If you have tried everything and nothing has worked, what on earth do you do next?

Lee565

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Why do people keep acting like we have tried everything when we haven't tried a half decent manager that plays attacking football.

We haven't even tried a pragmatic manager in their prime either like a conte or someone.

We have had two managers past their prime years that preferred to play cautiously and safe.

Then there is the other two who shouldnt be nowhere a club of our size, Solskjear was managing in a Mickey mouse league before hand and Moyes was a mid-table manager at best and has been abysmal in roles post United.
 

Sandikan

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With who in the 2?
Martial misses loads of games, Greenwood is very raw, and Rash hasn't looked the part for half a year.

And who would then be left and right midfield!
 

Hamza1989

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I think Man united has changed too many players over the past six years in all positions.It feels like there is no team play. Every match the players look like they play with each other for the first time !

In my opinion , I think that Man united has to build a youth team. It is not only about the current manager !
 

sunama

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You go all out for Pochettino and back him 1000%.
Woodward will not back any manager 100%.
He will try and save money whenever and wherever he can.
He will overrule the manager and claim he knows more about analysing players' ability than the manager...just like he did with Jose in the Summer of 2018. Then pay a huge fee a year later to buy the very player which Jose wanted to buy, a year earlier.

Woodward needs to relinquish his role as DoF. Until he does that, will continue to go from depth to depth.
 

red woppit

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It will be interesting to see how we play when all (or most) of our injuries are cleared up. With Wan Bissaka, Shaw, Lindelof, Pogba and Martial back we should have a stronger more stable line up, but we still have a glaring lack of quality in midfield and striker positions, this is where we need to strengthen in the January window.
 

Gandalf

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We still haven't tried buying a bunch of good players and getting rid of the shit ones.
Actually that is exactly what we are doing right now but there are a whole bunch of people who seem to believe that the entire squad could be rebuilt in one window. I don't miss any of the players that left and I am happy with everyone we brought in but the fact is we still need to ditch a few more and we need to sign a minimum of 6 more world class players. If everything breaks our way we might get most of those over the next 2 windows but we should not force it. Squad is threadbare right now and expectations need to be adjusted to reflect that.
 

Sky1981

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Welcome to real world past fergie.

Like someone says. Barcelona, juve, bayern all changes 20+ managers while we have 1 ferguson.

The only thing hampering us is "we have to do it the united way" since day 1
 

Casanova85

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Get a young attacking manager with credentials (Ten Hag); build a team around him (the players HE wants) in three windows (summer, winter, summer). Then give him at least 4-5 years as long as he finishes Top4. Klopp needed 2 years to truly take off. SAF five. Wegner won a PL and then he needed three long years to get back on top.

So far, Utd has only tried a midtable guy just because he was scottish, two aging has-beens (one of them ultra-defensive, toxic and known for 2-3 years eras), and currently a glorified interim ex-player. Time to sign a good young manager who wants to work with Man Utd and live in Manchester for several consecutive years.

All is not lost and there's time to rebuild; a "disaster" (finishing 11th-17th) has not happened and the brand of the club is more or less intact. If anything, people expect Man Utd to climb back on top, sooner or later; only the scouse dream of seeing Utd in the Championship or forever midtable, delusional as ever. For starters, the '10s decade has been a lot better for Utd (two PL, one FA Cup, a EL and a UCL final) than Liverpool's miserable run in the '90s. 2020 has to be the turning point.
 
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Adam-Utd

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We haven’t tried everything though, we haven’t tried a hipster manager, we shall do that next.
Someone who hasn’t peaked, but has shown clear style of play and development of players at a high level and the ability to compete against bigger clubs.
Somebody bonkers like Bielsa just might work.

id take a few crazy score lines in a season over several boring matches.
 

Catt

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Woodward will not back any manager 100%.
He will try and save money whenever and wherever he can.
He will overrule the manager and claim he knows more about analysing players' ability than the manager...just like he did with Jose in the Summer of 2018. Then pay a huge fee a year later to buy the very player which Jose wanted to buy, a year earlier.

Woodward needs to relinquish his role as DoF. Until he does that, will continue to go from depth to depth.
No manager will ever be 100% backed.
 

Adam-Utd

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Bielsa and Ed would clash since min 0. He'd probably demand to see the Glazers regularly as well.
Probably a good thing. Woodward can’t have it all his own way, surely the glazers will realise perhaps they need to try something different.
 

OverratedOpinion

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Agreed and that is a big part of the problem.

When you look at Moyes, Van Gaal, Mourinho and now Ole, it is very hard to find a common thread to point at and say "Man Utd are looking for these qualities in a manager". It just seems as though we are frantically throwing shit against the wall and hoping to God something sticks, there seems to be no real plan in place.

The thing that amazes me is that there is literally no downside to the idea of bringing in a respected director of football and letting him get a strategy in place which we actively start building towards from every level of recruitment.

If I was Woodward then I would bring Wenger in to steady the ship and then get that in place over the next few months. He won't do that, he will sign Gareth Bale in January and look fecking gormless in the stands as he goes 20 games without a goal.
 

RedCoffee

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If you have tried everything and nothing has worked, what on earth do you do next?

Only thing to do is hold your nerve.
 

RedDevilCanuck

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a City style transfer window. We have to buy ourselves out of this. Our youth is good but nowhere near world class.
 

OleBoiii

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The way I see it, there are mainly 3 things we haven't tried yet:

1. Hire a young, up-and-coming manager(most likely foreign) with exciting new ideas who's already proven himself a little.
2. Having owners willing to put more money into the club.
3. Fire Ed Woodward and replace him with an actual DoF who's competent at his/her job.

Let's go through each of them, shall we:

1. Hire a young, up-and-coming manager

Sure, this isn't a bad idea. But it will most likely not solve our problems quickly enough. And it's not like it's not a gamble. For every Klopp there are probably 20 failures.

2. Having owners willing to put more money into the club

This would be ideal, but it's never gonna happen. The club makes too much money and it will stay that way for a long time.

3. Fire Ed Woodward and replace him with an actual DoF

This is the most sensible option. We may still be 10 managers away from striking gold, but a proper DoF would probably improve things instantly. Sure, we'd still have a limited budget because of the Glazers, but we'd still be better off financially than all our rivals bar City. With sensible signings, we'd be on the right track.

I vote for number 3.
 

RedSky

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This isn't a complex puzzle to solve. The solution is simple, you get rid of players that are not at the right quality level, unfortunately we have a number that needs replacing and it will require a substantial window of rebuilding to get us moving in the right direction, it's started but we need to see it through.

This requires TOTAL backing from the board. Not the shit we've had in the last two seasons, but substantial backing. Getting rid of players like Young, Mata, Matic, Lingard and co who are still first choice players. The worst part is this was all completely avoidable as this isn't a new discovery. We all knew that the players above weren't good enough last season and yet here we are. They're still at the club and worse they're getting substantial minutes.
 

Casanova85

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Agreed and that is a big part of the problem.

When you look at Moyes, Van Gaal, Mourinho and now Ole, it is very hard to find a common thread to point at and say "Man Utd are looking for these qualities in a manager". It just seems as though we are frantically throwing shit against the wall and hoping to God something sticks, there seems to be no real plan in place.

The thing that amazes me is that there is literally no downside to the idea of bringing in a respected director of football and letting him get a strategy in place which we actively start building towards from every level of recruitment.

If I was Woodward then I would bring Wenger in to steady the ship and then get that in place over the next few months. He won't do that, he will sign Gareth Bale in January and look fecking gormless in the stands as he goes 20 games without a goal.
Wait, we are signing Bale in Jan? :):drool:
 

Camilo

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We hire a good manager. That's what we try next. It's not fecking rocket science.

We're not a special club. We've spent fecking loads of money, badly, because the wrong managers have been in. Ole let 3 first team starters go and didn't replace them. Try not doing that for example.

All too easy to blame the bogeyman upstairs.. He hires the manager, right? Well yes, but that's not changing. So the solution is to keep searching for the right manager. It'll happen. It's a simple sport.
 

Theonas

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Woodward will not back any manager 100%.
.
Nor should he. That doesn't really exist in football or any field. The problem is the lack of people who can contribute to the decision making and vision of the club beyond him, as far as we know at least.
 

USREDEVIL

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You go all out for Pochettino and back him 1000%. He has everything we want in a manager bar winning a trophy, but he has proven everywhere he has been that he has the ability to improve players he's got, play attacking football and develop young players.

Spurs' capitulation is worrying, but it has all the hallmarks of a team that knows it's probably gone past its peak and has nothing to show for it. There's something not right at the Spurs at the moment, but I wouldn't be quick to suddenly write Poch off as a mediocre manager all of a sudden. Everything we've seen over the past 5 years has told us otherwise.

He's not only the best option at the moment, or not as bad as we've got now. Bar Klopp and Pep, he is the best candidate for this club and if there is any chance he could be on the verge of the end of his tenure at Spurs, we should be all over him, and screw how stupid it might look after backing Ole.

Who here would be more comfortable sticking with Ole in regards to this long term 'plan' we've got going on, instead of seeing Poch as the man to take us forward.
It might be our last chance to board the Poch train too. I'm not for sacking Ole for now, but if Poch is more or less available and we continue to be shit, we really ought to cut our losses and jump on the Poch train before it leaves the station.
 

Strelok

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Ole let 3 first team starters go and didn't replace them. Try not doing that for example.
I don't think Fellani, Sanchez and Lukaku were first team starters. Squad players, yes.

Herrera left on a free, by the time Ole was appointed it was already too late.
 

fastwalker

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We hire a good manager. That's what we try next. It's not fecking rocket science.

We're not a special club. We've spent fecking loads of money, badly, because the wrong managers have been in. Ole let 3 first team starters go and didn't replace them. Try not doing that for example.

All too easy to blame the bogeyman upstairs.. He hires the manager, right? Well yes, but that's not changing. So the solution is to keep searching for the right manager. It'll happen. It's a simple sport.
But with the exception of Moyes who was signed on Sir Alex's recommendation and Ole who clearly has never had success in an elite league, we have actually recruited two very successful managers in Louis Van Gaal and Jose Mourinho. By any measure these are top managers or at least they were when we appointed them.
 

Florida Man

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Have we tried staging a coup to get Woodward and the Glazers out? Well then we haven't tried everything, have we?
 

Camilo

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I don't think Fellani, Sanchez and Lukaku were first team starters. Squad players, yes.

Herrera left on a free, by the time Ole was appointed it was already too late.
Herrera wasn't gone until he was gone. Lukaku and Fellaini are better than anyone we've "replaced" them with. They'd start. Sanchez, well who knows.

It's all well and good striving to have a better team, but Ole has made the squad weaker.
 

Camilo

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But with the exception of Moyes who was signed on Sir Alex's recommendation and Ole who clearly has never had success in an elite league, we have actually recruited two very successful managers in Louis Van Gaal and Jose Mourinho. By any measure these are top managers or at least they were when we appointed them.
So the solution, because two good managers failed, is to hire a shit manager? Is to play kids in the hope that a miracle happens?

No. We keep hiring good managers, and we stop whoever comes in next from moving on the never ending "deadwood" - do your fecking job and manage. We were never going to be great this year, but if Lukaku was still here he'd have tapped in 5 or 6 James crosses by now. Fellaini would've given us some professionalism in midfield, Herrera would've given us some semblance of quality... Nice one Ole, at least the kids are making an effort eh?
 

Stepney73

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Nobody has the answer.

Said it in an other thread but the reality is that Manchester United will not return to the good old days under the Glazer ownership, this current board and Woodward running things. The board set the culture, the board are not Manchester United people, they're not even football people.

We are f*cked until they go. The club is broken top to bottom, and we need to fix the top first...

100%

The mods could have locked this thread on the first answer.

Just imagine for some reason being in the championship meant increased revenues for the club.the glazers would have the manager sacked if he won the PL by 50 points.

I wonder if darcie glazer had any idea we even played on Sunday let alone the score.
 

Classical Mechanic

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We haven’t tried everything though, we haven’t tried a hipster manager, we shall do that next.
Someone who hasn’t peaked, but has shown clear style of play and development of players at a high level and the ability to compete against bigger clubs.
Woody needs to get a dartboard with every hipster German managers face on it, put on a blindfold and throw. He'd probably hit the wall though.
 

amolbhatia50k

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That's what everyone does. They don't stand on their hands telling themselves that they tried everything, they simply think "we didn't do it properly and we will improve the execution". United fans have been so used to SAF stability that they fail to accept that in football everyone fails and everyone tries again with small tweaks until it works.
Yeah, we keep going till we find the right combination/process/execution/personnel.

People are talking as if we've been stuck in the bottom half of the PL for a decade. We've finished top 4 here and there and won a few cups. The current situation is bad but we've hardly been obscure these past 6 years.
 

amolbhatia50k

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And we haven't tried everything. That's just silly. This comes from the simplistic notion that we have tried newbie managers and experienced ones. In reality, every individual is different
 

Eric7C

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And we haven't tried everything. That's just silly. This comes from the simplistic notion that we have tried newbie managers and experienced ones. In reality, every individual is different
Yes! People are thick.