With Müller and James in the team there is no real position for him.
Leon Goretzka | Bayern player in the summer
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Mueller is a fake top player, so they might want a real one.
And play him on the wing in the Robben/Ribery role? Or swith to a 442 with Thiago, Martinez, Coman and James in midfield? Please feel free to make a starting XI work, I just don‘t see it.
Why on earth would I suggest playing him on the wing, when I offered a direct response to you saying ‘they have Mueller and James’ by saying he’s better than Mueller. Of course, my suggestion is he plays where Mueller plays, but instead of him, because he’s rubbish.
He's more dynamic than Kroos and it's MY OPINION that he will be better than Kroos in future. Judging both players at the same age, Goretzka is ahead and is progressing fairly well and a move to a big club would make him even better. It's not wishful thinking or muppet mode.... it plain old statistics.
Thats a bold prediction though. Kroos is one of the best midfielders of his generation with a World Cup win and 3 CL wins while only 6 years older than Goretzka.
That's an extremely bold statement to make. And as someone who has been watching both players develop for their entire careers, I completely disagree. Kroos was always special, very special. Even at that age and even more so than Goretzka. Which doesn't take anything away from the amazing prospect that is Goretzka. But Kroos might be the best midfielder in the world right now, is extremely consistent and might be on his way to become the most succesful German player ever.
Kroos is better now and when Goretzka gets older, Kroos will have the better career. Goretzka is great though, still a long way to go
That's insane. Goretzka will be 23 in a few weeks. At that age, Kroos was a regular starter and key player in Heynckes' Bayern side keeping Robben out of the team during the treble season (until Kroos got injured and missed the last 2 months of the season). Performances like Kroos in the CL semifinal against Real in 2012 when he was easily the best midfielder on the pitch are far far above anything we've seen from Goretzka.
He suits Bayern more than United anyway.
Not every good player is suited to the style and traditions of our club. Someone like Vidal or Nainggolan would suit us and Mourinho much more than the likes of Goretzka or Savic. We should be going for them instead.
Not every good player is suited to the style and traditions of our club. Someone like Vidal or Nainggolan would suit us and Mourinho much more than the likes of Goretzka or Savic. We should be going for them instead.
He's about as good as Kroos was at Leverkusen, come on. At 22-23 TK was a top 10 midfielder in the world, while Goretzka is still thought of as a "talent".
I‘m pretty sure Vidal is available, if(!) Bayern signs Goretzka. Something like 50m will easily do it.
Okay, Griezman in the Müller role is a possibility.
But i) Müller is not „rubbish“ and ii) Bayern will not spend EUR100m on a player with similar output to him in order to bench a club legend.
Goretzka is better than Kroos was with 23-24 years.
Kroos had only 2 goals and 4 assists in 29 Bundesliga games (in 2013/2014).
That's why Bayern sold him to Real Madrid. They thought he is not worth it, but Kroos improved.
He is right, Goretzka is a way more dynamic. People in Munich blamed Kroos for being lazy.
Even the Daily Mail wrote that people called him lazy. He was a hit or miss:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...-Jupp-Heynckes-Bayern-not-Louis-van-Gaal.html
You can't compare Kroos and Goretzka. Goretzka is an explosive player and is more dangerous.
Kroos is a great player too, not very dangerous, but with an excellent passing game.
I hope that Kroos finds his form for the World Cup in Russia.
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Meh, Kroos is not defined through goal output. They arent comparable per se, different players, but Kroos at Bayern was better than Goretzka now.
Bayern didnt sell him because of his performances, he had a year left on his contract and wanted to move on due to not being able to agree a new contract (Bayern didnt want to pay him as much as he wanted and he didnt feel appreciated)
No, you are wrong.
He didn't want to leave but he didn't feel the trust. Rummenigge thought he is not good enough.
German media reported that and his best friend confirmed it in 2017.
Bayern Munich CEO Karl-Heinz Rummenigge told Toni: "We won't pay you more than €10 million a year because you're not a world-class player."
https://www.si.com/soccer/2017/09/1...eason-behind-ex-bayern-stars-real-madrid-move
You judge Kroos on goal and assist numbers and quote the Daily Mail. Okay.... I‘m oughta here.
"The best players of the world (and Xavi)".
In fairness Kroos at that age did play as a number 10 rather then CM and should have produced much larger numbers in a bayern team. however Goretzka has always been a more box to box for me where as Kroos always looked more a playmaker, bit of a weird comparision
Yeah, it‘s completely apples and oranges. Bayern basically had to play Kroos at the #10 since Martinez and Schweinsteiger were ace behind him. In hindsight they played him out of position.
But back to Goretzka.
I expect him to go to Bayern and I expect Vidal to leave.
After the Sanchez deal, we should go guns blazing in for Goretzka. If we need Pogba to break free, I think Goretzka is the man for his dynamicism. He's defends, technically good and makes runs into the penalty box to score goals as well. He can replace Pogba when suspended or being rested or injured.
Goretzka (free) --> United really need too get this guy... Fine, we don't know if he'll be better than Kroos but I think he would be perfect to play with Pogba and Matic in a midfield 3
Ozil (free) --> For his value, can't get a better No. 10 for free.
Fabinho for RB --> He can provide cover in midfield as well
That would offer us depth
Formation 1
--- Martial ---- Lukaku --- Sanchez ---
----- Pogba ------------- Goretzka ----
-------------- Matic ---------------------
-- Shaw -- Jones -- Bailly -- Valencia --
Formation 2
------------ Lukaku -------------
-- Martial --- Ozil --- Sanchez -
-------- Pogba----- Matic ------
-- Shaw -- Jones -- Bailly -- Valencia --
Formation 3
------ Sanchez ----- Lukaku -------
Shaw - Pogba --- Goretzka --- Ozil --- Valencia ---
----- Rojo ---- Jones ---- Bailly ------------------
Goretzka (free) --> United really need too get this guy... Fine, we don't know if he'll be better than Kroos but I think he would be perfect to play with Pogba and Matic in a midfield 3
Ozil (free) --> For his value, can't get a better No. 10 for free.
Fabinho for RB --> He can provide cover in midfield as well
That would offer us depth
Formation 1
--- Martial ---- Lukaku --- Sanchez ---
----- Pogba ------------- Goretzka ----
-------------- Matic ---------------------
-- Shaw -- Jones -- Bailly -- Valencia --
Formation 2
------------ Lukaku -------------
-- Martial --- Ozil --- Sanchez -
-------- Pogba----- Matic ------
-- Shaw -- Jones -- Bailly -- Valencia --
Formation 3
------ Sanchez ----- Lukaku -------
Shaw - Pogba --- Goretzka --- Ozil --- Valencia ---
----- Rojo ---- Jones ---- Bailly ------------------
Whilst Goretzka would probably serve to be that perfect 3rd midfield signing we are after, i'm afraid its almost 99% certain he is Bayern bound at this point, so it's all kind of moot. Of course, i'd be more than happy to be surprised..
@black_crow talked about 13/14. In 13/14 Kroos played as a deep lying playmaker. There was plenty of discussion about how Guardiola used him in comparison to Heynckes. Under Heynckes Kroos was played as a clear number 10, under Guardiola Kroos at times dropped between the two centerbacks and was rarely seen further forward.
He was talking about 13/14. Schweinsteiger was mostly injured and Martinez missed half the season as well and if he was fit, he played as a centerback.Yeah, it‘s completely apples and oranges. Bayern basically had to play Kroos at the #10 since Martinez and Schweinsteiger were ace behind him. In hindsight they played him out of position.
But back to Goretzka.
I expect him to go to Bayern and I expect Vidal to leave.
It's hilarious to suggest Goretzka is as good/better than Kroos at a similar age. He's barely at the level of Kroos at Leverkusen (when he was 19), Kroos was magnificent during that loan spell.
Kroos is one of the best midfielders in the world and it was clear he was going to be at that level from a very early age. I would be very surprised if Goretzka reaches a similar level, hell even if it's a level below he would still be a fantastic player for Germany.
It would be better not to hold him to the high standards of Kroos, Khedira would be a similar comparison since they play very similar roles (maybe you can argue Khedira is more defensive). Khedira has been a fantastic servant for Germany and his clubs over the last 10 years and Goretzka would do well to emulate that.
Kroos is one of the best midfielders in the world and it was clear he was going to be at that level from a very early age. I would be very surprised if Goretzka reaches a similar level, hell even if it's a level below he would still be a fantastic player for Germany.
It would be better not to hold him to the high standards of Kroos, Khedira would be a similar comparison since they play very similar roles (maybe you can argue Khedira is more defensive). Khedira has been a fantastic servant for Germany and his clubs over the last 10 years and Goretzka would do well to emulate that.
That was Kroos in 2014 against United:
https://spielverlagerung.de/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/bayern-Man Utd.png
Under Heynckes:
How anyone is surprised that his number of goals and assists went down under Guardiola is beyond me.
Again, Kroos was an established world class player at 23, who started regularly for an elite team and played a key role in a treble and went on to perform brillantly in a world cup win a year later. Goretzka has a lot of catching up to do to be compared to Kroos.
https://spielverlagerung.de/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/bayern-Man Utd.png
Under Heynckes:
How anyone is surprised that his number of goals and assists went down under Guardiola is beyond me.
Again, Kroos was an established world class player at 23, who started regularly for an elite team and played a key role in a treble and went on to perform brillantly in a world cup win a year later. Goretzka has a lot of catching up to do to be compared to Kroos.
So whats the consensus on this guy? A future world class player?
I saw both players more than 50 times over 90 minutes. Kroos wasn't as good as Goretzka with 22 and I think Goretzka has more potential.
Like I said, Kroos was a very average player at Bayern. That's why they didn't offer him the same salary as Götze.
While Guardiola was sold on him, those in power at the Allianz Arena weren’t. Rummenigge didn't value him enough and told him that. Bayern won the Champions League Final without Kroos, the 7:0 (two games) against Barcelona without Kroos, the 1/4 Final against Juventus without Kroos.
That's why Bayern allowed him to leave for a meager £20 million. I think they did a huge mistake because Kroos got better under Guardiola.
He wasn't world class but he was on a good way. Bayern did regret it later on.
Anyway, Kroos isn't as good as he was in 2017/2018. Goretzka is the future and Bayern got him for free.
Imagine a centerfield with:
..... Rodriguez .....
Thiago ..... Goretzka
..... Martinez .....
Their bench with stars like Vidal and Tolisso.
They will probably get Julian Brandt for the wings. They say Brandt has a buy-out clause of 12,5 million Euro (summer 2018). Gnabry and Coman will fight for the other position. Those Bayern deals are just insane because all those young Germans want to play for them.
Rummenigge said they are ready to spend 100 million for a player but I don't think they need to.
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Mate, they won‘t be allowed to play with 12 players, since I don’t assume they’ll be selling Lewandowski.
Also: Tolisso is not (yet?) a star and I just don’t see Brandt and Gnabry being good enoug for them.
Kroos already carried our entire midfield during the 11/12 season, where BS missed the first 2/3s due to injuries. He absolutely dominated the midfield in the Semis against Real. How anyone can say he was average is beyond me.
And no, Goretzka while a great prospect certainly doesn't have more potential. Kroos is the best midfielder we have produced since Schuster/Matthäus.
The calculus of our board was that he would finally cave in to their lowballing attempts. They wanted to keep their wage structure low, and as a "homegrown" player Kroos was supposed to be the perfect target. That, and the fact that they all fell for the Götze hype.
It backfired in spectacular fashion.
Yes, because we had a lot of other class players peaking at the time. I fail to see how that should diminish Kroos.
He's been one the best CMs worldwide since 2011
He definitely has the potential, yes.
They don't need to play 12 players.Mate, they won‘t be allowed to play with 12 players, since I don’t assume they’ll be selling Lewandowski.
Also: Tolisso is not (yet?) a star and I just don’t see Brandt and Gnabry being good enoug for them.
Tuchel might be their new coach and he played more than once with three centre-backs or with a system that switched to a 5-4-1.
Goretzka will make it into any team, but he needs to stay healthy. He missed 27 games in 2014/2015 and he missed half of the games in 2017/2018.
I won't reply to the Goretzka-Kroos thing anymore. They are different types and Leon is the future.
Experts believe that Goretzka will sign with Bayern within a matter of days now. I guess he is ready for his medical.
Liverpool gave up and I think we were never really tried. Goretzka on a free would have been a coup with Bayern Munich and Barcelona both wanting to sign him.
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My wife and I felt the same. The team functioned a way better without him.
Even worse.. Kroos is totally off form in 2017/2018.
I (German-American) hope he will improve until the World Cup.
Goretzka was injured but it looks like he is back soon.
Can't believe that the USA didn't make it.
The caf thinks you're crazy but i think you're right. I believe he will be on Toni Kroos level. It will take time but he'll get there
he's still young and has so much potential.My comment regarding the 12 starters was tongue in cheek, but I still assume it would be:
Neuer
Kimmich - Boateng - Hummels - Alaba
Martinez - Goretzka/Vidal
Müller - James - Coman
Lewandowski
You mentioned adding Brandt for the wing and that would make it 12 since I wouldn‘t take any of the above out for him.
Are there any credible links to this player from utd?
Seems Bayern are the favourites but I personally think we need this guy
Seems Bayern are the favourites but I personally think we need this guy
Schalke confirm Goretzka will be moving to Bayen Munchen.Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Yes!
The German league is a joke at this point. 
At this point?The German league is a joke at this point.
Feel a bit sorry for Schalke to be honest. They are having a good season too and have a real shot of finishing 2nd in the league, be interesting to see if this derails it somewhat.
Pathetic league
Goretzka to Bayern and we will take Vidal please
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