LVG Out Thread | BBC: Sacked!

[NJM78]

Moyes face is like mine before every game I watch under van Gaal, confused and slightly worried about what I'm about to witness, then 9 times out of 10 by the end of the game my face resembles van Gaals, still confused and worried but with added rage, hair being pulled out, all whilst struggling not to kick the first person I see in the throat before I succumb to a minor stroke.

Two complete fools.

 

[SirBobbysCombover]

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...tball-news/man-utd-rashford-van-gaal-11222470

Don't know if this had been posted from MEN, Louis thinks Rashford is not ready for first team yet.

 

[royboy16]

If Klopp is heavy metal then LVG must be funeral doom metal.

\m/

 

[Taxx]

Rashford not ready? Might be true, but.. Maybe Wayne didn't take to playing CM full-time just yet?

 

[Stacks]

Positives from LVG reign:

Acquisition (and development) of Martial, a potential world class talent

Bringing some excellent looking young players into the first team, especially Rashford, Fosu Monster and CBJ. You may say this was "luck due to injuries" but he deliberately thinned the squad out which created these opportunities (obviously there was a downside to this as well)

Development of Smalling into a first class centre back

Acquisition of Blind and conversion into a first class centre back

Emergence of Shaw before his injury

Actually dragging *some* half decent performances from previously written off Fellaini and Young (now re-written off !)

Under 21's winning their Championship which suggests some good foundations being built at the club

FA Cup run this year

Reducing the wage bill and offloading a lot of deadwood

Agreed on most. Shaw was already a solid LB though at Saints so he returned to his previous level. Also Fellaini is now a negative because he is currently surplus. Please not the foundations!!! Doesn't Warren Joyce coach the Under 21's?

 

[Robbie Boy]

LvG positives: None.
LvG negatives: Way too many to mention.

 

[Perrick Dubois]

Positives from LVG reign:

1 Acquisition (and development) of Martial, a potential world class talent

2 Bringing some excellent looking young players into the first team, especially Rashford, Fosu Monster and CBJ. You may say this was "luck due to injuries" but he deliberately thinned the squad out which created these opportunities (obviously there was a downside to this as well)

3 Development of Smalling into a first class centre back

4 Acquisition of Blind and conversion into a first class centre back

5 Emergence of Shaw before his injury

6 Actually dragging *some* half decent performances from previously written off Fellaini and Young (now re-written off !)

7 Under 21's winning their Championship which suggests some good foundations being built at the club

8 FA Cup run this year

9 Reducing the wage bill and offloading a lot of deadwood

1. Wasn't he scouted and pushed for by Giggs?
2. Will prove to be a massive error that should not have happened. Downside is league position and early Champions League exit.
3. Agreed.
4. I think he has been quite poor, pesonally. This is also arguably the one of the main reasons for style restrictions that have effected the attack.
5. Not really sure why he should get credit for that, seems Shaw's own personal "pulling the finger out" was a lot more to do with it.
6. Agreed, though I do feel that is more to do with their own personal situations and having to fight hard for the shirt. Not really sure if LVG can take any credit that they fall close to his median line.
7. Nothing to do with Van Gaal at all, one of the one things that was left for the outgoing McGuinness/Butt takeover and Warren Joyce.
8. Credit where it is due, a real scenario to finish the season on a big high. A trophy we've not won in donkeys years and I will be cheering us all the way. Having said that we've not really played that well in it and come up against some really ale-soaked teams.
9. Our wage bill is fine and this should not be a reason. Stripping the "Deadwood" (stupid term constantly being used incorrectly) players has caused the building to collapse. Thus rendering the decision left as "in question".

 

[Lowkey]

this thread should be re-named LvG In.

 

[Stacks]

Moyes face is like mine before every game I watch under van Gaal, confused and slightly worried about what I'm about to witness, then 9 times out of 10 by the end of the game my face resembles van Gaals, still confused and worried but with added rage, hair being pulled out, all whilst struggling not to kick the first person I see in the throat before I succumb to a minor stroke.

Two complete fools.

lol that Moyes face. Its a little bid of fed up in there as well

 

[clarkydaz]

this means making way for Rooney while we wait on him to get the record doesn't it

 

[LeftyBlaster]

Positives from LVG reign:

Acquisition (and development) of Martial, a potential world class talent

Bringing some excellent looking young players into the first team, especially Rashford, Fosu Monster and CBJ. You may say this was "luck due to injuries" but he deliberately thinned the squad out which created these opportunities (obviously there was a downside to this as well)

Development of Smalling into a first class centre back

Acquisition of Blind and conversion into a first class centre back

Emergence of Shaw before his injury

Actually dragging *some* half decent performances from previously written off Fellaini and Young (now re-written off !)

Under 21's winning their Championship which suggests some good foundations being built at the club

FA Cup run this year

Reducing the wage bill and offloading a lot of deadwood

1. Martial does look the goods and well done on Louis for bringing him in, I agree. But I strongly disagree with the opinion that LVG's way of development is the best for Martial.

2. Going to be harsh here. He only brought them in because he was forced to. Injuries forced his hand.

3. Smalling still makes a few silly errors and his far too rash with his tackling (if you can call his habit of wrapping himself around his opponent tackling) to be considered first class.

4. Agree that he's done well to convert Blind into a good centre back but we should be using actual top class centre backs.

5. Agree on Shaw.

6. He's failed to get the best out of others. So this really doesn't have any weight at all.

7. Is the U-21 win really his credit? I don't think so.

8. FA Cup run is still going, and that's good. But we are woeful. Absolutely woeful in the league. We've become the small time cup game raising team.

9. We still have deadwood that need clearing.

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

Re my "LVG positives" post

Let me be clear, the negatives outweigh the positives - he hasn't done enough and needs to go at the end of the season. I was just saying there have been positives (I can't think of any from Moyes' reign!)

 

[golden_blunder]

hmm I could swear that a few people have changed their vote to "he's great, give him an extension"

 

[LeftyBlaster]

hmm I could swear that a few people have changed their vote to "he's great, give him an extension"

It does seem that way doesn't it

 

[golden_blunder]

It does seem that way doesn't it

I think its risen by 4 votes

looneys

 

[JPRouve]

Re my "LVG positives" post

Let me be clear, the negatives outweigh the positives - he hasn't done enough and needs to go at the end of the season. I was just saying there have been positives (I can't think of any from Moyes' reign!)

He has not developed Martial and that's a worry.

 

[Adisa]

He has not developed Martial and that's a worry.

Football development isn't linear. Like any 20 year old some days he looks brilliant, some days he looks clueless. I think it's too early to judge.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Does anyone actually 100% believe that he won't be here next season?

 

[JPRouve]

Football development isn't linear. Like any 20 year old some days he looks brilliant, some days he looks clueless. I think it's too early to judge.

Which has nothing to do with what I said, as of today LVG has not developed Martial, you can't claim that he has developed him when Martial is the same player he was 12 months ago.

You wouldn't claim that he is developing Pereira or Darmian.

 

[The United]

Does anyone actually 100% believe that he won't be here next season?

I am almost 100% sure he won't be here. He might still be here next season only if we can't get an agreement with Jose though.

Paying a year worth of LVG's contract will be nothing if Woodward thinks we won't get top 4 in 2017-18. It will ruin the brand and lose too much money from not being in UCL. It is too much to care about LVG or United tradition or whatever.

The only problem we might have is he sacks LVG and appoints Giggs next season. That will be funny, kind of.

Edit: meant to say if we don't get CL football in 2017-18 which means we don't get top 4 in his last year.

 

[Robbie Boy]

I am almost 100% sure he won't be here. He might still be here next season only if we can't get an agreement with Jose though.

Paying a year worth of LVG's contract will be nothing if Woodward thinks we won't get top 4 in 2017-18. It will ruin the brand and lose too much money from not being in UCL. It is too much to care about LVG or United tradition or whatever.

The only problem we might have is he sacks LVG and appoints Giggs next season. That will be funny, kind of.

In a really macabre kind of way, I guess.

 

[Invictus]

Paying a year worth of LVG's contract will be nothing if Woodward thinks we won't get top 4 in 2017-18. It will ruin the brand and lose too much money from not being in UCL. It is too much to care about LVG or United tradition or whatever.

Yep. Another thing to consider is that apart from hemorrhaging broadcasting revenues and matchday fee, the Adidas clause will kick in at the end of next season (provided we finish outside of the Top 4 this time around):

United will see the £75m-a-year payment drop to £52.5m if they fail to qualify for the Champions League for two successive seasons.

Link

As a whole, that might prove to be to big of a risk to persist with Van Gaal when ultimately, the owners are seemingly in it for the money (not saying they don't like football success, just that their primary concern, and the reason they bought the club is maximizing revenues, and siphoning a portion of it). Probably why his fate might well hinge on Top 4 qualification this season, and why we're sticking with him until it's mathematically impossible.

 

[RedorDead21]

I am almost 100% sure he won't be here. He might still be here next season only if we can't get an agreement with Jose though.

Paying a year worth of LVG's contract will be nothing if Woodward thinks we won't get top 4 in 2017-18. It will ruin the brand and lose too much money from not being in UCL. It is too much to care about LVG or United tradition or whatever.

The only problem we might have is he sacks LVG and appoints Giggs next season. That will be funny, kind of.

LVG trumps Giggs everyday of the week not even a contest!

 

[Adebesi]

The biggest positive with Van Gaal is that now, if you need to rush to the toilet or flip the kettle on during the game, you generally dont need to worry about missing any action or excitement. In fact, a rendezvous with the kettle can even be a welcome moment of excitement, if for example you find its empty and you need to fill it up with water - its something to take your mind off what is happening on the pitch.

So yeah, that's a positive. My days of sitting for 15 or 20 minutes, desperate to go to the toilet but unable to move for fear of missing something - those days are over. My days of sitting there, spitting feathers, wanting a cuppa, or perhaps a bag of crisps, but unwilling to countenance the thought of taking my eyes of the TV - these days I have no such reservations.

Though I guess if you want to be pessimistic about it you can spin this the other way too. How would you feel if you sat through one of our 1-0s and happened to be out the room the one moment something happened? Its a risk.

But on balance I take it as a positive thing. Boredom has been liberating.

 

[Ole90+3]

The biggest positive with Van Gaal is that now, if you need to rush to the toilet or flip the kettle on during the game, you generally dont need to worry about missing any action or excitement. In fact, a rendezvous with the kettle can even be a welcome moment of excitement, if for example you find its empty and you need to fill it up with water - its something to take your mind off what is happening on the pitch.

So yeah, that's a positive. My days of sitting for 15 or 20 minutes, desperate to go to the toilet but unable to move for fear of missing something - those days are over. My days of sitting there, spitting feathers, wanting a cuppa, or perhaps a bag of crisps, but unwilling to countenance the thought of taking my eyes of the TV - these days I have no such reservations.

Though I guess if you want to be pessimistic about it you can spin this the other way too. How would you feel if you sat through one of our 1-0s and happened to be out the room the one moment something happened? Its a risk.

But on balance I take it as a positive thing. Boredom has been liberating.

I can relate to this all too well.

I was in the pisser for the 2nd goal on Wednesday night. I didn't care that I'd missed it at all.

 

[Adebesi]

That was a cracking goal to be fair.

 

[Insanity]

The biggest positive with Van Gaal is that now, if you need to rush to the toilet or flip the kettle on during the game, you generally dont need to worry about missing any action or excitement. In fact, a rendezvous with the kettle can even be a welcome moment of excitement, if for example you find its empty and you need to fill it up with water - its something to take your mind off what is happening on the pitch.

So yeah, that's a positive. My days of sitting for 15 or 20 minutes, desperate to go to the toilet but unable to move for fear of missing something - those days are over. My days of sitting there, spitting feathers, wanting a cuppa, or perhaps a bag of crisps, but unwilling to countenance the thought of taking my eyes of the TV - these days I have no such reservations.

Though I guess if you want to be pessimistic about it you can spin this the other way too. How would you feel if you sat through one of our 1-0s and happened to be out the room the one moment something happened? Its a risk.

But on balance I take it as a positive thing. Boredom has been liberating.

It's true. I knew there was a silver lining. Thanks for pointing in the right direction, mate.

 

[Silverman]

That's not a different story, that's the next paragraph.

Disagree.

That's why I'm asking what's your threshold? You would give him another chance next season whereas most fans want him gone now regardless of how the season pans out

I didn't say I would give him another chance. I said that I wouldn't be up in arms if he stays because of the FA cup win and top 4 finish.

 

[JPRouve]

Disagree.

What are you disagreeing with? The next manager name is directly linked to LVG's future, the list of candidates will be different next summer and the only name that will be in both lists is the name of Ryan Giggs, so no it's not a different story you can't isolate LVG's current situation with the club's future.

 

[Silverman]

What are you disagreeing with? The next manager name is directly linked to LVG's future, the list of candidates will be different next summer and the only name that will be in both lists is the name of Ryan Giggs, so no it's not a different story you can't isolate LVG's current situation with the club's future.

Very little proof that Giggs will take over from LVG.

 

[Acquire Me]

Does anyone actually 100% believe that he won't be here next season?

Yes.

 

[JPRouve]

Very little proof that Giggs will take over from LVG.

Did I said that he would take over from LVG? @JohnnyKills didn't said he would, he said that he could, that it was a plausible outcome and you answered that it was a different story and it's not because if the club allows LVG to stay, it means that they have ignored Mourinho, Klopp, Ancelotti and Guardiola, if they didn't do that for Giggs then they are idiots.

Now, maybe they are after Simeone, Luis Enrique or Pochettino.

 

[Silverman]

Did I said that he would take over from LVG? @JohnnyKills didn't said he would, he said that he could, that it was a plausible outcome and you answered that it was a different story and it's not because if the club allows LVG to stay, it means that they have ignored Mourinho, Klopp, Ancelotti and Guardiola, if they didn't do that for Giggs then they are idiots.

Now, maybe they are after Simeone, Luis Enrique or Pochettino.

Why worry about that now? One problem at a time.

 

[Giant Midget]

Yes.

Mate, if it turns out you're on a massive wind-up, I think I'm gonna quit the Caf as well. I wouldn't be able to handle that emotional roller coaster

 

[JPRouve]

Why worry about that now? One problem at a time.

Because you don't wait for a problem to occur before fixing it, especially when you know that you have to plan for that problem in the short term.

 

[Giant Midget]

Positives from LVG reign:

Acquisition (and development) of Martial, a potential world class talent. Giggs was the one who scouted him

Bringing some excellent looking young players into the first team, especially Rashford, Fosu Monster and CBJ. You may say this was "luck due to injuries" but he deliberately thinned the squad out which created these opportunities (obviously there was a downside to this as well). Injuries completely forced his hand. We literally didn't have anyone else to play in those positions, why does LVG get any credit for this?

Development of Smalling into a first class centre back. I'll sorta give you this one, but Smalling is in no way a top class CB.

Acquisition of Blind and conversion into a first class centre back. Again, Blind is not what I think of when I picture top class CBs

Emergence of Shaw before his injury. Shaw was already one of the best LBs in the league and capped by England before LVG was even at the club. In what way does LVG get credit for his emergence

Actually dragging *some* half decent performances from previously written off Fellaini and Young (now re-written off !) While almost every other player has been complete shite

Under 21's winning their Championship which suggests some good foundations being built at the club. He's not in-charge of the U21s

FA Cup run this year. We haven't faced a single top-side in the tournament. They've all knocked each other out while we've faced Championship and League 1 sides

Reducing the wage bill and offloading a lot of deadwood Deadwood that wasn't deadwood. Fletcher, Evans, Rafael, Kagawa, Nani are all better than some players we have at this club.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Yes.

I don't.

 

[JohnnyKills]

Why worry about that now? One problem at a time.

Because there's clearly a long-term picture here which, to me, is more important than whether we win a trophy this season, or qualify for the Top 4.

If LVG stays, in all likelihood we'll have to endure another tortuous year of football next year. And LVG himself said the plan was for Giggs to take over when he retires, so, if LVG is allowed to retire in 2017, it's logical to assume the board want Giggs to succeed him.

Given the very obvious downsides to Giggs' appointment, specifically his lack of managerial experience and pulling power when compared to other top managers, it's perfectly reasonable for fans to worry that, if United keep LVG this summer, we're letting ourselves in for three or four more years of tumescent football while our rivals zoom past us.

As a kid I wanted United to win the FA Cup more than any other trophy, but to me it's been robbed of its glamour by the FA and the top clubs. Now it's nothing more than a glorified version of the league cup to me. Top 4 would mean a return to the CL, but as other people have said we're likely to get knocked out at the first hurdle if we qualify.

Obviously it's always great to win a trophy and achieve CL football but I personally would accept the short-term pain of another barren season if it means long-term gain.

 

[Silverman]

Because you don't wait for a problem to occur before fixing it, especially when you know that you have to plan for that problem in the short term.

This is our board we're talking about.

 

[Silverman]

Because there's clearly a long-term picture here which, to me, is more important than whether we win a trophy this season, or qualify for the Top 4.

If LVG stays, in all likelihood we'll have to endure another tortuous year of football next year. And LVG himself said the plan was for Giggs to take over when he retires, so, if LVG is allowed to retire in 2017, it's logical to assume the board want Giggs to succeed him.

Given the very obvious downsides to Giggs' appointment, specifically his lack of managerial experience and pulling power when compared to other top managers, it's perfectly reasonable for fans to worry that, if United keep LVG this summer, we're letting ourselves in for three or four more years of tumescent football while our rivals zoom past us.

As a kid I wanted United to win the FA Cup more than any other trophy, but to me it's been robbed of its glamour by the FA and the top clubs. Now it's nothing more than a glorified version of the league cup to me. Top 4 would mean a return to the CL, but as other people have said we're likely to get knocked out at the first hurdle if we qualify.

Obviously it's always great to win a trophy and achieve CL football but I personally would accept the short-term pain of another barren season if it means long-term gain.

I know all this. People have taken one of my comments earlier and taken it up wrong. I do not want LVG or Giggs in charge.