If Mourinho's authority and ideology were given more backing, would we be challenging?

[Sauldogba]

Some list of players that had moved in his tenure to our rival:
Sane, Gundogan, Silva, Mahrez, Robertson, Mane, Salah, Fabinho.
Fabinho and Matic have cost the same
VVD and Lukaku have cost the same.

Mourinho supporters: Klopp was backed, Mourinho was not backed . Shameless

Again as others have alluded to this isnt on jose.
He doesnt create the contracts or negotiate the fee thats on Woodward

 

[cyril C]

Mourinho failed at Chelsea twice, failed at RM, demonstrated the fact that players power is stronger than the club or manager, whether you like it or not. With the right squad he might have made it but only if you allow him to get rid of all the "wild weed" first. Problem is that Mourinho is never patient in any club - the 3rd year curse still holds, he often invests or trust experienced players, that by the time all the clowns are gone, he together with the remaining squad, is gone as well.

Mourinho might make it again in a not-so-big club, when his name still mean something to those players. Say for example ACM, Napoli, he might make something out of it.

 

[hn4manunited]

Was he backed yes.
Was he backed enough or like he should have been no.
Do you want to know how great (gulp) clubs back their managers.
Clubs with direction and a plan back their managers?
They sign players like Nolito and Bravo and a a season later show them the door when they realize they aint good enough then sign someone else.
They also dont create a conflict of interest by going against the manager to keep players the manager doesnt want.
They also dont renew contracts of duds and make them surpluss to requirements.
Something that our board doesnt know how to do.

Point is all clubs sign duds.
Pep has done a few times but the boards of the clubs he goes to has no hesitation to get rid then back him further.
People really dont understand how bad our squad was before mourinho got here and it needed work which also needed time.

Great post. Thanks for posting this.

 

[hn4manunited]

Again as others have alluded to this isnt on jose.
He doesnt create the contracts or negotiate the fee thats on Woodward

Thanks for reiterating this. Unfortunately, what we say here wouldn’t get through to some of these fans.

 

[Acheron]

I think the main problem with Manchester United would be a lack of direction in how is being run. With adequate backing I'd have expected Mourinho to have done something similar like with Real Madrid, like he wasn't super successful but he set the team in the right direction before being sacked while also leaving a strong squad.

Ideally it would had been better for United to bring him after SAF but at this point the problem lie beyond the manager.

 

[el3mel]

Mourinho failed at Chelsea twice, failed at RM, demonstrated the fact that players power is stronger than the club or manager, whether you like it or not. With the right squad he might have made it but only if you allow him to get rid of all the "wild weed" first. Problem is that Mourinho is never patient in any club - the 3rd year curse still holds, he often invests or trust experienced players, that by the time all the clowns are gone, he together with the remaining squad, is gone as well.

Mourinho might make it again in a not-so-big club, when his name still mean something to those players. Say for example ACM, Napoli, he might make something out of it.

Eh what ? So because he left on bad terms with Roman in his first reign early in 4th season you considered the whole period a failure ?

 

[Bobcat]

Maybe, but there is no doubt he left the club in a worse state than it was when he was appointed. When he first got here he got plenty of backing from both the board and the fans, his first season was actually quite enjoyable, but as soon as Zlatan got injured, he lost his officer in the dressing room and it all went downhill from there.

This season, we might have stuck with him had it not been for his sour demeanor, embarrassing rants and how he constantly aired his dirty laundry in the press. Jose was right about the problems at our club, the clusterfeck at the top and the attitudes in the dressing room, but he handled it extremely poorly. Had he acted an adult about it, he might still be here and be in charge of the rebuild.

 

[Darkhorsez]

Maybe, but there is no doubt he left the club in a worse state than it was when he was appointed. When he first got here he got plenty of backing from both the board and the fans, his first season was actually quite enjoyable, but as soon as Zlatan got injured, he lost his officer in the dressing room and it all went downhill from there.

This season, we might have stuck with him had it not been for his sour demeanor, embarrassing rants and how he constantly aired his dirty laundry in the press. Jose was right about the problems at our club, the clusterfeck at the top and the attitudes in the dressing room, but he handled it extremely poorly. Had he acted an adult about it, he might still be here and be in charge of the rebuild.

Good post

 

[Canagel]

Again as others have alluded to this isnt on jose.
He doesnt create the contracts or negotiate the fee thats on Woodward

He wanted those players and was happy with it. Their was better option on the market . Mourinho wasted our money and seemingly will have wasted some more on average 30 yr olds.

 

[hn4manunited]

Maybe, but there is no doubt he left the club in a worse state than it was when he was appointed. When he first got here he got plenty of backing from both the board and the fans, his first season was actually quite enjoyable, but as soon as Zlatan got injured, he lost his officer in the dressing room and it all went downhill from there.

This season, we might have stuck with him had it not been for his sour demeanor, embarrassing rants and how he constantly aired his dirty laundry in the press. Jose was right about the problems at our club, the clusterfeck at the top and the attitudes in the dressing room, but he handled it extremely poorly. Had he acted an adult about it, he might still be here and be in charge of the rebuild.

I disagree. I would say Ed left this club in a worse state.

By the start of the season after not being backed in the summer, Jose didn’t want the club to stick with him. It was clear for everyone to see he was asking Ed to sack him. He was done fighting the hierarchy. If they didn’t want to back him to help us win, he didn’t want to stay.

 

[hn4manunited]

He wanted those players and was happy with it. Their was better option on the market . Mourinho wasted our money and seemingly will have wasted some more on average 30 yr olds.

Again, as others have alluded to, the contract details are not up to Jose.

30 year olds can provide experience and leadership to our young weak-spined players.

 

[Shark]

I disagree. I would say Ed left this club in a worse state.

By the start of the season after not being backed in the summer, Jose didn’t want the club to stick with him. It was clear for everyone to see he was asking Ed to sack him. He was done fighting the hierarchy. If they didn’t want to back him to help us win, he didn’t want to stay.

Except the players he was chasing wouldn’t have helped us win, we’d be in an even worse state. Is there a single player we were linked with that summer that you think, shit, we missed out there?

 

[Canagel]

Thanks for reiterating this. Unfortunately, what we say here wouldn’t get through to some of these fans.

Mourinho August 2017

https://www.skysports.com/football/...nited-are-ready-for-a-serious-title-challenge

He got Sanchez, Fred and Dalot after these comments.

1 yr later
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/amp/football/46565595

I have never heard such twisting before in my life.

 

[hn4manunited]

Except the players he was chasing wouldn’t have helped us win, we’d be in an even worse state. Is there a single player we were linked with that summer that you think, shit, we missed out there?

Yes. I think all those players would have added to our puzzle and strengthened us.

 

[hn4manunited]

Mourinho August 2017

https://www.skysports.com/football/...nited-are-ready-for-a-serious-title-challenge

He got Sanchez, Fred and Dalot after these comments.

1 yr later
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/amp/football/46565595

I have never heard such twisting before in my life.

I think I have already responded to that link. Jose was still playing nice at that time and try to play the positive PR piece for our Commercially-run club.

 

[cyril C]

Eh what ? So because he left on bad terms with Roman in his first reign early in 4th season you considered the whole period a failure ?

What was the context of this debate? About Player's power Vs Manager/Club. Mourinho's rein at Chelsea x2 were successful because he won them EPL except CL. His rein at RM was also successful. But this is not the point, not about whether he brought in any major trophy, but about whether backing Mourinho will bring in success even of replacing the entire squad. My argument point was, even if the Club is willing to re-fresh the entire squad, which we are appeared to be pursuing, Mourinho's 3 year curse is too short for such major restructure.

 

[Bobcat]

I disagree. I would say Ed left this club in a worse state.

By the start of the season after not being backed in the summer, Jose didn’t want the club to stick with him. It was clear for everyone to see he was asking Ed to sack him. He was done fighting the hierarchy. If they didn’t want to back him to help us win, he didn’t want to stay.

He got backing, the problem was that he spunked money on the likes of Fred, Matic, Sanchez, Mikitharian and Lukaku, and throwing your toys out of the pram when Daddy Woody does not give you another 300 million is not the way to go about it. Plenty of evidence points to the fact that Jose self sabotaged, that i agree with, he said so in the pre-season we "had to get ready for a terrible season", but that's an incredibly childish stunt to pull when you are supposed to be one of the top managers in the world

 

[Shark]

Yes. I think all those players would have added to our puzzle and strengthened us.

As in Willian, Perisic and Boateng?

Get out of here.

 

[roonster09]

Some list of players that had moved in his tenure to our rival:
Sane, Gundogan, Silva, Mahrez, Robertson, Mane, Salah, Fabinho.
Fabinho and Matic have cost the same
VVD and Lukaku have cost the same.

Mourinho supporters: Klopp was backed, Mourinho was not backed . Shameless

Exactly. What's worst is he didn't rate Shaw and he wanted one more CB, then we played against Hull City when 2 very good players played against us. Why didn't he push for the players? He was only interested in players who were playing at big clubs or were rated above 50 million when same players were available for nothing season before. It's not like Maguire was unknown, he was very good against us when he played for Hull City.

In 2017-18 he cried about Perisic when we wanted RW and there was a class RW who moved to Liverpool for just 37 million. He wanted DM and could have signed Fabinho but went for Dier and Matic.

Made mistakes after mistakes (won't blame him alone in this) and cry for more players.

What Liverpool have and we lack was not just good players, it's a good system. Gone are the days where you field 11 very good players and win the game.

 

[roonster09]

Yes. I think all those players would have added to our puzzle and strengthened us.

Yes, they would completed the puzzle of adding more dead wood, shit players. We have collected some average players over the years and they would have been the final missing piece.

 

[roonster09]

Again, as others have alluded to, the contract details are not up to Jose.

30 year olds can provide experience and leadership to our young weak-spined players.

De Gea - 28
Young - 33
Matic - 30
Smalling - 29
Lingard - 26
Pogba - 26
Lukaku - 25
Herrera - 29
Mata - 31
Fred - 26
Fellaini - 31
Valencia - 33
Darmian - 29
Rojo - 29

We don't lack experience, we lack quality and good coach who brings best out of players. Thanks to Jose we have collected the players who lack combination of mentality, technique, physicality. We have problems but Jose was never the solution. He was the bigger problem.

 

[EwanI Ted]

Nope. No point comparing to SAF in the 1980s, football was a different beast back then. Nowadays Mou had as much leeway and control as he could possibly ask for and a budget to match. He can fairly be blamed for his own failures.

 

[Boxing Clever]

You might challenge, but you would still be behind Chelsea and Liverpool. The insane attitude that prevails here is that you're a failure if you haven't won the league. Couple that with Mou's predilection for big money, older players and by 2020 the club would potentially in a worse way than it is now.

 

[EwanI Ted]

Again as others have alluded to this isnt on jose.
He doesnt create the contracts or negotiate the fee thats on Woodward

That’s obviously wrong, the market decides those things not the CEO. Not like Woodward could have paid £10m for Pogba if he’d negotiated better.

 

[Schneckerl]

Doubtful that Perisic, Willian and Maguire would add +30 points.

 

[Tincanalley]

I think the main problem with Manchester United would be a lack of direction in how is being run. With adequate backing I'd have expected Mourinho to have done something similar like with Real Madrid, like he wasn't super successful but he set the team in the right direction before being sacked while also leaving a strong squad.

Ideally it would had been better for United to bring him after SAF but at this point the problem lie beyond the manager.

Spot on.

 

[do.ob]

I wonder what kind of magic Mourinho possesses that he can convince people he wasn't properly backed after spending close to half a billion - most of it net - in three years?
By that standard Pep is probably the only guy in the world who received backing - barely.

 

[roonster09]

I wonder what kind of magic Mourinho possesses that he can convince people he wasn't properly backed after spending close to half a billion - most of it net - in three years?
By that standard Pep is probably the only guy in the world who received backing - barely.

He is the best sales man in the world. Sells is shit and people buy it.

This is the guy who sold Salah and shat on him when he loaned him out (with option to buy), then last year he completely changed his tune saying he never wanted to sell him but only loaned him out to gain experience. When he loaned Salah he said it's better if he never returned as he has 5 better players than him, now he blamed next managers for selling him when they had no say because of agreed fee. People still bought it.

 

[Jib]

I wonder what kind of magic Mourinho possesses that he can convince people he wasn't properly backed after spending close to half a billion - most of it net - in three years?
By that standard Pep is probably the only guy in the world who received backing - barely.

Spot on

 

[Matt007a]

Mourinho is a short term manager. He proved that by getting us to 2nd place last season, before the wheels fell off as they do at every club he manages. Backing him with Maguire over the summer would not solve that problem. He was backed previously and Zlatan aside made pretty poor signings.

 

[SER19]

I don't think so as his own faults still exist.

Despite this he was right about many things. He clearly despised the attitude and effort of so many players and was laughed at and accused of all sorts when he said mctominay has the attitude many lack. Months down the line mctominay looks like he'd do anything for the team and fans, is genuinely devastated it seems, while the same culprits are ambling round.

They hated mourinhos toughness. Solskjaers softness isnt tough enough. Van gaals emails and sessions were too boring to interact with. This is a truly toxic dressing room.

 

[ValenciaRocks]

Given the way that city and Liverpool have dominated this season I’d say absolutely not. You have to concede that these two are a light years ahead of the rest and it’s no coincidence that they both play similar styles. High pressing and possession with lots of intelligent runs in the final third.

Mourinhos style of play is outdated imo. You can’t just rely on strength, height and power anymore.

He wasn’t the right fit for this club either. He’s disrupted the club in so many ways and what sort of committed manger lived in a hotel? It was absolutely bonkers.

He may do okay in the Italian league where things are more tactical but in this league his style is outdated.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Lukaku & Matic signing and sold Blind. The answer is still no. He’s not the right man for the club.

 

[Smores]

No we shouldn't have backed him on his attitude.

We should have listened to his concerns and made the necessary signings though. It might not have won us a title but it would have averted this disaster.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

Why ask for evidence if you're just going to turn a blind eye once it's presented? Jose didn't just say what he had to say. He said it in unmistakably delighted terms. He called the Sanchez transfer the juiciest of oranges or something similarly cringy

Because your evidence isn't evidence?

 

[Sky1981]

I think the main problem with Manchester United would be a lack of direction in how is being run. With adequate backing I'd have expected Mourinho to have done something similar like with Real Madrid, like he wasn't super successful but he set the team in the right direction before being sacked while also leaving a strong squad.

Ideally it would had been better for United to bring him after SAF but at this point the problem lie beyond the manager.

He did has his 2nd season wonder. Alas city is having a better season. Problem is our fans took it for granted and thinks any manager could simply walked in and get 100pts

 

[Grylte]

Yes, i think we would, but still really boring to watch.

 

[TRUERED89]

He bought Bailly, Lindelöf, Matic, Mhikitaryan, Fred, Pogba, Lukaku, Sanchez, consistently played Fellaini and dropped the rest. Then said they're shite and we need new players, only Lindelöf has really proven himself. Cant feel any sympathy for him honestly.

 

[DeGea]

Very interesting views.

But I think people are not really understanding the question at hand. I am not suggesting that he was not backed financially in the transfer market (see first post), because he was to a certain degree. Maybe not as much as he liked, but still a significant amount spent. And with regards to the flop buys, we do not know whether that was because they were genuinely terrible, or whether they downed their tools and could not deal with Jose's demands - leading to poor performance.

SAF also had poor buys remember - Bellion, Bebe, Kleberson, Djemba-Djemba, Miller, Veron (arguable), De Laet, Obertan, Powell, Buttner, Taibi, Tosic.. you get the idea. So arguing along the lines of his poor buys in a 3 year period is questionable, as he also brought in Zlatan (free) and Lindelof and revitalised Shaw with the hairdryer - and arguably this has worked.

The devil is always in the detail. When you look at his two most impressive stints, (I would argue this was Porto and Inter), the players completely submitted to him and they won everything with a moderately talented squad (and they bloody loved him). He left Porto because he was going to a bigger club, and he left Inter because Italian media basically hounded him. Football was not the most sexy, but it was not terrible either. Inter beat Barcelona (who were amazing) to the Champions League title.

You see Jose is the devil, he comes to you and offers you success, but at GREAT cost. It's whether you are willing to go all the way with him and trust him 100% or not. Everything else is irrelevant in my view, until the end of his contract. You give him X number of years, and submit to his authority as a club and go to war with him as your leader. Then remove him at the end of his tenure if you do not think he is for you. But don't bail out midway because some of the players are p***ies and not willing to graft and spend too much time on Instagram. The players need to know he is the boss and the club backs him as the boss, and they will be sold if they do not turn up.

I always felt he wanted to do what he did at Inter with us. A mix of maybe not the best players, but absolute warriors who would die for him and work in a system that just can beat anyone on their day. Pity we did not see this to the very end.

 

[EwanI Ted]

... absolute warriors who would die for him and work in a system that just can beat anyone on their day. Pity we did not see this to the very end.

Pity we didnt see this start.