Jose Mourinho | 2017/18 Assessments | Poll Added

[Garethw]

Our summer transfer business was not good enough.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m thrilled with Lukaku, but signing him didn’t make the team stronger, it simply replaced one 25-30 goal a season striker with another.

With Jones, Smalling, Rojo, Bailly and Tuanzebe already at the club, was the purchase of Lindeloff really a priority?

Matic for me is the only player that has come in and truly strengthened the starting 11 from last season.

It was as clear day that a new left back and right back was needed and that our attack was woefully short of quality.

In addition to Lukaku we needed to sign a top class replacement in the 10 role for Rooney and a quick and skilful right sided player that would be a difference maker in tight games.

 

[spontaneus1]

With Jones, Smalling, Rojo, Bailly and Tuanzebe already at the club, was the purchase of Lindeloff really a priority?

Considering half of the players you names are injured, and I'm sure Smaling isn't too far behind, it probably was.

 

[prtk0811]

Our summer transfer business was not good enough.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m thrilled with Lukaku, but signing him didn’t make the team stronger, it simply replaced one 25-30 goal a season striker with another.

With Jones, Smalling, Rojo, Bailly and Tuanzebe already at the club, was the purchase of Lindeloff really a priority?

Matic for me is the only player that has come in and truly strengthened the starting 11 from last season.

It was as clear day that a new left back and right back was needed and that our attack was woefully short of quality.

In addition to Lukaku we needed to sign a top class replacement in the 10 role for Rooney and a quick and skilful right sided player that would be a difference maker in tight games.

Not that again , we don't need to go there. We are not the same side with key injuries because of an imbalaced system we have to deploy in a 4231 and our ball circulation is not designed to get the best out of the attacking quality we have.

 

[dichinero]

Because he dint want to compromise te balance of his side.

We are forced to compromise on it as our Philosophy has changed so much from fergie to Moyes to lvg to mourinho. It's very difficult to play on every players strenghts in a Philosophy you try to perfect.

I really don't get what you're trying to say here, care to explain?

 

[Garethw]

This is baseless bollox.

So you think that everything is rosey at the moment then? Look at the players body language yesterday. That wasn’t a team fighting for its manager. It looked more like a team that wasn’t buying into the managers “philosophy”.

Mourinho has a history of upsetting squads.

We all knew that there was the potential for it when he took over but hoped that it would happen after a few PL title wins.

Hopefully this is all bollocks. Hopefully we play like we know we can and destroy Tottenham next weekend.

 

[Garethw]

Considering half of the players you names are injured, and I'm sure Smaling isn't too far behind, it probably was.

I guess it doesn’t help when half your defence are sick notes

 

[Garethw]

Not that again , we don't need to go there. We are not the same side with key injuries because of an imbalaced system we have to deploy in a 4231 and our ball circulation is not designed to get the best out of the attacking quality we have.

That doesn’t alter the fact that we are woefully short of quality in attack. It was an issue that was more than apparent last season and should have been sorted out back in the summer.

 

[Water Melon]

With the amount we have spent and Mou being in his second year with us, I'd say he is doing okay. I would not extend his contract unless he wins EPL or UCL during his first 3 years. To be brutally honest, I can see City finishing above us this season and the next. They will spend more and are already playing better football. Hopefully, Jose gets things right and proves to everyone that he is still one of the best managers in the world.

 

[AXVnee7]

Our summer transfer business was not good enough.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m thrilled with Lukaku, but signing him didn’t make the team stronger, it simply replaced one 25-30 goal a season striker with another.

With Jones, Smalling, Rojo, Bailly and Tuanzebe already at the club, was the purchase of Lindeloff really a priority?

Matic for me is the only player that has come in and truly strengthened the starting 11 from last season.

It was as clear day that a new left back and right back was needed and that our attack was woefully short of quality.

In addition to Lukaku we needed to sign a top class replacement in the 10 role for Rooney and a quick and skilful right sided player that would be a difference maker in tight games.

Signing a new striker was necessary as Zlatan was injured. Even if he was fit though, he's a short term option so I'm glad we signed a great striker with potential in Lukaku for a pre-Neymar fee. But we do actually have Zlatan so I would argue our squad actually is stronger. Having the option to substitute one for the other is a great one, and not to mention playing both at the same time will be a dangerous strike-force. The most important thing I would argue though is those 25-30 goals a season. If we have a striker who can guarantee that, then we know that the striker is contributing enough.

If you look at the number of defenders we currently have injured and don't forget our CB crisis at the end of last season then I feel a CB was a necessary purchase. Certainly one of high priority. Unfortunately Lindelof has been poor so far which is what makes his purchase seem unnecessary. Had he come in and built a solid partnership with Bailly then I think this would be viewed differently.

I agree we need a LB and a right sided winger, but I think Shaw was expected to take his chance this season. He still may yet. Not sure what's going on with the RW position. I don't agree for RB because Valencia is still going strong. Perhaps next summer would be the time to look for a young RB. Mkhi is supposedly our top class no.10 but he's only been brilliant in flashes this season. If rumours are to be believed then we may be getting Ozil.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

Considering half of the players you names are injured, and I'm sure Smaling isn't too far behind, it probably was.

well going by his performances so far i would argue buying him wasn't a priority becuase he isnt very good.

I know Blind isn't a world class centre back but when he has played their he has looked more solid then Lindelöf has.

 

[prtk0811]

I really don't get what you're trying to say here, care to explain?

Any system you deploy uses the players on their strengths and weaknesses and balances the attacking and defending balance with numerical requirements and abilities of players for the Philosophy you try to perfect in the team.

A perfectly balanced team is a prerequisite for having a world class consistant team.

We don't have that balance. Mkh played best as a no10 but struggles as a right winger , at the same time martials best never comes in a 4231 in a mid 2 as he lacks workrate and movement required to get the best out of him. Herrera is a ball winner but his passing and ball circulation is poor on the ball he suits best in a 4141 we deployed last season to win it back.

Against big teams you play longballs to lukaku who is not good at holding the ball and playing with his back to goal. Martial and rashford are not natural wingers but strikers made to play on the wing so they will often try to shoot and do it themselves rather than feed lukaku as the Philosophy is not designed to play a specific way. Martial lacks workrate to play on the wing .Mata lacks the ability to run with the ball and take defense to attack and lacks pace to counter. Mata is good in final third thought. While lingard have the ability to turn defense to attack and counter but he sucks in final third.

There is too much of unbalance the manager has to deal with and you can't sell because of lack of depth as players coat too much these days.

If you lack balance in a team you can not be consistent as required

That's why mourinho targeted perisic a winger with work rate to feed lukaku and bring balance on the wing, but his cost was too much for the board for his age.

 

[dichinero]

Any system you deploy uses the players on their strengths and weaknesses and balances the attacking and defending balance with numerical requirements and abilities of players for the Philosophy you try to perfect in the team.

A perfectly balanced team is a prerequisite for having a world class consistant team.

We don't have that balance. Mkh played best as a no10 but struggles as a right winger , at the same time martials best never comes in a 4231 in a mid 2 as he lacks workrate and movement required to get the best out of him. Herrera is a ball winner but his passing and ball circulation is poor on the ball he suits best in a 4141 we deployed last season to win it back.

Against big teams you play longballs to lukaku who is not good at holding the ball and playing with his back to goal. Martial and rashford are not natural wingers but strikers made to play on the wing so they will often try to shoot and do it themselves rather than feed lukaku as the Philosophy is not designed to play a specific way. Martial lacks workrate to play on the wing .Mata lacks the ability to run with the ball and take defense to attack and lacks pace to counter. Mata is good in final third thought. While lingard have the ability to turn defense to attack and counter but he sucks in final third.

There is too much of unbalance the manager has to deal with and you can't sell because of lack of depth as players coat too much these days.

If you lack balance in a team you can not be consistent as required

It is all well and good but let's not pretend like we have not hired a manager with a world class pedigree. 3 windows, £400m and almost 7 years worth of experience as a PL manager at the top level, balance is the last excuse I will be having for Mourinho.

In addition to the fact that he had a 6 month spell out of the game and given that him being the next United manager was the worst keep secret, it behoved him to have been more prepared. For someone that claims that this was his dream job, he's had too many excuses ranging from fatigue, fixture congestion, injuries, balance et al, stuff that I'd expect from a rookie that is new into the league.
Personally, I have little sympathy when it comes to José and the balance of the team. He told us in the first year that he only wanted 4, he got the 4. Now he is one less player than he wanted, should that be enough reason for such a claim for balance.

I agree with your point but with José, I'm not buying it. I expect more from a world class manager.

 

[Garethw]

It is all well and good but let's not pretend like we have not hired a manager with a world class pedigree. 3 windows, £400m and almost 7 years worth of experience as a PL manager at the top level, balance is the last excuse I will be having for Mourinho.

In addition to the fact that he had a 6 month spell out of the game and given that him being the next United manager was the worst keep secret, it behoved him to have been more prepared. For someone that claims that this was his dream job, he's had too many excuses ranging from fatigue, fixture congestion, injuries, balance et al, stuff that I'd expect from a rookie that is new into the league.
Personally, I have little sympathy when it comes to José and the balance of the team. He told us in the first year that he only wanted 4, he got the 4. Now he is one less player than he wanted, should that be enough reason for such a claim for balance.

I agree with your point but with José, I'm not buying it. I expect more from a world class manager.

I can’t argue with any of that mate.

 

[goin4glory]

City have £11 million net spend higher than us in 2 years and I disagree on having much better squad seeing as they were hardly storming the league these last 2 seasons. in fact they were in transition. out with the Zabaleta's Kompany's, Toure's Clichys, Kolarovs, Nasri's, Sagna's, Milner's, Dzeko's, Joe Harts. The vast majority of their former winning team. They were needing a revamp like us. When Pep came, they needed CB's FB's, wingers and centre midfielders as Toure, Fernandinho and Fernando isn't strong. Pep bought FB, a CB, converted Silva and De Bruyne into centre midfielders in Xavi's, Kroos position, he bought a keeper and some young wingers they have too. a lot of surgery, new roles for players also. I think people are exaggerating their position of strength. They came 4th on merit and even Pep only elevated them one position after that.

As I have already stated on numerous occassions, Aguero/Silva/KDB are clearly better than anything we have available and I'd add Kompany/Sterling to that list as well, Pep inherited all of them.

You just not being honest by continuing to claim he bought "a keeper and some FBs" he spent £40m on Ederson 1 season after spending 17m on Bravo. He bought the 2 best fullbacks currently on the market for close to world record fees. It's much easier to transition from the Zabaleta's Kolarov's and Joe Harts when you can go out and offer top market prices for anyone you want.

Stop trivialising the amount of money he's spent with nonsense like "some young wingers and FB's.

Then make sure your entire post is strong. It doesn't strengthen my argument but certainly weakens yours. We can't get casemiero. How sad we had to settle for pogba. Poor old Jose. Wish he had proper resources at United.

He does have proper resources at United and I've never said otherwise. That's not what's being debated.

Pogba was a record signing and a young worldclass player where every big clubs want to have. What are you talking about?

It will inevitably come back to what you define as world class but he's never established himself in that bracket for myself (and most neutral fans going by common opinions) players like Aguero/Silva etc have.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

He does have proper resources at United and I've never said otherwise. That's not what's being debated.

We're debating a lot of things here.

 

[goin4glory]

We're debating a lot of things here.

And that's not one of them.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

And that's not one of them.

It sure is.

It's got as much to do with this thread as "what Mourinho and Pep inherited".

 

[haram]

People are over reacting. We just need more control in midfield with Pogba.

 

[buckooo1978]

the main issue we had coming into this season was confidence, developing mental strength and a winning mentality

building momentum takes time and we did well before the international break to develop that mentality - players like Mhiki, Rashford, Martial, Pogba and Fellaini were already exceeding what they did last year and we were scoring well despite not being at our best in some games

our patheticw approach last week has changed all that for me. Given our players fragile confidence (imo) at times it was surely counter productive to go to Anfield hoping for a draw.... how does that fit in with a winning mentality - even if we'd had a go and lost narrowly I think we might have gotten a better reaction

it seems to have knocked the players and we looked desperate the last few games. Feels like we are back to square one and we have to perform against Spurs

not sure we can rely on nervous/limited players like Smalling and co to dig us out- Jose has a job this week and he'd better work his ass off

 

[kouroux]

Don't disagree with that.

But you can bet your bottom dollar that if he doesn't win trophies with us, some of our fans would turn against him.

It goes without saying.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

Our summer transfer business was not good enough.

Disagree with you on some points and agree on others.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m thrilled with Lukaku, but signing him didn’t make the team stronger, it simply replaced one 25-30 goal a season striker with another.

I think Lukaku does make us stronger it gives us more variety in our attacking play, no doubt Zlatan is a great player who had a great season last year, but his lack of mobility did cause issues at times last, Lukaku has that mobility, he also still has strength and height, so we can play in a larger variety of ways with Lukaku up front rather then Zlatan, plus we still have Zlatan to come back.

With Jones, Smalling, Rojo, Bailly and Tuanzebe already at the club, was the purchase of Lindeloff really a priority?

I see where your coming from with Lindelof, but i also see why Mourinho wanted another centre back, I mean Bailly looks great, but beyond that their are questions about every other one of our centre backs:

• Jones who had a great season last year, but lets not forget a year ago people where writing him off, he also has serious issues staying fit, can he really be relied upon for a full season?
• Smalling's form over the past 18 months has dipped massivly, his game is also incredibly reliant on shirt pulling and when he gets pulled up on that he looks totally lost on how to defend set pieces. Plus he has also has problems staying fit.
• Rojo surprised everyone last season, while Bailly was out best centre back last season the partnership between Rojo and Jones actually looked our most solid last season, he showed form that we havn't seen from him since he joined united. but lets not forget that it was only year ago where Rojo was been talked about as one of the worse players in united history( which even then seemed ridiculous) but he looked like a player who would be out the door pretty soon and certainly wasn't a player we could rely on. Add to that he is coming back from an injury that some players never fully recover from (ask Vidic)
• Tuanzebe, i would love Tuanzebe to come through and be a starter, but lets face it he is a complete unknown at this level and Mourinho has never been the sort to rely on players from an academy.

So i totally understand why Mourinho wanted another centre back. The problem is we bought Lindelof, who at the moment looks weaker then everyone on the above list, He also looks worse then Blind when he has played in that position or even Carrick, which at £30+million is ridiculous.

Matic for me is the only player that has come in and truly strengthened the starting 11 from last season.

Agree with you Matic has been a great buy, and ive got to say i was bit worried by that by that by, i mean it had been two years since he has shown this kind of form, he was ok last year but was one of chelsea's weaker players and was utterly dreadful the year before that. But its great to be proved wrong and he has turned out to be a great buy!

It was as clear day that a new left back and right back

I dont really agree hear, i think Valencia has looked like one of the best right backs in the league for a couple of years now, and Darmain is a fine back up.

left back i can sort of see where your coming from, but we do still have Shaw, who started off last season great before been used as a scapegoat by Mourinho in a game that he got his tactics wrong and needed some one to blame. since then Shaws form has dipped he also hasn't helped himself with injurys, but i still feel that Mourinho should be doing better developing a player of his obvious talent.

Plus we also have Blind, Darmian, Rojo and Young who can play there and it isnt and endless of of money so think we had other priorities this summer.

In addition to Lukaku we needed to sign a top class replacement in the 10 role for Rooney and a quick and skilful right sided player that would be a difference maker in tight games.

yes and no with this one.
I go back he summer Mourinhos first Summer in charge where it was obvious to everyone and their mums our main priority needed to be a right sided attacker, and Mkhitaryan was obviously brought into be that player as that is where had played for Dorutmund and where he started playing for us. But with Rooney form dropping of to oblivion and Mkhitaryan looking more effective through the middle he ended up moving to a number 10 position. This has left us with 2 problems one while Mkhitaryan on form looks great as a number 10, he hasn't shown the consistency we saw from him at Dourtmund. Also we still have the original problem of the right side of the attack. Now in fairness Mata has done a lot better job on that side then we have seen from in a wide role since he joined united, but he still doesn't look as natural in that position as we would like.
So while I agree that we could of done with another attacker i would probably argue we needed a player more suited to playing on the right, but who could also fill in at number 10 and probably as a false 9.

But the problem comes down to money, to buy a quality attacker this summer who would improve our forward line you where looking at around at least 80 million. add that to the 90 million we spent on Lukaku who was arguably must buy) and that off Matic(we desperately needed a defensive midfielder was a major weak point last season) so in order to buy two attackers and a defesnive midfielder your re easily looking at 200+ million and united where never gonna spend that amount of money, the only club ever to have done so is PSG and they are financed by a country! fans expecting us too do that this summer where just kidding themselves and setting themselves up for disappointment!

I suppose the way Mourinho could of done it is buy a world class player like Griezmann and use Rashford as the main striker (which is to be honest what i wanted to see at the start of the summer) but when it becuase clear that Griezmann was staying at Madrid, plus Mourinho's reluctance to rely on youth then it became obvious Lukaku was the obvious and best target.

So when you realise you havn't got the money to buy a starting attacker, (plus you look t our attack Lukaku, Rashford, Martial Mkhitaryan Mata, with Zlatan to come back and Lingard and young as back ups, then its easily the second best in the league) then another centre back was the obvious way to go. It just turns out the centre back we bought (at the moment at least) seems to be shit.

But over all i think Mourinho and woodward have done excellent in the transfer market over the past two seasons, and even if Lindelof turns out to be the flop he looks like so far, then 7 out of 8 buys over the past two seasons is pretty awesome going!

 

[RedRonaldo]

It will inevitably come back to what you define as world class but he's never established himself in that bracket for myself (and most neutral fans going by common opinions) players like Aguero/Silva etc have.

Opinion differs, in your eyes maybe he is worthless, but back then (when he was in Juventus) I've always thought if clubs like Chelsea gets him, they will dominate the premier league, or if Real Madrid gets him, they will dominate Europe etc - and that's how highly I rate him.

 

[Bruno Marques]

He clearly sees them useful. He won stuff with those turds. He plays some good football at times with those turds.

Can't just blame them only when the team including the manager who has utmost responsible for the team fails some time.

I doubt he see's them useful and i would bet in the long run most of them will not be at United if Mourinho keeps being the coach. He won stuff, that's right but did the team convinced you last year? That's why when some of the additions aren't available you should expect the team to work at a different rate or to have a bad day.

More points will be lost from us and other teams.

I don't think we should worry already

 

[Dobbs]

It is all well and good but let's not pretend like we have not hired a manager with a world class pedigree. 3 windows, £400m and almost 7 years worth of experience as a PL manager at the top level, balance is the last excuse I will be having for Mourinho.

In addition to the fact that he had a 6 month spell out of the game and given that him being the next United manager was the worst keep secret, it behoved him to have been more prepared. For someone that claims that this was his dream job, he's had too many excuses ranging from fatigue, fixture congestion, injuries, balance et al, stuff that I'd expect from a rookie that is new into the league.
Personally, I have little sympathy when it comes to José and the balance of the team. He told us in the first year that he only wanted 4, he got the 4. Now he is one less player than he wanted, should that be enough reason for such a claim for balance.

I agree with your point but with José, I'm not buying it. I expect more from a world class manager.

Agree with all that.

I'd add that to be competing for the league and europe right now he needed every one of his buys to be a hit. That sadly hasn't been the case. Though overall I still think he's done well in terms of transfers. Which is promising for the future.

 

[AngliaRed]

We have one of the top 3-4 managers in the world today! One is retired (SAF) one manages city, one spurs and then Zidane at Madrid. All the fans who want managers like Martin O’Neill or other homegrown managers it will never work. Manchester United is too big and too overwhelming for a manager outside the above mentioned. Moyes did great at Everton but him and his small club mentality was simply swallowed up by the magnitude of the task here.

Jose isnt here for a long time, just a good time and that means winning trophies! If it means parking the bus at Liverpool thats what he’s gonna do! He’s gone to barca with a great madrid and inter side and done the same, thats his way! He doesn’t believe the current team can go blow to blow against the likes of city, chelsea and liverpool and rightfully so. In January and more likely the summer I can see Mata, Lingard, Shaw, Blind and probably Herrera( of whom I love) all sold or getting nowhere near the PL/CL Starting 11. Jose is known for being ruthless in his demotions and sellings in order to make room for new signings.


So far I’m more than pleased with the way Jose and Woodward have operated so far and 1 loss in 13 isnt bad considering the injuries we have. Right now if we sacked Jose there isnt a manager available in world football who could do a better job with our current squad IMO.

 

[prtk0811]

It is all well and good but let's not pretend like we have not hired a manager with a world class pedigree. 3 windows, £400m and almost 7 years worth of experience as a PL manager at the top level, balance is the last excuse I will be having for Mourinho.

In addition to the fact that he had a 6 month spell out of the game and given that him being the next United manager was the worst keep secret, it behoved him to have been more prepared. For someone that claims that this was his dream job, he's had too many excuses ranging from fatigue, fixture congestion, injuries, balance et al, stuff that I'd expect from a rookie that is new into the league.
Personally, I have little sympathy when it comes to José and the balance of the team. He told us in the first year that he only wanted 4, he got the 4. Now he is one less player than he wanted, should that be enough reason for such a claim for balance.

I agree with your point but with José, I'm not buying it. I expect more from a world class manager.

Doesn't change the facts and footballing principles. Managers are humans and not magicians.

It's like real Madrid galacticos type thing under perez who brought on all galacticos in one team yet remained unbalanced for a decade until mourinho rebuild it and zidane fixed the balance and philosophical issues sacking managers after managers before that yet living in Barcelona s shadow for so long.

At this level an unbalanced team will never be a dominating team through out the seaaon you can bring any manager in , he will give you inconsistent results.

While the managers job now becomes to find the right balance in a right system in every game with injuries and when you have got a unbalanced squad because of change in Philosophies it comes down to managers preference of whom to play on their strenghts and how to set up the system, and mourinho often goes to a 4231 hoping the wingers work hard which when is not the case the team looks dysfunctional which will always remain the case until right balance is achived via set up or via having a balanced team and squad.

The onus is also on the board to fix the balance issue which we have been ignoring idiotically since 4 seasons now. Lvg gave an input of signing mane who has worked with the team for 2 years and dropped That idea to listen to mourinho who has never worked with this team for his input on mkh who is a no 10 and could play as rw bet has never had epl experience and the work rate required in this team to have an advantage over other teams who could well turn out to be a one season wonder at Dortmund. The board is also at fault for mismanagement of the squad and the team having ignored the balance issue for long long time

While mourinho has a proven record of demanding work rate from wingers and full backs and players being unhappy or leaving because of that, so that is also a genuine concern one has to keep in mind in terms of the balance of the team while you hire mourinho to do the job.

Either mourinho has to fix the overall balance by playing them in the right system or you need to give mourinho the players and the money to bring the players who provide right balance. But in the first process you risk of leaving players unsatisfied and unhappy of them not being used right. And on second option you need to fork oitore money to find players who deliver right balance.

 

[SuperiorXI]

You can't blame Jose for that performance, the players were completely at fault. Man for man we had a much better team than fecking Huddersfield. There is no excuse for the gutless performance they put in.

 

[AshRK]

Why did he flirt with PSG when he did? It was fecking pointless

If I was a player under him, I'd think "well feck you then"

Gutless display yesterday and Mourinho is to blame

See this is the problem, players cannot pass a fecking ball and it's Jose's fault. Player comes out after the match and says things like we lacked attitude, it is manager's fault. Jose is a manager not a baby sitter. In his pre match interview he clearly said he is not going to PSG. Don't these so called professional footballers know how the media works. Are they little kids who get hurt for everything. Feck them I say if that's the case. If anyone that needs to be blamed it is the players. To not show up is inexcusable, simple as that. Herrera was misplacing simple passez, he should shut his mouth and start playing.

 

[barmyarmy]

Heard in the match day commentary while watching highlights, Mourinho's team never came back in pl while losing by 2 goals.

 

[kouroux]

Has ever been asked by a journalist of his reluctance to play Lukaku-Rashford-Martial at the same time ? I would have thought it to be a very straightforward question.

 

[iluvoursolskjær]

I've always supported Jose and still do, but we're past the point of excuses now. It's his second season with this group having added 7 players; he got just 3 in the previous window rather than 4 - boo fecking hoo. Obviously it's a matter of evolving the team, but the Huddersfield result could be seen coming a mile away and it's not because we needed more world class players against them. It wasn't something you can put down to 'a bad day at the office' either. In an attacking sense there just isn't much of a difference from the LVG era other than us having better players. Setting up the team to prioritise defensive shape and relying on your forwards to create from no particular strategy is bollocks. Losing Pogba = losing our midfield is bollocks. Fellaini being integral cos we need to skip the midfield and attack from knockdowns is bollocks. Slowly and aimlessly recycling the ball until it goes out wide for garbage crosses is bollocks. Setting low expectations (and consequently ruining the mentality of players) by being happy with a point against the likes of fecking Benfica is bollocks.

I get pragmatism in big games against big teams. The Liverpool performance was poor and frustrating but the result was acceptable. But then you need to be ruthless in others. If this goes on for much longer I'll begin to feel like I did under LVG. Not particularly bothered if I miss a United game or not cos if anything it'll probably save me 90mins of bollocks.

/rant

 

[dichinero]

Doesn't change the facts and footballing principles. Managers are humans and not magicians.

It's like real Madrid galacticos type thing under perez who brought on all galacticos in one team yet remained unbalanced for a decade until mourinho rebuild it and zidane fixed the balance and philosophical issues sacking managers after managers before that yet living in Barcelona s shadow for so long.

At this level an unbalanced team will never be a dominating team through out the seaaon you can bring any manager in , he will give you inconsistent results.

While the managers job now becomes to find the right balance in a right system in every game with injuries and when you have got a unbalanced squad because of change in Philosophies it comes down to managers preference of whom to play on their strenghts and how to set up the system, and mourinho often goes to a 4231 hoping the wingers work hard which when is not the case the team looks dysfunctional which will always remain the case until right balance is achived via set up or via having a balanced team and squad.

The onus is also on the board to fix the balance issue which we have been ignoring idiotically since 4 seasons now. Lvg gave an input of signing mane who has worked with the team for 2 years and dropped That idea to listen to mourinho who has never worked with this team for his input on mkh who is a no 10 and could play as rw bet has never had epl experience and the work rate required in this team to have an advantage over other teams who could well turn out to be a one season wonder at Dortmund. The board is also at fault for mismanagement of the squad and the team having ignored the balance issue for long long time

While mourinho has a proven record of demanding work rate from wingers and full backs and players being unhappy or leaving because of that, so that is also a genuine concern one has to keep in mind in terms of the balance of the team while you hire mourinho to do the job.

Either mourinho has to fix the overall balance by playing them in the right system or you need to give mourinho the players and the money to bring the players who provide right balance. But in the first process you risk of leaving players unsatisfied and unhappy of them not being used right. And on second option you need to fork oitore money to find players who deliver right balance.

This almost sounds like the manager's job is first to spend big, then select after spending. I would like to believe that what is required of them is more than that. At what point does the world class part of a manager get involved if it's just to buy and select? Does he not have a responsibility to work and improve that players at his disposal?

This is the same thing that fans were calling Pep a fraud for in that all he wants is to buy and select, meanwhile it is evident that he is improving both the players he has bought and the ones at his his disposal, technically and tactically.

I can't accept that it cannot be demanded of the manager to get more out of the players. Isn't that his job? Sure, the player's haven't performed well but they are the reflection of the manager at the end of the day.

No two manager's have the same idea and it is the job of the new one to be able to communicate his ideas to team and to individuals. This is where the big money is at.

I'm not throwing down your opinion but I don't buy the change in philosophy as an excuse. In the last decade, Spurs have gone through different styles of management from Jol to Ramos to Harry to AVB to Sherwood and now Poch. Many would say that Pochettino is not world class but somehow he has achieved some balance with less experience and resources in a short time.

 

[R'hllor]

MEdia made that shit up. Media twists everything.

 

[breakout67]

Just a reminder that we are second in the league and have had the best start since 2010/11. There is a clear improvement in the team and we have smashed West Ham, Swansea, Everton who we drew with last season. We have also been extremely comfortable in the CL unlike previous seasons where we would struggle against average teams like CSKA away from home.

Half the meltdown is simply because Man City have been better than us. It seems people are forgetting they have one of the best managers in the world and have more spending power than us. There's no shame in being worse than them; so long as we are in touching distance with them; we still have a shout at the league.

 

[MDFC Manager]

Opinion differs, in your eyes maybe he is worthless, but back then (when he was in Juventus) I've always thought if clubs like Chelsea gets him, they will dominate the premier league, or if Real Madrid gets him, they will dominate Europe etc - and that's how highly I rate him.

One wonders if issue is the managers inability to properly harness Pogba's talent

Heard in the match day commentary while watching highlights, Mourinho's team never came back in pl while losing by 2 goals.

Yup, but when you think about it, it's not surprising.

 

[Stacks]

As I have already stated on numerous occassions, Aguero/Silva/KDB are clearly better than anything we have available and I'd add Kompany/Sterling to that list as well, Pep inherited all of them.
You are exaggerating. Matic and Pogba are out and out centre midfielders who have won titles there. If 12 months ago Jose had a choice to buy Pogba and Matic to play in the middle of the park or Silva and De Bruyne, most would say ours, as they should be able to boss it more, having years of experience fighting in the middle of the park. Pogba was voted top 20 in the world whilst playing in the middle of the park so for Silva and De Bruyne (accustomed to being further forward), to drop deeper and be better than Pogba and Matic, it shouldn't be an option.
Kompany started 23 league games in 2 seasons so is a worthless bit of inheritance. Pep tried to sell Sterling to Arsenal. Some inheritance. Pep didn't even rate him. Sterling has had a meh City career to date. He is improving under Pep but Jose inherited Martial and he is stalling.
You just not being honest by continuing to claim he bought "a keeper and some FBs" he spent £40m on Ederson 1 season after spending 17m on Bravo. He bought the 2 best fullbacks currently on the market for close to world record fees. It's much easier to transition from the Zabaleta's Kolarov's and Joe Harts when you can go out and offer top market prices for anyone you want.

Stop trivialising the amount of money he's spent with nonsense like "some young wingers and FB's.
I don't think they are to be honest, but I get what you mean, he spent large on areas of weakness, fair enough. it's just to many, its not like he bought Mbappe, Suarez, Neymar, Bale etc, the type of players the actual big guns have been buying. Sane, Sterling and co are no Mbappe or a Neymar so I think Pep is doing well with these young guns.


He does have proper resources at United and I've never said otherwise. That's not what's being debated.



It will inevitably come back to what you define as world class but he's never established himself in that bracket for myself (and most neutral fans going by common opinions) players like Aguero/Silva etc have.

 

[Minimalist]

Just a reminder that we are second in the league and have had the best start since 2010/11. There is a clear improvement in the team and we have smashed West Ham, Swansea, Everton who we drew with last season. We have also been extremely comfortable in the CL unlike previous seasons where we would struggle against average teams like CSKA away from home.

Half the meltdown is simply because Man City have been better than us. It seems people are forgetting they have one of the best managers in the world and have more spending power than us. There's no shame in being worse than them; so long as we are in touching distance with them; we still have a shout at the league.

I think what people are considering is that if this (the opening 9 matches) is a sign of what's to come - then we'll probably end up in the top 4 somewhere but might not be challenging for the league (realistically) when it's heading into Feb/Mar/April. Especially if we have a bad run at some point.

And for some of us, regardless of how good City are, that was would be poor from Mourinho. Maybe not enough to say he deserves to be replaced (I mean it would be progress) but he's spent a lot of money already and theres expectations with that.

 

[Stacks]

So, please tell me what top team would want the like of young, blind, smalling, lingard, mata and so... A turd will always be a turd even if you put some sprinkles on it (just an analogy not trying to offend any player)

The thing is, you can live with 2 or 3 of those player on a team but not with more. Since we have some injuries it gets hard to create a team that has some fluid football. Midfield is at the worst possible at the moment, center backs also. If the core, the backbone of your team is stuck all the rest will be also.

You think Mourinho forgot what he knew in the first games of the Premier league? The squad is some degrees behind the first 11 and that will create problems in the team, just that.

Delph? Bravo, Danilo, Mangala, Yaya Toure, Gundpgan, Sterling, Stones....Any top teams want these guys??? I think not.

 

[Ban]

If we don't win the league this year or anything or maybe just a FA cup or a league cup should he get a third year? What I'm asking is would Ed fire him?
If we continue to progress (albeit maybe not in the speed we all wish it to) and if it's visible the club is going in a right way I think he still should have another year.
I'm asking this cause it seem to me a tide is turning a bit against him among our fanbase and another bad result or 2 and it will be worse.

There are problems and I don't want to be someone to paint everything rosy cause it isn't but I'm satisfied with the work he has done so far.
Still there are things he should do better and we still have holes in our squad. Mainly that we don't have a proper winger, our FB positions need a complete reconstruction and either we should add a CM or get Pereira back in January. Oh and a famous nr. 10 could prove to be a problem too.

 

[Cheesy]

If we don't win the league this year or anything or maybe just a FA cup or a league cup should he get a third year? What I'm asking is would Ed fire him?
If we continue to progress (albeit maybe not in the speed we all wish it to) and if it's visible the club is going in a right way I think he still should have another year.
I'm asking this cause it seem to me a tide is turning a bit against him among our fanbase and another bad result or 2 and it will be worse.

There are problems and I don't want to be someone to paint everything rosy cause it isn't but I'm satisfied with the work he has done so far.
Still there are things he should do better and we still have holes in our squad. Mainly that we don't have a proper winger, our FB positions need a complete reconstruction and either we should add a CM or get Pereira back in January. Oh and a famous nr. 10 could prove to be a problem too.

I reckon he should get another season if we mount a decent title challenge. That'd at least be a sign of notable progress.