Juan Mata as deep-lying playmaker (DLP)

[meamth]

Unlike Pjanic, Mata's distribution is mostly weak. His long balls are questionable, doesn't hit it with ease.

Pjanic was a pass master when he was an AM, now he is transformed into DLP. Made sense, Mata? Not so much.

EDIT:
But if you're eager to put him there as DLP, he will be like that Swansea player. What was his name again?

Britton. Yes, Lee Britton.

 

[Varun]

No, terrible idea

 

[RikRuud]

Better utilised in the final 3rd. Maybe in a few years when he’s moved on.

 

[SAFMUTD]

He has the strength and speed of an infant, massive no go from me.

This.

He has the physique, strenght and speed of a 12 year old, does not fit in the position, frankly there are not many positions where he fits. To shine he has to play in a high posesion team.

 

[Ekeke]

Terrible. Maybe we could try De Gea up front as the target man instead of Lukaku too.

 

[Sky1981]

I dont like this sort of thinking. It may work on a very very rare occasions (bastian schweisteinger). But most of the times we ended up with young, valencia, john oshea type of players. Solid at best but not a specialist.

Giggs in the midfield wasnt too successful. He's functional in midfield, if not because he's doing it as giggs in mid thirties let's be honest his performance there was medicore if we compare him with top natural center midfielders.

 

[Lay]

Half back or Regista. Hope when Mourinho says he played well, that Mata will overreact and storm out.

 

[Ish]

One of his biggest strengths, if not the biggest, is his timing and off-ball attacking movement. We'd deprive him of it as a DLP. He doesn't really have that good passing range either, his ball retention is good, sure, but he was more of a striker/finisher than a playmaker.

So no.

Bang on, IMO.

 

[redIndianDevil]

I don't get why Mata is being made as if he is Scott McTominay that always picks the safest and most obvious pass, he has the ability to deal with the pressing too. The only problem is he doesn't have that awareness to intercept passes and no pace or tackling ability to win back the possession.

If Sanchez is not going to play in the right, I'd rather have Mata in the right position than Rashford.

 

[Kostov]

No way, Mata has the physical tools of a toddler, he would be overrun as DLP.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

+ Build-up
+ Creative
+ Good movement to receive passes
+ Recycle Possession
+ Agile
+ Okay defensive work (marking and tackling)

- Long range of pass, unconvincing
- Ball retention, poor at deep position
- Keeping/Holding the ball, terrible
- Dispossessed too easily, deep position
- Speed, low
- Strength, poor
- Composure, bad under physical pressure
- Interception awareness? zero

 

[Craig Ward]

Why some fans think playing our players in positions they are not used to and have no skill set or history of playing there baffles me.

Mata is a central playmaker, a natural #10. He has wrongly been used as a wide right player for years so we can accommodate him into the team.

He is technically good, but our system and style would expose him as a DLP. We also have Matic/McTom/Periera/Herrea who would all do better there. Just makes no sense.

I've seen people stating Shaw should be CB too, bad enough Jose actually played Herrea/McTom in a back 3, now these suggestions.

If Jose was unwilling to play blind as DLP/DM - he aint gunna do it with Mata

 

[Ekeke]

+ Build-up
+ Creative
+ Good movement to receive passes
+ Recycle Possession
+ Agile
+ Okay defensive work (marking and tackling)

- Long range of pass, unconvincing
- Ball retention, poor at deep position
- Keeping/Holding the ball, terrible
- Dispossessed too easily, deep position
- Speed, low
- Strength, poor
- Composure, bad under physical pressure
- Interception awareness? zero

This is far, far too kind.

His defensive work would be atrocious for a deep CM. And when he did play CM under Van Gaal he wasn't creative. He just passed the ball sideways to keep it. In fact that was when his end product became average and even when he went back to playing a wide or forward role he's never had the same cutting edge he once had before that time.

Now I was going to mention that Andreas Pereira has better defensive work and he doesnt get picked and then I realized how stupid this idea was to even manifest in someone's brain.

Andreas Pereira has all of Mata's good points and nowhere near as many bad points. So if you want a player more like Mata in CM, we just play Andreas. Simple.

 

[Drz]

I think our deep lying midfielder should really be Pogba. He will still make mistakes in that position, but if we give him a run there, I think he will improve and iron-out some of the decision-making that lead to those gaffs.
But you need players on the same wave-length to accompany him in midfield, players that willingly run into space. I'd like to see a midfield of Pogba sitting deep with Fred and Peirera (or even Herrera) set-up as box-to-box midfielders.

 

[11101]

No, it's a terrible idea.

He doesn't have the passing range, the strength in possession or the stamina.

He would be run over by opposition midfields. He doesn't have the positional sense in defence to cut out passing lanes or make interceptions and he can't hold the ball well enough for long periods of time. It's totally different to the intricate one two passes further up the field. Then there's his passing range. He's great at 10-20 yard through balls but I don't recall ever really seeing him play longer than that, which is kind of a pre-requisite of that position.

 

[montpelier]

To encourage the opposition to press & we play on the break.

I like it.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

He's the best in our squad at getting in goalscoring positions. The idea is not altogether insane but we need him in the opposition box.

 

[Ashley R1+O]

Mata can't run, this would be an awful idea. The DLP should gravitate away from the tall and passing-oriented Matic to the more mobile defensive demonic tackler. It would complement a Pogba/Fred combo in front of them in a 4-3-3.

 

[Varun]

To think the OP is a regular in the draft games on Caf.

 

[mewnew11]

He'd be passing to De Gea more than he would the forwards. Slightest pressure and he goes backwards.

Absolutely right ....

 

[davidmichael]

No, no, no, no, no.

 

[simplyared]

Not for me! Mata has come to a stage in his career where he can be useful as a squad player for us and nothing more. We can't be looking to find a regular place/role in the team to just slot him into.

 

[shamans]

Scholes was good in younger days, but world class when he moved deep later in his career. Mata can't do the same?

One of Scholes’ biggest strength was that you just couldn’t take the ball off him if he didn’t want to attack. He’d move and switch between his feet but the ball never left.

For Mata that’s a huge weakness

 

[Dr Fink]

You lot are so obsessed with the negatives. Mata shouldn't play as Pirlo-lite not because he's too slow or weak, just like Pirlo was, but because he's by far the best player in our team at finding spaces in the middle and final third and connecting the dots by drifting from side to side at opportune moments. He's been very important in turning our season around for that reason alone.

This guy has it as I see it. Mata joins the dots. It took 20+ mins or so in the Newcastle game but it worked. Mata is a "floater", a number ten. When he did it against the Geordies, he became Pogba's foil, allowing him an outlet, to play off. Little triangles and Utd were off and away attacking. This releases Pogba and is the only way that seems to work as the front three (pick any from Sanchez, Rashford, Martial and Lukaku) don't run the channels between opponents' CB and full back. Pogba has very limited options if Mata doesn't play. Play Mata in the right position and he's fantastic, he creates chances. This gets the best out of Pogba and Mata. Juan is never cut out to be a DLP.

 

[londonredmaniac]

I think we have to stop trying to shoehorn players into positions to solve any issues we might have, or because we can't fit them into what may be perceived as their preferred position.

It seems to be happening all too often. Not that it can't work, more that it is the exception rather than the rule. Mata is very intelligent off the ball, his movement in the final third is certainly one of his assets.

He doesn't have anything like the passing range I would expect sat deeper into midfield, to echo what has already been said in the thread. That's just one of the concerns. If we want a player like that we need to look for one. Either through our academy or outside the club. The same for CB or FB...and wingers IMO. Occasionally it comes off, but when you are doing it in 2 or 3 positions at once? It's a recipe for madness IMO.

 

[Pughnichi]

He has the strength and speed of an infant, massive no go from me.

Brilliant

I second this

 

[Eleven-Eighteen]

Nope. Does not have the physicality to hold off players, nor the legs to move into space, nor the long range passing skills.

 

[MadMike]

I'm off to make a "Juan Mata as a goalkeeper" thread

 

[gerdm07]

I just picture him losing every 50/50 ball in center of the park. Scary.

 

[Decomposing In Paris]

I dont like this sort of thinking. It may work on a very very rare occasions (bastian schweisteinger). But most of the times we ended up with young, valencia, john oshea type of players. Solid at best but not a specialist.

Giggs in the midfield wasnt too successful. He's functional in midfield, if not because he's doing it as giggs in mid thirties let's be honest his performance there was medicore if we compare him with top natural center midfielders.

I personally think Mata in the DLP role wouldn't suit at all, but that's hardly the position Giggs played, or a fair reflection of the way Giggs reinvented himself as a footballer. Giggs was incredible in the middle in that 2011 run to the CL final... so let's be honest and say that your opinion of Giggs is just that. It's my opinion that people really underestimate how good an all-round player Ryan Giggs was.

 

[Sky1981]

I personally think Mata in the DLP role wouldn't suit at all, but that's hardly the position Giggs played, or a fair reflection of the way Giggs reinvented himself as a footballer. Giggs was incredible in the middle in that 2011 run to the CL final... so let's be honest and say that your opinion of Giggs is just that. It's my opinion that people really underestimate how good an all-round player Ryan Giggs was.

He's good. But top class good as center midfielder? In scholes / keane / kante / pogba class?

 

[Canagel]

Absolutely not. He can't even win the duels on the RW so how can he play as DLP? Maybe as number 8 like City how City use D Silva in the easier home games.

 

[Sky1981]

I think we have to stop trying to shoehorn players into positions to solve any issues we might have, or because we can't fit them into what may be perceived as their preferred position.

It seems to be happening all too often. Not that it can't work, more that it is the exception rather than the rule. Mata is very intelligent off the ball, his movement in the final third is certainly one of his assets.

He doesn't have anything like the passing range I would expect sat deeper into midfield, to echo what has already been said in the thread. That's just one of the concerns. If we want a player like that we need to look for one. Either through our academy or outside the club. The same for CB or FB...and wingers IMO. Occasionally it comes off, but when you are doing it in 2 or 3 positions at once? It's a recipe for madness IMO.

He's 28 yo though. His reading of the game, football intelligence, movement, instict and habit are built on being a playmaker. You can't drill a new set of play like that with 2 or 3 months training. It took years to perfect a position even when it looks simple.

 

[rpg]

A DLP apart of long range distribution has to be very good defensively and Mata has neither.

 

[Decomposing In Paris]

He's good. But top class good as center midfielder? In scholes / keane / kante / pogba class?

You used the term mediocre to describe his performances in central midfield. Mediocre isn't good. He played in similar areas of the pitch, but a completely different role to all the players you just listed except perhaps Pogba, and he was probably better defensively than Pogba because his play increased in risk as he moved closer to the opposition goal. I just feel you could have found a better comparison... Rooney in midfield for instance would have been at least closer.

 

[Minimalist]

Nah I don't think that's where his strengths are at all (in terms of passing and vision).

Final third is where he comes alive and he's not in there enough.

 

[Sunny Jim]

Not a chance - No10 or nada

hugs

This. He lacks physicality and engine to play deep.

 

[el3mel]

How can anyone not think this will end as a disaster ?

 

[luke511]

This is far, far too kind.

His defensive work would be atrocious for a deep CM. And when he did play CM under Van Gaal he wasn't creative. He just passed the ball sideways to keep it. In fact that was when his end product became average and even when he went back to playing a wide or forward role he's never had the same cutting edge he once had before that time.

Now I was going to mention that Andreas Pereira has better defensive work and he doesnt get picked and then I realized how stupid this idea was to even manifest in someone's brain.

Andreas Pereira has all of Mata's good points and nowhere near as many bad points. So if you want a player more like Mata in CM, we just play Andreas. Simple.

I've stressed this point numerous times recently on here, I'd love to see how he did as the most advanced in a midfield 3. He's closer to Coutinho than he is Mata, but that's a good thing.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

https://fansided.com/2018/10/22/juan-mata-can-manchester-uniteds-santi-cazorla/

It's just a fan opinion, but does make some points

+ Mata anyway drops deep to play even currently (whenever he plays)
+ Pogba (and even Fred) lacks the discipline to do this and both are anyways better good going forwards.
+ Will have a player dedicated to getting the ball out of the defence. Helps CBs and quicker transitions.
+ DLPs are not really known for pace usually, so partnered with say Herrera..it may be a workable combo. He has workrate and ain't bad in defensive work.

Opinions?

Mata is just a left footer, a lot of good quality DLP can use both feet (Carrick, Pirlo, Alonso, even Santi) and it’s very important if they know how to use both feet it helps for quicker transition as well.

Mata has problem in his defensive work, positioning and awareness, Mata is more of an attacker. Asking Mata to be DLP is like asking Ozil to be DLP as well. If his positioning and awareness aren’t good enough, and he can’t defend the ball with his strength then he’s likely to get exposed many time while under pressure.

I am 100x more comfortable with Pogba playing in the role than Mata.