Ibrahima Konate’

Adnan

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Exactly, and that's why I think that this transfer will still take a while. If Konaté's entourage is still in touch with Chelsea, and Konaté himself hasn't been involved yet, then we can't just rule out everyone else at this point. With that said, I think that we can rule United out. L'Équipe have only mentioned Chelsea in their report, which makes me think that we aren't necessarily in active contact with Konaté's reps.
According to a report from ESPN from yesterday, it's Liverpool, Chelsea and United who are in contact with the players reps with Liverpool ahead in the race. But like you stated, L'Equipe only name dropped Chelsea as the team who could well snatch the player so maybe we aren't in the running.
 
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I thought his pace was very underrated in general. Especially with the high line Liverpool want to play, having a slow CB is a liability regardless of how well he reads the game.

I'm mostly guessing though, I can't think of a lot of examples of 30yo CBs who either made it / didn't make it after an ACL.
I certainty don’t know of any players who haven’t recovered from such an injury in recent years.

perhaps Falcao took a lot longer than most, although that’s because he was rushed back into action.

ultimately we won’t know until he starts playing again, but Liverpool have problems in defence in addition to VVD that they need to fix.
 

AgentSmith

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I thought his pace was very underrated in general. Especially with the high line Liverpool want to play, having a slow CB is a liability regardless of how well he reads the game.

I'm mostly guessing though, I can't think of a lot of examples of 30yo CBs who either made it / didn't make it after an ACL.
Zlatan is a good recent example of someone in the later stage of their career who successfully came back from an ACL injury. They’re not the death sentence for a career that they were.
 

AgentSmith

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Konate - Van Dijk
Fabinho
That’s one hell of a defensive shield if they can keep Konate fit. Three absolute monsters physically.
 

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I certainty don’t know of any players who haven’t recovered from such an injury in recent years.

perhaps Falcao took a lot longer than most, although that’s because he was rushed back into action.

ultimately we won’t know until he starts playing again, but Liverpool have problems in defence in addition to VVD that they need to fix.
Yeah those problems are injuries to our other CBs. Replacing them with another potentially long term sickie is the last thing we should be doing.

Then again, I've never heard such good reviews from every source and fanbase since VvD. I'm torn. I Konate make up mind. :rolleyes:
 

Rob

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You'd think if he was having a medical then personal terms and the agent fees would be agreed before a medical would take place.
Didn’t realize he was having a medical already, but if that’s the case then you’re of course correct.

Is it normal procedure to have a medical so long before the actual transfer?
 

Adnan

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Didn’t realize he was having a medical already, but if that’s the case then you’re of course correct.

Is it normal procedure to have a medical so long before the actual transfer?
I don't know mate and it seems alittle baffling with a number of games and the u21 Euros still to play.

But if you do end up signing him and can keep him fit. He will be a absolute fantastic signing and the best young CB in the world IMO.
 
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TheReligion

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Zlatan is a good recent example of someone in the later stage of their career who successfully came back from an ACL injury. They’re not the death sentence for a career that they were.
Surely it entirely depends on the type of player and the attributes that they rely on too?
 

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He's saying we need two more. We've already got Maguire and Lindelof, then he seems to want Pau Torres and one of Konate/ Kounde/ Koulibaly.
I don’t think we need two more either
What team has ever had 4 centre back of that standard
We certainly don’t need more defenders, but i suppose that’s the purpose of this thread to talk about ha
Problem has been again not putting to bed teams of a lower standard and not enough depth in talent up top
 

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Surely it entirely depends on the type of player and the attributes that they rely on too?
Well of course it will always be dictated by the individual circumstances involved. But as a general point the ability to treat an ACL surgery has improved substantially and it’s no longer a career ender.

Van Dijk’s game isn’t overly reliant on pace either. His physique and power combined with his technical abilities make him a great CB, the speed was the cherry on top.

He’s probably still faster than Maguire in his crutches with one knee as well.
 

TheReligion

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Well of course it will always be dictated by the individual circumstances involved. But as a general point the ability to treat an ACL surgery has improved substantially and it’s no longer a career ender.

Van Dijk’s game isn’t overly reliant on pace either. His physique and power combined with his technical abilities make him a great CB, the speed was the cherry on top.

He’s probably still faster than Maguire in his crutches with one knee as well.
Point being the recovery from serious injuries, like ACL, can't be bracketed under the same thing for all. If the player returns as the same player can be wholly dependant on what attributes that particular player relies on as part of their game. In your example you used Zlatan who doesn't have explosive pace not basis his game around it. Barring his age he was probably a prime candidate to recover well without it negatively impacting on his game.

A player who relies on pace, power, twisting, turning and explosiveness is likely to recover differently with that kind of injury having more of an impact on them in the longer term.
 

AgentSmith

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Point being the recovery from serious injuries, like ACL, can't be bracketed under the same thing for all. If the player returns as the same player can be wholly dependant on what attributes that particular player relies on as part of their game. In your example you used Zlatan who doesn't have explosive pace not basis his game around it. Barring his age he was probably a prime candidate to recover well without it negatively impacting on his game.

A player who relies on pace, power, twisting, turning and explosiveness is likely to recover differently with that kind of injury having more of an impact on them in the longer term.
I didn’t bracket them all under the same thing. I said ACL injuries weren’t the death sentence for a career that they used to be due to improvements in the treatment process.
 

TheReligion

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I didn’t bracket them all under the same thing. I said ACL injuries weren’t the death sentence for a career that they used to be due to improvements in the treatment process.
Medical science has certainly evolved but I still believe the nature of the injury and projected recovery will vary from player to player and very much depend on their attributes.

I'd still be wary of investing in a player who had suffered such an injury especially if they had a game based around said attributes.
 

beingshe7don

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I don't know mate and it seems alittle baffling with at number of games and the u21 Euros still to play.

But if you do end up signing him and can keep him fit. He will be a absolute fantastic signing and the best young CB in the world IMO.
Sigh.... 34m for a player of his caliber who is just 21. If United have steered away, this is absolute bull crap. Getting Kounde and Konate would have benefitted for 75m would have worked out our CB issues in the longer run.
 

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From what I've see he is easily the best defender at the club. Upemacano is just good on the ball.
 

passing-wind

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He's a great defender but too injury prone. Between his injury record and Gomez they will still need another defender alongside VVD to have consistency throughout a season.
 

Bondi77

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I'm not so bothered by Liverpool getting Konate as much as i am by liverpool doing their business early. We have a reputation for negotiating at the pace of a glacier and being incredibly slow in the transfer market. So it would good if utd secured a target or two early. Especially if any of are targets are due to play in the
He's a great defender but too injury prone. Between his injury record and Gomez they will still need another defender alongside VVD to have consistency throughout a season.
And a lot depends on the shape VVD comes back in after a big injury??
 

dinostar77

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And a lot depends on the shape VVD comes back in after a big injury??
VVD won't come back the same player. They never do. Firstly it takes 18mths of actual football to get back to anywhere near your preinjury levels. Even then your not the same. He'll be 30 in july. So your talking xmas of 2022 to get somewhere bavk to pre injury levels of performance. Age isnt on his side.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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What's the fuss about this? The guy is injury prone and if Liverpool signs him then no big deal because they just added another injury prone player into their squad.

I'm sure lot of people here can see his talent but you have to admit it's not about talent, we need someone who can be reliable to play regularly. The guy can't stay fit and because of that Nagelsmann gives him the same treatment as Bailly sitting on the bench because you know he will get injured again if he starts playing.
 

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What's the fuss about this? The guy is injury prone and if Liverpool signs him then no big deal because they just added another injury prone player into their squad.

I'm sure lot of people here can see his talent but you have to admit it's not about talent, we need someone who can be reliable to play regularly. The guy can't stay fit and because of that Nagelsmann gives him the same treatment as Bailly sitting on the bench because you know he will get injured again if he starts playing.
Totally agree with all that.
 

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I thought his pace was very underrated in general. Especially with the high line Liverpool want to play, having a slow CB is a liability regardless of how well he reads the game.

I'm mostly guessing though, I can't think of a lot of examples of 30yo CBs who either made it / didn't make it after an ACL.
VVD isn't particularly pacey like Bailly or Upamecano, but he is not slow as well, he excels in positioning and is very strong, he can just brush off any attacker.

Regarding ACLs, i think what improved is how you live with it (non-professionals), but for professional athletes, i think it depends, VVD will need to follow a very strict plan of recovery and strengthening and re-introduction back to football which might take 18-24 months to return to playing only and maybe few months to return to pre injury levels physically, Bellerin has also torn his ACL but now is close to his pre injury physical levels (not his ability but his physicality).
 

B20

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VVD isn't particularly pacey like Bailly or Upamecano, but he is not slow as well, he excels in positioning and is very strong, he can just brush off any attacker.

Regarding ACLs, i think what improved is how you live with it (non-professionals), but for professional athletes, i think it depends, VVD will need to follow a very strict plan of recovery and strengthening and re-introduction back to football which might take 18-24 months to return to playing only and maybe few months to return to pre injury levels physically, Bellerin has also torn his ACL but now is close to his pre injury physical levels (not his ability but his physicality).
VVD is absolutely rapid.
 

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What's the fuss about this? The guy is injury prone and if Liverpool signs him then no big deal because they just added another injury prone player into their squad.

I'm sure lot of people here can see his talent but you have to admit it's not about talent, we need someone who can be reliable to play regularly. The guy can't stay fit and because of that Nagelsmann gives him the same treatment as Bailly sitting on the bench because you know he will get injured again if he starts playing.
That is true. Been fit since the start of February and in the ten games they've played since his return he's played 40 minutes off the bench in sub appearances in three games.

He is a very talented player and I'm a fan but says a lot that he wasn't picked in their biggest games of the season when he was fit.
 

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VVD won't come back the same player. They never do. Firstly it takes 18mths of actual football to get back to anywhere near your preinjury levels. Even then your not the same. He'll be 30 in july. So your talking xmas of 2022 to get somewhere bavk to pre injury levels of performance. Age isnt on his side.
Adrian Peterson started playing 8 months after doing his ACL + MCL, and won NFL MVP that season while coming within a hair of breaking one of the NFL’s most coveted records.

It‘s different for everyone, so you can’t really make blanket statements like that.
 

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VVD isn't particularly pacey like Bailly or Upamecano, but he is not slow as well, he excels in positioning and is very strong, he can just brush off any attacker.

Regarding ACLs, i think what improved is how you live with it (non-professionals), but for professional athletes, i think it depends, VVD will need to follow a very strict plan of recovery and strengthening and re-introduction back to football which might take 18-24 months to return to playing only and maybe few months to return to pre injury levels physically, Bellerin has also torn his ACL but now is close to his pre injury physical levels (not his ability but his physicality).
Considering he's 30yo next year, does that have impact on recovery? Players that came back like Falcao, RvN, Bellerin, Zouma etc. seem have had injuries fairly early on in their careers.

Someone else mentioned Zlatan but he's a bit of a physical specimen like Ronaldo, so I don't know how much to read into that.
 

OmarUnited4ever

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Considering he's 30yo next year, does that have impact on recovery? Players that came back like Falcao, RvN, Bellerin, Zouma etc. seem have had injuries fairly early on in their careers.

Someone else mentioned Zlatan but he's a bit of a physical specimen like Ronaldo, so I don't know how much to read into that.

It really depends, my best friend partially tore his ACL, after the surgery and rehab he tells me that sometimes he thinks his left knee isn't there and sometimes he is scared from walking too fast, the guy is fit and all and the injury really impacts mentally.

For VVD, I would expect the club and the player will not spare any efforts needed to come back to be able to play
 

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He's one of those players whose potential seems huge, right pace, height and physicality but his injury problems is a concern.

I wouldn't go for him because of that but would be totally devastated if a rival signs him.
 

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I think the injury concerns are extremely valid. As for VVD, well age isn’t on his side and he’ll be 30 before he plays again and has lost a peak year. The one thing he has in his favour is he’s a freak athlete. I’m not sure it’s top speed pace you worry about so much as the explosive twisting and turning movements. Hopefully as a CB that’ll be less of a concern than it is for an attacker.

In reality there are a lot of injuries that can kill a player, Sturridge is a great example. He kept getting injured and then returning immediately in top form like nothing happened. Eventually he got an injury that killed his pace and he was never the same player after that and couldn’t adapt well enough to the side anymore.
Aguero is one on the flip side who lost some speed and explosiveness but still managed to play at a world class level despite it.
 

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I'm not anti Scottish, I just wanted Moyes out.

Adnan

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Apparently he isn't injury prone


"There’s a perception that the player has been injury-prone.

"In reality, he’s suffered one serious injury: to his hip flexor muscle. It needed surgery in France last summer after a recurrence and is the main reason his game time has been limited

https://www.si.com/soccer/liverpool/news/the-athletics-raphael-honigstein-quashes-rb-leipzig-defender-ibrahima-konates-injury-prone-claims-ahead-of-proposed-liverpool-move#:~:text=In a recent article for,to his hip flexor muscle.
I've been saying similar regarding his injury. It's also said that the main cause of the injury is Konate not breaking stride when making recovery tackles which places pressure on the joint and the surrounding muscles. This is something that Klopp could easily rectify on the training ground.
 

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Completely agree. He's (VVD) one of the fastest CBs in football and has been in foot races with the likes of Adama Traore and comfortably won playing in a high line.
I agree. The foot races with Traore were exactly what came to my mind as I was reading the posts.
 

dinostar77

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Adrian Peterson started playing 8 months after doing his ACL + MCL, and won NFL MVP that season while coming within a hair of breaking one of the NFL’s most coveted records.

It‘s different for everyone, so you can’t really make blanket statements like that.
Yes you can for football. Very different sport to NFL. Its been proven over and over again with ACL injuries that players (im talking football not.nfl) don't come back the same. They lose half a yard of pace which cant be recovered. Its by far the worse injury for your career in football. Tearing your ACLs.

when it comes to bad injuries, there is one in particular that any footballer at any level will wish to avoid like the plague during their playing days; Anterior Cruciate Ligament (ACL) damage in their knees.

But why is it so damaging an injury for a player?

According to sports scientist Dr Rajpal Brar, of 3CB Performance: “An anterior cruciate ligament (ACL) injury can be difficult to recover from because it often involves multiple residual deficits such as quadriceps muscle atrophy, changes in movement patterns, and compensation along the rest of the body (which may lead to compensatory injuries).

“Further, the research shows an ACL graft can take upwards of 18 months to 2 years to fully integrate into the body, side to side leg asymmetry (a key indicator of injury risk) exists for an average of 2 years after injury.
 
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Organic Potatoes

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Yes you can for football. Very different sport to NFL. Its been proven over and over again with ACL injuries that players (im talking football not.nfl) don't come back the same. They lose half a yard of pace which cant be recovered. Its by far the worse injury for your career in football. Tearing your ACLs.

when it comes to bad injuries, there is one in particular that any footballer at any level will wish to avoid like the plague during their playing days; Anterior Cruciate Ligament (ACL) damage in their knees.

But why is it so damaging an injury for a player?

According to sports scientist Dr Rajpal Brar, of 3CB Performance: “An anterior cruciate ligament (ACL) injury can be difficult to recover from because it often involves multiple residual deficits such as quadriceps muscle atrophy, changes in movement patterns, and compensation along the rest of the body (which may lead to compensatory injuries).

“Further, the research shows an ACL graft can take upwards of 18 months to 2 years to fully integrate into the body, side to side leg asymmetry (a key indicator of injury risk) exists for an average of 2 years after injury.
You’re right, it is a much different sport in that it is more violent and suffers from ACL tears more often. The example I mentioned which you ignored contradicts what you have claimed.

But I think this derailment has run its course; I do not believe they are replacing VVD with Konate directly due to this injury unless there’s more to it than we know.
 

dinostar77

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You’re right, it is a much different sport in that it is more violent and suffers from ACL tears more often. The example I mentioned which you ignored contradicts what you have claimed.

But I think this derailment has run its course; I do not believe they are replacing VVD with Konate directly due to this injury unless there’s more to it than we know.
I never said anything about VVD being replaced. Anyway this isnt the thread for ACL injuries conversation. Happy to so on another thread. There are plenty of examples of famous players who havent been the same post acl injury.
 

A-man

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What's the fuss about this? The guy is injury prone and if Liverpool signs him then no big deal because they just added another injury prone player into their squad.

I'm sure lot of people here can see his talent but you have to admit it's not about talent, we need someone who can be reliable to play regularly. The guy can't stay fit and because of that Nagelsmann gives him the same treatment as Bailly sitting on the bench because you know he will get injured again if he starts playing.
You could very well be right. Maybe he’s not playing because he’s too unreliable.

So many in this thread claiming he is a great defender, monster, top talent, one of a kind, etc and I get the feeling many see him as I ne level above our current defenders. Is that based on reputation or by watching him? He’s hardly played the last two seasons and his record this season is not sensational.
He has started 8 games, and got 1 clean sheet and conceded 16 goals if I did my math right. Imo all the Leipzig defender still have to prove they can work well as a unit. I think they have all played more like individuals.