[AshRK]

Thats what I keep hearing but it’s not happening and hasn’t happened in 12 months. We don’t press as a team it’s all disjointed. Will Rashford bother to press? will the midfielders close the space and press through the middle? you can flip a coin because there’s a 50-50 chance. It seems to be if the player can be arsed running to close down or not

And then when we actually have the ball incredibly we look even worse. Passing sucks, movement sucks, runs in behind suck….hell even Onana seems to pass it to AWB at right back 90% of the time….the opposition are delighted to see our right back who isn’t comfortable on the ball starting attacks it’s a complete mess

Rashford as number 9 will never work if we want to be a pressing side. I will wait to see how we do with Hojlund before passing any judgment.

 

[UnitedSofa]

I have seen it suggested on Facebook that he should give the leeches an ultimatum of either give me the midfielder and backup ST or I will walk away from this mess

Maybe he should do that much like Jassim needs to give them an ultimatum in terms of offers

There we have it! The first EtH "will walk away" fantasy land drivel of the season!

 

[PoTMS]

How has he looked at Chelsea and thought it's Mount we need and not Kovacic? Only double the cost too.

 

[Moston Red]

Wasting millions on Antony, and over paying for an average player in mount when we clearly needed strikers, worries me slightly.

 

[UnitedSofa]

How has he looked at Chelsea and thought it's Mount we need and not Kovacic? Only double the cost too.

Why is the 'grass is always greener' on this forum?

If we'd have bought Kovacic he'd have been heavily criticised, more so than Mount probably too

 

[UnitedSofa]

Wasting millions on Antony, and over paying for an average player in mount when we clearly needed strikers, worries me slightly.

We got Hojland.

We needed midfielders too, can't rely on Erikson to play a full season

 

[Mercurial]

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Was Rashy like this entire game?

 

[Blood Mage]

So who is ETH out then? Certainly not me yet

I don't think anyone is yet but a lot of us are starting to ask questions and it's understandable.

 

[PoTMS]

Why is the 'grass is always greener' on this forum?

If we'd have bought Kovacic he'd have been heavily criticised, more so than Mount probably too

He's a far superior player at half the cost and wait for it, a player we actually needed.

 

[UnitedSofa]

I don't think anyone is yet but a lot of us are starting to ask questions and it's understandable.

football fans are fickle. opinion changes with the fecking wind

 

[UnitedSofa]

He's a far superior player at half the cost and wait for it, a player we actually needed.

Then why was it Mount and not Kovacic who was Chelseas POTY 2 seasons in a row?

 

[el3mel]

You don't start that criticism from the new managers game 2 and that's the point. So don't blame the people who question your motive .

That's not his second game. That's his 64th one and yet still no clear plan whatsoever. Moreover, our form has been going steadily downhill ever since that much celebrated league cup. We are regressing, not progressing. The current form is just more of the same coming from the end of last season.

 

[el3mel]

Can't be arsed to have a tedious and incredibly boring conversation about tactics when we're all just randoms on a forum.

Yeah, instead let's keep saying "3rd and league cup" repeatedly because that's the only thing we can say.

 

[devips]

Let's bring David Moyes back. His side is beating Chelsea.

He is the flavour of the day.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Chelsea are losing to 10 men West Ham. Why can't we be more like them?

 

[Mercurial]

Out of curiosity, those that want EtH out, who do you want in instead, and what type of play should that manager go for?

 

[bosnian_red]

Yeah, instead let's keep saying "3rd and league cup" repeatedly because that's the only thing we can say.

And showing our very positive underlying stats, excellent home record, deep cup runs, multiple good big game performances (albeit at home, or Barca away too). Better pressing tactics throughout the season. Far better deep build up this season now that Onana is here. Once Hojlund gets integrated I'd expect a drastic improvement in attack too, as he's an actual CF. Pretending to not see the positives is deliberately ignoring them at this point.

Will it be enough to take enough steps up to compete at the top, no idea. You need some truly world class attackers for that IMO. At least one. So that pretty much means Hojlund needs to turn into an elite CF. But being a 4-8th range team in Europe is where I think we'll find ourselves this season, while being a 1-3 is the ultimate goal and ultimate challenge.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Really impressive stuff from Poch and Chelsea. ten Hag please take note.

 

[El-Manos]

This is his actual real first test but those asking for a sack already need to get it their heads checked.

 

[VP89]

Are you seriously saying our form between Carabao cup final to end of season was good or even good enough?

We made getting top 4 a question near the end when it wasn't in Feb

Im seriously saying that out season under Ten Hag was a big step up, and he's allowed to have peaks and troughs within that period.

 

[Cee90]

Really surprised to see some of the reaction on here towards ETH. I still believe he’s the man, really do, but obviously cannot deny that we have a lot of issues atm.

 

[mav_9me]

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[el3mel]

And showing our very positive underlying stats, excellent home record, deep cup runs, multiple good big game performances (albeit at home, or Barca away too). Better pressing tactics throughout the season. Far better deep build up this season now that Onana is here. Pretending to not see the positives is deliberately ignoring them at this point.

Nothing of this actually real or even consistently evident on the pitch. Wolves were cornering us on our pitch for most of the game, for God's sake.

The previous managers like LvG, Mourinho and Ole had deep cup runs and very good big game performance and results. Are we rewriting history now?

 

[Ahmer Baig]

Just watching Chelsea who have a new manager and what feels like 50 new players and they looked settled with a game plan and tactic that lets them dominate games

I just don’t understand that after 12 months and 2 pre seasons we don’t seem to have an identity or way of playing it’s unacceptable

They just lost to 10 men West Ham 3-1. For 30 minutes they couldnt even score against 10 men West Ham.

 

[RVN1991]

At least his bank account is fatter than had he joined the scouse.

 

[Abhinav]

The fees paid by Chelsea for Mudryk (85m), Caicedo (115m) and Enzo (120m) is precisely why EtH should not be judged too harshly for having spent 400m without turning us into title challengers. The insane valuations of Antony, Mount or even Hojlund do not represent their actual talent. This is where the supporting structure needs to do better to find value deals and superior talent without blowing the roof off.
Having said that, the Mount signing still rankles because I don’t think he was the right profile of player for us.
Anyway, I am patient and hopeful that EtH will make the team work.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

I noticed Fergie last week said you have to trust your scouts. Seems almost too coincidental for him to say that when clearly ETH doesn't trust his scouts.

I think some of the onus is on the directors as well. Whether ETH fully trusts the scouts or not, he shouldn't have full autonomy either way on targets and signings. That strategy never works, and even if ETH was a brilliant evaluator he doesn't even have the time to sit and try to unearth hidden gems from the Brazilian league. Being a manager is a difficult job as it is, but being the manager and basically a DOF is impossible I don't care who you are.

 

[RuudTom83]

Last season with the team EtH had, he couldn't have finished any higher than he did.

Year 1 was a success.

Lets not just take a dump on his first season because we are all pissed off at how this season has started.