Maybe try watching him play
Khvicha Kvaratskhelia | Napoli Player
- Thread starter Ekeke
- Start date
And you have an alarm every time I post something, my friend. Let's not derail this thread any further.
It's really strange, isn't it? The poster below you even said stats don't matter when stats are literal facts used by football analysts in the modern game. I think they're forgetting how good he was for Leicester in the 15/16 season. Kvaratskhelia is an extraordinary player, alright, but let's not forget he had two goals and four assists in the Russian league before joining Napoli. There is nothing Kvaratskhelia has done that Mahrez hasn't, he just has the age on his side and his potential is way higher than Mahrez ever had.
By the highest standards, Mahrez is average.
PS: no 'analyst' uses just goals and assists in the ridiculously basic way you have to determine the quality of a player. If you're gonna use stats you have to consider everything.
What I also said is 'stats won't help you' meaning the two stats you have provided, not 'stats don't matter'. They do, but not in the way that people try to claim they do (ie quoting goal and assist numbers to prove that one player is better than another). There's like a thousand more statistical measures.
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Mahrez was a top 10 player in the world in 15/16.
Kvaratskhelia is arguably a top 5 player in the world right now so.....
I don't even know what to respond to the bolded part, but that is a frightening opinion. We're also talking about peak Mahrez, not 32 year old Mahrez.
Of course they don't, but these two stats are the most commonly used when debating on this forum. You don't talk about Messi's expected long balls per 90 to determine his quality here, do you? I don't need to consider every stat there is to determine whether a player is good enough or not, and by your logic you need to analyse Kvaratskhelia's statistics in order for him to be a great player. My guess is that you've not even watched 10 of Napoli's games this season, but a bunch of compilations and his stats. And again, whatever Kvaratskhelia has done so far, Mahrez did in 15/16 season, but at the time Mahrez was much older than Kvara so it's not as impressive to some.
Cute protective person.
I don’t have time to watch him play so when I ask about his performances he gets protected by you
So was Jamie Vardy, according to the Ballon D'Or voting. Does that mean that peak Vardy is better than current Victor Osimhen? After all, Vardy scored 24 goals in a much stronger league than Osimhen, who has only 21 goals so far in pathetically weak Serie A....
Peak @zaafi logic
Mahrez was very good in that single season for Leicester. No one is disputing that. But overall, he's not that good, by the standards of the top players in the world. It's pretty simple really. No need for you to tie yourself up in knots about it.
? That's wrong, he has 4 assists in the CL..
For sure it can't be zero, everyone should remember when he toyed TAA and Joe Gomez before assisting Gio Simeone.. That was one of the best individual play of the season..
I'm sure TAA still has nightmares about it now....
Vardy wasn't a top 10 player at all. Mahrez, however, was. It seems you've forgotten the amount of world class players that was around during 2015-16 season. The difference in quality then and now is massive. Messi is worse, Ronaldo is in Saudi-Arabia, Neymar is worse, then there is Kroos, Bale, Hazard, Suarez, Muller, Lewandowski, Benzema, Agüero, Alexis Sanchez, De Bruyne, Lahm, Busquets, Özil, Griezmann, David Silva, Modric, Ramos, Di Maria, Coutinho, Reus etc. There are just so many more world class players in that season than there is today. All of these players have either retired or aged and become worse.So was Jamie Vardy, according to the Ballon D'Or voting. Does that mean that peak Vardy is better than current Victor Osimhen? After all, Vardy scored 24 goals in a much stronger league than Osimhen, who has only 21 goals so far in pathetically weak Serie A....
Peak @zaafi logic
Also, even though Serie A is a lot better and more fun to watch than a few years back, there are still teams like Monza, Empoli, Salernitana, Lecce and Verona in it. These teams would very likely lose to the bottom team in Premier League.
He was world class, not very good. So yeah, you're disputing it. Oh, "it's pretty simple", huh? Well, it all makes sense now with your reasonable argumentation
Let me ask you something. If Kvaratskhelia broke through in 2015, would you still put him as top 5 in the world?Edit: I'd like you to explain to me how Mahrez wasn't a very good fotballer since you feel so strongly about it. Why is he average? Does he lack technique, shooting power, passing, dribbling? Enlighten me.
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Pretty much every single player you've named there is better than Mahrez. There's a couple of dodgy ones (e.g. Coutinho) where you could make an argument for Mahrez.Vardy wasn't a top 10 player at all. Mahrez, however, was. It seems you've forgotten the amount of world class players that was around during 2015-16 season. The difference in quality then and now is massive. Messi is worse, Ronaldo is in Saudi-Arabia, Neymar is worse, then there is Kroos, Bale, Hazard, Suarez, Muller, Lewandowski, Benzema, Agüero, Alexis Sanchez, De Bruyne, Lahm, Busquets, Özil, Griezmann, David Silva, Modric, Ramos, Di Maria, Coutinho, Reus etc. There are just so many more world class players in that season than there is today. All of these players have either retired or aged and become worse.
He was world class, not very good. So yeah, you're disputing it. Oh, "it's pretty simple", huh? Well, it all makes sense now with your reasonable argumentation
The point is that neither Vardy nor Mahrez were top 10 players in the world at that point, there were easily 10 players better than both of them at that time. But they both had great seasons in leading Leicester to the title and finished 7th and 8th in the BDO voting respectively. However, it was Kante who got a move to a big club first, Mahrez had to wait another 2 years.
Re your question, no, Kvara probably wouldn't have been top 5 at that time. But Mahrez certainly wasn't either, so that doesn't really mean anything in comparing the two.
He’s played well in most of the games in the UCL group stages. The stats which aren’t correct anyway don’t paint the whole picture
No...
Just no.
And for interest's sake, you should take a gander at Mahrez threads on here from the time period. He was rated - and I'll have posts in the affirmative of that - but to a degree and with regard to the [weak] season it was.
Kvaratskhelia also has the CL before the expansiveness of his game over Mahrez's is factored in.
Don't forget Asamoah Gyan being top-20 player in 2010So was Jamie Vardy, according to the Ballon D'Or voting. Does that mean that peak Vardy is better than current Victor Osimhen? After all, Vardy scored 24 goals in a much stronger league than Osimhen, who has only 21 goals so far in pathetically weak Serie A....
Peak @zaafi logic
This Mahrez thread is super interesting.
I never mentioned Vardy or Ballon D’Or voting. I don’t know if peak Vardy was better than current Osimhen, nor if Kvara is better than Mahrez was. I’ve watched Napoli like 5 times.So was Jamie Vardy, according to the Ballon D'Or voting. Does that mean that peak Vardy is better than current Victor Osimhen? After all, Vardy scored 24 goals in a much stronger league than Osimhen, who has only 21 goals so far in pathetically weak Serie A....
Peak @zaafi logic
I do know what I was thinking of Mahrez at the time - that he’s a top 10 player in the world.
I agree it was a weak season, but if you're going to judge Mahrez in regards to that, the same should be applied to Kvaratskhelia and the frequently weak opposition he faces. I'm not downplaying his abilities or anything, I love Khvicha and would be thrilled if he signed for us along with Osimhen.
The CL point is fair but Mahrez following season with Leicester in the CL, he had 4 goals and 2 assists which is the amount of goal points Kvara currently is on.
Serie A has 3 CL QF this season - it's the worst time to be calling the league weak, especially in comparison to the season when Leicester won the PL, which, as amazing a feat as it was, was an absolute nadir for big club quality this millennium.
And, as I said in my previous post, I'm someone who really enjoyed Mahrez's performances that season, but it is a season that exists within a bubble, a unique bubble, but a bubble nonetheless. Kante, Vardy and Mahrez all proved their worth over further seasons, but only Kante grew from that juncture.
With regard to the next season for Mahrez and the CL, it's not really applicable as it exists outside the season you are referring to, where he wasn't considered in the same light. Kvarat is doing everything this season whilst being the star of his side, all rolled into one, and ongoing.
About their abilities, isn't that part and parcel of comparison? And in that regard, Kvarat has a massive scope in his play compared to the more myopic Mahrez who has always been chided for his tunnel-vision and decision-making within a team construct. At Leicester, he got away with it, was even applauded for it, but it has Pep going crazy at him for City and has often led to long spells on the bench. By contrast, Kvarat is showing clear aspects of potentially ending up a playmaker in the centre of the pitch and is a consummate team player as well as being an individual threat that is capturing hearts and attention across the continent. From the outset, we're talking about two very different starting points.
One might say Kvara can do everything Mahrez can, but Mahrez hasn't shown the scope to do what Kvarat does.
If that's what you thought from watching him then fair enough. I'd disagree, I think there were easily 10 better players at that time but that's just my opinion from watching him and others. At least you haven't just presented his goals and assists for that year as proof that he's better than someone else.
You're doing it again. A player can have less goals and less assists than another and still be a better player. You have to judge them based on their entire performances.
Why are you so obsessed with how I used goals and assists to show how good Mahrez was that season? Those are elite numbers and you don't reach those numbers without having an extremely good season.
I watched Mahrez that season and the way he was taking on players through silky dribbling and fake shots was incredibly efficient. His Robben-like cutting in style and curling was also his trademark. He was also superb at creating chances for his team, which is something I wish Antony could do, and he could easily have had way more assists. I mean, you keep mentioning that he's not a good player but not once have you reasoned why. So can you tell me or are you just going to reply that "he's average and Kvara's compilation showed me he's better". Looking forward to read your reasons that explain him being average.
This is my last post of the day being a newbie and all.
It was just to point out that Mahrez also has performed in CL, and not just PL. Didn't say anything else. And, of course. Otherwise Lukaku would be a better player than Agüero for some seasons, which is far from the truth. I've watched Mahrez in 15/16 and I've watched Kvara this season, and my opinion is that Kvara's potential is skyhigh and way bigger than Mahrez', but I don't think he has outperformed Mahrez 15/16 season. Your opinion is the opposite, and that's fine, but saying he is average is just not true.
not sure why there would be any question that this kid is going to end up being one of the better players in Europe over the next 5-6 years.....the bigger question is when does he make that jump to one of the top european sides outside of Italy?? Napoli are good right now but they aren't regularly a top side so you assume Spain and England will be coming soon for him
He has 4 assists in the CL.
Also there is no point in watching football if all that matters to rate a players are assists and goals.
Just download SofaScore app, to see who's the "best player".
Ermm Mahrez is still world class, he’s competing with 3 others this kvaradona would barely get games for city.
Sure those stats are correct? He assisted Simeone against Liverpool and Di Lorenzo against Frankfurt.
What? Whos keeping him out Grealish? Thats pretty laughable, he would start nearly every game at City.
These 2 were beautiful. As was his assist for Raspadori’s goal against Ajax (a wonderfully built up goal). Total 4 assist.
Mahrez was probably top 10/15 in the World back in 2016 and he still produces WC performances every now and then for City.. But he’s never shown the kind of potential that Kvara is showing at 22 years old.
This guy is awesome. Reminds me of a young Ryan Giggs tearing it up. We don't need him, but he's so good I'd love to see us go for him anyway.
You misspelt "a young Riyad Mahrez at Le Havre"
Can’t believe some daft sods in here are refusing to acknowledge how special this kid is.
The Sancho non believers were also daft.
He plays like a poor man’s George Best (it’s a compliment).
What kind of bad faith reasoning are you trying to introduce here?
None, he is being completely overhyped. Looking in detail at his performances he’s a level behind Saka, Rashford, Mahrez, Grealish, Foden, Martinelli.
Some of Mahrez’s best games for City have been in the Champions League, scored three important goals in semi finals in the past two seasons for example. City just ruin the individual wonder of players, if he went somewhere else he’d be considered one of the best in the league. Hope Kvara never goes to City under Pep.
Exactly, Mahrez and Grealish are exceptional. Grealish was taking the piss with villa, I still think he’s brilliant whenever he plays for city, he has a slightly different role now.
Yeah cause, you know, Mahrez was world class 6 years ago so.
He’s so fecking good. I wish we had the extra cash lying around to get him.