That's a bizarre way of looking at it. There's always a small minority who'll try and sneak in for free, and seeing as it always happens it's up to the people planning the event to take the necessary safety precautions with that in mind. To blame fans who jibbed is just plain wrong.You know what, my heart truly goes out to those 96 that bought tickets and got into the ground within the designated time that the ticket stated.
People are afraid to say it, the police were at fault for making the decision to open the gates but you must question all those fans that travelled without a ticket and tried to jib their way into the game.
The crush was inevitable, whether it was outside the ground or in the ground. Take away the fans without tickets trying to jib their way in and you avoid the whole disaster.
Booze would've also been a factor but we dont need to bring that into it.
The Police made the wrong decision in opening the gates, however people never look at the whole story though.
Iam not and never will say there wasnt any ticketless fans . It was like that for most teams back then. What I will say is your statement needs evidence. Solid evidence .You know what, my heart truly goes out to those 96 that bought tickets and got into the ground within the designated time that the ticket stated.
People are afraid to say it, the police were at fault for making the decision to open the gates but you must question all those fans that travelled without a ticket and tried to jib their way into the game.
The crush was inevitable, whether it was outside the ground or in the ground. Take away the fans without tickets trying to jib their way in and you avoid the whole disaster.
Booze would've also been a factor but we dont need to bring that into it.
The Police made the wrong decision in opening the gates, however people never look at the whole story though.
And that is it a nutshell.Disgusting that an inquest cleared the fans of any blame, but there are still people on here trying to find reason to blame them because they do not like Liverpool F.C. Have a look at yourselves.
You need to do yourself a favour and learn something about a subject before speaking and revealing your ignorance.You know what, my heart truly goes out to those 96 that bought tickets and got into the ground within the designated time that the ticket stated.
People are afraid to say it, the police were at fault for making the decision to open the gates but you must question all those fans that travelled without a ticket and tried to jib their way into the game.
The crush was inevitable, whether it was outside the ground or in the ground. Take away the fans without tickets trying to jib their way in and you avoid the whole disaster.
Booze would've also been a factor but we dont need to bring that into it.
The Police made the wrong decision in opening the gates, however people never look at the whole story though.
Off the top of my head I can't remember the details, but I seem to remember there were concerns that they'd miss the kick off and that some fans were getting frustrated. I think also the officer who made the decision was unfamiliar with the tunnel at Hillsborough. This details could be wrong, but I do remember when watching it thinking that I might have done the same. That's not defending it, as it was a decision with tragic consequences. I'm just saying what I thought when watching a documentary and reading a website dedicated the disaster.You wouldn't have just opened a gate and let a massive unspecified amount of people, that you hadn't even checked all had tickets, go in without the security of single file through turnstiles though surely?
He needs educating.The fecking state of that post.
After all this time, and we still need to read wormy shite like that? Some of you lot have done well to even respond with rational critique.
Absolute bollocks.
Disgusting that an inquest cleared the fans of any blame, but there are still people on here trying to find reason to blame them because they do not like Liverpool F.C. Have a look at yourselves.
You need to read more about it. The whole tragedy has been picked apart and experts have concluded that it wasn't caused by the behaviour of the fans.
Those who've spent years looking at all the evidence have been very clear about why so many people died.
That's a bizarre way of looking at it. There's always a small minority who'll try and sneak in for free, and seeing as it always happens it's up to the people planning the event to take the necessary safety precautions with that in mind. To blame fans who jibbed is just plain wrong.
And why would booze be a factor? Again, people are always going to have a drink before a football game. So what? What absolute horse-shit.
Iam not and never will say there wasnt any ticketless fans . It was like that for most teams back then. What I will say is your statement needs evidence. Solid evidence .
Booze . It was a footie match which means that most people drink . Especially in the semi's.
One question . Where is this rampaging drunken mob that forced down the gates ? It never existed and you.know it.
Many factors contributed to fans being late mate . Traffic congestion on the Pennines being one. Was you aware of this ?
Anyway. Youre speaking shite lad and you fecking know it .
Forst and foremost it doesn't matter which team was involved at all my views wouldn't change. I have no ignorance around the matter, my cousins were there that day with their dad. Thankfully they got tickets in the opposite end and what I believe is exactly their accounts.You need to do yourself a favour and learn something about a subject before speaking and revealing your ignorance.
They closed the tunnel in 1988 when we played Forest. Like Ive said bones were broke that day and people fainted. Was it Duckenfield who ordered the gates to be open ? Think it was . How can the person in charge not know the layout of the ground ? It beggars belief.Off the top of my head I can't remember the details, but I seem to remember there were concerns that they'd miss the kick off and that some fans were getting frustrated. I think also the officer who made the decision was unfamiliar with the tunnel at Hillsborough. This details could be wrong, but I do remember when watching it thinking that I might have done the same. That's not defending it, as it was a decision with tragic consequences. I'm just saying what I thought when watching a documentary and reading a website dedicated the disaster.
The police commanders aren't supposed to be amateurs though. There's a recording of John Motson, pre-match, looking at the terrace and commenting on how odd the loading was - as if everyone was being fed into the middle pens and no one directed to the corners. The people who should have noticed the problem, and who could have dealt with it, ignored it.Off the top of my head I can't remember the details, but I seem to remember there were concerns that they'd miss the kick off and that some fans were getting frustrated. I think also the officer who made the decision was unfamiliar with the tunnel at Hillsborough. This details could be wrong, but I do remember when watching it thinking that I might have done the same. That's not defending it, as it was a decision with tragic consequences. I'm just saying what I thought when watching a documentary and reading a website dedicated the disaster.
It was a football match. There were a lot of fans there, some had been drinking, some didn't have tickets - nothing out of the ordinary for a match, and nothing out of the ordinary for a Cup semifinal.Bbc debunking everything ive said above and then contradict themselves, when you read the taylor report, even they admit
Or better yet, why was it allowed to happen? No ticket - no entry simple. Authorities/security are to blame.To counter act you BTC .
If it was a common occurance back then ( jibbing in ) and if it wasn't the first time Hillsborough was at capacity then this begs the question.....
Why did it happen ?
Amazing, mate. Today is reward for all of his hard work.This ones for you lad.
Crying my fecking eyes out here.
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news...aid-hillsborough-survivor-campaigner-13016824
Mate, you don't get police officers up on manslaughter charges for 95 (why is it only 95 by the way?) people if they aren't at fault.Or better yet, why was it allowed to happen? No ticket - no entry simple. Authorities/security are to blame.
The liverpool echo posted this account in 2014 from a turnstyle attendant
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/turnstile-operator-tells-hillsborough-inquests-7782185
Could also blame Sheffield Wednesday/FA/whoever is in charge of hiring the turnstyle staff as this guy let anyone through anyway.
Blackburn away 2006, my last ewood park game, there were too many fans for the away end there. Turns out many jibbed in, happened then not so much anymore with the terror alerts going on.
Thanks.Amazing, mate. Today is reward for all of his hard work.
Be proud.
Tony Bland was the 96th . He died four years after as was on a machine. The law states something about with it being over a year or something.Mate, you don't get police officers up on manslaughter charges for 95 (why is it only 95 by the way?) people if they aren't at fault.
I did my own research over a few months before the huge investigation took place and i found the same verdict as the panel did. I suggest that you watch many of the same things that I did. If you look hard enough you can even find the Match of the Day that aired that night complete with aerial pictures of both the outside area and the leppings lane end. It is instantly clear that the pen on the far left hand side as you look at it is almost completely empty.
Also, you mentioned that it wasn't the first big semi-final at Hillsborough, You obviously forgot the 1981 semi final where there was very nearly a fatal crush at the same end of the ground, That was 8 years before and very nearly ended the same way.....only this was midway through the game, so either the tickletless hordes that you proclaim caused this were really really late or you are talking shite.
I will also point out that although this wasn't the first semi at hillsborough it WAS Duckenfields first and he made a catastrophic clusterfeck out of it and caused the deaths of 96 innocent people.
I understand that, but I find it genuinely astounding that after all of the reports, inquests and new information presented publicly over recent years (and well done to your brother and everybody else who has fought for the truth) that there are people still recklessly arguing that ticketless fans (or those who were pissed) contributed to those deaths. They did not.He needs educating.
I've messaged one or two on here over the years and advised them to watch " How they buried the truth " . The last person was a Juventus fan when he posted shite ( he has reasons to be angry ) on the Hillsborough anniversary this year. Fair play to him as he apologised .
People still need educating .
That's awful man. it was clear once i took the time to look into it that it was nobodies fault except those in charge that day. The fact it has taken 28 years to finally bring charges is nothing short of disgusting.Tony Bland was the 96th . He died four years after as was on a machine. The law states something about with it being over a year or something.
If you take it into account suicides or people just not being able to continue in life then the toll is more than 96. With people being blamed for so long you can not even begin to imagine how this effected them. Our kid couldn't even speak about it for years. He tried to take his life on a few occasions too.
It's a human condition to stick to their guns or their initial opinion no matter how many facts they are present with. Not everyone does this but some people do.I understand that, but I find it genuinely astounding that after all of the reports, inquests and new information presented publicly over recent years (and well done to your brother and everybody else who has fought for the truth) that there are people still recklessly arguing that ticketless fans (or those who were pissed) contributed to those deaths. They did not.
Incorrect. That was one of a number of reasons why it happened.It happend because the bizzies fecked up.
It really is that simple mate .
Hmm I'm torn on this. I haven't seen enough of the detail to make any kind of judgement, but have seen documentaries etc that highlight all the errors.The cover up of it all is still the thing that I find the most disgusting. People make mistakes and had they held there hands up at the time and admitted they had made a monumental feck up then that would be one thing. But everything that happened after was just awful.
And left the people who lost friends and family fighting for justice for decades, unable to move on with their lives or properly grieve for their loved ones because they were essentially blamed for their own deaths.And the not getting justice early enough has done what exactly? Helped a few people who screwed up have a career helping the public.
I just think put yourselves in their shoes. A combination of probably not realising the errors made, so assuming public to blame or at least detracting from errors. Then maybe realising the errors, but keeping the shield of police to stop them appearing as grossly inept.And left the people who lost friends and family fighting for justice for decades, unable to move on with their lives or properly grieve for their loved ones because they were essentially blamed for their own deaths.
If the police are grossly incompetent, then the public has a right to know and see them that way. That's the only way improvement will occur, not by covering it up and blaming the innocent. We can't know the full reach of consequences covering up Hillsborough had, to think of only the impact upon the police officers is a very narrow minded perspective.The cover up side of things I think has some merit, i.e its not exactly great for the public to view the police as grossly incompetent. That being said there is a balance, but again it's always a judgement call. The police I would expect regularly cover up mistakes along the way. The nature of what they do will put them on the boundaries of questioning all the time, e.g the Mark Duggan incident.
In most people's jobs errors don't put them in prison. So I do think rationale needs to be considered in context.
Surgeons make mistakes and might be sued, but you won't see many go to prison.
Life isn't an exact science. I'm sure many of those who made mistakes have been stuck living with them their whole lives.
And the not getting justice early enough has done what exactly? Helped a few people who screwed up have a career helping the public.
I really hope the victory and truth coming out can help you all start to come to terms with it, (not sure if come to terms with it is the right term, but I'm struggling for the right words) the whole football community regardless of club alligence is so proud of you all. Much love and respect chap.I was at Hillsborough, but not in the Leppings Lane End.
Thanks to all who have posted their sincere and well received comments, a shame someone has spoilt it a little and it's become a bit of a debate.
But to everyone else a big thank you from LFC and the families concerned.
JFT96
Thanks mate.I really hope the victory and truth coming out can help you all start to come to terms with it, (not sure if come to terms with it is the right term, but I'm struggling for the right words) the whole football community regardless of club alligence is so proud of you all. Much love and respect chap.
