Are long diagonals something ETH employs?
Kalvin Phillips
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If we can make a deal, this would be an absolutely fantastic signing.
I think I read somewhere that Man Utd have over 50 scouts, which makes me wonder why the club finds it tough to scout anyone who doesn't regularly feature on Match of Day.
Not sure. Someone earlier in the thread said he did. I'm just assuming that if we are in for him then it must be at the new managers request. The report could be nonsense of course.
I rate him. Tenacious and hard working. His technique and passing in his position and a second to none. So he can be really helpful for us in that regard playing as a no. 6. But he doesn’t impose himself in the match like he should. He has the right tools to do it but he fades away too easily for my liking. Between the two I rate Rice higher.
What a ridiculous signing this would be. I hope he's as true to his Leeds roots as everyone around him says he is and he tells us to do one if this interest is correct.
Dream signing
Add him and we are looking at Bruno, VDB, Scott, Fred, Garner, Matic, Kalvin as our midfield for next season. Still feel we are over dependant on Bruno to create.
He’s a fine player. Nothing special but a solid player with a pretty well-rounded skillset suited for the league.
Would be a great test for ten Hag - not expecting miracles of course, but I would like to see if he would be able to raise a decent player like Phillips to a top-class midfielder in the way Klopp has with some players at Liverpool.
He has certainly provided evidence of that at Ajax, looking at Tadic, van de Beek, Haller etc. (though remains to be seen how league quality/demands may have influenced this).
Would be a great test for ten Hag - not expecting miracles of course, but I would like to see if he would be able to raise a decent player like Phillips to a top-class midfielder in the way Klopp has with some players at Liverpool.
He has certainly provided evidence of that at Ajax, looking at Tadic, van de Beek, Haller etc. (though remains to be seen how league quality/demands may have influenced this).
I'd be happy with that as well, but then you can still invest in another position.
Not a fan, really. Like, at all.
Be interesting if he does. Rhodri is always clipping it in the final third out wide. Obviously Liverpool too who do it much deeper. One of the most notable things watching those sides compared to us. When RR first came I thought we started doing it more but that went away fast.
Great tank and great ability. Rather him than Neves. But really have to get a hold of his injury record.
The latter. The two seem to be compared by the media when looking at PL targets for us in that position. Holding mid, English, easy (lazy) comparison for the feckwits that call themselves journalists in this country.
@Classical Mechanic post gives a reasonable explanation of KP (* he's saying he CAN pass a long ball, similar to Scholes, not saying he's another Sxholes
). Video shows a bit.I see him as one of these players that sits and is a buffer for the defence and gets the ball moving when attacking. Nice and simple.. one of those players that you're right, you don't always notice but probably because does things comfortably and not an 8, 10, forward (the players who tend to get the attention). I'd say a bit like Carrick bit t.b.c. NOT comparing the two.
interviews post Leeds and England games have been interesting. Comes across as calm, feet on the ground, confident but not arrogant. Apart from ability, one of my main issues with this shower of shite squad is how mentally weak they appear.. KP doesn't look like he'd have that problem, took to England appearances like a duck to water.
Are there potentially better players? Yes.
Are they available for a fee we'd pay and have Pl experience? (I realise not essential but helps surely as a lot of overseas players can need a settling in period)... not sure.
£40mish, I'd definitely take.
We've never had a Brexit transfer strategy.
Out of 36 paid transfers since 2013, only 6 have been British (Sancho, Maguire, James, AWB, Grant and Shaw). And of those, AWB might still declare for DR Congo having played for them at U-20 level, whilst Grant is more of a coach than a player.
That's exactly the same number (6) as Manchester City bought in the same period.
People only seem to bringing up 'Brexit' when it comes to British players they don't like. Nobody said it about Sancho. And nobody brings up some equivalent term about unfancied European or South American targets - even though failed European/SA transfers are the main reason for the mess we're currently in.
For what it's worth, the current first team is as Portuguese as it is English. And the rumours about Neves are stronger than the ones about Philips.
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You’d say you wouldn’t sign for united until you have your agent on the phone saying man united are in for you. I’m sure you’d listen, it’s a big step up, a good project, more money. Would be silly to not even listen.
Would he even want to join us? I know Alan Smith famously claimed he would never join us, but those were mitigating circumstances when Leeds were relegated and under dire financial straits.
Either way Leeds will look to fleece us if they even entertain the possibility of a deal, would rather we look for a cheaper option.
Either way Leeds will look to fleece us if they even entertain the possibility of a deal, would rather we look for a cheaper option.
One of the most notable things when I’ve watched Kamara on the odd occasion is how good he is at the diagonal. He’s younger and free. I still think he’s a good option.
He won't come here! Leeds through & through
I totally agree - for the right price he is just what we need - really hardworking, will do the dirty work without fuss, and will pop off the odd decent pass to get a counter started. Would be a great addition to the squad, but I just think Leeds will overprice him! The Utd tax will hurt us on this one!
What’s his injury record like? Didn’t watch much of him last season, but was impressed at the euros. Leeds seemed to have fallen apart without him this season where he’s been injured whenever I watch them
Would be happy to know we're not trying to bring Rice for 80+m, on the other hand I could imagine a more exciting prospect than Philips. Then again if baldie wants him leggo.
I think there's a strong rumour that Atletico have turned his head. I'd definitely be more inclined to go for him for much less.
Why?
He’s decent but I think there’s better out there for a cheaper price.
Bissouma would be my first choice if we’re dipping into the PL. Tchouameni would also be an excellent addition. Signing both him and Bissouma would be.
Bissouma would be my first choice if we’re dipping into the PL. Tchouameni would also be an excellent addition. Signing both him and Bissouma would be
.Is he actually great at defending or on the ball?
I liked his work-rate in the Euros, he is also a capable passer, but I am not sure he is a DM, as in the Euros, it was Rice playing the DM role while Phillips was pressing upfield.
Thank you ever so much for this.
Thanks for the explanation. I just have one small remark, PL experience isn't a thing for players either, PL players also need a settling period in their new clubs people seem to overlook that it also apply to them and happens every single year. There is also a big difference between playing for a bottom half team and top team, the game is played differently for these teams even if they are in the same league.The latter. The two seem to be compared by the media when looking at PL targets for us in that position. Holding mid, English, easy (lazy) comparison for the feckwits that call themselves journalists in this country.
@Classical Mechanic post gives a reasonable explanation of KP (* he's saying he CAN pass a long ball, similar to Scholes, not saying he's another Sxholes
I see him as one of these players that sits and is a buffer for the defence and gets the ball moving when attacking. Nice and simple.. one of those players that you're right, you don't always notice but probably because does things comfortably and not an 8, 10, forward (the players who tend to get the attention). I'd say a bit like Carrick bit t.b.c. NOT comparing the two.
interviews post Leeds and England games have been interesting. Comes across as calm, feet on the ground, confident but not arrogant. Apart from ability, one of my main issues with this shower of shite squad is how mentally weak they appear.. KP doesn't look like he'd have that problem, took to England appearances like a duck to water.
Are there potentially better players? Yes.
Are they available for a fee we'd pay and have Pl experience? (I realise not essential but helps surely as a lot of overseas players can need a settling in period)... not sure.
£40mish, I'd definitely take.
The cross-field diagonal is a real feature in teams who sacrifice defensive stability for goals to then create overloads on one side of the pitch, which then results in a switch of play diagonally to open space up for the free man. And as far as profile goes, Phillips is a fit for ten Hag in that regard, as well having fantastic intensity off the ball.
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Decent player and Leeds look much worse when he isn't in the side. Hasn't looked as good for England next to Rice in what isn't the most natural midfield combination.
There was an interview a while ago where Pirlo noted Phillips as an example of one of the few Regista-like English midfielders as opposed to the more typical box-to-box mold, even while also noting that they (Pirlo and Phillips) were quite different types of players.
Here's a section from an article on him in The Athletic to give an idea of the type of DM he is.
There was an interview a while ago where Pirlo noted Phillips as an example of one of the few Regista-like English midfielders as opposed to the more typical box-to-box mold, even while also noting that they (Pirlo and Phillips) were quite different types of players.
Here's a section from an article on him in The Athletic to give an idea of the type of DM he is.
The right choice of data metrics can be subjective in these instances but there are three main parts to Phillips’ game: being busy defensively, dropping between the centre-backs and getting on the ball in his own defensive third, and a willingness to play long.
In this piece of analysis, the cut-off has been set at the top 20 per cent of players for each given statistic — the things that define Phillips — in an attempt to answer the question of how unique he really is.
Looking at his true tackles (a calculation taking into account tackles, interceptions and fouls when attempting a tackle) and true interceptions (interceptions plus blocked passes) per 90 minutes, Phillips racks up 5.6 of the former and 3.1 of the latter. Combined, this puts him in the top 15 per cent of all players in the Premier League who have amassed 900 minutes or more in central or defensive midfield. He is joined there by the likes of Chelsea’s N’Golo Kante, Yves Bissouma of Brighton and Manchester City’s Fernandinho; elite midfielders in their own right.
To reflect his positional versatility and the time he spends either in the back line or dictating build-up play, it is necessary to look at the share of his total touches which come within Leeds’ defensive third. Overall, 30 per cent of Phillips’ touches are made here, putting him in the top five per cent. This puts him alongside Arsenal’s Mohamed Elneny and Tom Davies of Everton, who also drop deep to help their teams construct attacks.
Lastly, his volume of long passes — 7.8 per 90, to be precise — puts him in the top 10 per cent of midfielders, a range he shares with Jonjo Shelvey of Newcastle, Burnley’s Ashley Westwood and Youri Tielemans of Leicester.
Current data shows that it is unusual for anyone to rate highly in even two of these three areas.
For example, Leicester’s Wilfred Ndidi, Allan of Everton and Crystal Palace’s James McArthur are the only others to put up the requisite defensive numbers while also getting on the ball a lot in their defensive third. Chelsea’s Jorginho, Thiago of Liverpool and Wolves’ Ruben Neves are the only three who are very active defensively and have a penchant for a long pass too.
In fact, he is the only player to appear in the top 20 per cent across all three categories.
In this piece of analysis, the cut-off has been set at the top 20 per cent of players for each given statistic — the things that define Phillips — in an attempt to answer the question of how unique he really is.
Looking at his true tackles (a calculation taking into account tackles, interceptions and fouls when attempting a tackle) and true interceptions (interceptions plus blocked passes) per 90 minutes, Phillips racks up 5.6 of the former and 3.1 of the latter. Combined, this puts him in the top 15 per cent of all players in the Premier League who have amassed 900 minutes or more in central or defensive midfield. He is joined there by the likes of Chelsea’s N’Golo Kante, Yves Bissouma of Brighton and Manchester City’s Fernandinho; elite midfielders in their own right.
To reflect his positional versatility and the time he spends either in the back line or dictating build-up play, it is necessary to look at the share of his total touches which come within Leeds’ defensive third. Overall, 30 per cent of Phillips’ touches are made here, putting him in the top five per cent. This puts him alongside Arsenal’s Mohamed Elneny and Tom Davies of Everton, who also drop deep to help their teams construct attacks.
Lastly, his volume of long passes — 7.8 per 90, to be precise — puts him in the top 10 per cent of midfielders, a range he shares with Jonjo Shelvey of Newcastle, Burnley’s Ashley Westwood and Youri Tielemans of Leicester.
Current data shows that it is unusual for anyone to rate highly in even two of these three areas.
For example, Leicester’s Wilfred Ndidi, Allan of Everton and Crystal Palace’s James McArthur are the only others to put up the requisite defensive numbers while also getting on the ball a lot in their defensive third. Chelsea’s Jorginho, Thiago of Liverpool and Wolves’ Ruben Neves are the only three who are very active defensively and have a penchant for a long pass too.
In fact, he is the only player to appear in the top 20 per cent across all three categories.
Before I watched him I thought Phillips was like Carrick.
The more I watched him for England more than Leeds he didn't seem all that eye catching on the ball.
Then I found out more about how Rice plays off the ball and became a fan of him.
Whilst I'm not sure - my gut feeling tells me that Phillips is not good enough for us.
The more I watched him for England more than Leeds he didn't seem all that eye catching on the ball.
Then I found out more about how Rice plays off the ball and became a fan of him.
Whilst I'm not sure - my gut feeling tells me that Phillips is not good enough for us.
Rice has looked a class above in my opinion this season especially.
Yeah he's really under-rated in general I think on here because of the supposed price tag, but he'd be a brilliant addition.
Obviously the issue here is that he'll likely be twice the price of Phillips.
Rice is better but aside from the likely difference in cost, there is also a difference in the way they play, especially as Rice has developed into slightly more of a box to box midfielder. That isn't neccesarily what you want from a DM in every set-up, many of which would see Rice's big driving runs forward into space discouraged.
Wouldn't be my first choice, but exactly the type of player we should be looking at moving forward. High energy, love it.
Won't happen. I've seen videos of this guy openly referring to Man Utd as "the scum" and not as if the club has the same pull as when they signed Smith etc.
We are probably buying the entire England midfield along with Declan Rice for 150M. Can we include Phil Foden too?
Rice is obviously better but Phillips is good enough to play for top club imo. The price will be more reasonable to sign good quality DM. He played under Bielsa in the very high line and high press in very aggressive and attacking way. He should fit in to ETH system.
Due to him being die hard Leeds fan, I didn’t expect him to join us unless if Leeds get relegated or Leeds in financial trouble which forcing to sell him to us like Alan smith. But if we can get him, I like the idea. Luckhurst is a reliable source these days.
Due to him being die hard Leeds fan, I didn’t expect him to join us unless if Leeds get relegated or Leeds in financial trouble which forcing to sell him to us like Alan smith. But if we can get him, I like the idea. Luckhurst is a reliable source these days.
I think naturally he's more of a box to box midfielder but since Bielsa took over he's regularly played as a DM for Leeds and done very well. For England he had more of a licence to roam. While he doesn't get forward as much as Soucek, Rice is a lot more advanced than he is for England at West Ham.
If ETH wants Phillips for a DM role, I think his profile is fine, even if I'm not a huge fan of his.
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