Ivan Toney Pt.2

Bobski

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Wasn't too impressed by him talking about possibly getting a move this January before he had even come back. I don't have an issue with him being ambitious and looking to better himself but if you get yourself banned because of your own stupidity and the club you have fecked over stand by you then maybe don't tell the world your are looking to move on from them before you have even played a minute.

Good player, targetman with good and varied finishing ability but red flags around his character that he will have to work through.
 

Crimson King

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What are Mounts standout qualities then? What does he do better than other players in the league?

Toney is 27 (ok, he will be 28 in the summer), not 37. And he scores and brings the wide players into play better than most (if not all) PL strikers.

I don’t think he is worth 60+ by the way, but it doesn’t mean teams won’t pay it.
For what it's worth I wouldn't have signed Mount, I don't think he was the most pressing profile in CM we needed. I do think he's pretty good at a lot of things, and I think we'll see that when he's back, hopefully. Although admittedly I don't think he excels at anything in particular.

I'm sure Toney would offer something to any team, even City and Liverpool. He plays the role well. I'm not sure it would translate fully at other clubs though. Brentford lean into his strengths quite heavily, which is why they struggled so much without him. I'm also pretty sure around 1/3 of his goals for Brentford are penalties. Good luck scoring 10 pens a season playing for United, we'll be lucky to be awarded that many in 3 seasons let alone 1...

It just isn't worth paying £60m+ for him when we've already invested in Højlund. It might be worth it for Arsenal, who are actually pushing to win the league and don't have a young striker they've invested in. He could actually do enough to push them over the line.

At United he just wouldn't make enough of an overall impact. He wouldn't make us league contenders. You're better off taking a longer term view and plan to win the league a few years down the line.
 

Spaghetti

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For what it's worth I wouldn't have signed Mount, I don't think he was the most pressing profile in CM we needed. I do think he's pretty good at a lot of things, and I think we'll see that when he's back, hopefully. Although admittedly I don't think he excels at anything in particular.

I'm sure Toney would offer something to any team, even City and Liverpool. He plays the role well. I'm not sure it would translate fully at other clubs though. Brentford lean into his strengths quite heavily, which is why they struggled so much without him. I'm also pretty sure around 1/3 of his goals for Brentford are penalties. Good luck scoring 10 pens a season playing for United, we'll be lucky to be awarded that many in 3 seasons let alone 1...

It just isn't worth paying £60m+ for him when we've already invested in Højlund. It might be worth it for Arsenal, who are actually pushing to win the league and don't have a young striker they've invested in. He could actually do enough to push them over the line.

At United he just wouldn't make enough of an overall impact. He wouldn't make us league contenders. You're better off taking a longer term view and plan to win the league a few years down the line.
I didn’t say United would or should buy him.

I only said that holding out for 60+ isn’t completely unreasonable considering that a team (that happened to be us) paid 60 for a non entity footballer, with 1 year on his contract, just last summer.
 

Crimson King

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I didn’t say United would or should buy him.

I only said that holding out for 60+ isn’t completely unreasonable considering that a team (that happened to be us) paid 60 for a non entity footballer, with 1 year on his contract, just last summer.
Ok that I do agree with, sorry it looks like I misunderstood your post.

I can definitely understand why they would hold out for that much. It reminds me a bit of the situation Zaha was in at Palace. He was good enough to play for a top 4 team, but probably not good enough to be really instrumental to them. At Palace he was absolutely key for keeping them in the PL, head and shoulders above anything else they had. Money didn't matter, they couldn't replace him. Other clubs just weren't going to pay that kind of money though.

That's where Toney is right now. He'll probably run his contract down and go for free. Definitely a good signing for any club at that point.
 

tenpoless

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Has anyone tried the gambling trick on him? since he likes betting.

Score 5 more goals before the end of this month: win 5x of your weekly salary. But if you don't do it, your salary will be reduced by half.
Take it or leave it?
 

daba

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Look at it from their perspective. He is a quality Premier League striker. What could they do with 60m that would add more value to their squad than him?
The point is his contract runs out next summer, so its 50-60m now or zero the following season. That 50-60m would go a long way for them they way that they scout and spend their money - probably 2-3 players.
 
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Look at it from their perspective. He is a quality Premier League striker. What could they do with 60m that would add more value to their squad than him?
I get that and I understand clubs might look at United as weak.

But I don’t think Brentford can risk £0 vs £60m (one year left) and clubs will very quickly find out we’re a different animal now… we will bid carefully, we will walk away. 100% confident in that.
 

croadyman

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According to Whitwell we are monitoring his progress until the end of the season. Have a feeling Osimhen has agreed to join Chelsea in the summer. Given the choice who would people prefer out of the two?
 
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golden_blunder

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According to Whitwell we are monitoring his progress until the end of the season. Have a feeling Osimhen has agreed to join Chelsea in the summer. Given the choice who would people prefer out of the two?
I’m not sure how Odimhen will transition to the PL. he needs a team that’s going to supply chances. That’s not United at this point in time.

I can’t see us spending 130m on one player either, I think those days are gone, and rightly so
 

croadyman

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I’m not sure how Odimhen will transition to the PL. he needs a team that’s going to supply chances. That’s not United at this point in time.

I can’t see us spending 130m on one player either, I think those days are gone, and rightly so
Yeah you might have a valid point,also feel that Toney is made for the Utd shirt. Yes I know he is not at the level of Kane/Haaland
 
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Lash

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Brentford dropping 30m for Nusa and potentially 20m on Dallinga makes me think they've got an agreement with someone for the summer.
 

tentan

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Hope he fancies a move to United instead. Quality player.
 

Bwuk

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You could play him upfront with Hojlund as well. Toneys link play is superb.
 

Varun1

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Good striker with a shit character. I wouldn't like him at United.
 

didz

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Brentford dropping 30m for Nusa and potentially 20m on Dallinga makes me think they've got an agreement with someone for the summer.
The Nusa money is basically just the fee they're getting off Arsenal for Raya in the summer isn't it?
 

Hound Dog

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These pathetic ideas should stop if United are ever to get back to the top.

Are Real Madrid considering bringing in Borja Majoral?
 

didz

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These pathetic ideas should stop if United are ever to get back to the top.

Are Real Madrid considering bringing in Borja Majoral?
No, because they already signed Joselu for £1.5m in the summer
 

AdamColeBebe

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These pathetic ideas should stop if United are ever to get back to the top.

Are Real Madrid considering bringing in Borja Majoral?
The idea of signing a quality striker when we are utterly bereft of depth in that position is pathetic? Why?
 

didz

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Come on. How much would Toney cost?



Because he is not good enough to be a starter for a title contender and would cost a lot.
I don't believe his price was ever the crux of your argument. Your argument appears to be that Real Madrid wouldn't sign Borja Majoral so we shouldn't sign Ivan Toney.

I can completely understand why you're retroactively trying to adjust that position though - it is a bit of a hard one to defend with a straight face.
 

Hound Dog

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I don't believe his price was ever the crux of your argument. Your argument appears to be that Real Madrid wouldn't sign Borja Majoral so we shouldn't sign Ivan Toney.

I can completely understand why you're retroactively trying to adjust that position though - it is a bit of a hard one to defend with a straight face.
Nope, not true. Obviously, everyone has third choice fourth choice players etc.

But bringing in Toney, for the money he would cost, I dont think anyone constrained by FFP could spend that much money on a backup striker. And if he is not a backup striker, United are in trouble.

So, he would be the right signing for someone like Tottenham. Or Dortmund.
 

didz

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Nope, not true. Obviously, everyone has third choice fourth choice players etc.

But bringing in Toney, for the money he would cost, I dont think anyone constrained by FFP could spend that much money on a backup striker. And if he is not a backup striker, United are in trouble.

So, he would be the right signing for someone like Tottenham. Or Dortmund.
Or Arsenal, perhaps? Given they're the most heavily linked with Toney. I wonder what their ambitions are?

In any case, if you would like to dismiss the idea that a proven PL goalscorer with a fine all round game would be good enough as "pathetic," you might need to come up with a slightly more coherent argument than one that weirdly hinges on Borja Mayoral.
 
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AdamColeBebe

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Nope, not true. Obviously, everyone has third choice fourth choice players etc.

But bringing in Toney, for the money he would cost, I dont think anyone constrained by FFP could spend that much money on a backup striker. And if he is not a backup striker, United are in trouble.

So, he would be the right signing for someone like Tottenham. Or Dortmund.
You haven't answered my question as to why you think Toney isn't good enough for Man United
 

Hound Dog

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You haven't answered my question as to why you think Toney isn't good enough for Man United
Generally, I feel that a player of that age signed to be a starter should be a proven world class player.

I might be wrong, Toney might scored a goal per game in a better team. But very risky.

Or Arsenal, perhaps? Given they're the most heavily linked with Toney. I wonder what their ambitions are?

In any case, if you would like to dismiss the idea that a proven PL goalscorer with a fine all round game would be good enough as "pathetic," you might need to come up with a slightly more coherent argument than one that weirdly hinges on Borja Mayoral.
I pulled a random midtable La Liga scorer.

As for Arsenal... How the standards have fallen if United aspire to be like them.
 

AdamColeBebe

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Generally, I feel that a player of that age signed to be a starter should be a proven world class player.

I might be wrong, Toney might scored a goal per game in a better team. But very risky.



I pulled a random midtable La Liga scorer.

As for Arsenal... How the standards have fallen if United aspire to be like them.
Our standards have fallen if we are aspiring to be a team that is fighting for the title, whilst we are midtable?

Sorry if I keep repeating your points back to you, but I really need you to read them out because I'm not sure you are before you are posting. Arsenal are far above us at the moment mate.
 

didz

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Generally, I feel that a player of that age signed to be a starter should be a proven world class player.

I might be wrong, Toney might scored a goal per game in a better team. But very risky.



I pulled a random midtable La Liga scorer.

As for Arsenal... How the standards have fallen if United aspire to be like them.
I'm glad you've been talked down from calling the idea of Toney pathetic to just very risky. I'd call that a win for common sense and decency.
 

Hound Dog

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I'm glad you've been talked down from calling the idea of Toney pathetic to just very risky. I'd call that a win for common sense and decency.
Okay fair enough. I just think that all other options have been exhausted and United should aim for a higher calibre of players to reestablish themselvs.
 

No Love

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Wasnt Woody a banker?
He absolutely was a banker. A flying banker. One of the biggest bankers we’ve had at the club.

Not to mention a him being a beady eyed little cu ck that did his fair share when it came to ruining the club.
 

Borys

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Okay fair enough. I just think that all other options have been exhausted and United should aim for a higher calibre of players to reestablish themselvs.
We're most likely not getting Champions League next season (we have not strengthened in winter window so I am pretty sure we're not going to make top 4), therefore I doubt we're getting a striker better than Toney in the summer.