What the fecking hell are you on about ?
Hillsborough: Duckenfield to be charged with manslaughter
- Thread starter Tarrou
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
He was the same in the 'Huge Fire in West London' thread, mate. Best bloody ignored.
The quick & easy way to counter your point would be to say that if you'd have been there your opinions would have been totally different to that above. I reckon you probably know that anyway. It's very easy to be calm & logical from something that hasn't affected you & happened over 28 years ago. I was in The Leppings Lane that day & witnessed first hand, not just the horrors of watching my fellow Liverpool fans die, but in just how incompetent & complicit the police, the establishment, & a certain newspaper was, in the actual tragedy & the aftermath.
Those responsible had plenty of opportunity to come clean & admit their failings. But like the cowards they are they continued to hide behind the lies, smears, & deceit provided to them by others. They chose not to take the road to redemption, so we took them on the long, slow, painful road to justice. We didn't ask for this. It was their choice. So now the judges & courts will decide their fate. That's how the legal system works. That's how a civilised society works. There's been nothing civilised about the actions of those who await trial, & that's why they'll not sleep very well over the coming weeks/months. It's called justice my friend. Justice for the 96.
It's paragraph two that gets me. Infact. It gave me a bit of a giggle.
Twenty odd thousand Liverpool fans walking around Sheffield in deep shock and trauma.
" Hey SYP . We all know what's just happened and you have started the cover up already ( 3.12pm live on TV ) ... but hey ho... shit happens.. fancy a pint " ?
This happened in the thread I made about the e-petition years ago. A few people, who didn't know much, talked a lot of nonsense and derailed the thread for a bit. Thankfully, they either saw the light or left the thread.
Grenfell happened. We all saw it and we were all appalled. We all received reports, almost immediately, that the people living there had complained about fire safety and hadn't been listened to. We know that they were let down by everyone who should have been looking out for them.
Now imagine, that instead of us hearing about the residents' complaints, we were fed a story about how the council had tried to push for greater fire safety, but that the residents pushed back. Didn't want it. Were abusive. Were threatening. That when the fire broke out, fire engines were pelted with bricks and bottles by the locals.
Now you're not very sympathetic for the victims. Now you're maybe thinking "well, they deserved it".
This is similar to what happened with Hillsborough. Almost immediately, the fans were blamed. The police hid their ineptitude and doctored almost 300 statements to make it appear that it was the fans' fault, not theirs. The media, especially The S*n, pushed the narrative that the heroic cops were trying to save lives while being taunted by pissed up Liverpool fans. Did you know that one police statement said that, while officers were trying to give a dying girl the kiss of life, Liverpool fans shouted "pass her over here and we'll f*ck her!"??? Did you know that the families of the victims discovered that their relatives were tested for alcohol levels, INCLUDING A TEN YEAR OLD BOY, so desperate were the authorities to find some dirt with which to smear the fans?? And did you know that the lack of an organised response from the emergency services meant that many of the victims could have been saved if they'd received medical attention?
I've not even scratched the surface. And neither have you if you still think that drunk or ticketless fans were in any way responsible for Hillsborough.
Grenfell happened. We all saw it and we were all appalled. We all received reports, almost immediately, that the people living there had complained about fire safety and hadn't been listened to. We know that they were let down by everyone who should have been looking out for them.
Now imagine, that instead of us hearing about the residents' complaints, we were fed a story about how the council had tried to push for greater fire safety, but that the residents pushed back. Didn't want it. Were abusive. Were threatening. That when the fire broke out, fire engines were pelted with bricks and bottles by the locals.
Now you're not very sympathetic for the victims. Now you're maybe thinking "well, they deserved it".
This is similar to what happened with Hillsborough. Almost immediately, the fans were blamed. The police hid their ineptitude and doctored almost 300 statements to make it appear that it was the fans' fault, not theirs. The media, especially The S*n, pushed the narrative that the heroic cops were trying to save lives while being taunted by pissed up Liverpool fans. Did you know that one police statement said that, while officers were trying to give a dying girl the kiss of life, Liverpool fans shouted "pass her over here and we'll f*ck her!"??? Did you know that the families of the victims discovered that their relatives were tested for alcohol levels, INCLUDING A TEN YEAR OLD BOY, so desperate were the authorities to find some dirt with which to smear the fans?? And did you know that the lack of an organised response from the emergency services meant that many of the victims could have been saved if they'd received medical attention?
I've not even scratched the surface. And neither have you if you still think that drunk or ticketless fans were in any way responsible for Hillsborough.
It does read that way, yes.
I hope justice is done, as much as it can be at this stage. This was one of the most disgusting examples of the authorities thinking they could blame the victims for their mistakes. Abusing the media image of football fans to blacken the names of the dead and the survivors. It's disgusting they got away with it for so long and that so many have thus avoided the punishment they should have had.
As always, when we have new news to re-open the wounds, thoughts with the victims, the survivors, the families, the club and it's fans and the city as a whole.
You make an impassioned point that is hard to argue with and assuming the trial is fair the right outcome should come out. I don't think courts look to punish people unduly and I guess that is the main thing.
It just freaks me out to imagine being the people involved that screwed up and how easily a simple wrong decision can change your life.
Really nice to see Manchester and Liverpool fans coming together over a great injustice, as it should be!
Thanks.
I hope they get what is coming to them. Iam not sure what that means but there should be some sort of punishment.
Iam a cynical and suspicious twat when it comes to authority. I just hope we ( Liverpudlians , the families , the 96 , survivors and the working class in general ) haven't been lead a merry dance just to be kicked in the bollocks .
I really don't know how that would feel .
One thing I know the Families and the City will regroup and fight.
A little part of me would want a fecking riot being honest but in the long term that wouldn't be the answer. It would be a good emotional release but not the answer.
I need to stop thinking too far ahead.
It really is.
We are similar cities . Too similar for some people to admit being honest. I've always got on with Mancs when Ive been abroad or met them elsewhere.
Even if you didn't, it shouldn't matter. Everyone should come together over such injustice.
Obviously no-one set out that day to kill people, what transpired was just an unfortunate sequence of events which lead to an awful tragedy. There were many good coppers on duty that day who tried their best in circumstances they were not trained for. I think they too deserve some sort of justice for the failings of those who were supposed to be their leaders. People in certain jobs have a lot of responsibility thrust upon their shoulders. One would assume they're quite happy to take on those responsibilities along with all the financial & status rewards the job brings. It's only right therefore that they should be punished accordingly when they fail. The punishment should obviously fit the severity of the crime otherwise others will follow suit in cutting corners, cutting costs, taking risks, & generally disregarding the health & safety of those they're duty bound to look after, be it in the workplace, on the streets, or those attending sporting events. It's not coincidence or evolution that's brought us to having football stadia far removed from those back in 1989. The Bradford fire, followed by Hillsborough just 4 years later, are the key components in why people can now go to football matches in the confidence that they'll be able to return home safely to their loved ones.
True . Just saying like.
The part that really stinks for me is the police who were on duty that day being forced to change their statements. Dead children having blood samples taken trying to prove they had been drinking. In a country with an accepted fair legal system and democracy I find this sort of thing very hard to understand. Somewhere in there I get the feeling that Thatcher may have had a hand in the cover up. All those lives many still teenagers lost. For the families the pain will never go away
She played a part alright.
While we're all distracted by Russia, Trump etc etc:
Hillsborough relatives 'disgusted' by CPS decision over West Midlands police
Prosecutors say evidential threshold not met for charges over original investigation into football disaster
https://amp.theguardian.com/footbal...ce?CMP=share_btn_tw&__twitter_impression=true
Hillsborough relatives 'disgusted' by CPS decision over West Midlands police
Prosecutors say evidential threshold not met for charges over original investigation into football disaster
https://amp.theguardian.com/footbal...ce?CMP=share_btn_tw&__twitter_impression=true
The Liverpool Way said:
Scousers not too happy with Topman at the moment apparently:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-43424172
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-43424172
No chance that's a coincidence. None.
Would be quite a coincidence to have a 96 on a red shirt, with that slogan on it. Looks like typical attempt at profiting from anything, which these stores tend to do.
Every right to be furious.
"The item could, however, be referencing the Bob Marley song 'What Goes Around Comes Around'.
It was released in 1996 and has the lyrics 'What goes around comes around, What goes up must come down, it's called Karma baby and it goes around"
It was released in 1996 and has the lyrics 'What goes around comes around, What goes up must come down, it's called Karma baby and it goes around"
It could but there are too many coincidences to be ignored as just that.
It is designed similar to a football shirt with number on the back and frontal rose as a football crest. Its red in colour which bares no relation to the Bob Marly orange and green which he continually sported.
Is the year of release of that song really that important in the honouring of a song that it should be blazon to such size. And with respect to Bobby, I dont think that a ‘Rose’ was his plant of choice.
Its an apauling product to produce which to me is a slur on the victims of Hillsborough. RIP96
Hmmm..I'm bordering on not coincidence.
But even if it was I'm always surprised how this kind of stuff gets through any type of process without somebody picking up on it.
But even if it was I'm always surprised how this kind of stuff gets through any type of process without somebody picking up on it.
Yep, all of this. It purposely looks like a football shirt. They knew what they were doing.
It shouldn't have even made it in the shops. The only reason I can think of is that Topman would consider all press to be good press, perhaps hoping that some people (i.e. antagonistic football fans) would try to hunt it down and buy it. But that's a bit of a stretch. It's probably just negligent quality assurance.
Whats going on ?
Just read it. Thats fecking disgusting. If there is still a store in Liverpool and think its had its day. Twats !
Apparently there were 200 in stock and all have been sold. Product has now been removed.
As ‘Rpitchfo’ says above; if it was accidental, someone involved from the drafting of the idea to the advertising of the finished product, should have picked up on it. No doubt the probable ‘antagonistic football fan’ will have seen it at first glance.
No doubt we'll get the likes of Chelsea fans saying we are wallowing in ours self pity again.
Yep. A quick google search shows theres three stores in Liverpool with the main one in Liverpool One in the city centre. I can see the HJC organising some sort of protests over this. If our kid was still with us he'd down there now plastering the shop windows with JFT 96 stickers.
RIP Alan you mad twat.
RIP Alan you mad twat.
They are saying this is what it is meant to be about. Did nobody working for Topman not realise that it could be taken the wrong way. Do it in a different colour, have Bob Marley's face on it, give people a clue.
Exactly. With the inquiries still going on to its feckin weird. Someone is being a bellend. Thanks for posting anyway lads but I choked on my coffee when I sen this thread bumped .
I don't think anyone will believe that though. Sounds like they're covering their tracks.
Complete idiots.
i think it's perfectly possible something like this could be designed innocently. Hillsborough is a giant event in British society but i'm not sure how big it is around the world, it's possible whoever did the design was unaware of the connotations. (just to be clear i don't think this is what actually happened, i think someones been a wanker)
what shouldn't be possible though is for this design to go through the various levels required prior to production in an organization of this size without someone picking up on it.
what shouldn't be possible though is for this design to go through the various levels required prior to production in an organization of this size without someone picking up on it.
Yeah, I don't really associate Bob Marley with the year 1996. It's a red football shirt design with 96 and karma on it. Not much to debate here. The designer knew what they were doing. Topshop got pranked.
Why was it sold in red? Very deliberate.
A red top with a crest (football style shirt, in LFC colours) with 96 on the back, a caption "what goes around comes around" and "karma" on the sleeves?
Does not sound like a coincidence at all. This is a British fashioneer, remember. I think this is a despicable wum.
Does not sound like a coincidence at all. This is a British fashioneer, remember. I think this is a despicable wum.
I think it's impossible that not one person along the chain from Design > Production > Retail didn't spot this.
Some of these fashion retailers are ridiculous. Same with H&M and the monkey hoodie. How daft can you be? That was on purpose, no way that it went unnoticed. You dont put out anything that could potentially be highly controversial.
There are all sorts of ways they could've avoided copyright issues, if that was the concern (just like those sellers who print band members' surnames on shirts instead of the band's name): BM on the back, colour scheme based on the Jamaican flag, a lion print etc etc.
Instead, it could even be that some muppet deliberately stoked up controversy just to draw people to the website.
Instead, it could even be that some muppet deliberately stoked up controversy just to draw people to the website.